Da Vinci Crop circle ( the netherlands)

So we get news like thus:

According to Peter Vanlaerhove the butterfly, which is 530 by 450 meters made by Remco Delfgauw, who with a team of 55 people have made the formation in one night, prior to this there had been preparation for it, which took 1,5 days.

also the dailynews PZC from ''Zeeland'' had released a comment about this:

''Made by us''

Blue area - Yes, it exist. And no, it's not authentic. The cropcircle which is shaped like a butterfly near Goes is in the night of thursday on friday made by a designer, called Remco Delfgauw.

He has been giving permission for this by the Royal community of whilhelminapolder.

On the internet there has been a lot of turmoil about this cropcircle, after a message from the Coen&Sander show of BNN on radio 3, The media ''appearantly does not want this important event to go public''

But also cropcircle expert Sjaak damen of the Circle Corp Archive in Steenbergen, has also confirmed that it is a fake cropcircle.

Yet... that isn't enough for you? If I was that farmer, and someone fessed up to making it, I'd be on the phone getting a lawyer. So with such a confession, it's fairly obvious they did get permission.

You just want to believe so badly, you ignore the facts looking you in the face. I doubt you would believe it, if all the members who made the thing, took polygraph tests. You'd assume there was some grand coverup. Why does every CC HAVE to be made by mysterious forces with a secret agenda? Move on already... this one is man-made.

reply to post by fleabit


Very good information.
Do you have a link possibly?

Originally posted by Sol12
Case not 'solved', period.

I am thoroughly convinced now,
mr. Delfgaauw is NOT the creator of the Butterfly.

Case is solved. Here is the page again. I will translate what i can.
Link to butterfly crop aka Atlas.
www.xld-sign.com...

Homepage
www.xld-sign.com...

Translated from Atlas page
Project name: Atlas
Design: XL D-Sign
Reason: Promotion
Members: 60
Date: 07 Augustus 2009
Location: Nederland, Province Zeeland, South-Beveland, Wilhelminapolder
Vegetation: Wintertarwe?
Size: 530 x 450 meters

The biggest cropcircle in the world and so the biggest design which XL D -Sign has done so far on farmland of almost 25 hectares.


[edit on 8/16/2009 by qonone]

[edit on 8/16/2009 by qonone]

reply to post by qonone


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qonone,

Are you aware of the fact that the links you've just provided
have been posted on each previous 10 pages already?

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Originally posted by Sol12
qonone,

Are you aware of the fact that the links you've just provided
have been posted on each previous 10 pages already?

I am aware it has been posted. But it seems you are not aware what it says so i tried to explain it again hence posting the link again, same as i stated in my post above, the word again. Did you read my post?

This circle is man made, no matter what you believe.

[edit on 8/16/2009 by qonone]

Originally posted by qonone


This circle is man made, no matter what you believe.

[edit on 8/16/2009 by qonone]

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qonone,

This thread isn't about beliefs.

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reply to post by fleabit


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To Fleabit, et al.

Who are those "specialists"??

The sources you've quoted have been posted multiple times already.

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As you and some others insist that these
quotes actually mean 'something':

Maybe it would be fair to let the readers know then, who are
Peter Vanlaerhoven and Sjaak Damen, the implicit
"specialists" your much cited quote refers to?

So here we go:

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'Dutch Crop Circle Archive'.

Regardless their name, DCCA is not particularly known for
any kind of actual serious cropcircle research.

They are merely archiving/highlighting
those cases, they consider genuine.

For some strange reason that usually means that a 'psychic',
Mr Robert van den Broeke is involved.

On their website, you'll find only very little
information of interest to the CC phenomenon.

www.dcca.nl...

www.dcca.nl...

Below two examples of their work.

Follow the links for more images.

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c4d85a163c04.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/d907439ef10e.jpg[/atsimg]

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Butterfly/DaVinci has been harvested.

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I just want to let you all know that Monday, on the eleventh
day since it's appearance, the Butterfly/DaVinci cropcircle
has been harvested. (17th August))

They have used two big harvesters and several trucks to
transport away the wheat, in order to get the job done in a day.

They actually worked till after sunset.

Initially they were going to harvest last week,
just after it had appeared.

Due to rainy weather, they say, they had to delay this.

This field was in dire need of harvesting.

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Those who have followed this matter/thread know that
according to the cover-story, the cropcircle allegedly
had been created related to some kind of an "event"
organised by the land-owner?

I have tried to point out earlier that this was
highly unlikely.

Now that the area is harvested, we know that
this part of the story, if not all of it,
can be ruled out/is fabricated.

Also, the land-owner has nowhere publicly
stated to be involved.

Here are the facts, once again:

(From land owner's website)

www.kmwp.nl...

A Shakespeare festival will be held in the region,
(not the actual CC area) starting next week,
25th augustus / 5th september. They will perform
'The Storm". There is small scale land-art created
for this festival with the actual theme; Shakespeare.

The nearest "event" will only be on the 29th of August.
(public open day, one time event.)

