Israel should be tried for war crimes

Originally posted by Doc Velocity

Is it because we in the West know something that hasn't yet been revealed to the rest of the world? Do we know that Armageddon is upon us, which must be played out in the State of Israel, and that Israel must be protected at all costs for the Second Coming?

Pretty creepy, eh?

— Doc Velocity

Like I said, I'd rather my tax dollars not contribute to propagate, Super powers, Banks, killing women and children or worst of all Double-damned prophecies!

[edit on 17-1-2010 by Izarith]

Originally posted by thedeadtruth

Stop trying to change the subject, its pathetic and transparent...

Me change the subject? no... You just don't like the awnser you got that is all.....

Originally posted by thedeadtruth
I specifically asked where the proof was that God gave it to anybody. Someone just writing it down is not proof.

First of all, they believe he did...that is all it takes... Second of all, and AGAIN, the Jewish people have been fighting for that land for thousands of years...so why are they not entitled to it? because you say so?....

Now, who is reaching a conclusion because of a bias and not because of any sort of proof?....

Originally posted by thedeadtruth
Now going off the same rules that we all have to follow here on ATS. If you make a statement you need to back it up.

and i did...

Originally posted by thedeadtruth
Or do you declare you are debunked ?

And yet again you show to be nothing more than an arrogant, ignorant person...you CAN'T debunk another person....

You asked for proof that God gave this land to them, they believe he did, which sorry to tell you it is ALL IT TAKES, and they have been fighting, and living in that land for thousands of years...but somehow people like you "believe" the Jewish people are not entitled to have their own nation in that land they have fought for thousands of years for some unexplained reason....

So tell us the reason why the Jewish people shouldn't be able to have Israel, and the land where it sits?....


[edit on 17-1-2010 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by Izarith

Like I said, I'd rather my tax dollars not contribute to propagate, Super powers, Banks, killing women and children or worst of all Double-damned prophecies!

Well, for whatever reason you have to not like Israel, they have been an ally of ours, but then again some of you will point to the fact that Israel has also been spying on the U.S., but you know what?... if I was in power in Israel, and knowing that there are Democrats/Progressives, and have been in power in the U.S. i would also be watching real close to make sure the U.S. doesn't change it's mind, because of Democrats, and so called "Progressives"....

The way it is going it seems that Obama, and his administration want to dump Israel, but you know what?... The United States is also the main country IN THE WORLD that gives humanitarian aid to the Palestinians, more than ANY othe country...

But I didn't see you b!tch about that....I wonder why?.....

[edit on 17-1-2010 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse but then again some of you will point to the fact that Israel has also been spying on the U.S., but you know what?... if I was in power in Israel, and knowing that there are Democrats/Progressives, and have been in power in the U.S. i would also be watching real close to make sure the U.S. doesn't change it's mind, because of Democrats, and so called "Progressives"...

And if you found that sentiment , or reason, was changing towards Israel
That a policy change was going to incur ..

Then What??

Perhaps another False Flag , to incriminate Those Evil Arabs again?

reply to post by Doc Velocity


Doc, that goes in the documents folder. What a beautiful speech. star indeed.

So many in the modern world view our progress as something good, not realizing that it will inevitably lead to a stark division of haves and have nots. Companies PATENT parts of the human genome. Disgusting.

I'd hate to say it, but perhaps a bit of genuine communism is needed in that part. Humanity owns its genome, not companies. Any progress to humanity in those fields should be available to all, not the people who can afford it. ANd life should not be thrown away so easily as it is in the process.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

Well, for whatever reason you have to not like Israel, they have been an ally of ours, but then again some of you will point to the fact that Israel has also been spying on the U.S., but you know what?... if I was in power in Israel, and knowing that there are Democrats/Progressives, and have been in power in the U.S. i would also be watching real close to make sure the U.S. doesn't change it's mind, because of Democrats, and so called "Progressives"....

I have no problem with the land Jews conquered with the help of the US and the UN. Stuff like that happens all the time. Some day the Jews will lose that land too.....again.

What I have a problem with is a Super Power putting the Palestinians through hell every day of their lives and them bombing little kids when some Terrorists blow themselves up or shoot rockets.

Is that all America is to Israel, MONEY? What would Mossad do if one day the US found it unhealthy to give money to a country like Israel after they have done nothing but build a terrible reputation with said money?

