Is Fighting Back Really Going to Help?

I'm going to bump this thread once.
I'm still wanting to see where others here are coming from.
I've heard no convincing reason to fight that wouldn't make things worse. I hope we all figure that out sooner rather than later.

reply to post by muzzleflash


muzzle, you're a dreamer.

I was rejoining my fellow Arctic Rangers (Co. O, 75th Infantry) walking along the lake shore and discovered a Brown bear with a cub between me and where I was going.

I had a .44 magnum, and as she stood up and sniffed the air, reaching almost to the clouds, that .44 felt mighty puny.

You're not going to have a crowd, all in synch, all holding hands and singing Kumbahyah. The sweetest, nicest crowd when hungry will eat each other. Literally.

I really don't care whether you will fight or not. In a tits-up situation, there will only be a small percentage who are survivors after a year or so, so the more dumbasses, peaceniks, pushovers, pacifists, and cowards, the better I like my chances.

I won't be preying on them, but it certainly keeps the other predators busy. Easy pickin's first.

Don't need a weapon . . . yeah. Not if you're planning on making a very, very brief, very forgettable statement.

This thing we call civilization - it's razor thin. Damn near invisible, and the only thing that keeps a lot of these predators at bay currently is the force that they know will be used against them.

Increasingly, you may note the higher and higher percentages of predators who just don't give a damn and do it anyway.

[edit on 4-8-2009 by dooper]

This is what happens when people start getting violent... just what they want... its starting...

We need to go about it peacefully... it is the ONLY way...

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Guard troops may be needed in troubled Ala. county

www.miamiherald.com

By JAY REEVES
Associated Press Writer
BIRMINGHAM, Ala. -- The sheriff in Alabama's most populous county may call for the National Guard to help maintain order, a spokesman said Tuesday, after a judge cleared the way for cuts in the sheriff's budget and hopes dimmed for a quick end to a budget crisis.

Circuit Judge Joseph L. Boohaker ruled that leaders in Jefferson County - now trying to head off a municipal bankruptcy filing of historic proportions - could go ahead with plans to slash $4.1 million from the budget of Sheriff Mike Hale, who had filed a lawsuit that temporarily blocked spe

(visit the link for the full news article)

reply to post by Odessy


I have no doubt you are sincere in your belief. I believe you are sincerely wrong on only one point... fatalism. Whether or not one is inclined to resort to violence to protect his loved ones is up to his own discretion. Would you really just love someone with intent on causing bodily harm to your mate or parents? Would you really reason that, “… well I just have to accept that this is the way it was supposed to be”? I think not. I don’t think anyone should be advising others how to react to rape, whether it is personal or governmental. Just to accept evil because you feel you must be nice to everyone is fatalism. To “love” evil is foolish, in my opinion, but to each his own.

Personally, I think that there is only so much one being can take. At some point a line is drawn and/or crossed.

Sure we can turn the other cheek. Sure we can see past the lies and deceit and everything else. But isn't that we've been doing all along?

At some point we HAVE to fight back.

Take fishing for example. If you aren't catching anything what do you do? Change. Change ur tactics, ur bait, ur vantage point.

At some point we must change. Change our tactics...our bait...our 'fishing spot', if you will.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by romanmel


fair enough. I suppose I'm concentrating more on the aspect of people fighting the govt based on their opinions on the current and coming situations.
If I saw someone hurting my family, yes, I would fight back, hard.
It would be out of love for my family.
If I saw someone getting raped, yes, I would attack the predator, out of love for the victim.
However, when it comes to the govt. taking away my rights (which is kind of the matter I'm focusing on), well, I guess thats a matter of perspective. They may think they are taking away my freedoms, but I have everything I need to be happy just being alive, staring in awe at the beauty of life and the marvel of our beings.
When it comes to physical harm becoming me, and not someone else, yes, I will show love, turn the other cheek.
I dont believe in Fatalism. I don't think we should just accept the current situation. I think we can change it, by showing compassion.
I would gladly take a bullet for a fellow human being.
So I think you and I were just on separate pages. I would fight to stop harm being done to another person, and yes, I may get hurt in the process. But its all out of love. They are all acts of love.

reply to post by dooper


I cant agree with everything you posted, I would like to point out that we are separate from wild animals, we don't need to eat each other to survive, we can make a choice.
You think its all about survival, and thats totally cool, we just walk different paths.
You see, I wouldn't do anything it takes to survive, no matter what the cost. I don't think this life ends after death, and I would rather move on to whatever comes next with a clear conscious that live this life with the regret of stepping on others in order to survive.

reply to post by Odessy



Good. I was glad to see that you reject fatalism, my major point of disagreement with you. I think you may wrongfully view the current criminal BigGov as just intent on taking our "freedoms". In fact, I think TPTB (who pull the strings of BigGov) have in mind mass exterminations (ie: false H1N1 flu and forced inoculations which will kill millions) as well as many other programs to de-people the world.

