Funny how the Bible talks about most ATSers

"Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."
2 Peter 3:3-7

I feel as though the overwhelming attitude on ATS is very anti-Christian. It seems this site is full of people who feel that they are 100% correct on their Athiest/Agnostic/New-age/Pagan views. As I read most of the Debates on this forum turn to World vs Bible, I find it is almost always the Christian having to defend their point of view. I don't believe there could ever be enough evidence for some of these people.

Why are people so afraid anymore to hear about Jesus Christ? Is it because when we say "God" we can conform him to whatever we think he should be, but Christ was very precise in his teachings, he cannot be conformed?

As our country crumbles mostly because of the loss of morals in this country, people continue to rationalize that we should liberate ourselves from this old religion and its outdated moral guidelines. Little do they know that our founders created our rights with an assumption that the citizens would continue holding up in respect the 10 commandments from God.

"It is impossible to rightly govern a nation without God and the Bible."
-George Washington

"Mankind, when left to themselves, are unfit for their own government."
-George Washington

So my point:
From the passage above Peter talks of scoffers in the last days, most of whom believe the earth was old, and deny a flood(because it represents Judgement). Whats the big deal? Well Peter was one of Christ's greatest apostles. He died For his belief. He gave up everything for God. He saw miracles performed. He cast out demons and healed through the power of Christ's name. After witnessing all this how could anyone ever think that someday, noone will believe it; that they would rather laugh it off and be willfully ignorant than know the truth.

I'm interested to see how many scoffers will add to Peter's prophecy.

No great civilization has ever been defeated from the outside
without first defeating itself from the inside.

There is some what of a paradox to your observation.
The Bible tells us of these scoufers and prideful men, houghty is one of the words I believe. That is why when you tell them look here at the very prophecy you are fullfillling. They seem almost blind to what you are showing them. It's written and nothing can stop it from being done.

[edit on 12-2-2010 by randyvs]

Originally posted by Bilw85
I feel as though the overwhelming attitude on ATS is very anti-Christian. It seems this site is full of people who feel that they are 100% correct on their Athiest/Agnostic/New-age/Pagan views. As I read most of the Debates on this forum turn to World vs Bible, I find it is almost always the Christian having to defend their point of view. I don't believe there could ever be enough evidence for some of these people.

It's written... PLUS everyone is entitled to have an opinion. Respect it. (Some are so funny they need a good slap upside the head)

Why are people so afraid anymore to hear about Jesus Christ? Is it because when we say "God" we can conform him to whatever we think he should be, but Christ was very precise in his teachings, he cannot be conformed?

It's written...

As our country crumbles mostly because of the loss of morals in this country, people continue to rationalize that we should liberate ourselves from this old religion and its outdated moral guidelines. Little do they know that our founders created our rights with an assumption that the citizens would continue holding up in respect the 10 commandments from God.

"It is impossible to rightly govern a nation without God and the Bible."
-George Washington

"Mankind, when left to themselves, are unfit for their own government."
-George Washington

Exactly... Without laws we'd be no where and our laws and many laws of other nations can trace directly to those 10 commandments of the Hebrews NOT ZIONIST or the other plethora of negative names of Judaism. God's laws.

So my point:
From the passage above Peter talks of scoffers in the last days, most of whom believe the earth was old, and deny a flood(because it represents Judgement). Whats the big deal? Well Peter was one of Christ's greatest apostles. He died For his belief. He gave up everything for God. He saw miracles performed. He cast out demons and healed through the power of Christ's name. After witnessing all this how could anyone ever think that someday, noone will believe it; that they would rather laugh it off and be willfully ignorant than know the truth.

I'm interested to see how many scoffers will add to Peter's prophecy.

It's written... They are who they are. No shame. Not now.

Altogether, Kick ass, man!

Too bad that organized religion embraces the likes of Jim Baker's & Tammy Faye's of the world looking to make a quick buck off of mostly "trusting Christian sheep". They ruin the image of what Christianity is all about.

