I am a Military Recruiter and would like to clear up some misconceptions.

reply to post by Juston

Bottom line people. If someone wants to enlist, they do it on their own free will.

Sure they do....right after they are fed a line of crap from a recruiter. Don't try and pull any fast ones dude, I am former military as well....I know how recruiters operate. There are good ones and bad ones....the majority are bad. Maybe you are not, but the group of people that you have chosen to be with in the military are picked and trained to be able to convince people to sign up, even under the worst of circumstances. Instead of telling someone with a low ASVAB score that they are only going to get a crappy job that will not translate to any useful skill out in the real world, recruiters assure those people that they will be just fine. The reality is that a gunner, or an infantryman, or someone that pushes a button to launch a missile really has no real marketable skills when they get out.

Everyone in the military has a job to do soldier.....yours just happens to be pulling the wool over people's eyes. Just my observation....I am sure you are a fine individual, you just made a career move that has a certain stigmatism that goes along with it. So don't get all offended when those of us that have served as well decide to call you on your post.

Juston,

Thanks for the response. At least you don't start with a certain income and they deduct for everyone who doesn't join!

Cheers!

reply to post by alyosha1981

take what the recuiters say with a grain of salt unless of course it's written in their contracts.

And that is the million dollar question....has anyone here, that has been or is in the military, got their recruiter to put ANYTHING that they wanted in writing? I mean yes, you are going to have standard things in your contract, but just as you have said, your recruiter said you could get your choice of duty station and MOS, but neither of them happened. And I bet that he would not put that in your contract and sign his name to it either.

reply to post by desertdreamer


I'm going to be perfectly honest with you.

When I joined in 2002 - the recruiter that got me enlisted told the absolute truth about EVERYTHING.

It was the old man in MEPS - the career counselor I talked to - that lied through his teeth.

I had a good recruiter when I joined.

First I will say I do see where you're coming from but see my side too. My husband didn't serve in the Air Force to kill anyone. He served to provide for his family. I contribute back to society every single day whether it be as simple as asking the cashier at the drive through if it would be ok for me to pay for the car behind me's order or today dropping off food for a lady going on a Navajo-sp? mission trip. We have worked very hard to stay above water and this is really the 1st year we can breathe without struggling. The Elite may use the military for their own needs but we used it to provide food and clothing and an education for our family so we didn't have to stand in the welfare lines our whole life. Sometimes you can't take care of others problems or needs without taking care of your own first.

Maybe we were one of those families who did not spend money when we didn't have it when everyone else was living beyond their means. We did things the right way and if the world is going to hell (financially anyway) we were not a part of it. We paid our dues.

I DO NOT believe in war but as long as there are human beings there will be wars. I have to take care of my family first and as long as we are able I will help others who are struggling.

Originally posted by Mindmelding

Originally posted by Bachrk
I had to chime in here.
My husband of 11 years enlisted in the Air Force. Served in Desert Storm. After he served they paid for his college education AND paid him not to work until it was completed. He raised 2 babies without the mother while attending school and although he didn't have to he also worked at FedEx in the hub.
Today he not only has his BA, but his engineering degree (PE) and his Masters in Business. He makes a 6 figure income working only the standard 40 hr week.

The military assisted in our decent lifestyle today.

Almost makes all those dead Iraqis and Afghanis worth it, eh? I'm so happy you're a 6 figure income family as the rest of the world goes to hell. Maybe if you are willing to do a few more blood sacrifices you can hit 7 figures.

I have no hatred towards you, or anyone else in this thread, but for the love of god realise what you're doing, what you're contributing to. Are the material gains worth it? Are you people that shallow and unthinking? Don't you know what is going on in the world today? That the military are just tools for elitist powerbrokers that despise not only the people the military kill but the military themselves? Don't you know that the military won't be defending anyone if this all goes bottoms up, because they will be the first to be genocided, with soft kill weapons?

This is not fairytail america, land of patriots enlisting to defend the free, this is harsh reality america, land of missguided people under economic pressure and enlisting to prop up the global cleptocracy.

[edit on 20-6-2009 by Bachrk]

reply to post by mf_luder



Like I said, there are good ones and bad ones.

reply to post by Cool Breeze


Well said: I am constantly amazed at how the Americans turn their own.
We honor our armed forces because of their sacrifice, because they are our own families. My family fought for freedom from state, church and the
right to be all we can be, we in England repay our family by being loyal
and faithful. To be truly free you must allow others to be free in the path they choose, otherwise you are DENIEING FREEDOM.

reply to post by Bachrk


do not ever apologize for doing what you think is right. Your family sacrificed more than most when your husband deployed and I can certainly attest to the fact that you were not eating fillet mignon every night while providing for a family on enlisted pay. I think about how much we didn't have back then and I think about mostly good times. We had friends over for really bad steak on special occasions. We budgeted ice cream and extras for the kids.

