The Great Lie is John 3:16

Originally posted by Max_TO
I would recommend to anyone interested in this topic read , Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible and Why by Bart D Ehrman .

Thanks for the book.

You all have to be very aware of that Jesus=The sun in our galaxy

Originally posted by The Baby Seal Club
reply to post by nomorecruelty

 

I think you're confusing all-knowing and omnipotence. God is omnipotent. Before time began, God already knew how it would end and everything in between.
You mention God's wrath and the end of days as if God is an angry child..."What?! Those puny humans want to ignore my commandments? I'll show them!" Dude, God knew before he created the universe that we would be like we are. He can't help it, he's God.

On the contrary - the Bible states that if nations would repent to God, He will hear and will heal their land.

You may not think our land needs healing right now - but in time, I think a few minds will be changing.

God's wrath is very real - regardless of what mankind believes. Somewhere along the roads of history, man decided that if he just started not believing in God, then that would mean God wouldn't exist.

I can start not believing in bills - but they still exist, and they still have to be paid.

Originally posted by Moonman1111
reply to post by hotbakedtater

 

Only the false religion of Islam has verses that command its followers to kill those who don't believe.

Oh, my bad. I guess the Church used other criteria for the slaughter of all those humans then.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty

Originally posted by Gwynniver

Bottom line - stop blaming God for mankind's evil choices.

I think that is quite impossible, because god created mankind. He is supposedly all-knowing, so he knew from scratch what we would be like. Yet he created us so he is definitely responsible for the misery of this world. He knew beforehand who would do what, so 1.) he created evil and 2.)there is no such thing as free will, because it was determined from day one what would happen. If god wouldn know that all, how can he be all-knowing
If you actually really believe in this god and what he says is true, then face up to the fact that he is indeed responsible.

God created mankind perfect - it was satan who approached Adam and Eve in the Garden and tempted them - which led to sin. From that point on, mankind was born into sin - we are, by and at birth, sinners separated from God. Enter Jesus Christ, who was sent as our only way out to avoid eternal damnation. IF we accept Him as our Lord and Savior, we escape eternal hell.

Again, it depends on us to make the right choice.

This is a big part of what is wrong with the bible and people that claim to believe it. I have my bible right here and nowhere does it mentions Satan tempting Adam and Eve. It only mentions a talking snake. The story is a lot easier to swallow when we say that Satan spoiled the first humans but according to the very book that story comes from...it was just a talking snake.

Originally posted by Archirvion
You all have to be very aware of that Jesus=The sun in our galaxy

That's worshiping of the sun - which is anti God.


When all is said and done, it will come down to God vs satan. I.e. Armageddon. The Bible says that if you are against God, then you are for satan. There are only two choices - regardless of what mankind has convinced society of today.

But for some reason, today's mankind thinks that if he just doesn't believe in God, then he will escape accountability or judgement.

I'm sorry but it just doesn't work that way. There is no gray area with God - you are either for Him, or you are against Him. He says He will spit out even the lukewarm followers.

You can say "Oh, I have Buddha" or "Well, I don't believe in God" all you want - but mankind can't just wish God away. He is real, He is our Creator, and if you reject Him, then you have to be ready to accept the consequences - because in all honesty, we won't have a choice when we are judged. We will be the judged, not the judgee.



[edit on 21-3-2010 by nomorecruelty]

Originally posted by nomorecruelty

Originally posted by hotbakedtater
Knowing what I know about the RCC.

Knowing what I know about their misogyny.

Knowing what I know about the bloody history of organized religion.

And knowing what I know about the GREED for money organized religion possesses.

Why would I trust anything in our current editions of the Bible?

I look at the Bible as a nice collection of written word, some beautiful and some clearly on agenda.

Any book promoted and used to order deaths of disbelievers is NOT a book I feel comfortable basing my life around.

Don't be deceived though - God's Scriptures, His Word, can be believed. What CAN'T be believed is ANY (A_N_Y) man made entity or organization that "claims" to be of God - but is only interested in their own greed and gain.