If you haven't found him yet...

[color=#00BFFF]BOLD Link Here; Not for whiney little wuss baggs

If you learn something, GREAT!, if not move on (.org). No worries.

Hakkuna mattata


[edit on 2·12·10 by DrMattMaddix]

I don't believe there could ever be enough evidence for some of these people.

Dude...people don't have enough evidence or witness testimony to believe Aliens have visited Earth...when IMO, there is more than enough witness testimony from highly intelligent and respectable people...and extremely amazing accounts where hundreds of people have been present...The Battle of LA for example...or the 52 kids all seeing a UFO land, and Aliens get out...not to mention all the extremely mind-blowing crop circles and leaked Government documents...I reckon even if a UFO lands on the white house lawn, people will still deny the truth and say it was a hologram or something...

But Christianity...that's a different story...there is absolutely no evidence to support it...merely a book which IMO, was clearly written by man without the help of God...so please forgive if I don't believe in something I can't even confirm as the truth...have you ever considered the possibility that it is COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY wrong...every word of it...what happens then? You were believing and following total lies most of your life...wonderful...but what am I saying, I mean, you MUST be right huh? I for one will never claim the bible holds the truth because I have absolutely no idea...that's why I also will not state that the bible does hold the truth...I have no idea...although, even if it did contain the words of God at some stage...it's obviously been highly modified by Man since then...and you're following lies anyway...so good luck with that...

[edit on 12/2/10 by CHA0S]

I have no problem with Christians, Jews, Buddists, Hindu, ect. but there is no need to put your beliefs on other people let them come to there own beliefs on their own time.

Much of what Christianity was has been changed through time, if you dont believe me let me see what you know

You do know that Christmas is a pagan holiday...... That Jesus was not born on December 25......Jesus was not white.........That Judaism might have been the first written religion that we know of, but it was not the first religion recorded.

If you do not believe what I just told you, then you are ignorant.

Peter, by the way, denounced God three times in front of others, so I hope I do not test your faith merely challenging your knowledge.

"It is impossible to rightly govern a nation without God and the Bible."
-George Washington

this is to true our government now runs by pure self-preservation

I do not believe in any religion, I personally can't find how they are all different. Miracles happen for people of all faiths, but they all believe in a higher power.

Out of curiosity do you believe that aliens exist?

[edit on 12-2-2010 by Pajjikor]

[edit on 12-2-2010 by Pajjikor]

People who dont believe in God. Don't even understand their own knowledge of science.

Non believer have never seen the clue. Even though they seam to know everything about life, quantum physics and so on.
Non believer knows that existence and our life is made up by different energies, in different combinations. Our human life is made up by a specific combination of energies,which gives us the function and creative mind that we have. Its the same for every living thing but to different degree.

God created us humans with a specific energy combination so that we could have a independent mind. "God created us in he's image". (God is independent).

If a specific combination of energy can create a independent mind. Why wouldn't infinite energy have the same ability?

Dude...people don't have enough evidence or witness testimony to believe Aliens have visited Earth...

Read EZEKIEL

But Christianity...that's a different story...there is absolutely no evidence to support it...merely a book which IMO

LOL That's called [color=gold]faith. People have faith in many screwball stuff here on ATS. "But don't fall for that screwy Christian stuff." LOL

If you (collectively) took the time reading ATS and put that toward studying Biblical teachings... Wull, here try this...

Ask God to prove it to you. Same as in Bruce Almighty movie. Make God prove it to you. If you don't believe in God you should have no fear.

Not like you'll have to answer prayers to God via email like in the movie but if you ask...

Anyhow. It's all faith. Read about it. You'll be surprised.

I must make a confession, I am heavily into politics and I am personally on the Left (Democratic Socialist). Well for the past year or so I turned against Christianity seeing it as a joke; a burning bush talked to some guy, he must have been high. Me turning against Christianity seeing it as lies and delusion was provoked by what I saw as the Christians in our nation; they back stabbed, lied, money hungry, war hungry, anti Muslim, right-wing lunatics, etc...

