Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

Originally posted by apacheman
reply to post by ecoparity

 

Thanks for the link.

One thing painfully clear looking at it though is that the deaths are underreported everywhere. With the new figures released by the CDC, the totals make a huge jump. If other countries are similarly under-counting, and this thing's accelerating as it looks to be, what's January gonna be like?

Popular opinion among the virology community is that the WHO is finally coming clean and trying to let the real numbers come out.

The stats are showing two dozen or more deaths each day in several countries - either the pandemic is much worse or they are "fixing" the cooked books.

For all the claims of "hype" surrounding this subject I find the fact the WHO is just now trying to undo the huge amounts of stat hiding they performed kind of ironic.

The other thing that occurs to me is the previous posts comparing previous flu seasons with current Ukraine stats.

The stats are completely off right now but regardless, people are comparing an entire flu season of previous years to a two week period this time and saying, "oh look, it's not that bad".

When this year's virus has killed as many in two weeks as last years seasonal flu killed in an entire year that does not mean "everything is OK".

Not to mention the difference in who is dying, (young and healthy vs. old and sick normally).

Most of the seasonal flu deaths are elderly people who get pneumonia and die after a month or two in the ICU, they weren't 19 yr olds choking to death in blood.

Whatever it takes to prop up the fiction, I suppose. Up is down, black is white and my dog had a litter with my cat......

hisz.rsoe.hu...

Thailand's North has alerted of the bird flu outbreak after almost 100 poultries died recently in a northern province of Nan. As Thailand's North is now experiencing the winter, during Oct.7 to Nov. 5 some 79 poultries died in six districts of Nan province, a senior official at Nan's livestock department said Thursday. The department collected some examples of the dead poultries and sent them to a nearby province of Lam-pang, where a regional office of the National Institute of Animal Health, is located, to examine, the official said. It will take about two weeks to know if the dead poultries were affected with the bird flu or A/H1N1 influenza, the official said.

Let's hope that they find only avian flu or A/H1N1, not both: that would be truly disastrous. I've been keeping an eye on this area for a week or so now, ever since I noticed a report about avian flu resurfacing in Vietnam.

The number of deaths is growing by 12% per day. That is if you believe the numbers they are posting. That will yield 1041 by Thanksgiving.

And with the under reporting the WHO has been caught doing, they are likely higher.

But what is troubling and confusing the Ukrainian people is the fact that they report over a million sick, but that number is just a estimate based on, you guessed it, the death rate.

You see they are figuring the number of dead is at the normal flu rate, and to have that many dead requires a million sick. It is not based on anything but a reversed ratio.

So people at ground zero are confused because the number of sick people they see is much lower. Hence, the danger of the illness is down played.

You doubt it. OK, where did they get the One Million sick figures? They are not testing people, they have 50,000+ people in the hospitals ALL untested, are you gullible enough to think a million people have visited the hospitals and they counted them all? They are spinning the numbers, always have, always will.

You want the truth, you can’t handle the truth!

Ecoparity
Thanks for keeping this thread on track. This outbreak is not over.
This still deserves our attention. I just saw a MSM news report that
just slightly showed how WHO numbers were bogus. They devoted
24 seconds to the issue.

reply to post by Absum!


I never thought of that... One question that I still have, are these the number of cases with flu AND acute respiratory illness? Or cases of flu OR respiratory illness?

I had heard there was only 1 person employed for the flu tracking job before the outbreak.. I highly doubt any small group of people is going to be taking phone calls 100,000 times a day, so I guess you have to be right. They must be using last years flu / mortality rate and the death figures (or atleast hospitalized) to calculate the numbers.

reply to post by seattletruth

One question that I still have, are these the number of cases with flu AND acute respiratory illness? Or cases of flu OR respiratory illness?

Think about your question. It should be obvious the answer is "or". They are keeping stats on presenting symptoms only because they do not have the wherewithal to actually test people and know for sure what they have. We've known that from the beginning.


[edit on 11/13/2009 by wayno]

I posted this on the other thread but thought people might find it interesting. It's the govt database in the US for tracking "adverse reactions" to vaccines.

Scary, scary stuff....

Almost all the flu vaccine reports were sore arms or feeling "flu-ish" afterwards. One serious report about a soldier but the Dr claims it wasn't the nasal spray vaccine.

Now, anyone can report into this and Congress mandates it to be kept, even patients can call in reports and after reading it, I don't see anything being left out or sugar coated.

