Swine Flu Vaccine Fears Debunked

Originally posted by Copernicus

Originally posted by Aggie Man
And BTW, I trust discovery channel because they do not intentionally misrepresent the facts. Again, believe what you wish...more power to you. For those that do not subscribe fear mongering, this thread is intended for you. Otherwise just move on along, this thread could do without irrational non-fact based drivel.

The Discovery Channel dont do their own research you know. If they are saying something, you can be 100% sure its what the government and medical companies are saying as well.

I think you are the one with irrational non-fact based drivel if you are only going to repeat the mainstream opinion. We all know what they say. If you choose to believe it, thats fine. But all the facts of the "fear mongering" people are still 100% accurate, weather its on Discovery Channel or not.

Really. Where are your sources? Getting your info from Alex Jones and/or other non-medical professionals?

Originally posted by Aggie Man

Originally posted by Unregistered
Last time I checked, mercury's toxic.

It is available without the preservative thimerosal, which contains mercury and has raised health concerns even though no studies have linked it with any problems.

Last time I checked, it is available w/o mercury. Again, take this however you want. I'm not an advocate for or against the H1N1 vaccine. Just presenting facts.

Why put a mercury and a mercury-free version?

Does the Average Joes know that there's a mercury-free version?

Last time I checked mercury's poisonous.

Originally posted by Aggie Man

The vaccine contains no adjuvants -- additives that can boost a drug's effectiveness.

Pandemrix, is a influenza vaccine for the pandemic H1N1 virus, or Swine flu.

The vaccine is the H1N1 vaccine approved for use by the European Commission in October 2009 upon the recommendations of The European Medicines Agency (EMEA).[1] The vaccine is only approved for use when an H1N1 Influenza pandemic has been officially declared by the WHO or EU.[2] This vaccine was initially developed as a pandemic mock-up vaccine using an H5N1 strain. The public assessment report for the mock-up H5N1 vaccine can be found here.www.emea.europa.eu...

Advantages over other H1N1 pandemic vaccines

Whilst other H1N1 vaccines have been developed (see H1N1 clinical trials), the use of a proprietary Immunologic adjuvant, known as AS03 (which includes squalene), is claimed to boost the potency of the body’s immune response, meaning that much less of the inactivated virus is needed [3]). This is particularly useful, since once a pandemic is declared and pandemic vaccines are prepared, the inactivated virus will be at a premium.
[edit]
Dosage

The vaccine is supplied in separate vials one containing the adjuvant and the other the inactivated virus,[4] which require mixing before intramuscular injection. For full efficacy, two doses of the vaccine must be given 21 days apart, although immune response is observed in some cases after the first dose (see references below).

Pandemrix



Shenanigans.

reply to post by Aggie Man



This should be fairly easy to debunk in itself.

Thimerosol/mercury

flumist pdf





[edit on 23-10-2009 by Seiko]

Originally posted by Unregistered


Does the Average Joes know that there's a mercury-free version?

I don't know. I would imagine that if mercury is an issue to "average joe", then joe will discuss with their physician; who, in turn, would discuss the various vaccination options.

I would hope the avg. joe is educating themselves. If not, LOL @ them...I take my health seriously...if joe doesn't then he best be looking out for the grim reaper.

Really. Where are your sources? Getting your info from Alex Jones and/or other non-medical professionals?

You are the one claiming Discovery Channel as a reliable source.

Its the same info as the medical companies are giving out, wrapped in a more popular package. If you trust their info, fine. Putting their stuff on Discovery Channel doesnt make it any more credible.



[edit on 23-10-2009 by Copernicus]

reply to post by Unregistered


The flumist version needs no mercury, but it contains many other ingredients. It is also a live attenuated virus vaccine. The fear of shedding, or spreading, is what alarms people here.

Each pre-filled refrigerated FluMist sprayer contains a single 0.2 mL dose. Each 0.2 mL dose
contains 106.5-7.5 FFU of live attenuated influenza virus reassortants of each of the three strains:
A/South Dakota/6/2007 (H1N1) (an A/Brisbane/59/2007-like), A/Uruguay/716/2007 (H3N2) (an
A/Brisbane/10/2007-like), and B/Brisbane/60/2008 [1]. Each 0.2 mL dose also contains 0.188 mg/dose
monosodium glutamate, 2.00 mg/dose hydrolyzed porcine gelatin, 2.42 mg/dose arginine,
13.68 mg/dose sucrose, 2.26 mg/dose dibasic potassium phosphate, 0.96 mg/dose monobasic
potassium phosphate, and

From the OP source:

Oct. 23, 2009 -- With school closings, a run on face masks, and even a flu-tracker iPhone app, it's clear that swine flu is taking the country by storm.