But a couple weeks back as I was skipping through Wikipedia I stumbled upon 'Liberal Christianity', and it made some pretty good points. So I read upon other left-wing Christian Wikipedia pages then I went and started to read some things in the bible. And as I was reading it with a neutral mind it began to make sense to me; Jesus spoke of always helping one another and rejecting what the religious right love, he spoke of turning the other cheek which is the opposite of the religious right, and when they spoke of how God spoke to them it began to make sense that the only reason they could speak to God is because humanity was closer to nature and the universe than we are now.

So as I kept reading I thought to myself, "How can the religious right say they are the most Christian when in fact they seem to do the opposite of what the bible says"? This also brings up the point that most people who are Agnostic/Atheist/Humanist actually seem to follow Jesus/Gods' rules better than the actual religious ones screaming about it. So I have to admit that now I have changed my opinion of Christianity and religion, and have became a Christian, I am still searching for what branch of Christianity fits me.

So here is my guess of why people have turned on Christianity. a.) Because the 'devout' Christians have actually turned against the word of the Bible, b.) We are a more tolerant world and the Christian-Right is still trying to force their opinions on others.


Anyway S+F

[edit on 2/12/10 by Misoir]

reply to post by Pajjikor

If you do not believe what I just told you, then you are ignorant.

I don't believe the part about Judaism being a language. I do, however, agree with some of the other things (especially Jesus not being white or born on Dec 25th.)

To the OP, a lot of it has to do with the bad things many so-called christians have done that are lumped on all christians. I'm not a christian myself, but at times I've defended christians here and do not like when people generalize and bash all of them. However, there are times where I'm against some christians and some of their beliefs (mainly the belif in a group of chosen people.)

Ill give that to you, ATS does slant towards anti-christian and the "conspiracy in religion" board is really just a religion themed bickering thread. But the problem is on both sides, Athiests think that religion=christianity and christians think that quoting bible passages is some kind of proof of something. There is a spirituality board if you are interested in discussion bit CiR is really just a warzone.
you have a couple different types of threads here
1."There is no god/jesus threads" you are all so dumb threads
2."OMG lets stop the christians" threads
3. "OMG like jesus is the best thing ever" threads
4. and the "im going to ask the christians a really dumb question in an attempt to troll them" threads.

Originally posted by Misoir
I must make a confession, I am heavily into politics and I am personally on the Left(Democratic Socialist). Well for the past year or so I turned against Christianity seeing it as a joke; a burning bush talked to some guy, he must have been high.

Me turning against Christianity seeing it as lies and dillusion was provoked be what I saw as the Christians in our nation; they back stabbed, lied, money hungry, war hungry, anti muslim, right-wing lunatics, etc...

Good job.

But a couple weeks back as I was skipping through wikipedia I stumbled upon 'Liberal Christianity', and it made some pretty good points. So I read upon other left-wing Christian wikipedia pages then I went and started to read some things in the bible. And as I was reading it with a neutral mind it began to make sence to me; Jesus spoke of always helping one another and rejecting what the religious right love, he spoke of turning the other cheek which is the opposite of the religious right, and when they spoke of how God spoke to them it began to make sence that the only reason they could speak to God is because humanity was closer to nature and the universe than we are now.

OMG the most misunderstood phrase in the Bible about Jesus teaching.

"Turn the other cheek" means : To a fellow Christian that hits another Christian while debating scripture!

OMG ... Some people are so dense.

Else Kick their ass... as in the moneychangers in the temple.

For other readers that have seen SouthPark Christmas Special (Episode 1?) Jesus Kicked ASS! LOL

Yeah, Christmas is pagan. How better to get people to choose to go to church than to make it a Christian Holiday that occurs when pagans need to sacrifice or some such non sense. Like Choosing SuperBowl Sunday or Church. Get it?

