Norway spiral in China today

reply to post by cripmeister


Even though it doesn't look like a rocket, doesn't move like a rocket, and doesn't sound like a rocket, you still insist that it is a rocket.

Hey, whatever delusions float your boat.

Oops. edit to change "does move like a rocket" to "doesn't move like a rocket".



[edit on 20-1-2010 by poet1b]

Poet, will you answer this question about "large"??

Originally posted by JimOberg

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by JimOberg

 

Um, did you follow the many links to the pictures of the Norway spiral?

This picture is a good example of how large this spiral appeared in the sky.

So -- in angular size, or compared to the moon, how big WAS it?

How big does this photo show it was, do you think?

reply to post by JimOberg


I'm sorry Jim, didn't mean to ignore you.

Large, as in too big to be a rocket failure 500 miles away.

Why the analysis is important:

Russia's Ailing ICBM Program
Spiral over Norway latest in string of failures

spectrum.ieee.org...

BY JAMES OBERG // JANUARY 2010
19 January 2010—One of the most spectacular sky shows in recent history took place shortly before dawn this past 9 December over northern Norway. Hundreds of witnesses—many of them fortuitously equipped with the latest in camcorder technology—stared in amazement at a bright white spiral cloud spinning silently in the eastern sky.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by JimOberg

 

I'm sorry Jim, didn't mean to ignore you.

Large, as in too big to be a rocket failure 500 miles away.

Poet, that's a totally useless answer, it is merely a statement of your conclusion, not even a description of the evidence you CLAIM the conclusion is based on. Do you really not even see how spurious the claim is?

The only proper 'size' of something at unknown distance in the sky is angular size. Measure it in degrees or milliradians or 'moon diameters' or 'fist-at-end-of-arm' or whatever -- but MEASURE it. What do you think it is, in these images?

Originally posted by JimOberg
Why the analysis is important:

Russia's Ailing ICBM Program
Spiral over Norway latest in string of failures

spectrum.ieee.org...

BY JAMES OBERG // JANUARY 2010
19 January 2010—One of the most spectacular sky shows in recent history took place shortly before dawn this past 9 December over northern Norway. Hundreds of witnesses—many of them fortuitously equipped with the latest in camcorder technology—stared in amazement at a bright white spiral cloud spinning silently in the eastern sky.

It Wasn't over Norway! It was over the White Sea or Russia!!

Man, why can't anyone get their facts straight?

reply to post by mikeg2222


Thanks for the translation. Just returned to this thread. I don't like having any add-ons on my browser so not gonna go for that one. Still unsure as to the nature of this event however as the witness account aren't entirely similar.....

reply to post by JimOberg


Yeah I know, just being sarcastic.

Not an easy question to answer.

How big is this Norway spiral, when estimating from the pictures?

Big enough to attract the attention of large numbers of people over a very large area. This would mean bigger than typical missile launches, when viewed from several hundred miles distance.

From the pictures it looks to be about the size of the typical star burst in a fireworks display when view from about a block away.

From witness testimony and the pictures it looks larger than the moon in the sky.

If this thing looked like a large spring in the sky, I could buy the failed rocket claim, but it doesn't.

What we have learned, or what I have learned from this thread is that this spiral phenomenon has been seen numerous times before in China, and apparently Russia.

Now if this is the result or some strange rocket program, then the Russians and the Chinese should have numerous videos of it.

Maybe it is some secret rocket program being worked on by the Chinese and the Russians, and that is the explanation for why it doesn't look like a rocket failure, as we normally see on video and in pictures.

I vaguely remember watching a rock launch from about a hundred miles away, I think when I was in Diego Garcia. It was brighter than I thought it would be, but still, just a glow on the horizon. I will have to watch the schedule for Vandenberg and schedule a family outing.

If this was the result of another failure of the Bulava rocket, and this was a scheduled launch, then there must be numerous videos of the launch, yet none have made their way onto the internet.

Another question, exactly how far into the launch does the third stage ignite? Wouldn't the missile have made it out of the White Sea area before the third stage was supposed to ignite?

Here is a video of a Trident failure which succeeds in making two 360ties before blowing up. Of course this failure is at launch, so the missile has not gained any speed. I would think that a third stage failure wouldn't be capable of such a spiral when the rocket is moving close to hyperspeed, or mach 5.

www.armscontrolwonk.com...

How big?

One thing I did observe, after looking more at the pictures, is that this spiral appears to be much larger in some pictures than in others, when compared to objects in the foreground, and at different heights.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by JimOberg

 

If this was the result of another failure of the Bulava rocket, and this was a scheduled launch, then there must be numerous videos of the launch, yet none have made their way onto the internet.

Of course there must be seeing as the russian military always video's it's underwater ICBM launches and posts them on youtube for our entertainment

reply to post by Wh00pS


And nobody in Sweden or Finland or Russia has a video camera or even a regular camera? Lot of people in China have them, why not in these other countries. I would think that cameras and video cameras are as common in Sweden as in Norway.


Somehow these got on utube.