I didn't find a single report of miscarriage after flu shot. I thought at least one would be there if the Internet rumors were true.

GARDASIL on the other hand is one scary as hell monster vaccine. That one has been reported to cause miscarriages and all kinds of bad juju. Based on the reports I would avoid Gardasil like "the plague".

Anyway, Here it is, Vaccine Reaction Database

Data is in CSV format, MS Excell or equivalent required.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by ecoparity]

www.charter97.org...

Viktor Yushchenko and Alyaksandr Lukashenka are to visit the Ukrainian one of the Ukrainian regions affected by swine flu epidemic. The Ukrainian president told this during the joint press conference in Kiev, UNIAN reports. Yushchenko didn’t say which of the regions is meant. He added his Belarusian colleague wouldn’t come empty-handed. Russian “Novye Izvestiya” reports that the Belarusian ruler and Viktor Yushchenko will visit Ivano-Frankovsk (the epidemic center) and bring humanitarian aid from Minsk. As we have already reported, Alyaksandr Lukashenka said yesterday that people “shouldn’t panic” about A(H1N1) flu. “Let’s be sincere – we stopped crowing about “bird” flu. The whole world was crowing. They probably sold everything relating to avian flu, now they are squealing likes pigs. Will we purr or bleat tomorrow?” Lukashenka wondered. “The flu, even swine flu, is not incurable plague or cholera, it can be treated,” the Belarusian president said. “We are able to cope with it, and Ukraine is able too. Do not fear, do not aggravate the situation,” Lukashenka stated. He Belarus was ready to produce medical face masks for Ukraine if necessary: “We have a gauze-producing factory, if protective masks are needed Mr Viktor and I will make them and deliver. But you must buy them, I know, you’ll stop buying them in a week.” We remind, even according to official data, the number of swine flu cases in Belarus is 4.5-fold higher than in Ukraine. The drugstores don not have anti-flu medicines, including Tamiflu, the medication the whole world use to treat A(H1N1) virus. Belarusian drugstores lack the most required things – medical face masks, Unguentum Oxolini, and even cevitamic acid.

Can anyone from the region verify this? 4.5 times the Ukrainian casload would be huge. I'd like to think the translating software hiccupped . Could they mean the rate of infection? Either way that is not very good.

reply to post by ecoparity

Hey ecoparity check the posts about 6 or so pages back on canada's info completely listing the vaccines an miscarriages if given more time tonight would look it up for you but you have got to bbe *snip* me if you think this *snip* in these vaccines are o.K. Where may i ask have you been on this trail? and why do you think these vaccines are o.K. That by itself is spooky coming from the information we all have and to try to make it appear as though it's not that bad; *snip*

Mod Edit: All Caps – Please Review This Link.

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 11/13/2009 by semperfortis]

reply to post by afoolbyanyothername


I am realistic enough to believe that nothing or not much discussed here on ATS will change things in the Ukraine or anywhere. I'm here because I want to know what is happening. I have Ukrainian friends here in NYC who are estranged from their motherland. So, I'm curious for them as well as myself. I am curious to really know what is happening there because it could happen here. Anyway, what's the harm in some discussion. If you're not into it just don't participate.

reply to post by Jim Scott


The Ukraine has around 46-48 million people, not 75 mill. Last I looked there were around 1.2 million reported infected in the Ukraine and around 47,000 hospitalized. I think someone just posted the # dead (around 240 I believe). These are only the ones reported and confirmed. However, there will be another waive which might very well be worse and these are only the confirmed sick, dying and dead.

More on Belarus, as usual, conflicting reports:

www.recombinomics.com...

