Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

Originally posted by Millions

Can someone here summarise the facts without the rumours? I'm not being lazy - I just can't make any sense of the thread at all with over 50 pages of stuff to sift through.

And sorry if this sounds stupid - but what is MSM?

And has anyone found this story on any news sites at all? If not, why not?!?

Thanks,

John.

Basically the facts are:

Two people in Ukraine posting on ATS what they see going on
11 people, then 30, and now 50 have been confirmed with H1N1 virus


There are rumors that thousands of people have become sick with a respiratory illness that is yet unknown. There are rumors that borders are closed and vaccination may become mandatory.

These are rumors and have not been verified so some people don't like to hear about them but they are circulating nonetheless.

MSM means Mainstream Media like CNN, Fox News, etc.

The numbers in these kind of situations are never reliable. Its like when the US claims they lost 4000 soldiers in the Iraq war when other sources say several tens of thousands.

So I would say the real numbers are actually a lot higher... unfortunately. You guys believe the numbers 30 and 50 and so on, but there is absolutely no reason to think that is the truth. Real numbers are never reported to the press, thats just the way it is.

If only 1% of the 180.000 people have died, thats 1800 people.


[edit on 1-11-2009 by Copernicus]

reply to post by nikiano


It is, just no more on the top, it´s in the last week category.


L´viv in panic: what causes "swine" influenza (translated)
See how they put swine in quotation marks?
original story

Uninformed guest in the city on Friday would seem that in filming a disaster movie. Streets and town center filled with people in respiratory masks. Before the pharmacy - a crazy turn. Hospitals - overcrowded. And all they say only one thing - attack of the new unknown virus.

and

Even now, when the Ministry of Health officially announced that the particular strain of influenza A (N1H1), among lvovyan rage not talk about what it is about something else, even worse - fever or pneumonic plague. Nascent and new rumors. Yes, even on Friday morning the Internet rumor that the lions will spray over a disinfecting medium - whether with helicopters, or aircraft. Some people immediately began to produce conspiracy theory - saying, in reality it´s not about disinfection but a planned massive infection by the disease. That is, in fact, the impact of the lions biological weapons of mass destruction.
What is characteristic: the disinfection raid heard almost all but the author could not find even one person who saw his own eyes over the city of any flying object that would be involved in something similar. He himself also did not like watching.

bad translation, i know, but you should get the most interesting parts.
Thx to asen, who brought a link to this site(rus.4post.com, looks like it´s a normal news website.

[edit on 1-11-2009 by euleberlin]

[edit on 1-11-2009 by euleberlin]

[edit on 1-11-2009 by euleberlin]

Originally posted by Cadbury

Originally posted by nikiano
so, why is this thread not on the front page of ATS?

Good question.

Perhaps there is a good reason. Would a member of staff like to explain?

I just went to the home page and this thread IS on there, I'm guessing it's just the age of the thread that pushes it off of the very top, into 'Top Topics 1 Week' section.

But it's definitely there guys.



[edit on 1-11-2009 by kiwifoot]

Originally posted by euleberlin
reply to post by nikiano

 

It is, just no more on the top, it´s in the last week category.

What is the criteria required for a thread to be featured at the top?

And if situation REALLY is that bad as some claim, why airports are open?

KIEV
www.flightstats.com...

www.europe-airports.com...

LVIV
www.flightstats.com...

They would definitely be closed. No question about that.

Originally posted by Cadbury

Originally posted by euleberlin
reply to post by nikiano

 

It is, just no more on the top, it´s in the last week category.

What is the criteria required for a thread to be featured at the top?

You need to have posted it THIS week I guess lol!

Originally posted by kiwifoot

I just went to the home page and this thread IS on there, I'm guessing it's just the age of the thread that pushes it off of the very top, into 'Top Topics 1 Week' section.

I think you're right. Thank you. All of the threads featured at the top were posted today.

Originally posted by pause4thought
reply to post by dreamseeker

 

Seems plausible/reasonable. But the first question has to be: why weren't all international connections closed IMMEDIATELY?

As to the potential source, I read that the interim outbreaks of the pneumonic plague in China tend to be caused by people skinning marmots while preparing them for food. The explanation involving the opening of an animal graveyard therefore sounds logical. (However at this stage their is no way of knowing whether this explanation is simply a ruse.)

Maybe they were not 100% sure. I just don't buy this is the swine flu because why are borders being shut down and martial law ensuig. The swine flu has been going on since April.

reply to post by Cadbury


No worries, although I think this thread is important, maybe there should be a ticker or something going across the top, for important, breaking issues and threads of that nature!

Kiwifoot

reply to post by dreamseeker


If, as has been reported from within country, many people were coughing up blood before succumbing, the medical fraternity have known full-well this was not your run-of-the-mill swine flu right since it started. (One poster mentioned it could be haemorrhagic swine flu reminiscent of what was seen early in the 20th century, though most sources seem to be suggesting it could possibly be pneumonic plague).

If these are the facts then the borders ought to have been closed without delay. Any other course of action in such circumstances would be negligent, to say the least, (though we still do not have enough information to be able to confirm whether a significant number of those who were very sick were indeed haemorrhaging from the outset of the crisis.)

Here is the latest information from (RSOE) - EMERGENCY AND DISASTER INFORMATION SERVICE.. Arrived 20.51 U.K time.