As of this month, the flu, now called the 2009 H1N1 influenza, was widespread among people of all ages in 41 states, and it has been reported in all 50. Numbers of cases, hospitalizations, and deaths are unusually high for this time of year. And the situation is likely to get worse.

To stem the pandemic, the U.S. government is urging just about everyone older than 6 months to get the H1N1 vaccine as doses of the shot and nasal spray eventually become available for more than just high-risk groups.

Yet, while some people are waiting for hours in line to get themselves or their children vaccinated, others are avoiding it -- convinced that the H1N1 vaccine is unnecessary or even unsafe. Scientists are fighting hard to tackle those misconceptions.

"These are urban myths and you can't even track them down," said Greg Poland, Director of the Mayo Clinic's Vaccine Research Group in Rochester, Minn. "Someone says something that spreads virally from person to person and becomes truth in their minds."

Discovery is getting their info. from reliable medical sources. Where are your sources?

Mayo Clinic

Originally posted by Aggie Man

Originally posted by Unregistered


Does the Average Joes know that there's a mercury-free version?

I don't know. I would imagine that if mercury is an issue to "average joe", then joe will discuss with their physician; who, in turn, would discuss the various vaccination options.

I would hope the avg. joe is educating themselves. If not, LOL @ them...I take my health seriously...if joe doesn't then he best be looking out for the grim reaper.

Average Joe do not educate themselves. They rely on TV programs with Internet sites like Discovery Channel.

The flumist version needs no mercury, but it contains many other preservatives. It is also a live attenuated virus vaccine. The fear of shedding, or spreading, is what alarms people here.

Why give an option between a mercury and a non-mercury solution then? Why not give the flumist right there and then instead of opting for the mercury version?

Discovery is getting their info. from reliable medical sources. Where are your sources?

Mayo Clinic

Think Ill move on to another thread since you dont get what Im saying.

To the others: read my previous posts.


[edit on 23-10-2009 by Copernicus]

reply to post by Aggie Man


I myself was quoting from the center for disease control and the makers of flu mist. Not sure if you were asking me though.

There is some reason to be alarmed, and some vaccines do contain mercury. The Flu mist contains msg, many people are allergic to msg.

Originally posted by Seiko
reply to post by Aggie Man

 

I myself was quoting from the center for disease control and the makers of flu mist. Not sure if you were asking me though.

There is some reason to be alarmed, and some vaccines do contain mercury. The Flu mist contains msg, many people are allergic to msg.

I wasn't directing it at you. You provide a source. Plus you seem to understand the point of the thread, no?

Originally posted by Copernicus

Discovery is getting their info. from reliable medical sources. Where are your sources?

Mayo Clinic

Think Ill move on to another thread since you dont get what Im saying.

To the others: read my previous posts.


[edit on 23-10-2009 by Copernicus]

I get what you are saying. But, I believe your opinions are unfounded and are perpetuating a of the cycle of fear of this vaccine. Go preach AGAINST the vaccine in your own thread. While I will stay in my thread and remain neutral. I'm Just presenting facts...that's all. I wish more people on ATS would do just that.

reply to post by Aggie Man


You stated a dis=information campaign. Fear mongering if you will. I myself believe that people have a right to be hesitant about the vaccination. I myself will not be vaccinated. My problem is not that i think this is a government plot to kill me, or wipe out the population, but I have serious reservations about the ingredients and the handling of vaccines. People do need to be given proper information so they can make their on decisions.

I do have a hesitation with point 2 in your original thread. "And more than a billion doses of the H1N1 vaccine have already been distributed without any unexpected side effects or other warning signs", is simply not true. People have been hurt by this vaccine. lots of people every year have adverse reactions to vaccines.

Neurological disorders temporally associated with influenza vaccination, such as encephalopathy, optic neuritis/neuropathy, partial facial paralysis, and brachial plexus neuropathy, have been reported.

csl limited vaccine

8.1 Pregnancy
Pregnancy Category C: Animal reproduction studies have not been conducted with Influenza A (H1N1) 2009 Monovalent Vaccine or AFLURIA. It is also not known whether these vaccines can cause fetal harm when administered to a pregnant woman or can affect reproduction capacity. Influenza A (H1N1) 2009 Monovalent Vaccine should be given to a pregnant woman only if clearly needed.

But they are clearly calling for pregnant women to be vaccinated non the news. There should be a better report on the difference between these vaccines.

more ingredients; A single 0.5 mL dose of Influenza A (H1N1) 2009 Monovalent Vaccine contains sodium chloride (4.1 mg), monobasic sodium phosphate (80 mcg), dibasic sodium phosphate (300 mcg), monobasic potassium phosphate (20 mcg), potassium chloride (20 mcg), and calcium chloride (1.5 mcg). From the manufacturing process, each dose may also contain residual amounts of sodium taurodeoxycholate (≤ 10 ppm), ovalbumin (≤ 1 mcg), neomycin sulfate (≤ 0.2 picograms [pg]), polymyxin B (≤ 0.03 pg), and beta-propiolactone (< 25 nanograms).