Belarus Reports Almost 1/4 Million Flu Cases Recombinomics Commentary 23:32 November 10, 2009 The press service of the Gomel regional executive committee BelaPAN reported that in the Gomel region died of pneumonia eight people. Pneumonia was diagnosed in 827 people, including a 643 adults and 184 children. According to the press service of Belarus continues to rise in the incidence of influenza and acute respiratory infections (ARI). From 2 to 9 November in 18 cities of the republic controls 223,349 registered cases of influenza and ARI. Among the control of cities, the highest incidence rates of influenza and ARI recorded in Rechitsa, Gomel, Mozyr, Molodechno, Mogilev, Vitebsk, Borisov, Minsk, Soligorsk. In the region from 2 to 9 November diagnosed with influenza and acute respiratory infections (ARI), put 48,752 people, of which the proportion of children was 49% (24051), adults - 51% (24701). Share hospitalized was 2.7% (1,299 people). Among the hospitalized children predominate (60%). At all administrative territories of the Gomel region introduced a set of preventive measures. In connection with a high incidence in Gomel region on November 9 in 169 schools and three vocational training institutions suspended the learning process. The above translation describes a significant influenza outbreak in Belarus, which has many similarities with Ukraine. Eight pneumonia deaths have been reported in Gomel, which is adjacent to the Kiev Oblast in Ukraine (see map). In the latest report from Ukraine, the largest increases in cases were in Kiev and Kiev Oblast. In addition, 10 suspect H1N1 deaths in Minsk have been reported suggesting that the deaths may also be linked to H1N1 and hemorrhagic pneumonia. 90 such fatalities were described in Ukraine, and the total disintegration of both lungs is similar to cases described in the United States and Mexico, as well as cases in 1918. The cases in Belarus are widespread and the numbers cited for Gomel would be above the epidemic threshold. Most areas in Ukraine are also above the epidemic threshold, while the remaining areas are near the threshold. These high rates are driven by H1N1 because levels of other seasonal flu's throughout Europe and North America are negligible. Well over 99% of sub-typed flu is swine H1N1. The deaths in Belarus and Ukraine raise concerns that there have been small genetic changes in the virus position 225. These changes (D225G, D225N, and D225E) have been reported in multiple swine H1N1 isolates, including recent isolates from fatal cases in Sau Paulo, Brazil. The expanding number of cases and fatalities increases concerns created by the delay in the release of H1N1 sequences from Ukraine

crofsblogs.typepad.com...

According to official data, the number of A(H1N1) pandemic have increased by 63 in Belarus over the last four days. According to the Ministry of Health of Belarus, 165 laboratory confirmed cases of A(H1N1) flu have been detected since May 2009 BelaPAN reports. As of November 9, the Republican Scientific and Research Center of Epidemiology and Microbiology, 128 laboratory confirmed cases of diseases caused by A(H1N1) virus. Deputy minister of health and chief sanitary officer Valyantsina Kachan said on November 8 that 102 cases were recorded in Belarus. According to official information (as of November 4) 7 persons died from swine flu. Thus, in accordance with official statistics, the number of patients suffering from swine flu has increased by 63 over four days.

Who's on the ground there?

Can anyone report as an eyewitness?

reply to post by ecoparity


Ecoparity,

The WHO gets it's stats from hospitals, hospitals under normal circumstances get their stats from testing. Hospitals no longer test to see what sickness is killing the people and by symptoms alone mark their stats then refer them to the WHO.

What is happening in the Ukraine is an overblown scare tactic much like the one in Mexico.

And just like the Swine Flu out break in Mexico it will pass like nothing abnormal happened because nothing abnormal aside from a lab strain flu outbreak.

After the big scare in Mexico do you see today mountains of dead people? The scare brought the country to a complete stand still, it was that scary, and yet today it's no big deal.

But in either case don't worry about it. Baxter has come out with a vaccine that was not able to pass the corrupt standard of the FDA, just go get that.

TA!!

Izzy.

Oh, almost forgot to add.

I'm just throwing this out there just in case you don't know. The Ukraine is currently at war with the IMF over a workers rites dispute.

The IMF is flexing it's power and threatening the Ukraine government not to pass a bill that insures workers rites.

A perfect time for a nice huge scary plague to take over the news outlets.

Seems to be picking up steam:

preventdisease.com...