Your husband is a smart man. He took the opportunities presented to him and tried to make his life better. And apparently succeeded. So the only thing you should be getting it a hearty congratulations for earning your way into the american dream. A chance to prove your own worth and provide for the ones you love. I salute you and your husband.

reply to post by Bachrk


Fair enough, but I guess what bothers me is the defeatist atitude. "Humans are bad, there will be wars, might as well just accept it and survive" type of deal.

This is not true. Most people are good, it's the minority that create the problems, the psychopathic minority. Again, ponerology.

As someone who is from an extended family that came from abject poverty and pretty much all of us made it to the middle class without any envolvement in the military I know this, the invitability of military envolvement, is not true, and submit that you're rationalizing to avoid both peer pressure and guilt. Not that I'm demonising your family, I fully realise most military personnel are just swept by the wave into the chaos and are only responsible for not realizing this and for not stepping away.

Your family is probably good people, but it was always a bad choice, regardless of your own personal profit. In the big picture, people like you empower the genocidal maniacs that do whatever it takes to climb hierarchical ladders and get what they want. Try this link to fully understand where I'm coming from.

reply to post by Juston


Hey I agree with you about military recruiters. I enlisted into the USAF in 1980 (called 'the delayed entry program') and went into active duty service Feb. 1981. I stayed in until 1988. Everything my recruiter told me about how basic training would be like, was accurate. I never found myself saying, "I feel decieved by him!"
Say, I got a question for you or any other military person who would know. Just sheerly out of curiosity only: I was in a classified communications job, where exotic levels of TS intel would be processed. After I left that access, I was given a copy of a (signed by me) debriefing document which describes the penalties for violations of security for all things classified. Ranging from a few thousand dollars, to life in prison, to the death penalty. Almost 30 years later, how much a 'Sword Of Democles', if-u-will, is this thing still --- sharply over my head? Because I have heard that the maximum status for much Top Secrets, is ( 10 or 20) years, and a lot of fear-based conditioning (which is nothing more) is often utilized to keep young impressionable enlisteds in line. ( I --still-- posess a copy of my debriefing document). (And theres NO expiration date on it!)

reply to post by simonecharisse


Really depends on the material.

General level of Secret lasts for about 25-30 years before it is available for the FOIA.

Don't know about the stuff you're referring to, though.

Also - I'm an Army Counterintelligence Agent and if I'm on here for the hell of it - you can be sure there are those here who are on for their jobs or the government to look for people to "get."

Good luck to you.

Well, glad to see this post is still alive with some decent replies added.

Do recruiters lie? Well, if they get caught, that's it for them. My Uncle was a recruiter for the Marines. He said they'd nail his ass to the floorboards if he was caught lying to a recruit. I also asked my recruiter when I enlisted and he told me the same thing.

I've heard story after story that starts, "my recruiter lied to me!!!" If Big Army/Air Force/Navy/Marines did screw you over... tough s**t! You ain't the first guy screwed by The Man and won't be the last. That said, I highly doubt Uncle Army did you over as incestuously as you claim.

Bottom line: Grab a box of crayons, the ball gag your wife gave you for your birthday and STFU while coloring! Life sometimes sucks and you just have to buckle the helmet tighter.

Originally posted by Mindmelding
reply to post by Bachrk

 

Your family is probably good people, but it was always a bad choice, regardless of your own personal profit. In the big picture, people like you empower the genocidal maniacs that do whatever it takes to climb hierarchical ladders and get what they want. Try this link to fully understand where I'm coming from.

Wow, generalize much? What do you do for a living? how pure are you? Don't you dare demonize this family with your holier then thou talk. Jesus himself said "he who is without sin, cast the first stone." think about that for a bit then come back here and tell us how this family struggled to "empower the genocidal maniacs"
You make me want to puke. Go back to Cali and tell all your friends about it at the "screw the troops" rally you have tonight.

'

reply to post by HunkaHunka

LOL! In defense of recruiters, they are not corporate headhunters and the military only needs so many majors, fighter pilots and snipers. Someone has to cook and type requisitions.....

Granted, recruiters often lie but it is not like kids are interviewing for a job, you take what they can give you and that's that. When I used to type up military notices for a newspaper I flat out refused to accept them from parents handwritten, it was simply shocking that every single kid from our area was in the Delta Force or Blue Angels, fresh out of boot camp. (More often than not, the parents had no clue what they did...) Apparently all soldiers are Special Ops, fly Stealth Bombers during the day and eat at Burger King every night because the military no longer employs cooks. One mother who swore up and down her son was Delta Force sent in for proof....a photo of him peeling potatoes in the kitchen. Nice. No, we did not run it though I begged to just to watch the vets in our area howl in anger!

I enlisted Air Force. My recruiter, and the guys at MEPS, told me I had to put down "Open General" on my list of jobs that I wanted. Being that I scored a 98 on the ASVAB, first try, my recruiter had many suggestions for things I would be suited for, considering I qualified for so much. I really wanted to work in intelligence. The five jobs I put down were four intelligence positions, and then Open General because, according to both my recruiter and the Air Force reps at MEPS, it would give me 100% spot in an intelligence position. Once I got to basic, I was thrown into security. 98 on my ASVAB and they want me standing at a door all day.

