Is Pumapunku our smoking gun?

Hans, what is the theory or view of mainstream scholars about the used metal I-clamps at puma punku, regarding how they think it was done.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b865de7fbfc1.jpg[/atsimg]

Those I-clamps at Tiwanaku are made of a particular alloy of iron, copper and arsenic that requires a smelter operating at very high temperatures.

A scanning electron microscope determined that the clamps were poured into place, necessitating a portable smelter.

All this in an area current theory denies an iron age.

jcolavito.tripod.com...

In Graham Hancock’s book Heaven’s Mirror is said.

A spectrografische analysis of one of the view been left clamp has demonstrated that they consist of a very unusual alloy of 2.05 percent arseen, 95.15 percent copper, 0.26 percent iron, 0.84 percent silicium and 1.70 percent nickel. There is nowhere in bolivia a source for nickel to find.

Moreover requires the rarely occurring alloy of arseen-nickel-bronze a melt oven with which one reach can extreme high temperatures.

Because both these images of where the clamps were poured into place are copyright protected, I post only the link to them.

Carved groove once occupied by metal clamp for joining stone blocks in Puma Punku temple , Tiahuanaco , Bolivia

img3.photographersdirect.com...

Carved groove once occupied by metal clamp for joining stone blocks in Puma Punku temple , Tiahuanaco , Bolivia

img3.photographersdirect.com...

Howdy Spacevisitor

My own opinion is

They melted copper that already had 'contamination' in it. Melting copper isn't that difficult. Nor do you need a 'portable smelter' you just pour it into a pottery vessel that has wooden handles and walk it over to the spot which is itself sealed with a thin layer of clay (to keep it from leaking down the joint). I believe Perez(?) found the source of that metal in the 1970~but I'm going purely off memory, so don't quote me. A good question for the HoM.

Copper melts at around 1000c but various inpurities will increase or decrease this point. I believe in SA they were melting copper around 4000 BP while in the rest of the world, in particular Turkey and the Balkans they did so around 7000 BP.

If the copper were pure it would be interesting, the fact it isn't just demonstates the primitive nature of the operation.

Several civilizations came up with the smart idea of uses 'staples' to keep smaller blocks together.



[edit on 21/9/09 by Hanslune]

Originally posted by Hanslune
Howdy Spacevisitor

My own opinion is

They melted copper that already had 'contamination' in it. Melting copper isn't that difficult. Nor do you need a 'portable smelter' you just pour it into a pottery vessel that has wooden handles and walk it over to the spot which is itself sealed with a thin layer of clay (to keep it from leaking down the joint). I believe Perez(?) found the source of that metal in the 1970~but I'm going purely off memory, so don't quote me. A good question for the HoM.

Copper melts at around 1000c but various inpurities will increase or decrease this point. I believe in SA they were melting copper around 40000 BP while in the rest of the world, in particular Turkey and the Balkans they did so around 7000 BP.

If the copper were pure it would be interesting, the fact it isn't just demonstates the primitive nature of the operation.

Several civilizations came up with the smart idea of uses 'staples' to keep smaller blocks together.

[edit on 21/9/09 by Hanslune]

Thanks for your opinion and thoughts Hans.

Hey Space I made one correction I had 40,000 BP instead of 4000 BP ! Edited in my copy


Oh and an added feature

The fringe writers above say

All this in an area current theory denies an iron age.

Current theory remains correct the iron is a contaminant and in such a small amount it doesn't need to melt

There is nowhere in Bolivia a source for nickel to find.

Wow and where is the city located? Right in an area near both Chile and Peru – in one of the worlds greatest mining areas. However Hancock is correct – partially, there are no operating nickel mines presently in Bolivia, however in the past there were but – just in Peru and Chile which are nearby- not that the poor native ever traded – and of course there are deposit of copper in the nearby area which are not commercially viable in our world but fine for the natives use.

Yep the local native often followed modern boundary lines! LOL


[edit on 21/9/09 by Hanslune]

Originally posted by Hanslune

There is nowhere in Bolivia a source for nickel to find.

Wow and where is the city located? Right in an area near both Chile and Peru – in one of the worlds greatest mining areas. However Hancock is correct – partially, there are no operating nickel mines presently in Bolivia, however in the past there were but – just in Peru and Chile which are nearby- not that the poor native ever traded – and of course there are deposit of copper in the nearby area which are not commercially viable in our world but fine for the natives use.

Yep the local native often followed modern boundary lines! LOL

Well Hans, fair enough, this is hard to disprove, sorely for me.
Your explanation brought a smile on my face and that is a positive thing in discussions here on ATS.
We still have different views/opinions about certain issues, but that is all part of the game.

[edit on 22/9/09 by spacevisitor]

reply to post by spacevisitor


Hey there Space

I live only to serve, or somethin' like that.

One other thing about that site I believe there was extensive reconstruction-that wasn't done very well so one has to be careful you'll not looking at their handy work instead of the original folks.

Originally posted by Hanslune
reply to post by spacevisitor

 

Hey there Space

I live only to serve, or somethin' like that.

Hi Hans,
Because of your saying above, I would like to add this one.

What is the purpose of life?

The purpose is so simple that most people don’t want it. The purpose is to prove to ourselves what we are, what we are made of. After doing so, that will determine where we go once we are off of this planet. Humans are here to determine where we go after the moment of death, which is related to how much more information and truths we become aware of, or not.

Lou Baldin alias former ATS member sleeper

Hans.

The purpose is so simple that most people don’t want it. The purpose is to prove to ourselves what we are, what we are made of. After doing so, that will determine where we go once we are off of this planet. Humans are here to determine where we go after the moment of death, which is related to how much more information and truths we become aware of, or not.

Way to complex Spacevisitor, I'm here for the pudding, iced drinks and excellent toilet facilities.

reply to post by spacevisitor
I'd say that Baldin has overcomplicated the question. The purpose of life is to perpetuate life. As motives go, it's elementary.

Originally posted by Kandinsky
reply to post by spacevisitor

 

I'd say that Baldin has overcomplicated the question. The purpose of life is to perpetuate life. As motives go, it's elementary.

Thanks for your reply Kandinsky.
He doesn't overcomplicated the question in my opinion, and you are right by saying that another “purpose of life is to perpetuate life”, but that particular saying from Lou Baldin isn’t meant for life in generality, it is only meant for the purpose of our life’s, you, me, and everyone else.

It’s up to any individual whether he/she believes that as to be true.

Believing what you want is great but there are certain physical laws that don't adapt to belief. There have been numerous people who thought they were immune to death, poison, sunstroke, drowing or bullets, all were wrong.

Originally posted by Hanslune

Believing what you want is great but there are certain physical laws that don't adapt to belief. There have been numerous people who thought they were immune to death, poison, sunstroke, drowing or bullets, all were wrong.

Of course they were all wrong, but if I understand that saying of Lou Baldin correct, it has nothing to do with HOW one dies, it has everything to do with HOW one lived.