Ukraine's president has asked the international community for help dealing with a flu epidemic that the country's Health Ministry said on Sunday has killed 53 people. "The current threat to the national security of Ukraine, which we cannot offset by just our own efforts, requires me to turn to our closest friends and strategic partners for emergency assistance," Viktor Yushchenko said in a letter posted on the presidential administration web site. Letters were sent on Sunday to the leaders of Belarus, Hungary, Moldova, Poland, Russia, Romania, Slovakia and the United States, as well as to the European Commission president and secretary general of NATO. "In the letters, Viktor Yushchenko also contains a list of the medicines and medical equipment that are necessary first of all for our nation to effectively counter the spread of epidemic influenza," a statement on the site said. Ukraine has already received offers of assistance from Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Russia and Poland, including for the delivery of vaccines and medical masks.

The Health Ministry said the 53 people had died from influenza or acute respiratory infections, but it was not clear how many of the deaths were related to the H1N1 virus. There was an outbreak of swine flu in western Ukraine in the middle of the week, but recent data only confirmed 13 cases and one death. The ministry said that 184,919 people were sick with flu or colds, with 7,383 requiring hospitalization, 123 in serious condition. The government has announced quarantine in nine areas in western Ukraine, and banned public events across the country and closed schools. A team of experts from the World Health Organization is due in the country on Monday. "In response to the request from the Minister of Health of the Ukraine, WHO is deploying a multi-disciplinary team of experts to assist national authorities in mitigating the impact of the pandemic," the WHO said on Sunday in a statement on its web site.

Greetings to all from Lviv,

I could see the issue is developing here more fast than anyone can read.

We have 60 people died in Ukraine, for the last four days including 23 persons here in Lviv area (to compare Lviv region is appr half size of Denmark).

NOT ALL 60 people died from PIG FLU.
People used to die here before from regular influenza.
Even in bigger quantities than now.
For several years we have pandemic level of tuberculosis. ANd what??
ANyone concerned? Borders closed?

Frankly speaking I dont give a damn about this Pig flue, its all over world.

ONLY CASES with this bloody pneumonia makes me feel uncomfortable.

YES there is a panic in city, but mainly because You cant by a Stupid mask,
and any antiflu pills.

Yes streets are much more empty, people are vearing masks, including handmade. But there is no police, no military, no Marshal Law or obligatory vaccination.

THere is a lot of political speculations.
You have to be ukrainian to understand that if government spends 500mln of local money right away to fight flu, than big part of this will be stolen.

Sorry 29 died in Lviv region, thats half of all,
thats #y fact actually.



[edit on 1-11-2009 by former_ussr]

reply to post by former_ussr


Good post and good info, thank you.

For me, this and previous post cuts wings from a lots of rumors. Keep us updated, thanks again.

it may also be worthy to note, that the Ukraine also has quite a problem with TB, and if Swine Flu diid infect a TB patient, you could be sure it wouldn't be pretty.

Ukraine

Ukraine is among the top-priority countries in Europe targeted for improved tuberculosis (TB) control. Ukraine’s estimated TB case rate of 102 cases per 100,000 population is the eighth highest in Europe and Eurasia. According to the World Health Organization’s (WHO’s) Global Tuberculosis Control Report 2009, Ukraine had an estimated 46,916 TB cases in 2007, little change from 2006. Of these, about 44 percent were cases of sputum smear-positive (SS+) TB.

The site says there are an estimated 47,000 cases in the Ukraine.

Just some more food for thought.

Originally posted by former_ussr
Greetings to all from Lviv,


Sorry 29 died in Lviv region, thats half of all,
thats #y fact actually.



[edit on 1-11-2009 by former_ussr]

OK, thanks for the info, but these 29 deaths, I don't imagine that it's half of all the cases of this disease, just half of the hospitalised ones, there could be 10,000 people out there with the same thing, just not seriously.

This is just some rational thoughts, I've got nothing to prove it, or disprove it.

Originally posted by YouAreDreaming
I think all the current virus outbreaks are man made with any "new" virus that the CDC/Who reports on. I really want to know what this virus is.

Ebola is probably the most frightening virus we have to deal with, and it is showing more occurances of outbreaks in the last 10 years then when it was discovered in 1976.

www.cdc.gov...

There is a chart from the CDC showing it's progress. We know from Ebola Reston that Ebola viruses can become air born. At least with Ebola Reston the airborn version isn't deadly to humans as it was to monkeys.

I wonder how man made ebola is, and how weaponized it is. Will we ever see an ebola pandemic? I hope not.

Next is the H5N1 with the 60% mortality rate... which some theorize H1N1 will act as the bridging virus to recombine into a killer airborn H5N1 pandemic... with Baxter and the live H5N1 shots, this could very well have been part of the end game.

What ever it is, what ever the truth is... we are under biological attack. That much is clear. This is WWIII as this war is being fought on many countries in many hospitals across the planet.

Oh, talking about ebola, you remind me about that guy of a scientist Dr. "Doom" Pianka who has suggested to use the Ebola virus to exterminate 90% of earth's population
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Ko3

I am in UK but my GF is Ukranian in lives in central region.Was speaking to her today and she said the people are all worried.I regularly read online news from Ukraine so will try to find some good links (English language)
Gov today confirmed 30+ deaths.Most are apparently in Lyviv region.4 doctors have died there.Its worry for Poland since its on their border.
Russia has offered support-but the continuing spats between President Lushenko and Prime minister Tymeshenko are not making things any better as both are point scoring ahead of the January elections.4 neigbouring countries have sent humanitarian aid.There is a delegation due to arrive in Kiev tomorrow 2nd.November to assist withg trying to identify the problems.
London was also sent samples for analysis on Friday-its expected to be 2 weeks before results from those are available.


more here;en.rian.ru...


Also you can read www.kievpost.com

www.pravda.ru

ru.today

Sorry that link does not look correct;

Theres an update here which now says the number of deaths is confirmed as 53

www.kyivpost.com...

Four deaths in Bulgaria.

Currently viewing a flu map