Women banned from flight for refusing scan

reply to post by harvib


No problem, I'll indulge, quite simply:

If the government had anything to do with 9/11 or not the fact still stands that terrorists are still going to try and smuggle weapons or explosives onto planes and if this can be prevented via body scanners then great!

reply to post by Death_Kron


But in your view point the US Government are the terrorist or at least a part of them. Can you really expect the terrorist to protect you from the terrorist?

Originally posted by harvib
reply to post by Death_Kron

 

But in your view point the US Government are the terrorist or at least a part of them. Can you really expect the terrorist to protect you from the terrorist?

Hmmm, I will admit that is actually a good point, however I do not live in the United States...

reply to post by Death_Kron

Hmmm, I will admit that is actually a good point, however I do not live in the United States...

Well if the US Government is as corrupt and evil as you believe it to be then hopefully your Government doesn't have the same ulterior motives ours may. Can you at least understand my cynicism regarding the US Governments takeover of the airline industry?

Originally posted by harvib
reply to post by Death_Kron

 

Hmmm, I will admit that is actually a good point, however I do not live in the United States...

Well if the US Government is as corrupt and evil as you believe it to be then hopefully your Government doesn't have the same ulterior motives ours may. Can you at least understand my cynicism regarding the US Governments takeover of the airline industry?

Well yeah, I mean I must admit I didn't look at this thread like that, I completely missed that aspect out.

I would be contradicting myself if I believed that the US installs body scanners for the protection of its public but yet I think the US government had something to with 9/11.

reply to post by harvib


Like yourself and Death_Kron, I'm just about done with this thread. I don't think we will ever see this issue the same way. Which is great because if everybody thought the same as me, I would be rather worried.

I do believe however that we can agree on this.

Governments should not act unlawfully and without lawful jurisdiction or authority.

Thankyou for your input and see you on the next one.

Originally posted by harvib
reply to post by AmmonSeth

If the Government can demand jurisdiction of an airline can they not demand it of boat, or a automobile.

Its a little harder to drive a boat into a skyscraper than an airplane normally, so i guess they dont worry as much

reply to post by Death_Kron
reply to post by BritofTexas


Good debating with you guys. See you around.

reply to post by AmmonSeth

Its a little harder to drive a boat into a skyscraper than an airplane normally, so i guess they dont worry as much

I just worry there is a concerted effort to gain more and more control over any and all means of significant travel. I remember a few years back when they were talking about a terrorist threat on cruise ships...

I can respect and share in the view point that wants to keep individuals safe however I believe that our greatest present threat is not terrorist from the Middle East but terrorist who use words and propaganda to bully us into a complete loss of any type of freedom. It is distressing when Nations the are self proclaimed "free nations" are steadily moving away from freedom.

Maybe i'm just buying all the hype, but i just looked up how the scanner works, and you can't see nude skin, panties or anything from the pictures i saw. So if someone's only gripe is because they are afraid of being seen nude then it is a non issue. Still don't fly tho cause i don't really like putting my life in the hands of someone i don't know.

reply to post by harvib


You too mate

Originally posted by TravisT
How do you know what god intended with these body scanners? The simple fact that we have them, shows that he intended us to use them.
[edit on 4-3-2010 by TravisT]

"God intended it" is a moot point. EVERYthing that ever happens was intended simply because it happened. Some things are good, some bad- but all are meant to further the individuals whose lives they touch. BUT don't forget that we have free will, which makes us gods of our own. We can create, we can destroy, etc. WE are free to decide how we want things to be used. It is important is to understand that you are your own god. No other human on this planet (gov't included) has the right to dictate what you do, how/when&why (unless you believe they have that right). With that said, there is a moral standpoint that we all (although I'm not so sure these days) agree with: you are free to live your life freely AS LONG AS you do not infringe upon the rights of others. Regarding guns, I DO NOT think that they should be regulated (I don't think anything should be regulated, but this is because I am capable of being responsible for myself and actions- I regulate myself. If you aren't capable of doing so, then I can see why you'd want a government to step in). In a world where everyone is free to be self-responsible, there would be much less corruption because the community would never allow criminals to get away with their crimes (there would be no governments to bail them out or authorities to pull strings) therefore the criminals would inevitably fail.