God did not create all of the "religions" on the planet - mankind did - aka satan. God created us, the planet, the universe, and His Bible which is His instructions for us while on this planet. But as usual, mankind decided to get all puffed up with pride and vanity and start creating his own "religions", his own "gods".

Why do you think we are now in the end days - God's wrath has just begun - because of mankind's evil.

I dont think we are in the end days.

Mankind wrote every word of the bible, too. And we all know it is human nature to puff and pomp and create and exaggerate.

How can the bible be trusted when applied to the logic of the rest of your post denigrating mankind?

reply to post by K J Gunderson


The "talking snake" was a serpent who was actually satan.

Just as the serpent that tempted Jesus in the desert -

Again, you have to truly want to seek God, and His laws, before He
will allow anyone to gain understanding from the Bible.

The Bible is an incredible work of literary words - unlike ANY book sitting
on ANY bookshelf on the planet. It was written in a way that keeps the
scoffer from gaining understanding.

So maybe that's why you read that part and assume it was just a 'talking snake'.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
reply to post by K J Gunderson

 

The "talking snake" was a serpent who was actually satan.

According to whom was it Satan? I cannot find it in my bible so you are going to have to help me out here.

Just as the serpent that tempted Jesus in the desert -

Again, you have to truly want to seek God, and His laws, before He
will allow anyone to gain understanding from the Bible.

The Bible is an incredible work of literary words - unlike ANY book sitting
on ANY bookshelf on the planet. It was written in a way that keeps the
scoffer from gaining understanding.

So maybe that's why you read that part and assume it was just a 'talking snake'.

Nope. I read "serpent" over and over again and not one mention of it being Satan. That would be why I assume it was just a talking snake. I look forward to you educating me on this.

I am stunned that so many assumptions by the OP is credible to the point of a discussion.
There is no evidence whatsover Constantine was an editor or even had miniscule input.
The problem today is that someone reads the book like "the Da Vinci codes" and accepts it as scripture, a final authority.

To believe this dogma you first have to assume that the leaders of the different churches somehow were able to be hoodwinked by a man after years and centuries of serious persecution.
I need to know, why is it so easy some people to believe that Constantine had power over these church fathers? Why is gnosticism supposed to be believed as truth when it was in opposition of the faith from almost day one after the Resurrection?
Constantine had virtually nothing to do with the forming of the canon and it was not even discussed at Nicea. Instead, the council that formed decisions about the canon took place in 397 in Cathage. This was 60 years after Constantine’s death.

It is important to note that 21 books were acknowledged by Christians long before Constantine. In AD 330, Constantine did finance the copying of 50 Christian Scriptures. However, this was not a new Bible, and he did not omit any of the already accepted books.

So, how did Constantine alter the Bible? There is no historical evidence that he did!

reply to post by hotbakedtater


Again, I can "think" something is this or that - but it doesn't make it truth. I'm not trying to come across as personally attacking you, because I'm not.

I'm trying to drive home the point that this is exactly why God's Bible, and laws, and our society, have gotten so twisted with this last generation. It is because "mankind" sits back and wants to claim that God isn't real, or that the Bible shouldn't be believed.

Satan uses mankind to obtain his goals - he gloats everytime a believer doubts God, or the Bible, he gloats everytime someone chooses to view porn, he gloats everytime one of us steals, or lies, or murders, or commits any sins. The more he can coerce us into evil behavior, the happier he is.

Satan's number one enemy is God, and any one of us that choose to follow him. He knows which of us are having doubts and which of us are prime targets for swaying into not believing God or the Bible.

Maybe I see things different but everytime I see someone on these threads denouncing God, or the Bible, all I can think is that satan has deceived another person.

I hate to see so many people being deceived - and robbed of their eternal salvation just because of satan.

reply to post by nomorecruelty


Just to say, if we do not believe in "god" then we are in for a stint in Hell?!

I believe in an all powerfull being that created everything, but to state that if we do not believe in a particular faith and will be damed for it seems mad!

Faith in something is better than nothing.......