People should read up on these, and not take my word, or the word of others. All medical decisions should be evaluated on a personal basis.

Originally posted by Aggie Man
I get what you are saying. But, I believe your opinions are unfounded and are perpetuating a of the cycle of fear of this vaccine. Go preach AGAINST the vaccine in your own thread. While I will stay in my thread and remain neutral. I'm Just presenting facts...that's all. I wish more people on ATS would do just that.

Neutral? You are not neutral, you have chosen what you believe in. You present it as facts simply because you dont believe the contradicting information. This whole thread is just about pushing your opinion. And like most people with their minds made up, you dont like people disagreeing with you.

Thats how I see it. You probably dont agree.


[edit on 23-10-2009 by Copernicus]

Apologies in advance if this video is already posted here.

The Katy Capsule

Soon to be Washington Redskins Cheerleader, Desiree Jennings received a flu shot that left her only able to walk backwards. She had a one-in-a-million chance of obtaining this neurological disorder.




(Edited Link)

[edit on 23-10-2009 by jkro21]

Originally posted by Seiko
reply to post by Aggie Man

 

You stated a dis=information campaign. Fear mongering if you will. I myself believe that people have a right to be hesitant about the vaccination. I myself will not be vaccinated. My problem is not that i think this is a government plot to kill me, or wipe out the population, but I have serious reservations about the ingredients and the handling of vaccines. People do need to be given proper information so they can make their on decisions.

I agree. But come on now...you read these H1N1 threads just like I do. Don't tell me there is not more assumption than fact presented in most of them. Not to mention, people highlighting an instance or two and saying "this is what swine flu looks like" Or "the vaccine looks like". Sure, there are rare adverse affects...but that goes for anything in life.

I think that everyone is looking at #2 in the OP and harping on that and that alone. Look at #1 & #3. How many "government forced vaccination" threads have you seen? Or H1N1 is harmless or will do less harm than the vaccine? it's all opinions based in VERY LITTLE factual evidence.

This excerpt from #4 of the OP is important IMO.

"The very people who say that are most at risk," Poland said. If you're young, you're unlikely to have ever been exposed to a virus similar to H1N1, which means you probably don't have a reservoir of defense proteins, or antibodies, equipped to fight it.

Fortunately I am old enough and have had several strains of the flu...so that quote applies less to me than some of our younger ATSers. Unfortunately, the younger ones seem, more often than not, to be the ones spreading disinfo and/or believing the disinfo.

Again, I am not advocating the vaccine, only presenting factual data for those that want info.

I'm done here...MODS feel welcome to close the thread...the point was made in the OP.

Originally posted by Aggie Man


I agree. But come on now...you read these H1N1 threads just like I do. Don't tell me there is not more assumption than fact presented in most of them. Not to mention, people highlighting an instance or two and saying "this is what swine flu looks like" Or "the vaccine looks like". Sure, there are rare adverse affects...but that goes for anything in life.


This excerpt from #4 of the OP is important IMO.

"The very people who say that are most at risk," Poland said. If you're young, you're unlikely to have ever been exposed to a virus similar to H1N1, which means you probably don't have a reservoir of defense proteins, or antibodies, equipped to fight it.

Fortunately I am old enough and have had several strains of the flu...so that quote applies less to me than some of our younger ATSers. Unfortunately, the younger ones seem, more often than not, to be the ones spreading disinfo and/or believing the disinfo.

Again, I am not advocating the vaccine, only presenting factual data for those that want info.

I'm done here...MODS feel welcome to close the thread...the point was made in the OP.

Given this last sentence by you, I should claim that you're being disingenuous. If the point was made in the op, you're not inviting any response from other ats members. I must ask why you made the thread then? This is a forum, I expect to see many opinions here from many different perspectives. This is in essence why I joined. I have rather enjoyed my brief time here, seeing others I agree with, but even more seeing the multitudes of those that do not. We must allow ourselves to be open to others opinions or this whole site would be pointless.

Your sentence in closing denotes an unwillingness to accept the opinions of others, and makes me question the agenda of just posting a"debunk" copied from a source without the willingness to explore it in detail.

Actually you can get it if you take the nasal mist. The mist is live H1N1 and the papers your given to read or should have been state you can contract H1N1 from the mist because it is a live virus and you can give it to others although it's extremely rare it is possible.

The reality of it is at least 3 of us at work got it after we took the mist. I got it about 10-12 days after taking it.