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

From the original News item in the OP which I translated in this post,

we see that light blue horizontal fast-moving ball of light, and subsequently with an unknown object collided, resulting in an explosion, and produces two white circular light waves. waves from small quickly formed a halo of larger , two rings in the proliferation of cross-together, aperture lasted about two minutes after the disappearance, at the same time with a tail of blue light-emitting body is also bigger fades slowly. nearly two minutes later, the rings gradually disappear. "

Here is a video of a failed rocket......



As you can see, the failed rocket in the above video behaves in a similar fashion to the witness description in the Chinese news source.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/10db794d3182.jpg[/atsimg]

Unfortunately, it doesn't appear to match the the photo provided by the news source or

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f9f1f695310d.png[/atsimg]

look anything like the Norway Spiral.

reply to post by Psychoses


I would say this missile failure looks like most missile failures, it did about a 270 degree turn and then exploded. The shaking of the cam makes it a bit hard to see what is going on, but the explosion can be seen.

The picture which started this thread looks quite a bit different. The Norway spiral looks completely different from this missile failure. The numerous perfect spirals of the Norway phenomenon are nothing like any rocket failure ever caught on camera.

chinese surely know how to fake things...

*coughs* lotsa fake ufo's *cough

When is a rocket failure not a rocket failure?

When it's an orchestrated piece of atmospheric alien concept art.

[I hope you guys don't mind the multiple posts - I find the 4,000 character limit too restrictive.]

For those interested, I personally have had quite a bit of interest in knowledge that is from and related to spirits over the past few years (which started with reading several hundred ghost stories at ghosts.org as I wanted to decide for myself whether or not the evidence of life after death adds up to something that may be real or not - as I was always skeptical [though usually open minded] about anything that is not currently understood by science), and after educating myself on the subject by reading several good books about spirits and the spirit world from sources I feel are trustworthy I started experiencing things that I had never experienced before [see a few long, detailed examples, if you're interested). Later on (September 2008) I began being able to have two-way telepathic communication with my spirit guide (during the 8 months prior to that I was only receiving responses to my thoughts via clicking or creaking noises in the room, small muscle twitches, and dreams). I still feel that I have a fair amount to learn about how to communicate with spirits, but as that takes time and this occurred a while ago I want to share some of the information I have gathered so far (from various spirit-related sources including my guide) with others (and I encourage everyone to be skeptical about this information as I can't verify it myself, but I also hope that you will at least be willing to listen - as I feel that we can all agree that one doesn't become knowledgeable through the use of willful ignorance).

On December 10th, 2009 at 3 AM I woke up (after only 3 hours of sleep) after dreaming of a spherical object that was hovering on the front porch of a neighbor's house and it was doing energy healing on someone inside (I didn't see any people, or anything being emitted from this object, but I knew that's what was going on). The object looked to be about 2.5 to 3 feet in diameter, and it had an area around its circumference that had a number of circles on it with a diameter that was between the size of a Ritz cracker and a typical coffee mug, and the circles were in a few different colors, while the rest of the object was just dark. (I don't know how many of those circles there were on the object, but there were probably between 10 and 30.) At that time I just thought it was an interesting dream so I made note to remember it when I finished sleeping for the night so I could write it down - which I did. A day or two later I heard news about a rocket sighted in Norway but didn't bother reading as I wasn't surprised that missiles can be interesting when seen. Then on the 13th I finally saw a picture of the spiral seen in Norway and was really impressed - if that was created by a missile then I'd really be surprised, mainly due to the perfection of it.

Later on the 13th I came across this video where a psychic intuitive describes the thing that created the Norway spiral as a "small device, like a micro disc." I have never heard of such a thing, but when asking my spirit guide if he'd describe the object in my dream (which I had completely forgotten about until watching that video) as a "micro disc" he gives me a very strong affirmative response.

A very crude illustration of this object can be seen here (note that my attention wasn't focused that much on the small details as I saw an entire scene around this object - as such the number and colors of the circles aren't all that accurate, mostly just illustrative):

To me (assuming that humans aren't perfect and omniscient with regard to the news reports about the Norway spiral being a missile) this kind of object seems as though it could have been what created the Norway spiral and the event over China (among others, including the Miracle of the Sun in Fátima, Portugal in 1917 - where thousand of people saw an object in the sky that appeared as a spinning disk in the sky that emitted multiple colors) as the Norway spiral had white exhaust being emitted at opposite ends of the object (see this image) at the same time that blue exhaust was being emitted - that seems very unlikely to occur from a solid fuel missile, but an object that has ports for that purpose seems much more plausible. There's also the questions of how a missile would expel white exhaust in such a confined manner (all the missiles I've seen that are high up in/above the atmosphere make a cone shaped exhaust plume, not something that travels far in one direction with little dispersion, as this appears to have done), and how a missile could create a spiral with such consistent (or what the probability of that is - not to say that it's impossible, it just seems quite unlikely) as it spirals out of control - a small rotating sphere could do that easily and be oriented so that the spiral is facing Norway (which is another improbability from the missile standpoint), but it seems to me like a big leap of faith to assume a missile could do all these things and perhaps more (see the next paragraph) that wasn't designed with that in purpose. Also looking at this image it seems that the white exhaust is being emitted from the object rather than propelling its rotation - there's certainly a small difference between the two since it's so far away (I read the page at spellconsulting.com and feel that it's fairly good at pinpointing the locations of the spiral and its trail, along with the size of it) and not rotating that fast, but I feel that it's something worth pondering about.