So as I kept reading I thought to myself, "How can the religious right say they are the most Christian when in fact they seem to do the opposite of what the bible says". This also brings up the point that most people who are Agnostic/Atheist/Humanist actually seem to follow Jesus/Gods' rules better than the actual religious ones screaming about it. So I have to admit that now I have changed my opinion of Christianity and religion, and have became a Christian, I am still searching for what branch of Christianity fits.

WTG check out [color=gold]This link if you are ready for more...

So here is my guess of why people have turned on Christianity. a.) Because the 'devout' Christians have actually turned against the word of the Bible, b.) We are a more tolerant world and the Christian-Right are still trying to force their opinions on others.

Christians don't FORCE their beliefs upon others else they aren't Christian.

IF you can believe nothing else, believe that. Else, you are on your own.

God has said very explicitly and many times. NO PINHEADS! you have a choice.


[edit on 2·12·10 by DrMattMaddix]

Originally posted by DrMattMaddix
LOL That's called [color=gold]faith. People have faith in many screwball stuff here on ATS. "But don't fall for that screwy Christian stuff." LOL
----
Anyhow. It's all faith. Read about it. You'll be surprised.

Yes, but only a smart/sane conspiracy theorist believes in crazy sounding ideas, as long as there is at least a little evidence to back it up...I personally prefer not to believe anything in faith as it hasn't turned out to good for me in the past...faith is over-rated...the only faith I have, lies in my belief that humans will somehow change their disgusting and destructive ways...but that's a VERY shaky belief which I don't have much faith in...if you so desperately want everyone to have faith in something, I wouldn't advise recommending Christianity...

Heh...maybe I should try Hinduism...it's no more correct then Christianity...what makes your beliefs more reliable than mine huh? I'd put my bets on both of us being wrong...long story short, faith is a waste of time...you need to know that your beliefs mean something and have value...that they are founded on truth...how do you know that your praying makes any difference at all? Would it not be better to spend that time actually doing something you KNOW makes a difference?

reply to post by Misoir


What this is saying is that: Its not the religion that is wrong. Its the people who practice religion who fails to understand it correctly.

reply to post by EMPIRE


thanks for catching that

I will say that I do not try to bash religious people, I try to be respectful.

I think that when religious people try to push their religion on people, they need to realize there religion is not the only religion out there, and respect other people and their beliefs. Don't force it on them let them come to you.

Physical life is short , just a blink of an eye .

Eternal life of the soul , and it's residence , is a clear choice

that is spurned by all who deny the glory of God .

Hell is full of souls who "don't deserve to be there"!

A big mistake made by the ignorant is the assumption that

"when I'm dead , I won't care" ....... [ you will !!!!!!!!!!! ]

.... use your free will wisely ..... listen to your ancestors testimony !

Most Christians have forgotten things as simple as remembering the sabbath and keeping it holy, how is anyone supposed to take that lot seriously if they cant even get that blatant screw up right?

Most like to go on religious crusades condemning homosexuals to hell, while at the same time partaking in equally wrong old testament sins.

Most continue to uphold pagan holidays in willful ignorance.

Most are so hateful of Barrack Obama and ready for revolution against those evil democrats that they are willfully prepared to violate the book of Romans.

Most believe that god got mary pregnant with; himself, was born, then regularly prayed to, himself; then sacrificed himself for our sins to, himself... all so we could be forgiven for our sins by himself....

yeah.... and get the best part, none of that crap is even in the book they claim to worship... but oh its bad when people who at least try to believe and rationalize the bible attempt to find different truths in it, but those right wing Christians can make all the crap up they want with their misguided interpretations....