Good thread for one. I can agree with most of this, I am a huge skeptic on religious beliefs. I am also baptised Roman Catholic, and had to go to bible study, and went to Catholic school, and so on, and so forth. Along the way thru life, I seemed to have lost my faith for my religion somewhere. Do I believe in God Almighty, ................. eh? no. But I do believe in a higher power, but not quite sure what that might be. I find this subject so fascinating, do you have any links, or sources to back this thread up with? If so, please put them up for us to see. Thanks for the religious debates keep em coming

reply to post by nomorecruelty

The Bible is an incredible work of literary words - unlike ANY book sitting on ANY bookshelf on the planet. It was written in a way that keeps the scoffer from gaining understanding.

Except, that every religious and esoteric text is the same way. You have to be willing to accept what those books are teaching before you can gain a deeper understanding from then. Just look at the works of Fulcanelli. They're certainly interesting to read on their own, but unless you've done significant study into alchemy, their true meaning lies hidden.

Also, from the way you describe God it makes him sound like an abusive boyfriend or father. As long as you behave he loves you, but as soon as you step out of line you face anger and wrath. The God I was taught about was eternally benevolent, not some insecure being who would be all too happy to see you in Hell if you didn't believe in him.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
reply to post by The Baby Seal Club

 

Adultery covers both of those - sex is sex.

The Ten Commandments are not the only commandments/laws in the Bible.

If you are interested, all of God's laws are detailed in the Bible- as well as His
promises for those of us that overcome this sinful world.

I'm sorry, but I missed out on the dictionary (or other book) where it says that adultery is the same as homosexuality and prostitution. Could you give me a source for that.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
reply to post by hotbakedtater

 

Again, I can "think" something is this or that - but it doesn't make it truth. I'm not trying to come across as personally attacking you, because I'm not.

I'm trying to drive home the point that this is exactly why God's Bible, and laws, and our society, have gotten so twisted with this last generation. It is because "mankind" sits back and wants to claim that God isn't real, or that the Bible shouldn't be believed.

Satan uses mankind to obtain his goals - he gloats everytime a believer doubts God, or the Bible, he gloats everytime someone chooses to view porn, he gloats everytime one of us steals, or lies, or murders, or commits any sins. The more he can coerce us into evil behavior, the happier he is.

Satan's number one enemy is God, and any one of us that choose to follow him. He knows which of us are having doubts and which of us are prime targets for swaying into not believing God or the Bible.

Maybe I see things different but everytime I see someone on these threads denouncing God, or the Bible, all I can think is that satan has deceived another person.

I hate to see so many people being deceived - and robbed of their eternal salvation just because of satan.

But don't you see nomorecruelty, we're not denouncing God. But look at your statement;
"Maybe I see things different but everytime I see someone on these threads denouncing God, or the Bible, all I can think is that satan has deceived another person."

Do you realize that you're putting God and the bible on the same level? There is nothing on the same level as God.

Not to be offensive but it sounds like you worship a church and book, not God.

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
reply to post by hotbakedtater

 

double post

[edit on 21-3-2010 by The Baby Seal Club]

Originally posted by mobo99
reply to post by nomorecruelty

 

Just to say, if we do not believe in "god" then we are in for a stint in Hell?!

I believe in an all powerfull being that created everything, but to state that if we do not believe in a particular faith and will be damed for it seems mad!

Faith in something is better than nothing.......

I'm not saying people have to be a "Christian" - as I said, there are numerous/hundreds of "religions" out there - all of them manmade.

Forget "religion" -

Think God -

We have the choice of accepting Jesus or rejecting Jesus.

Either or, there are consequences, and rewards, for both choices.

That is what I'm trying to say.

reply to post by The Baby Seal Club


Understood - and that wasn't what I was trying to get across - the Bible IS God's Word, and instructions, for mankind.

The Bible, or any other thing, or person, isn't above God - God is above all.

Sorry for that confusion.

reply to post by nomorecruelty


I guess you are having trouble locating the part of your bible that says the serpent was Satan? I am honestly eagerly waiting for this new information and starting to feel like maybe someone realized they were wrong and cannot admit it. To be honest, I would be happy to be wrong. You just have to show me what I am missing. Many thanks!