Also, during both events it seems as though the object slowed down at a point (one eyewitness of the Norway spiral said it stopped, but looking at video and pictures shows that it did not) - prior to the point where the blue trail is angled (which is what Bluebelle's friend described as seeing in China) and expands at an increased rate you can also see that there are waves or coils that are fairly clearly defined, and the lack of that clarity after this point seems to indicate that the velocity of the object may have slowed down at that point (or at least it significantly increased in rotational velocity at that point - though as some pictures show that the white spiral was being created prior to and after this change in angle I would say that the eyewitness are at least correct in saying that its velocity did decrease at [or around] the point where the blue trail has an angle in it since there doesn't appear to be any significant changes in the white spiral other than it seems less conical later on than at the beginning of it's travel).

In short, I feel that one would either have to make too many assumptions, or ignore the evidence in order to conclude that the spiral seen in Norway and Sweden was created by a missile.

Perhaps what's more important, though, is why events such as these are occurring, and if they are not just missiles, why are they coinciding with missile tests?

Aside from my own speculation and own guide's support for my speculation, I have not heard much from other sources on why aliens would make it so difficult for us to be certain that they are here, but my speculation is that there are a lot of people who may be afraid of any and all aliens (perhaps thinking that they'd be as inhumane as humans often are towards others, if not moreso), and that there may be a good number of people who don't want to hear about things that they are not already familiar with ("familiarity breeds comfort"). As such, these events allow us to become more familiar with the friendly and cordial nature of most aliens without us having to associate these events with beings from other planets.

As for why events such as this are occurring now (when it seems that aliens have been with us for thousands of years, and my guide says hundreds of thousands of years, but less than a million years), what I've been getting from multiple sources (initially Matthew's Messages, below, and more recently the other links below which provide information that I feel is similar enough to help show the validity of this information) is that humanity is going through a significant amount of change, and aliens want to offer us their support and the technology we can benefit from. But that is something that will likely take some time as people tend to be reluctant towards making and accepting change (just look at how many people are reluctant to move towards a sustainable lifestyle - e.g., climate change, pollution, etc.), and so they are starting out slowly by giving us the option to believe what we want to believe: these events are just missile tests if you want to believe that, or they are indicators of alien contact if you want to believe that (among a list of other possibilities).

Matthew's Messages - This site contains messages channeled from various spirits (mostly Matthew), and the November 19th, 2009 message implied to me that we'd be seeing events such as the recent Norway and China events in the near future. (Note that if you're not well versed in what life is like from the perspective of spirits then much of it will sound as though it's fictional - so I'll just say that if you want to begin learning things that are new and unfamiliar to you then the best way is to just be open minded and compare sources to see what is similar among different sources - as that is perhaps the best indicator we have that information such as this is from a common source rather than made up by someone [as channeling/telepathy is often viewed as not being real].)

GalacticMessages.com - This is a site that I recently came across and I have only read a few entries so far, but it is something that I feel I can recommend to others (there's a lot of "spiritual" information on the Internet that I would not recommend due to how it does not fit with common spiritual themes [I feel that many books are a better source of such information] - which, if you read enough information from multiple sources you will get a sense of what I mean for yourself - it can take quite a while to provide the details of what I mean here, but the main thing is that things which are a benefit to all [not just yourself, certain groups, or only humans] are of the utmost importance from a spiritual perspective.)

Hatonn and Transition into 4th Density Earth are a couple pages with information from and about Hantonn - one of many beings from another planet who are here to help us. Again, I feel that the information on these pages is worth recommending.

And Bluebelle, have you received a response from your friend about what time he saw this? It seems to me (and my guide) that the accounts from the eyewitnesses in China may be describing both a "micro disc" (in these instances, a rotating object with a blue trail and perhaps also a faint white exhaust) and the missile intercept test (an explosion caused by two missiles colliding) that the Chinese conducted...

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by Wh00pS

 

And nobody in Sweden or Finland or Russia has a video camera or even a regular camera? Lot of people in China have them, why not in these other countries. I would think that cameras and video cameras are as common in Sweden as in Norway.


Somehow these got on utube.

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

Again, cloud coverage prevented people in Sweden and Finland from seeing the spiral. That's mentioned a bunch of times in this thread and others. There is one photo from northern Sweden, it was posted earlier in this thread.

reply to post by cripmeister


Where is your proof of this massively selective cloud coverage?

In addition, why would the Russians conduct their test in such cloud coverage when it would greatly reduce their own ability to monitor the launch.