It gets even better, they actually believe that the ONLY way to heaven is by accepting Jesus Christ into their lives as the SON? of GOD? who was sent here by GOD to die for our sins, while at the same time making claims that "it will be to late come judgment day for those who didn't accept Christ beforehand"

Yet they are trucking on in their crusade to defend the state of Israel and some illogical belief that they must support the Jews for some reason that really makes zero sense to me seeing as the Jews believe that your only way to god is a fraud... hey i rhymed!


meanwhile they hate a religion that has more in common with them than the Jews do, and a religion that actually believes in Jesus and his virgin birth and his return, go figure...

I could go into more of the BS details but I will just go away now


And before it comes up, yes I attend church twice a week on days that are not holy, because for some reason everyone refuses to believe they are forgetting the sabbath and not keeping it holy.

And yes I do believe in a higher power, I just don't believe in the bs that actually spews from some people, I don't believe that god wanted us to spend every waking moment of our lives judging people and gossiping about the teenage girl down the street who had some fun and made a baby, or the homosexual kid who has already dealt with enough bs to last a lifetime..

Maybe I'm a freaking retard but maybe just maybe whoever created us wanted us to live by example and teach people how to be good by get this, leading by example, and not sitting in a luxurious tax free institution, preaching to the choir about just how holy we are like its a freaking popularity contest.


bottom line, most people don't care about your religion, they just don't like some bs double standards being applied to them and forced on them against their will, i mean seriously do you think "god" wants will full devoted and loving followers or followers motivated by force and by fear?

I guess free will goes out the door when it comes to FORCING bs on others who have had enough of it...


/end rant

heck maybe some of us should just become Buddhist Christians, after all Buddha is closer to following in Christs footsteps than any of these "christians" could ever dream to be, but oh wait hes a false god, even though hes, not... so we cant do that according to them, curse those idol worshipers!

[edit on 12-2-2010 by C0le]

reply to post by CHA0S


Christians in Haiti?

Suicide Bombers For Peace?

Hamas Safe Schools Fund?

Iranian Space Exploration Agency?

Global Christian Missionaries from all divisions?



All I'm saying is that you can feel free to judge people on the actions and results. Globally, locally or within the family.

It's not 'right' in many peoples view to 'judge' others. We all do though. How else can you quantify and make decisions?

Anyhow, I haven't studied other religions for 20 years. I've forgotten more than what I know about them all.

All I know is that my personal experience was the result of asking God to "Prove it!". Doesn't mean it was all roses. It means I had a resounding, undeniable personal response.

Telling others and passing along the Good News is, wull... let me put it like this...



If you got a lotto ticket from the same store over and over guaranteed winner every time... Do you share that the store is selling winning tickets all the time? Do you want others to get in on the unlimited winnings?

This is why some Christians have an insatiable desire to "Force it down your throat."

In my opinion, if someone doesn't want to pursue it and get a winning lotto ticket it's not my loss. They've been told.

Only one warning. If you've been a PINHEAD all your life, expect the winning lotto ticket MIGHT cost you something in the way of 'suffering' (big MAYBE) until it's paid up. A word to the wise.

Then you are all free and clear. God loves everyone beyond what you could possibly imagine.



Anyhow... This is why I'm not going to evangelize on a forum and otherwise "force it down your throat!". I've given a link to a real teacher.

It's my responsibility as a Christian to offer up the information.

Edit for fat fingers and a tired mind

[edit on 2·12·10 by DrMattMaddix]

It is written...

Along with the Torah and the Qur'an who are all oestensably worshipping the same God anyway... and yet can't agree on a damn thing here on earth but

... what man holds bound on earth God shall hold bound in heaven...

Give me hell any day if this is the case. Actually the above line disproves God, for me, in the Bibles own words. I can elaborate later on the many reasons I don't believe in a single deity, I don't have time to get into it now. But here's a snippet.

Man is fallible and yet what he holds true will be held true by the infallible God? But since man is fallible he may have written that line down wrong... but wait...

It is written!! Do you see how ridiculous saying that is? Jurassic Park is written but I'm not worried... just not moving to Isla Nubla.