But what about the people who murder/rob/steal? WELL, if guns weren't so "regulated" then you would be able to defend yourself against said people, and then the next time they decided to act stupidly, they would think twice because they would know that you are armed and willing to defend. Criminals carry guns whether or not they are regulated. If you regulate weapons then all of the good guys end up with no guns and the criminals will still do as they wish while the good guys are left defenseless. The Nazis understood this. So yes, god intended for us to have guns because we have them. But it is up to US (our free will) to decide if and how we want to use them (for good or bad). Since we are free to live our lives (without infringing upon the rights of others), that means that it goes against our freedom to be forced to take these body scans. They intrude upon our privacy and infringe upon our health (each scan has a healthy dose of radiation) therefore these scans DO infringe upon others' rights.

Of course, these things happen all of the time. So, with our own free will, WE must 'create' the reality we want. It is a given that our world contains technology (all of which was "intended") that we may use to accomplish many things, but it is up to us to figure out HOW we want to utilize our technology. A good starting point would be "If we regulate guns, will that go against the rights of someone else?" The obvious answer is "Yes, because all people are free to live their lives however they wish. You can't tell a person what he can and can't have." But, if a person uses his gun to kill another, then that person is wrong- and in a society where guns aren't regulated, you can bet that the community will take care of such occurrences.

All that exists in this world, all that ever has and all that ever will, was intended by our creator. However, since we are endowed with the ability to be our own gods (also "intended"), we have the freedom to be free! The technology will exist whether or not we argue over its intention for human use, but the big issue here is: if you do not want body scans, god intended you to DO something about it! not just bend over and take it. Use your free will to fight for what you think is right! Sure, we can use body scanners if we wish, but god did not say HOW we must use them. So then, why should the government?

Originally posted by harvib
reply to post by Death_Kron
reply to post by BritofTexas

 

Good debating with you guys. See you around.

Off topic for a moment - I'd like to say that it's good to see a mature and decent response from two dudes with different opinions rather than the (sadly) 'normal' response that you see all too often in forums these days - good effort!

Peace

bb

reply to post by Death_Kron


I will absolutely object to a pat down as well. I consider that to be assault if I have done nothing wrong...or suspicious.

I have never flown before and my trip to Europe in two weeks is a first so I have not experienced body scanning or pat downs ever.

Not looking forward to my reaction when confronted with this possibility.


I am not a weirdo, or freak, or a terrorist if I object to body scanning or being touched.

I just have reasons and strong opinions and can see through the BS and paranoid hype.


res

No, its ridiculous that people like you are unwilling to submit to a simple body scanner test because you believe that your privacy is being invaded when these scans could potentially save lives.

Not to mention unknown health effects.


One of the KNOWN health effects of NOT passing through the body scanner is that 20mins into the flight the FUC**ING PLANE EXPLODES.

And THAT seriously damages your health and wellbeing.

There is a tremendous lack of common sense in the muslim community.
The make every thing SO difficult for themselves.

We're gonna spend billions on these new x ray scanners despite NO PROOF that they'll have any effect of terrorism.
Where as PROVEN methods like profiling are being side lined.
Someone is making BIG BUCKS by selling these machines... I bet they're in kahoots with the media who made a big splash about these being the 'answer to defeat terrorism'.
If it only takes a pen-full of explosives to put a whole in a plane couldn't the terrorist simply stuff the explosives up his/her bum?
I really don't see who this is gonna catch.

What it will do is provide some dirty bugger with 1000's of nudey photos of innocent men, women and most disturbingly... children.

I pity this world.

Why would you be against the body scan if it is to enforce security for flights and those who board the flight..i would personally preffer to have body scan and to know i arrive safely at my destination....

Well we have to be very careful about people going through our airports.
It's not like it say's in their bible You can't walk through a scanner.
Beside's what if they had a bomb? We don't want another terriost attack.

If you don't like the conditions for flying, don't fly.

That said the terrorists have won if we have to adjust our behaviour.

Finally, if I was a terrorist I would do the following:

1. Collect medium level nuclear waste.
2. Load the waste onto a light aircraft (or balloon with the right wind direction)
or
2. Store the waste at the top of a high building to the west and wait for a windy westerly (prevailing wind direction)
3. Explode the waste!

London would be uninhabitable for centuries.

This is devastatingly easy to do. It is NOT rocket science and yet the terrorist does not do this ? Instead they look for the short term horrific injuries event. This means they are looking for high impact publicity and NOT the destruction of a country as a primary objective. Secondary certainly but that's up to us hence our obsession with security!!!!!

reply to post by SilentShadow


i'm glad she was banned. what point would security measures have if you can simply decline to take part and get on the plain anyway.