Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2

Wow, just returned and this thread has grown.

I find it interesting to read though the comments and have not yet digested them all yet.

The summary seems to be:

- It's just a game.
- There is nothing wrong with this level and it is great.
- Just like the movies which are full of this type of stuff (or worse).

I'm still undecided, and yes as it has been pointed out....it's my choice.

It can be argued that the world I live in is now more violent and rude (I say argued, as some will say its always been like this or looking back a few hundred years people went around chopping people up with swords).... if people agree that people do tend to be more violent, disrespectful, no fear etc. etc. can games/movies etc have something to do with it?

I have looked at this with an element of conspiracy. And why not? Is it not possible? I mean, someone takes a photo and a bird gets blurred on it and we have 50 pages of 'UFO spotted'. That's what this site is all about - discussions about stuff that may or may not be....

In-fact the more I think at how quickly everyone has defended this makes me wonder even more.

reply to post by spy66


No it's really not, you just must be scared of anything

lines

Originally posted by AlwaysQuestion

This is taking you a 'good' guy and getting you to be a 'bad' guy.

I think what people REALLY need to remember is, there's no "good" guys and no "bad" guys out there. It's all a matter of perspective. In YOUR eyes, someones ideologies might be "wrong", but in theirs? they're justified, under whatever belief system they have.


There's no "programming" or "brainwashing" to a game like this. Violent video games sell. And sell well. And according to this article, this one's going to sell REALLY well.

It's a matter of profit margins.

Originally posted by AlwaysQuestion

In-fact the more I think at how quickly everyone has defended this makes me wonder even more.

I'd say that's more thanks to people like Jack Thompson and his ilk, doing their best to get their panties in an uproar at every opportunity.

People tend to knee-jerk reaction when it comes to dealing with that, anymore.

Movies contain FAR worse yet I never see complaints about them.

Movies like the Saw series and the Hostel series both contain graphic brutal violence, torture, gore and killings and I have never seen any complaints.

Then you get things like this scene in CoD or a minor sex scene in Mass Effect and for some reason it causes a media uproar.

I rented the game yesterday and did not know about the airport scene. When the disclaimer came up i lol'ed like wtf is this nonsense.

Im very liberal when it comes to movies and games and have allways felt that nothing is off limits. GTA being one of my favorites.

So girlfriend falls asleep i put on my headphones and start playing. Get to the third level, the characters step off the elevator and start mowing people down. People are running and screaming for their lives and trying to save other people which in turn gets them killed. Cops are trying to save them but they get killed aswell. And i have the option of taking part in this.

The 2008 Mumbi attacks pop'ed in my head, and at that moment the entertainment ceased. Then i started thinking about all the little terrorist bastards that are going to love playing this level over and over again. And then the young people who will play this and think it was funny.

The more i think about it the more i think IW crossed the line and that this was a very bad judgement call. Yea its free speech but that doesnt mean they should do it.

It would be one thing if you could not take part in it. I really dont understand why they decided to give the player the opportunity to help in the attack.

Im very conflicted on this because im a firm believer in no censorship in entertainment. And if you censor one thing then that opens the floodgates. But at the same time im really pissed off that they did this and think that they should face backlash over it.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by Dark Passenger]

Reply to post by Dark Passenger

It would be one thing if you could not take part in it. I really dont understand why they decided to give the player the opportunity to help in the attack.

Didn't you pay attention to the story? Also, once you realize just how messed up it is what you've been asked to do you can choose to not kill anyone. The level will run it's course with the NPC's. Did you fire on them? Why? Why not? How did it make you feel? Knowing how the level ends and what comes of your "mission" how dies that make you feel? These are all important questions to the storytelling.

Between the posters who cast it off as offensive and the posters who reply with "it's fun as hell" I'm afraid the actual quality narrative and meat if what would qualify a video game as valid art are being lost.

This is some great storytelling here. And if properly engaged the player can expect to go through the entire spectrum of emotion and experience numerous opportunities to question and reflect. No different than a great novel or great movie.

But all anyone came seem to focus on is perceived offense at method and "omgz, I fragz you noobz" idiocy.

I like the whole "I oppose censorship but..." bit. Spoken like a true liberal .


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

In my mind the issue is that the vast majority of kids are probably playing it without any adult supervision, follow-up or context whatsoever.

Mommy and Daddy are stressed out, dialed out and disaffected. They just want little Johnny to entertain himself. The result is that younger and younger kids are playing this game. The games celebrate virtual violence which can creep into real life by impacting the impulse control of fragile psyches.

Every week on the news you see stories about kids participating in shocking acts of violence. I genuinely feel that video games like this prime kids to over-react in situations and not fully comprehend the long term effects of their behavior. You can't hit the reset button on real life.

The games aren't all bad but there is no way they are helping either - especially in already dysfunctional families.

Originally posted by skeetontheconspiracy
...when SHTF and ive been trained from playing FPS games like this...