Nearly A Quarter Million Flu Cases in Belarus: WHO Remains Silent on Ukraine Plague As flu cases in Belarus near the quarter million mark, the World Health Organization (WHO) still remains silent on the gene sequences and cause of the pneumonic plague that has infected well over one million people in the Ukraine. According to the press service of Belarus, there were 223,349 registered cases of influenza and acute respiratory illness (ARI) in less than eight days from November 2-9. Among the control of cities, the highest incidence rates of influenza and ARI were recorded in Rechitsa, Gomel, Mozyr, Molodechno, Mogilev, Vitebsk, Borisov, Minsk, Soligorsk. In connection with a high incidence in the Gomel region, preventive measures were introduced in all its administrative territories including 169 schools and three vocational training institutions were suspended. As in the Ukraine, the WHO and Belarus government are not releasing the actual number deaths which are currently being suppressed. Dr. Donald Lau had stated in a previous report that the chances of the Ukrainian pandemic being the same H1N1 virus were statistically low since the high viral transmission rates were unusual for H1N1. He also stated that "there must have been some misrepresentation of actual deaths versus infection rates." The cases in Belarus are widespread and the numbers cited for Gomel are above the epidemic threshold just as they are across the Ukraine. The symptoms being observed in Belarus mimic those of the Ukraine indicating it may be the same biological agent which has infected both countries. The symptoms that were reported in the Ukraine were observed at different stages of the disease - a fever with a temperature over 38 C, cough, respiratory disorders. When cough was characterized by negligible allocation phlegm or dry unproductive cough with blotches of blood. All the patients come to hospital on average by 3-7 days of onset, were in serious condition. Period of time from onset to death averaged from 4 to 7 days. In all patients during a hospital for signs of respiratory insufficiency of various degrees, which quickly rose and manifested accelerated respiration rate, shortness of breath and effectiveness of independent breathing. X-ray studies were performed on 1-2 day hospitalization. Most patients experienced a double-headed particles of lower lung lesion, followed by a trend towards total destruction of the pulmonary system. The Belarusian Health Ministry had confirmed that deaths are being attributed to acute pneumonia. Although the number of fatalities in Belarus are increasing, and may rival Ukraine, announcements of sequencing data are still being delayed by the WHO, raising concerns of a covert operation to withhold critical information that should be made public.

What strikes me is that the higher the number of infected, the greater the probability of a bad mutation emerging, which is what appears to be the case now. While each of the mutations cited at 225 above may be small, what the cumulative effect is, well, hard to say, but most likely not good.

reply to post by apacheman


Thanks for the update, apacheman.
2nd line.

Pages and pages ago I raised the possibility that this was more than H1N1. In fact I said this was a hemorrhagic virus of some type. I explained that Hemorrhagic viruses were the most deadly in the world and were classified as Level 4 Biosafety. Diseases like Ebola, Crimean Congo, Marburg, Hanta Pulmonary Virus, Lhasa fever, Plague and Dengue.

I listed the different links of hemorrhagic viruses and the symptoms. How in the beginning they look like flu. Headache, chills, fever, muscle aches vomiting and oh yes hemorrhaging.

Even with these being the deadliest, there has always been a safety net, in that the viruses are not transmitted easily by human to human contact. In other words, they are not airborne and are usually only transmitted through direct contact i.e. blood or body fluids.

That is until now!! Whatever is killing the people in Ukraine is something no one has ever seen before, It is not the result of 1 virus and a bacterial co-infection but several. The deadliest virus on the planet, could not do what this is doing. Yes, hemorrhagic viruses do cause bleeding and sometimes massive amounts, but not like this! The organs have been melted, disintegrated! A single pathogen is not capable of this! Not even the Spanish Influenza of 1918 could do this.

This is maybe all your plagues hemorrhagic viruses your worst bacteria weaponized! Then aerolyzed.

Whatever these people have been exposed is truly UNGODLY, UNIMAGINABLE and UNRELENTING. All on purpose. Upon autopsy they are finding not one but multiple deadly infections. Most of them bacterial.

Please do not tell me the H1N1 has a slight mutation and this is the cytokine storm! While I agree cytokine storms cause people to drown in their own secretions, they do not cause organs to liquify.

I have seen a list of the drugs that have been ordered, and they are your heaviest hitters. The drugs you give in Systemic Life threatening Infections as a last resort. The list even consist of antineoplastics. For those of you who don't know, 'cancer drugs'! The doctors are trying everything and yet more and more people keep dying.

Will this virus come to the states or UK or travel the entire world? I have no idea. In fact maybe only a handful do. I can only pray for the entire world at this point. May God have Mercy On Us All.

Tomorrow I will post more about the drugs they are trying to use to fight this Monster.

Thanks,
Pax


[edit on 13-11-2009 by paxnatus]

reply to post by paxnatus


You always bring an interesting light to the thread........

reply to post by paxnatus


Great post.

I've been thinking that instead of trying to figure out what the virus is, best to figure out prevention and cure.

What would be good medical equipment to have on hand? (ventilator, nebulizer, etc)

What would be good meds to have? Pills and injections?

Also saw this earlier on another post jimhumble.biz... sounds interesting

Would appreciate any advice