Tell me what would Israel do in a situation like that?

Does not the sovereign county of the United States of America have the right to give it's money to whom it's people want? And do not the people of America have the right to demand that it's government stop giving money to Israel if it does not want to act like a decent country?

What would Israel do? Would it regard America as it's enemy after all the years of Aid it has given Israel? Is America nothing but a big fat welfare check to Israel?

TELL ME!

The way it is going it seems that Obama, and his administration want to dump Israel, but you know what?... The United States is also the main country IN THE WORLD that gives humanitarian aid to the Palestinians, more than ANY other country...

But I didn't see you b!tch about that....I wonder why?.....

Good! I'm glad the US gives the Palestinians "Humanitarian" aid, I only wish it made up for our part in killing Palestinian babies, but it never will.

But the people who should be paying restoration tax to the Palestinians is Israel. The people of Germany to this day pay a tax to the Jews for their suffering so Israel should do the same the the Palestinians.

Israel should be building schools, hospitals, homes, museums, and any other beneficial forms of infrastructure for the Palestinian people. But no Israel just wants to blow them up with bombs while they tare down Palestinian homes to build Israeli settlement MEGA structures!

[edit on 17-1-2010 by Izarith]

reply to post by Izarith


Yes, America is a welfare source to Israel, and its only one of pretty much every 3rd world nation.

Why don't they stop killing them? Because a few years ago a dramatic shift in politics occurred in Israel. Before this, the policy was to either sell land or pay for peace, then go back to war a little bit later. IE, perpetual war. Now the policy has changed with a new administration. This one is not interested in perpetual warfare. It recognizes the problem with perpetual warfare. So they did what no one else did. They ended it. They cut off and blockaded Gaza and pretty much choked them. is it justified? from a fairness point of view yes, but it is NOT right nor should it be done. What's going to happen is very simple Israel is going to cut off Gaza until a 2 month interval of no rockets occurs, or around that. Once this event occurs, Israel well annex Gaza and begin building schools and all that great stuff.

The reason why the US doesn't like Israel anymore is because without perpetual war, there's no reason to be in the middle east. If Israel succeeds, there won't be any more wars. No more wars, no more US there. That's probably why Iran b*tches, but doesn't do anything. Because they recognize the fact that the US will be gone.


Despite or that, it is not right what they are doing. But it's going to end the war there permanently. I would much sooner support a state of Israelistine and destroy both nations.

Also, if those settlements allow anyone to live there, I really don't care. If not, it's segregation and racism.

Oh, and if the US does cut them off, Israel will continue doing what its doing until it needs the US again and then it will enslave itself again.

[edit on 17-1-2010 by Gorman91]

reply to post by Gorman91


So your saying Israel is going to starve the Palestinians with the hopes that well funded Terrorist, who eat three times a day and could give a crap about the Palestinian people, wont shoot rockets into Israel. I'm sure Israel is crossing it's fingers that during this 2 month chocking Not a single Palestinian wont choose to end his or her miserable life by blowing themselves up.

After these miraculous two months pass Israel is going to Annex Gaza?

That's the prize at the end of the road for the Palestinians, to be assimilated into the very occupying oppressors that have won the majority of their land and put them through hell for the past 30 years?

After years and years of dreaming of a day there they could have their own independent State, those dreams will be crushed and they will become part of Israel?

And this will end all wars, all bad feeling between Israel and the Palestinians will go away After those two months......

This world if @#$% crazy........

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
Well, for whatever reason you have to not like Israel, they have been an ally of ours, but then again some of you will point to the fact that Israel has also been spying on the U.S., but you know what?... if I was in power in Israel, and knowing that there are Democrats/Progressives, and have been in power in the U.S. i would also be watching real close to make sure the U.S. doesn't change it's mind, because of Democrats, and so called "Progressives"

I think you're right on the edge of a revelation. Israel exists because several nations agreed that it could exist. This makes Israel a sort of inviolate potato cast out there in the Middle East, sort of just daring anyone to pick it off. There have been takers, and Israel has uncoiled on them, with prejudice.

With prejudice. I am coming to associate this phrase with Israel.

I can tell you that Israeli covert forces have actually hit warehouses in the USA that contained anti-semite literature. Heh. Crazy, right? I'm talking about many years ago, out in California, when a writer named William Grimstad published his book "Anti-Zion"... Now, that paperback (aside from being a collector's item) was essentially a book of quotations of prominent historical figures such as Charlemagne, Napoleon, Churchill, Stalin, etc, all pronouncing upon the Jew.