TPTB have announced they intend to reduce the world population to 500 million. That means the eventual elimination of 6 billion human souls. This then elevates my concern of where we are heading as a nation. This then DOES threaten my loved ones. With evil this great, we need to be sober in our response. Time is short and our loved ones and their future existance are at risk.

Reply to post by romanmel

They announced they wanted to reduce it to 500 mil? How did I miss this and where is the credibility to back that statement.

I'm not usually one to do this. But I have to see this one...


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by Agree2Disagree
Reply to post by romanmel

 

They announced they wanted to reduce it to 500 mil? How did I miss this and where is the credibility to back that statement.

I'm not usually one to do this. But I have to see this one...

 

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

 

Yes, the reference is "The Georgia Guidestones: American Stonehendge". You may see a short video regarding it's message to the world at:

www.youtube.com...

Actually, there are many organizations (Bilderburger, Trilateral Commission, CFR, Club of Rome, etc.) wishing to reduce the world population to various levels from 500 million to 2 billion or so. Nevertheless, it would mean, in all cases, a depopulation by several billions of our fellow human beings.

Pres. Obama's own top Science Advisor John Holdren in a 1977 book advocated the following draconian measures to depopulate the world:

"- Forcibly and unknowingly sterilizing the entire population by adding infertility drugs to the nation’s water and food supply.

- Legalizing “compulsory abortions,” ie forced abortions carried out against the will of the pregnant women, as is common place in Communist China where women who have already had one child and refuse to abort the second are kidnapped off the street by the authorities before a procedure is carried out to forcibly abort the baby.

- Babies who are born out of wedlock or to teenage mothers to be forcibly taken away from their mother by the government and put up for adoption. Another proposed measure would force single mothers to demonstrate to the government that they can care for the child, effectively introducing licensing to have children.

- Implementing a system of “involuntary birth control,” where both men and women would be mandated to have an infertility device implanted into their body at puberty and only have it removed temporarily if they received permission from the government to have a baby.

- Permanently sterilizing people who the authorities deem have already had too many children or who have contributed to “general social deterioration”.

- Formally passing a law that criminalizes having more than two children, similar to the one child policy in Communist China.

- This would all be overseen by a transnational and centralized “planetary regime” that would utilize a “global police force” to enforce the measures outlined above. The “planetary regime” would also have the power to determine population levels for every country in the world."

See an excellent article by Paul Joseph Watson, with screen scans of the actual passages from the book here:

www.prisonplanet.com...

Hope this helps in your quest for truth.



[edit on 6-8-2009 by romanmel]

reply to post by Odessy

Odessey, it really isn't important whether or not you agree with me. The fact is, as you speak - you're safe, fed, sufficiently hydrated, and the rest of the day is looking good.

You find yourself without those things, and you'll resort to some disgusting, desperate measures.

As did the Donner Party. Dalles de Morts, the crew of the Essex, Uruguayan Air Force Flight 571. Desperation makes folks do some desperate things.

Fighting back? We came upon a small village about an hour or two after some bad guys had left. They killed everyone, and there were a couple survivors who weren't actually inside the village at the time, and hid in the jungle.

Now these villagers never bothered anyone, weren't armed, never threatened anyone, but they were killed by these men just because they could.

Now if you want to hold to an arbitrary, high moral standard and die doing so, then I say, you go with it.

Evil men win when good men sit by and allow them to continue.

Its a machine , when it cant work it wont.
hunter gather, farm life, tradesmen, if you cant do nothing pick up a dead trade like black smithing, gunsmithing, it all depends on how much pain Bernanke want to inflect on the American People. (the last time bernanke was before Congress his name plate said "Hon." Ben Bernanke....
I dont remember voting for him.... did you... where does he get off on assuming a title like that.... Honorible..... how honorible is your banker... not... well he is there banker... his arse is even more water tight.

So when the people have had enough we stop -- they stop ... and we go hungry until we get a new new deal....

reply to post by dooper


youre right, I suppose it doesn't matter if we agree.
If I was stripped of everything today, there is nothing the land can not provide me.
Would it be as easy? no, but I would still be happy.
Life continues, its just our life situations that change.

and the point you seem to be missing is that I wouldn't be doing nothing, I would be trying to change the world through love, which is a hell of a lot harder than getting angry and shooting back... that would be the easy thing to do...

