Plane carrying Polish president Lech Kaczynski crashes near Russian airport, CONFIRMED DEAD

Rest in Peace

It is always possible that they used meaconing which is "Meaconing is the interception and rebroadcast of navigation signals. These signals are rebroadcast on the received frequency to confuse enemy navigation. Consequently, aircraft or ground stations are given inaccurate bearings.
Successful meaconing can cause: Aircraft to be lured into "hot" (ambush-ready) landing zones or enemy airspace, ships to be diverted from their intended routes, bombers to expend ordnance on false targets, or ground stations to receive inaccurate bearings or position locations."

With no visability the pilot would have no clue that he was landing in the woods and not an airport. We use it in the military

my prayers to the people of poland and the family of the love ones who died in that plane crash its sad thing to see on t v and there comminty in this world

First of all sorry to Poland, this is a tragedy. Second, this does not seem to be an accident. Okay so heavy fog is possible to blame. Here is my problem with that. Would there EVER be ANY official presidential plane that is told to land in such dangerous conditions? Um no...Air Force One would know days ahead of such a problematic condition and prepare accordingly. Poland is a wealthy country and there is no way this is to blame on fog. If anything the airport controller and pilot were in on the whole thing to make it look plausible that the fog was the cause. The fact that they were on their way to the 70th anniversary of the Katyn massacre makes Russia look like the main cause. This is so sad and could very well be the tipping point for some. My heart goes out to Poland and I hope the villains pay for this. This was no accident, they are just trying like usual to pull smoke over everyone's eyes and use power to cover up a massacre. It is a sad day we live in and I for one am very angry with the world we live in.

Maybe in US reality but in Poland we haven't such standards. There were only two government planes and both are very old. Really very old. Go to your air force museum in DC and you find such old planes. they are monuments of aviations and not because we are poor country but because we live stupid community witch you can't explain that the government need to have good planes.

This in The Guardian this morning...

Theories swirl over Polish disaster

Originally posted by Smell The RosesAir Force One would know days ahead of such a problematic condition and prepare accordingly. Poland is a wealthy country and there is no way this is to blame on fog.

- Air Force One would divert to the other airport at the first signal about increasing risk due to low cloud's base. Air force One always chooses minimal risk path. When ANYTHING lights up, even if a pilot farts - all the effort, (sometimes even disproportional) immediately goes to minimize any possible risk. Safety first. It is not so in Poland.

Polish government broke many rules that day. Instead of minimizing the risk - everything went in entirely the opposite direction. Started from everybody going into the same plane - every next decision increased the risk. All the decisions were wrong in terms of risk management and everybody felt OK with it. There was something fundamentally wrong in their heads.

Originally posted by Smell The Roses
Would there EVER be ANY official presidential plane that is told to land in such dangerous conditions? Um no...

It wasn't told to land, but it attempted it anyway, possibly because of tight schedule.

Originally posted by Smell The Roses
Poland is a wealthy country and there is no way this is to blame on fog.

Wealth does not preempt the possibility that the crew was reckless in bad weather conditions. And how do you know what the standards and procedures are for the Polish airforce?

Originally posted by Smell The Roses
If anything the airport controller and pilot were in on the whole thing to make it look plausible that the fog was the cause.

And the pilot was suicidal? He was an experienced and high ranked Polish serviceman - not a halfwit extremist.

Originally posted by Smell The Roses
The fact that they were on their way to the 70th anniversary of the Katyn massacre makes Russia look like the main cause.

Why does that make Russia look like the main cause? Is Russia so delusionaly fond of irony? Or are Russians bred to want to kill Poles?

If anything that would make Russia seem a less likely suspect. It invited the Polish delegation to Katyn in an effort to reconcile the past and pave way for a better future.

At least present a likely motive if you are going with that predictable yet extemely naive and clueless theory.