The book itself was an eye-opener for many people who wondered about the thoughts of great leaders and thinkers throughout history and how they pondered upon Jews, as if Jews needed pondering. So, you could flip through the book (alphabetically, I think) to find Shakespeare's quotes on Jews. Or Caesar's quotes on Jews. Or anybody's quotes regarding Jews. Kind of goes without saying, all these quotes were anti-zionist.

I consider the book a novelty.

Other people did not consider it a novelty. In fact, other people took it really, REALLY seriously.

Grimstad is not a Nazi; but neo-Nazi groups bought up his book like a firestorm, assimilating it into their Nazi philosophy. TSHTF. Israel activated a commando cell in the United States that went out and burned those books. Set fire to a warehouse full of Grimstad's books. Those books are now very hard to come by, they're real collector's items.

Title is "Anti-Zion" by Jim Brandon (that's Grimstad's pen name), and that was over a quarter-century ago.

So we know that Israel has operatives in America, and they have had operatives in America probably going back to the birth of the Israeli State. Yeah, they probably do manipulate legislation and strong-arm government officials behind closed doors, and they probably can tilt our elections in the USA. No problem.

On the one hand, I'm bemused with Israel, and on the other hand I'm wary.

— Doc Velocity





[edit on 1/17/2010 by Doc Velocity]

reply to post by Izarith


I could just as easily replace Palestinian with native American Indian and Israel with USA. We all know that tale. History repeats.

Yes, this world is #ed up. Learn it young, and you will learn much.

and 2 months is the average time Israel takes to calm down after some aggression. It restarts every time an attack happens. Also not many people blow themselves up in Israel. Also, Iraq had the same problem, today there are no more suicide bombs. Simply put, the tactic has never worked successfully.

[edit on 17-1-2010 by Gorman91]

reply to post by Gorman91


I see...

Well No offence to anyone but I'm sick to my stomach talking about this stuff so I'm done. I'm just glad I'm not a Palestinian or an Israeli.

Have a nice night everyone.

Party On. Dude.

— Doc Velocity

Be excellent to each other, and...

Originally posted by Doc Velocity
Party On. Dude.

— Doc Velocity

*Izzy does killer rift on his air guitar*

Well then palestine should be charged for war crimes against humanity remember all those suicide bombers blowing up 100s of buses between 1999-2004 ?? I know you guys must remember it wasnt too long ago. Those were NOT military targets. Atleast israel makes an attempt to avoid civilian casualties. Cant be a one way street OP

Originally posted by constantwonder

Originally posted by bigyin

Originally posted by constantwonder

Like ive said already point the finger whre it belongs. Israel isn't guilty alone. Take out a globe, spin it, put your finger down on any random piece of land, dollars to dimes says that the government there are causing suffering in one form or another.

What makes me sick is people that think they have it all figured out so that they can point that finger. Again point it where it needs pointing at the assholes who perpetuate this crap and its not just israel its all of them.

[edit on 16-1-2010 by constantwonder]

On that globe of yours point to another country, with 7 million population thats gets 30 billion from USA to attack their indiginous residents ?

You seem to be missing the point. It's not the people its the Governing bodies, the leaders, the tyrants. Hate them not the people. You actually helped make my point.

The American people are robbed the money then goes to fuel both sides of every major conflict for the last 60+ years.

I just can't stand it when people direct so much hatred towards regular people who have nothing to do with it.

If this thread were about how wrong world leaders are it would be one thing. It however is not its anit-semite hate monguring. No people should be excoriatied based on what its government does.

Here at home in the U.S our government is doing tons of stuff the citizenry hates. No matter what we say however they continue to do as they please. Can you blame the american people for this when they disagree with it aswell?

I didn't agree to send Israel any money but in threads that discuss it I (or all Americans) get lumped in with the tyrants at the top.

I guess you'd say I try to be a true humanitarian not a selective humanitarian. The vast majority of people all over the world deserve respect and love.

Hate the right people, not all the people

Ok I'm agreeing with you.

In all of my posts on this subject I have always stated that it's is not the Jews who are at fault, but their Zionist leaders.

The government of Israel is not doing Jews any favours by commiting war crimes. The level of anti semitisim is growing every day as more people realise what is going on.