I got separated before completing training. When I went to MEPS and got checked out, the guy said I have flat feet, which was an auto-disqualification. He said he wasn't putting it down on the paper work so I could get in, as everything else about me was tip-top shape. In training, my flat feet (plantar fasciitis) acted up severely to the point that I woke up one morning in week 3 and couldn't walk. I as sent to a doctor, where it was confirmed I have flat feet and was sent to the 319th TRS, the medical flight. I spent 4 weeks there before they sent me home. The Air Force threatened to throw me in jail AND sued me. Why? Because they said I knew about my flat feet before I enlisted. I told them that MEPS told me I had flat feet but the guy didn't put it on my papers. They didn't believe me, and of course MEPS denied everything. I settled out of court. I got a plane ticket home. No benefits, nothing. To this day I have permanent damage from basic training that I have to pay out of my pocket to take care of because all this.

That's my story.

Originally posted by misfitoy
reply to post by Juston

 

The people of today wouldn't handle a draft too well

This is so true. It saddens me that our Nation has so many cowards residing in its borders. Any US citzen with an able body should look forward to their opportunity to serve and protect their Country. What people dont realize is that all the little comforts they enjoy every day, the freedoms to do what they will with their lives, comes from bloody wars fought by brave Soldiers. Ive not gotten very far into this thread yet, but what I have seen so far re affirms my beliefs that there are many cowards living and enjoying freedoms in the US.

The OP of this thread was merely trying to make a point that the rumors you hear about recruiters and soldiers are not generally true. Now I have heard stories of recruiters who were misleading in their descriptions of what may or may not happen. But I believe it is the person who enters the recruiting offices responsibility to find the facts out for themselves. The fact is, that the most important thing a person needs to understand when they enlist, is that they are giving their lives over to the service of the Country.

Stop whining about recruiters. Stop whining about evil soldier bodyguards of the devil. You people who say that are morons and are cluttering up our gene pool. You likely dont even deserve to reside in our Great Nation anyways. Think we have it bad? Think again, our country may be struggling, but we are still the best in the world.

reply to post by Bachrk

Bachrk, please do not take the following as an attack upon yourself or your husband.

I moved to Europe in 1985, so I am using that as a time reference. Before I went there I remember watching a documentary about the atomic tests they did in the early days of the cold war when they had soldiers in a dugout two miles from an atomic blast with no protective clothing. The military denied for decades that the greatly increased rate of tumors and other health problems that those men experienced had anything to do with the blasts.

I remember that I saw more than one documentary about agent orange, and how the military claimed at the time, and in any possible single instance will still claim that a veteran's health problems have nothing to do with it. A previous poster mentioned his own situation in this regard.

When I still lived in Europe, we saw documentaries about gulf war syndrome. Together or separately from documentaries about depleted uranium. Denial denial denial.

Your husband was very lucky. He gambled with his own life and possibly that of you and your children, if even some of the stories about depleted uranium are true. It looks like he won the bet. So far. Good luck.

In addition to the above, I am old enough to remember the My Lai massacre. It seems that Lieutenant Calley was given orders to do what he did. It seems also that at least part of the time that the unfortunate incident was occurring that his superior officer, Captain Medina was present. Medina did nothing to stop the massacre. Calley was court martialled and sentenced to prison (which President Nixon took care of). Medina was acquitted. He claimed not to have given the orders, but the fact remains that those who were present at the massacre testified that he was present during some of the massacre, and did nothing to stop it. The person who followed the orders was punished, in the end he was under house arrest for some time, lost his career, has been convicted of a felony, has a bad discharge, and has to go through life with the reputation of being a baby killing mass murderer, while how many people remember about Ernie Medina, who is in point of law an innocent man and a benefited veteran?

It would interest me to know why your husband would take the risk of something like that happening to him. As I said, he gambled and seems to have won.

Justin, I would like to hear what your response would be if one of your prospectives brought up the above.

reply to post by treemanx


Actually, (as far as a draft goes) I kinda meant it more in the way of Americans not handling the idea of being 'forced' to do anything, not so much being cowards. I get the impression that we have a lot of people here who wouldn't hesitate to nail a threatening enemy the moment they set foot on American soil. But yes, it's expected that there will always be some people who would run... I'm guessing that would be the case just about anywhere.



edit because I can't type today.

[edit on 21-6-2009 by misfitoy]

Originally posted by misfitoy
reply to post by treemanx

 

I get the impression that we have a lot of people here who wouldn't hesitate to nail a threatening enemy the moment they set foot on American soil. But yes, it's expected that there will always be some people who would run... I'm guessing that would be the case just about anywhere.

Running or fighting isn't the problem. I have and continue to support those who fight, and understand those who must run. The real concern, IMHO, are those who invite the enemy in. Those who open the door under the misconception that "everyone is basically good".

And lets not forget the "regret" factor. How many people enlist, realize they either can't take it or have a change of (bleeding) heart but don't take personal responsibility. "I was lied to", I'm sure, flows easier from their lips than "I screwed up". Especially in this society where nothing is your own fault.