There are speculations that some generals might have had some important information (about NATO as well) with them onboard – laptops, phones with numbers and messages, notes, perhaps even other documents as well. Russians didn't wait for Poles and started to pick up the pieces immediately. So they cooperate but at the very beginning there were no Poles present.
Btw –other crew members, who knew the pilots for years, say that language barrier is not an option. In my opinion “great” pilots simply ignored the “little, local, stupid, unimportant” tower. Ultimately they decide whether to land or not. The attitude again.

Quote from The Guardian: "Numbers were hard for them so I could not determine their altitude”

It is not what the controller said. He said, that they didn’t report their altitude back at all. When asked why was that - he speculated they had difficulties, because before other polish pilots often had difficulties.

Here's the satelite photo from the crash scene.

Hmm..so there's NO fuselage there as we were told.
Btw, is there hires pic available?

STolarZ, jeśli masz jakieś info, PM, plz.

I made quickmerge of image from google earth and your one to widen area view.
i39.tinypic.com...

Crash site seems to confirm left banking of plane before crash...

[edit on 13-4-2010 by potential_problem]

[edit on 13-4-2010 by potential_problem]

Here's the same photo in higher resolution. Quality isn't very good.



[edit on 13-4-2010 by STolarZ]

The photo is good enough to clearly see that they were in the totally wrong place according to the runway line, and they had wrong direction and judging from the fact that they crashed they had wrong altitude too. Witnesses say the plane was turning left, but being so close to the runway it should be ideally leveled and on course from quite a distance back. These are at least 4 most critical flight parameters entirely wrong. So it was a very bad attempt – but some say it was an interrupted attempt and the plane tried to ascend again. But it was not quite according to the art either – because the plane should go over the runway and then turn around as I know. So he went off course on low altitude while making the turn and with lower wing hit some kind of transmitter (antenna).

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[edit on 13-4-2010 by potential_problem]

reply to post by potential_problem


"weird" box?

Mobile ILS?

Not impossible....IF the Polish airliner was equipped with MLS. (The 'M' stands for 'microwave').

US military has this type equipment however...is it plausible that Poland does? AND, why would it be in former Russian republic?

AND, ATC repeatedly told Polish flight they were too low, and to miss the approach, and divert....

Three trained personnel can set up the MMLS in a co-located configuration in 60 minutes. Set up in a split-site configuration will take 2 hours (times do not include site survey or transportation time)
The unit requires Terminal Instrument Procedures Specialist (TERPS) to draw instrument approach procedures and flight inspection to be certified for IFR use.

www.globalsecurity.org...

Here is the image:



Can we NOW, finally, accept the facts?

Pilots, by nature, tend to be arrogant. Pressure was ON this guy to GET THERE!

He was over-confident in his abilities.....under very low visibility conditions.

Tragic, unprofessional....but happens a lot. usually, they get away with it, and are hailed as "super" pilots....

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[edit on 13-4-2010 by potential_problem]

reply to post by weedwhacker


Can you accept that Poland is not the US? Their President was flying in a 20+ year old plane with nearly 100 other VIPs from the highest ranks of their government and military. That would never happen in the US.

Not dissing the country here, but the best they could do for their President was a 20+ year old plane. I doubt they're swinging the kind of tech you're talking about.

It's beyond suspect that Russia is simultaneously hitting two other former Soviet bloc countries and this happens. Pilots have a flight plan. They know the lat and long of where they're going, they also know the altitude of the destination. Fog or no, the pilot would have known he was skimming the tree line. High tech gadgets or no, there's an altimeter in the plane. And the pilot knows the alt of the landing site.

I'd say this article is a decent summary of the issue:

www.henrymakow.com...

Too many inconsistencies with the official story...

I'd say this article is a decent summary of the issue:
www.henrymakow.com...

- after reading this article I will always remember how far fetched conspiracy theories sometimes can be Priceless.

If the pilot was so inept like everyone is saying why didnt he just put the plane on AUTO-PILOT and have it land for him?