The actual land-art project they have is in October.
I have mentioned this earlier. They will reveal
specifically something durable and lasting.
Not a cropcircle.

The cropcircle/story has received close to no coverage
by the MSM in Holland nor, so far, has any promotional
campaign been linked to the DaVinci/Butterfly.

The only person/organization who publicly admits to have
anything to do with this is Mr Delfgaauw /xld-sign.

However, he doesn't like to talk about it?

They better rename it, to 'project Sphinx'.

It took xld-sign almost one week to actually mention
the 'project' on their hobby site.

Still, there are no actual details and facts presented
on their site, only a bare claim.

Most of their other 'projects' are scarcely documented.
(Only the obvious fakes have some additional info.)

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They had 10 full days now, after the fact, in order to
fabricate some footage or photo's.

Which they did.

Here is actually some footage they shot last week.
Not revealing anything though, and it hasn't been
shown anywhere, not even on Delfgaauw's site
will you find a link to it?

www.youtube.com...

Here is the best part:

The grain in the night-part of this footage is clearly not
ready yet to be harvested, it is green instead of brown,
and the buds aren't fully matured yet.

They even got the name wrong of the region
in their initial delayed comment on their site.

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9c467cc88ba7.jpg[/atsimg]

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Also, people seem to under-estimate the size of this thing
and Delfgaauw/xld-sign really shouldn't have claimed they
made it at night.

I consider that the biggest failure here.

After all, they allegedly had a permission to do this?
(One of many unsubstantiated claims.)

The logistics of creating this at night, even if
planned ahead is a daunting task.

Also, you need to understand that this is very muddy
wet land, and it is hardly as smooth and equal as it
appears from an aerial photograph.

This isn't exactly a flat drawing board. Even after
harvesting it still isn't very easy to work/walk here.

Let alone, to create a mega sized artwork,
with a perfect geometric shape, without leaving
any traces all over the field.

The overall design is very accurate and the circles
exhibit perfect vortex geometry inside of them.

Many more additional details can be noticed.

Which all ought to be explainable
by the alleged designer?

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/89814a65c27a.jpg[/atsimg]

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The irony here,

Isn't it really up to the 'debunkers' to
actually provide, if not demand some real proof
from Mr. Delfgaauw and his xld-sign?

And then, some here consider "me" a 'believer'?


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Click here for more information.

reply to post by Sol12


Hey sol i see your are still discussing this topic with great manner. I appreciate the way you try to find the truth in all of this. Good job. one thing I do find strange and that is Why would it be so significant for lets say entities to make one of the biggest crop circle in the Netherlands. Why not Britain's Wilshire. It would be more obvious for them to put there were the eyes of the world are expect it to be ? just an assumption nothing more.

But also if this answer you get from this investigation is not satisfied try to conduct some of our fellow skeptic members hints maybe you get more proof.

Ill hope this will bring something up for you

reply to post by 0bserver1

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Hi observer,

Nice to see you back here.

England has no monopoly on cropcircles as far as I'm
aware of, they appear around the world, even though
it is true that most appear in England.

As far as the 'skeptics' hints are concerned,

Where are they?

What points do they have?

I have seen only the same links, that lead nowhere,
regarding 'facts/details'?

I have only seen the same unsubstantiated
sources/info being quoted and copy&pasted?

I post here my observations, for those who care
to read some actual 'facts/details'.

For the rest,

It is not up to me to prove anything here.

Everyone is making up their own minds anyhow.

I don't have much answers either.

I do have many questions though.



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Originally posted by Sol12
The grain in the night-part of this footage is clearly not
ready yet to be harvested, it is green instead of brown,
and the buds aren't fully matured yet.

You're taking the piss right ?

It's night vision, of course the grain is going to look green because of the way night vision works, a green phosphor display is generally used because the human eye is most sensitive to the color green, which falls in the middle of the visible light spectrum, or do you have some new fantastic night vision technology which shows everything in perfect colour as it would look in daylight ?

Congratulations though, for ignoring the facts presented to you and continuing your already debunked claims, just like you do in every single thread you're involved in

Originally posted by Discotech
"just like you do in every single thread you're involved in"

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You can't handle the subject,
nor a decent discussion,
just come in here shooting at "me"?

Next please.

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reply to post by Sol12


Decent discussion ?

A discussion is 2 way, not one person presenting facts and sources to back up those facts and the other person completely disregarding what has been presented and going off on their own tangent of irrelevance.

I singled out the snippet about night vision just to highlight the ignorance in your postings. Note how I said "postings" and not "you", I wasn't shooting at you I was shooting at your postings, unfortunately it appears to be you who can't handle the subject otherwise you wouldn't put blinkers on and cover your ears when facts are presented to you.

Good day to you

Originally posted by Discotech

Originally posted by Sol12
The grain in the night-part of this footage is clearly not
ready yet to be harvested, it is green instead of brown,
and the buds aren't fully matured yet.

You're taking the piss right ?

It's night vision, of course the grain is going to look green because of the way night vision works, a green phosphor display is generally used because the human eye is most sensitive to the color green, which falls in the middle of the visible light spectrum, or do you have some new fantastic night vision technology which shows everything in perfect colour as it would look in daylight ?