Nostradamus predicted a lot of events which 'seem' to have come true over time... it's easy to write about foreseeing doomer's and naysayers because they were also present 2000 years ago (well mostly 1800 years ago, anyone writing about Jesus then is like me writing about a little known man from the 1800's... sure I'd have to embellish a bit, because noone of his own time wrote about him... hmm peculiar for such a great man, the closest reference is an antagonist named "Chrestus" who was crucified, but little else is known).

Photo's, video, eyewitness or respectable provable cause or none of it happened and the Bible is just a novel... whats that? there is no proof only 'faith'? Ok, novel it is then.

What a broad judgement you have just made against every single person who is "not Christian", OP. Maybe it is because of attitudes like yours that there appear to be so many "anti-Christians" on ATS.

"It seems this site is full of people who feel that they are 100% correct on their Athiest/Agnostic/New-age/Pagan views."

Everyone thinks they are 100% correct on their "views", otherwise they wouldn't be "views". What do you mean by "views" anyway?

"As I read most of the Debates on this forum turn to World vs Bible, I find it is almost always the Christian having to defend their point of view. I don't believe there could ever be enough evidence for some of these people."

If you don't like having your views questioned, then stop reading the debates. Aren't you just trying to push your own beliefs on others when you "debate" ?

Why are people so afraid anymore to hear about Jesus Christ? Is it because when we say "God" we can conform him to whatever we think he should be, but Christ was very precise in his teachings, he cannot be conformed?

The reason people fear the return of "Jesus" is simple. If Jesus were to return from the dead, he would be a zombie. And we all know that zombies are mindless eating machines that consume the flesh of the living.

As our country crumbles mostly because of the loss of morals in this country

The country crumbles because the system is not sustainable. But yeah I guess it is also due to lack of morals and intelligence in general.

"It is impossible to rightly govern a nation without God and the Bible."
-George Washington

So basically it is impossible to govern (control) people without brainwashing them?

So my point:
From the passage above Peter talks of scoffers in the last days, most of whom believe the earth was old, and deny a flood(because it represents Judgement). Whats the big deal? Well Peter was one of Christ's greatest apostles. He died For his belief. He gave up everything for God. He saw miracles performed. He cast out demons and healed through the power of Christ's name.

Yeah if you believe what the Bible tells you...

After witnessing all this how could anyone ever think that someday, noone will believe it; that they would rather laugh it off and be willfully ignorant than know the truth.

Again, just because you read it in a book doesn't mean you actually witnessed it.

I'm interested to see how many scoffers will add to Peter's prophecy.

Scoff, scoff.




[edit on 12-2-2010 by avatar01]

I feel as though the overwhelming attitude on ATS is very anti-Christian.

...have you ever considered that it might be because people on ATS are are simply tired of hearing about christianity?

With all the conspiracies about jews owning hollywood and zionists trying to take over the world, surely there must be a lot of talk about jews on ATS.

jew: 2530 pages

And with all the muslim hate and people terrified and worrying over 9/11 and suicide bombers, surely there must be a lot of talk about muslims on ATS.

muslim: 8190 pages

But, oh look:

christian: 12000 pages

Yes, more pages about christians on ATS than jews and muslims combined.

Why are people so afraid anymore to hear about Jesus Christ?

"Afraid?" No, it's not fear.

Mohammad 255 pages
Allah 1050 pages
Buddha 800 pages
Nostradamus 1340 pages
Mormon 514 pages
Joseph Smith 156 pages
reptilian 540 pages
Crowley 646 pages
unibomber 170 pages
waco 378 pages
ruby ridge 806 pages
Kennedy 2580 pages

But who beats them all...COMBINED? Yep:

Jesus 11,100 pages

Any more questions?

I find it is almost always the Christian having to defend their point of view.

Yes, and believe me...we feel the pain of you having to defend your point of view. Probably more than you do.


[edit on 12-2-2010 by LordBucket]