And the same actions are giving radical muslims more justification to carry out counter attacks.

Their is absolutely nothing that a regular Palestinian can do to change the policies of the Israeli government. Only the Israeli government has the power to change what is happening.

My belief is though that they have no wish to change. They simply want to drive the palestinians out and get rid of them period.

Otherwise known as genocide.

Originally posted by dereks

Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
This debate will get nowhere. Why? Because people that can't see Israelis atrocities are either cool with them, biased towards them, or are so indoctrinated they could never imagine Israel in the wrong.

Exactly the same can be said about Hamas, there are people here that cant see Hamas atrocities, or are cool with them, biased towards them or hate jews that much that they support the Hamas terrorists and think that they can do no wrong

I havn't seen anyone on ATS ever say they agree with any terrorist act.

Could you please flag up which posts your referring to.

I do remember Tony Blairs wife, Cherie, saying she understood why a Palestinian would become a terrorist because of the attrocious conditions they have to live in. She said this when she visited Gazza.

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by Izarith

 

Yes, America is a welfare source to Israel, and its only one of pretty much every 3rd world nation.

Why don't they stop killing them? Because a few years ago a dramatic shift in politics occurred in Israel. Before this, the policy was to either sell land or pay for peace, then go back to war a little bit later. IE, perpetual war. Now the policy has changed with a new administration. This one is not interested in perpetual warfare. It recognizes the problem with perpetual warfare. So they did what no one else did. They ended it. They cut off and blockaded Gaza and pretty much choked them. is it justified? from a fairness point of view yes, but it is NOT right nor should it be done. What's going to happen is very simple Israel is going to cut off Gaza until a 2 month interval of no rockets occurs, or around that. Once this event occurs, Israel well annex Gaza and begin building schools and all that great stuff.

The reason why the US doesn't like Israel anymore is because without perpetual war, there's no reason to be in the middle east. If Israel succeeds, there won't be any more wars. No more wars, no more US there. That's probably why Iran b*tches, but doesn't do anything. Because they recognize the fact that the US will be gone.


Despite or that, it is not right what they are doing. But it's going to end the war there permanently. I would much sooner support a state of Israelistine and destroy both nations.

Also, if those settlements allow anyone to live there, I really don't care. If not, it's segregation and racism.

Oh, and if the US does cut them off, Israel will continue doing what its doing until it needs the US again and then it will enslave itself again.

[edit on 17-1-2010 by Gorman91]

Interesting take. Thanks for posting

Its a very complicated situation and I'm always interested to hear different ways of looking at it.

reply to post thedeadtruth

" defend their land that was given to them more than 3000 years ago by God himself "


Still no takers ? Not once piece of evidence God gave anybody anything.

Debunked



Did you not look up the scriptures i posted? Are you really that lazy? Fine, I'll spell it out for you and you then you will have no argument left:

Genesis 28:13-15 as, i posted before. And, behold, the LORD stood above it, and said, I am the LORD God of Abraham thy father, and the God of Isaac: the land whereon thou liest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed;

GEN 28:14 And thy seed shall be as the dust of the earth, and thou shalt spread abroad to the west, and to the east, and to the north, and to the south: and in thee and in thy seed shall all the families of the earth be blessed.

GEN 28:15 And, behold, I am with thee, and will keep thee in all places whither thou goest, and will bring thee again into this land; for I will not leave thee, until I have done that which I have spoken to thee of.


This is only one passage of about 100 where "God himself" gives Israel all the land in and surrounding Israel. For a complete map of the land Israel is given read here:

Genesis 15:7 And he said unto him, I am the LORD that brought thee out of Ur of the Chaldees, to give thee this land to inherit it.

GEN 15:18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:

GEN 15:19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,

GEN 15:20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaim,

GEN 15:21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girga#es, and the Jebusites.

And just to keep your mouth shut, look these up yourself you lazy bum:

Deuteronomy 1:8, 21, 25, 35-39, chapter 2:12, 24, and so on and so forth for at least 100 more times. Next time know what your talking about before you post some thing arrogant to me.

P.S One more thing about your above comment about God not giving people anything:

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

[edit on 17-1-2010 by Dallas1611]

[edit on 17-1-2010 by Dallas1611]

Socrateeze... you have a bunch of urgent U2U's

Please read them