Originally posted by Odessy
and the point you seem to be missing is that I wouldn't be doing nothing, I would be trying to change the world through love, which is a hell of a lot harder than getting angry and shooting back... that would be the easy thing to do...

oh my goodness, i just came to this realization as well.

fighting back is the "easy" thing to do and just as pointless, really. in all honesty, don't you think thats what they want? for people to fight back, fire with fire? it just proves their point...or it does to the majority and thats who really matters in this reality, isn't it?

i don't think we are here merely to survive...i believe we are here for our souls progress and, dare i say, to ascend. can we do that when we are living lives in fear or even anger, at those who would take advantage of us? or shall we be the "bigger person" in the situation and choose to withdraw ourselves from the fight as much as possible.

reply to post by double_frick


I do think thats what they want, what they expect.
They can't honestly think people will just LET them take away everything they have.
Theyre just waiting for us to fight back so they can break out the big guns.

besides, I dont know what fighting has EVER solved...
Has it ever permanently stopped the bad guys?
Its a temporary solution to an ever going problem.
Thats why there is ALWAYS someone to fight...

Thanks for the response. I was beginning to think I was alone in the matter.

[edit on 10-8-2009 by Odessy]

reply to post by dooper


Let me change your example to express why I feel you are wrong.

There are five pitbulls and one chihuahua on the porch and the bone is thrown. You're the chihuahua.

Fighting back when you have less firepower, less technology, less of everything is suicide, plus it makes you an aggressive a-hole like the people oppressing you.

Pacifism and non-violence take longer, but the peace is more lasting because it changes hearts without destroying who you are. I've protested and had stuff thrown at and on me. I've been called names. I sleep just fine at night.

reply to post by dooper


dooper i agree with you and i'm on your side!
not looking for a fight and never do but if it happens so be it. most people will just be good little sheeple but there are enough who aren't to scare the gubmint-that is why they are doing what they are.
they keep taking away my CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS and they just might get one.
and i liked the thing about the bear- i lived in alaska and stared one down but i was only armed with a fly rod

[edit on 11-8-2009 by bigfoot1212]

reply to post by bigfoot1212

What these folks don't realize, is that you don't always get to pick your fights. You don't always get a choice to walk away.

You don't even get to pick the time or the difference.

In any state of relative anarchy, if you're going to avoid a fight, you better be dug in deep. So deep the ground is hot.

As I've stated, I don't care whether anyone else fights or not. All life is a race, a hide, or a fight.

You are predator or prey.

One or the other. Generally, predators avoid each other like the plague. It's the prey that gets everyone's attention.

Believe me, in a disorganized state, accompanied by hunger, shortages desperation, anger, frustration, obligation to their own loved ones, and those who just like to destroy for the hell of it - if you are still alive, it means you have something.

And SOMEONE is going to want that SOMETHING you have. And they'll kill without hesitation to take it.

You die, it's for a long time, and then who's going to take care of your family or those who rely on you?

You may have doomed them to the same - or worse.

You know that white stuff in chikenschitt? It's chikenschitt too.

reply to post by dooper


i fully agree with you 100%
hopefully you are on my side when need be
WE are the PREY and they are the the PREDATORS.
done enough hunting trapping fishing watching wildlife etc to know that sometimes the predator knows when it can't win so they back off.
only problem is in this case noone is standing up to the predator and when they do they get arrested because they did
so the intimidation factor is working for them. sheeple need to stop being intimidated!
just like the bear- don't flee stand your ground!!! will you get mauled? maybe but at least you fought.
i would rather die and have fought than to be trampled on by people telling me i need this needle stuck in my arm, you don't need this healthcare but still have to pay for it, etc.
i am tired of my rights being taken away from me- i can count 5 offhand so far- but isn't that why our forefathers fought against the british tyrrany and made the constitution so we shouldn't go through this again?
alas history repeats itself! not a hitler fan but he was an absolute genius in the way he took power and this gubmint is reminding me of that- scary thoughts there
i'm a fan of patrick henry and what he said.....if patriotic you know the quote

Originally posted by bigfoot1212
reply to post by dooper

 

dooper i agree with you and i'm on your side!
not looking for a fight and never do but if it happens so be it. most people will just be good little sheeple but there are enough who aren't to scare the gubmint-that is why they are doing what they are.
they keep taking away my CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS and they just might get one.
and i liked the thing about the bear- i lived in alaska and stared one down but i was only armed with a fly rod

[edit on 11-8-2009 by bigfoot1212]

No one is talking about being sheeple... in fact, it is unlike most people to fight back with love.
You can ask yourself what fighting (physically) ever solved... nothing...
And you can take examples of people in the past such as Ghandi who freed India from british regime... it took more than 20 years, but it worked...
I guess we fight in a different type of way... its a free country