Kind of my point. The games have a psychological effect that carries over to a degree in real life.




[edit on 11/11/2009 by kosmicjack]

I watched that level on YouTube and was a bit at it's level of violence. People say 'hey, it's been done before in games like Grand Theft Auto' but GTA's violence is more cartoon-like and less threatening. Clearly it's meant to cause debate and ultimately sell more games.

I'm a bit disappointed in the PC of the game for other reasons than the content - the multiplayer.

Counter Strike allowed players to operate as terrorists, even involving hostages - with the ability to execute them.

Nothing new and not concerning, in my opinion.

reply to post by infinite


As did Splinter Cell, and no doubt many other games.

reply to post by spy66


On the contrary, the verbal bashing is just another gaming tactic. It may be annoying, but nobody can argue that it is not somewhat effective. While you're sitting there being all emo about being raged on, your opponents will be laughing about how much of a baby you're being (along with the rest of the online gaming community), and while you sit there furiously stumbling around, your team will be getting fragged all because you got upset by some words on a screen. Emotions are just as much a weapon in war than guns and bullets, if you don;t know that you should stick to scrabble.

the thing that we need to discuss is .... why the hell they put this scene in the game

they could show this massacre in many ways, so it wouldnt be so brutal

that makes u think, that, maybe its some kind of message ... and not just a game ... who knows ...

pc version is crap ... dont buy it .. MP is = xbox360 + mouse support, nothing like cod4

how real is too real?

www.theonion.com...

:-)

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


I’m an independent actually, and saying its ok because it’s important to the narrative is copout imo. Boiled down: you are partaking in an ultra realistic terrorist simulation. That can be played over and over again without even paying attention to the rest of the game.

Yea I think that morally reprehensible and irresponsible.

And this may blowup into a huge issue causing further support for stricter regulations on videogames. Just because these jackass's wanted to create controversy to pump sales.

Edit: This may even be why they decided against custom modding and dedicated servers for the pc version. They new what they were doing.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by Dark Passenger]

It is not terrorism. The attack is a false flag attack. You play a CIA infiltrator in a Russian gang who mow their way through an airport and leave a dead American at the end in a frame up. The new leader of Russia in the game wants to provoke war with the US, and this attack is their way of engaging the Russian public's support. Geez, you'd have though that some here would be glad of such a blatant example of a false flag attack, but as is par for the course, the sheeple scream terrorism. It's bizarre.

I really love this thread...full of opinions and different views along with the justifications behind putting this scene in, being able to partake in the shootings and reasons why it should / should not be in the game...

That said, I have been a COD fan since it's inception years ago and I have played every single one of them over and over...

"No Russian" is in there for a point. It's not some GTA level or mission where you can kill a hooker or shoot a cop, it goes much deeper than that.

I played the level, mowed down some civilians and then stopped and started thinking in the middle of the level "wow, this is really violent, considerably more violent than games past". As I progressed I started feeling different though, like I shouldn't be firing on these innocents and a wave of guilt swept over me.

What really does it for this game is the realness. IW did an outstanding job of making this the single most realistic COD put out and IMHO the most realistic fps ever. The screams, the people praying not to die, the blood splattering everywhere....it all truly immerses you in the role you play and gives you that feeling.

As another poster mentioned, it really goes to show there are no "good guys" and no "bad guys", it's simply a matter of perception. The cut scene before the mission even begins has the general saying "you have no idea what it took to put you here" (assuming other innocent life) and "you'll lose a piece of yourself" (engaging in terrorist acts).

Great game, great realism, great graphics, sound and a decent plotline but it is damn violent....ENJOY

Originally posted by quackers

Really?

Arghh thanks for the massive spoiler!

reply to post by quackers


After this post im done with this, you’re trying to tell me walking into an airport and mass murdering people is not terrorism? And it’s ok because it’s a false flag attack?

Nice way to dodge the content there, I wish I was that naive.

My definition of Sheeple: Those who do not question what they are told ,see or hear. And accept everything as it is laid out to them.

Edit: And i will be finishing the game, its probably the most realalistic war game to date, and other than this its fantastic. But these things do need to be discussed and thought over. In a free society when the line is crossed people need to speak up and say "no thats not okay".

[edit on 11-11-2009 by Dark Passenger]

reply to post by Internet Explorer


Sorry, but people need to take the entire scene in context, and a spoiler is needed for those who refuse to either watch the scene, play the game, or take some initiative to find out how it plays in to the story line of the game. It is not just some random act of violence with no meaning or consequence, and establishing that is of more importance than spoiling that part of the game.

Originally posted by Dark Passenger

My definition of Sheeple: Those who do not question what they are told ,see or hear. And accept everything as it is laid out to them.

]

Including calling any act of violence, even fictional, an act of terrorism? Have you just lost the plot completely? You seem to have already accepted that fictional violence = real violence.



[edit on 11-11-2009 by quackers]

[edit on 11-11-2009 by quackers]