Here are some more ‘FACTS’

From the UK

'Doctors may refuse swine flu vaccine'...Several studies suggest up to 60% of GPs would oppose being immunised because they are concerned the safety trials will be rushed

www.guardian.co.uk...

BUT

'Swine flu: Doctors who refuse vaccine 'putting patients at risk' ...Doctors and nurses are potentially putting patients at risk if they refuse the swine flu vaccine, experts have warned.

www.telegraph.co.uk...

I would have thought that doctors were fairly qualified but obviously they are not ‘experts’ so I wonder why so many doctors are reluctant to get the jab?

I personally know of one nurse who will not be having the vaccine.

In Australia..

Children must wait for swine flu vaccine....

SWINE flu is killing children at twice the rate of seasonal flu, but under-10s will have to wait at least two months for the vaccine that is soon to be offered to every Australian adult in the nation's biggest immunisation scheme.
Health Minister Nicola Roxon yesterday announced that the first swine flu jabs would be given to adults from September 30. Health workers, indigenous people, pregnant women and people with underlying medical conditions such as asthma, cancer, HIV, heart disease, diabetes, chronic kidney failure and obesity would be given priority.
The medical watchdog, the Therapeutic Goods Administration, has ruled that a single dose of the CSL vaccine for the H1N1 virus is safe and effective in preventing swine flu infections among adults.
But a vaccine for children will not be available until at least November. Clinical trials are now being carried out on 400 children nationally. .

www.theaustralian.news.com.au... (September 19, 2009)

So basically, those more at risk such as health workers, the Indigeneous, pregnant women and those with underlying health issues are encouraged to take the vaccine although they are still waiting to see if it safe for children.....?????

But in the US...

Younger kids will need 2 swine flu shots

www.msnbc.msn.com... (September 21, 2009)

What about the regular preventative and treatment Flu drug Tamiflu?

The most common side effects of TAMIFLU® are nausea and vomiting. ….Other events reported commonly by children treated with TAMIFLU® included abdominal pain, nosebleeds, ear problems, and pink eye. Side effects for children less than 1 year of age are not known, because there is little information on TAMIFLU® use in this age group.
If you develop an allergic reaction or severe rash, stop taking TAMIFLU® and contact your healthcare provider.
Children and teenagers with the flu may be at an increased risk of seizures, confusion, or abnormal behavior early during their illness. These events may occur shortly after beginning TAMIFLU® or may occur even when flu is not treated. These events are uncommon but may result in accidental injury to the patient. Therefore, children should be observed for signs of unusual behavior and a healthcare provider should be contacted immediately if the patient
shows any signs of unusual behavior.

www.cdc.gov...

Why are many of the adverse events being reported from Japan? Initially, it was not clear why the neuropsychiatric adverse events and deaths were reported almost entirely in Japanese children. The FDA receives adverse event reports from all over the world and usually adverse events are roughly the same from different reporting countries. The reports of death and neuropsychiatric events associated with Tamiflu, almost entirely from Japan, was unusual enough to prompt further evaluation.

www.fda.gov...

Half of children taking Tamiflu have side-effects. Nausea, insomnia and nightmares reported after taking antiviral drug for swine flu, study finds

www.guardian.co.uk...


However, the only apparent side effects from the (a)H1N1 vaccine are

Tenderness Pain
Redness
Hardening of skin
Swelling
Bruising

Read more: diseases-viruses.suite101.com...
Only time will tell the real truth however


I certainly won't be taking any chances.


I wonder if these questions can be answered?

Ten questions about flu vaccines that doctors and health authorities refuse to answer

#1) Where are the randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled studies proving flu vaccines are both safe and effective?

#2) Where, then, is the so-called "science" backing the idea that flu vaccines work at all?

#3) How can methyl mercury (Thimerosal, a preservative used in flu vaccines) be safe for injecting into the human body when mercury is an extremely toxic heavy metal?

#4) Why do reports keep surfacing of children and teens suffering debilitating neurological disorders, brain swelling, seizures and even death following flu vaccines or HPV vaccines?

#5) Why don't doctors recommend vitamin D for flu protection, especially when vitamin D activates the immune response far better than a vaccine? (

#6) If human beings need flu vaccines to survive, then how did humans survive through all of Earth's history?

#7) If the flu vaccine offers protection against the flu, then why are the people who often catch the flu the very same people who were vaccinated against it?

#8) If the flu vaccine really works, then why was there no huge increase in flu death rates in 2004, the year when flu vaccines were in short supply and vaccination rates dropped by 40%? (

#9) How can flu vaccines reduce mortality by 50% (as is claimed) when only about 10% of winter deaths are related to the flu in the first place?

#10) If flu vaccines work so well, then why are drug makers and health authorities so reluctant to subject them to scientific scrutiny with randomized, placebo-controlled studies?

www.naturalnews.com...

Refer to link for answers.