Congratulations though, for ignoring the facts presented to you and continuing your already debunked claims, just like you do in every single thread you're involved in

I completely agree with this. Especially the part in bold.

Sol12 has no respect at all for anyone's opinions other than his/her's own. What they say is fact and everyone else is entirely wrong. That's how their mind works. Don't even bother trying to have a discussion with this person. You'll get nothing out of it.

Originally posted by Discotech

A discussion is 2 way, not one person presenting facts and sources
to back up those facts and the other person completely disregarding
what has been presented and going off on their own tangent of irrelevance.

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Discotech,

I really couldn't agree more with you.

Why don't you or anyone else bring some actual
facts to the table?

Why is xld-sign not bringing any facts/details
to the table?

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As far as you raised a point,

The wheat in the night-part of this
footage, is clearly immature.

Therefore it has to be archived footage,
not actual footage from last week.

Regardless how it was videotaped.

It hasn't reached the stage yet where it dries and hardens.

Just before harvest time, the plants are so mature and dried out
that the grain starts to drop to the floor.

If there is no rain, that's when it is going to be harvested.

This particular field was just about ready to be harvested
around the time the cropcircle had appeared.

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e7b6f3945238.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/ccdeec4a78ad.jpg[/atsimg]

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Only few people know that the land-owner is actually
very closely associated with the government and
advanced scientific research.

This is one reason why they have a Royal connection.

This is a HIGH-TECH agricultural research area.

The code name here is: IMHOTEP.

In short, a "management system for farming".

www.kmwp.nl...

They are developing an agricultural database and every
single detail of the production process is being stored in
the database, and used for advanced research and
for the development of applications.

This information is used by the government for legislation,
and to streamline activity between producers and buyers.

This is another BIG REASON, why it is very highly
unlikely that anyone would get a permission here to
get to mess around in a field of 36.4 hectare!

There is much more at stake in this area than just
a bunch of farmers growing wheat.

Very close by in the very same region is an
active nuclear power plant; Borssele.

And,

The national storage facility for all radioactive wastes. (COVRA).

Some info in English:

en.wikipedia.org...

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/6aef6c4001dc.jpg[/atsimg]

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Originally posted by Sol12
This is another BIG REASON, why it is very highly
unlikely that anyone would get a permission here to
get to mess around in a field of 36.4 hectare!

Or maybe that's the reason why this crop circle was made and we do not get more information about it, could it be that they were studying the effect of crop circles on the crop?

reply to post by ArMaP


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Hi ArMap.

One thing is for sure here:

If anyone has the ability to study the effects
of the appearance of a genuine cropcircle on a
farmland, it has to be this company.

IMHOTEP. (see my previous post.)

Many/most of these fields are equipped with sensors etc.

We can rest assured that the same/similar system is
being used to monitor radio-activity, because of the very
close proximity of the nuclear power plant and
the national nuclear storage facility.

Of course,

It is highly unlikely, they will admit to be studying (genuine) cropcircles.

This field was left to dry out for another full week,
even though it was ready to be harvested.

There have been 10 full days of activity on and
around this field.

Nobody talks.

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Many who have studied the UFO phenomenon,
know that UFO activity is often witnessed
around nuclear facilities.

According to ET, and others, we do NOT understand radio-activity.

There are aspects of radio-activity, which we
are not aware of, and which our instruments can not measure.

Therefore,

We are severely polluting the atmosphere, without realizing it.

Regardless of all the small accidents that continue to happen,
and which are not reported.

Some say, that ET is cleaning up our
mess, that we create unknowingly, again because
our instruments are not yet sensitive enough.

We don't understand the true fabric of Life and Matter.

There are subtle planes of matter that seem
not to exist, like germs did not seem to exist until
we had the instruments to observe them.

Our nuclear toxics are RADIATING OUT INTO THE SOLAR SYSTEM.

Therefore, it is no longer only "our business".

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The Borssele nuclear power plant was scheduled to be closed.

Due to the international rise of 'neo-conism', they changed that
and now want to build a second nuclear facility right next to it.

The Dutch have always had a strong stance AGAINST
nuclear experiments/weapons/energy.

The majority of the Dutch people don't want to live
in a nuclear waste deposit.

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Conclusion:

There are many reasons for un-explained
activity in this region.

Therefore it is not surprising that a
fake company like xld-sign was invented,
in order to have a convenient cover-story
for cropcircles appearing in this region.

And, for general purpose, to make the common people to
look the other way, ignore the issues at hand.

Nuclear toxics, cropcircles, UFOs.

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/5e1f56d292d8.jpg[/atsimg]

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Originally posted by Sol12
According to ET, and others, we do NOT understand radio-activity.

There are aspects of radio-activity, which we are not aware of, and which our instruments can not measure.

OK, it's natural that we do not fully understand radio-activity, we don't fully understand most (if not all) things, but that "according to ET" part is doubtful, specially considering that we understand even less about ET (if they exist) than about radio-activity.