Does the Right Want a Civil War?

reply to post by Genfinity


Genfinity, well put!!!

I actually agree with most of your comment(s)! Accept the conservative one!

[edit on 16-6-2009 by Bearack]

reply to post by grover


The reason the right holds a monopoly on talk radio is because the left doesn't listen to talk radio, and frankly the lefts idea of "progression" looks more like feudal mid-evil times where the king tells you what you can and cannot do.

America is overwhelmingly conservative, and it isn't going to change. That is why the right holds a monopoly on talk radio. Between TARP and this administrations people are getting really angry.

Nationalizations are not constitutional, the banks should have been left to fail. ACORN getting more billions in tax money, etc.

And the right is inciting hate? Uhh, the left might want to take a look in the mirror and realize what they are doing to the constitution and maybe they will realize why people are getting mad.

Oh and another thing, want to also know why people are getting mad? Because of things like this they take two instances of two whack jobs that do disgusting things and completely overlook the fact that some whacked out muslim went and shot two Army recruits and killed one.

First, let's all dumb ourselves down to the point we actually believe there is a "right" and a "left."

Second, we have to define the factors driving the forces in conflict. I'll assume we're going to have a two-sided war being fought by two "armies?" People keep calling this a "Civil War" so I'll assume the two armies will be federal and anti-federal respectively.

So what would motivate an individual to take up arms against the federal army and what would motivate the federal army to take up arms against its once-been citizens?

If the motivations of the anti-federal force meet your criteria for "right" then the answer is yes. If not, the answer is no.

What do you expect to be the anti-federal motivation and would the federal be justified in battling against this motivation?

Originally posted by Hastobemoretolife
reply to post by grover

 

And the right is inciting hate? Uhh, the left might want to take a look in the mirror and realize what they are doing to the constitution and maybe they will realize why people are getting mad.

One only needs to see the Olbermann interview with Jeneane Garofalo to see the left instills as much hate with moronic ideology that all republicans are redneck racist.

I am speaking as a conservative and not a Repub. Conservatives believe in personal freedom, protecting the general welfare of the nation, representative government, and yes, oh yes.. the Constitution of the United States of America. So, Let me tell you how this is going to go down.

The people of the nation today are basically alseep in the back of the cab as Obama and his propaghanda media, and his cronies in the House and Senate rape America, spend all of her money, demorilize her honor, and dismantle her Constitution. Like a racehorse on crack, they are swiftly, systematicly, and intentionally reforming a once free and honorable nation into a socialist/marxist totalitarian state.

As this happens, the people are beginning to rub theeir eyes as they slowly begin to awaken to the oncoming cliff of no return up ahead. Yes, it is slow and steady. The man in the white house and the cronies of congress are not unaware of this as they are keeping a watchful eye on the adults as they raid the refrigerator in the middle of the night like school boys on a late night party. So they have devised a solution and begin the spin to attempt to turn the populace against the oncoming barrier to their ultimate socialist goal. They link religious, conservative, and republicans in with the malitias, the terrorists and the crackpot extremists thereby scaring the crap out of the ones still sleeping. But it is a doomed plan and here's why..

As people begin to realize they they are now foreigners in their own nation, and that they have no rights or freedoms, they will react in numbers that far exceed what we are seeing in Iran today. In fact Iran today should scare those tyrants in America sleepless. If you read the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, you will see that it says that it is the right of the people to resist and abolish any government against the people.

There will be war. It is coming and it cannot be stopped. It is unfortunate that it is coming but that's how it is. The mistake that Obama and his Obominites make is to depend upon the military to squash open rebellion. They will side for freedom in numbers and not obey orders that hurt the populace. Obama will bring in foreign troops and the real war will begin. And it will be the liberal democrats and their communist Islamic leader that will make it happen.

That is why more than ever we as a people who are awake must begin to awaken as many now as we can. We will have one chance coming in 2010 to halt the tyranny, only one chance in 2012 to end it and undo all of the damage done to us all.

BTW, as this all happens, China and Russia will be thinking of just moving in and taking over.

So do not listen nor believe when they do this lying propaghanda campaign. After all, it was Hitler's propaghandist who said that if you tell a lie often enough the people will accept it as truth. Just don't believe it.

[edit on 16-6-2009 by Fromabove]

reply to post by Bearack

One only needs to see the Olbermann interview with Jeneane Garofalo to see the left instills as much hate with moronic ideology that all republicans are redneck racist.

If that isn't the truth.

I can't stand that women. Not only that, but the collectivist group think eats that crap up.

It seemed like during the period of the election and the mainstream realization that we really are in deep economic trouble, that there was a bit of a movement toward the middle and just trying to do what makes sense. I personally seen that as one of the few rays of hope in recent times. For some reason it seems to have been forgotten about and people are going into even more extreme corners.

Armed civil war? I think that's still a little way off but we're most certainly in an ugly ongoing social war. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if power mad kooks from 'pick a side' think it's the only way to go. I really dislike this saying but, it's scary.

I'm not going to get involved in your political theory battle but I will answer your question. If you could, please define "the right" for me. The term is used constantly and I'd like to know what you think it means. The catch-phrase is a reference to ideology that is often misconstrued.

"The right" and "the left" is a simple, yet effective diversion to build emotional loyalty to whichever side one perceives himself on.

Some one(s) Want Civil War! But I'm positive (gut instinct) that it isn't the right or left (however you define those terms). The political loyalty game is in full force. Each side ready to tear the head off the other, masterfully manipulated by an invisible puppeteer.

In order to culminate the master plan, citizens must be thoroughly divided, hating each other and willing to put our very lives and security at risk in order to denounce once and for all the other side of the aisle. Even if it comes to war. The times we are living in are no different psychologically than the first civil war. North and South. Hatred. War. All political scheming by the way. The people themselves didn't hate each other until the "invisible puppeteer" began pulling strings.

If you just stand back from your emotional, party loyalty. The view becomes clearer. There is propaganda abounding to support the division necessary to achieve global, world, planet dominance.

The crap election in Iran is a duplicate of the sham elections held here in our very UNITED States of America over the past 3 presidential elections. Cripes! A governor's race disputed for over four months ought to tell us something significant about our voting scam - I mean system.

You can point fingers all day long and find valid reasons to support your cause, your party, your loyalty. But what you can't do is determine exactly how you are being manipulated...expertly, swiftly, thoroughly and inescapably manipulated.

There are very, very clever people willing to do anything to help themselves. Those clever people have known for a very long time, that to get what you want, you have to be joyful about taking advantage of other people. You have to WANT it for yourself at any cost. Those people are the ones who are doing the dirty work of pitting you against each other. And being rewarded nicely for it.

Stop being taken advantage of. Wake yourself out of your dizzy maze of confusing rhetoric and get a clue.

Originally posted by grover
reply to post by 0010110011101

 

Not all of the right by any stretch and nor are all on the left anti-war either.

There are extremists in both political polarities and I despise all extremists.

BTW I think that the article in question is over reacting some but it is still a relevant question regardless.

[edit on 16-6-2009 by grover]

Really? So you despise MLK? Also most of our founding fathers would be considered extremist as well. Me personally, I don't group all my values up in one package with a bow and call them "Conservative". I am a libertarian, a Conservative and a constitutionalist among others.

I don't think anyone wants civil war. Women, children and family members die in war and none wants that. I think everyone just wants a happy medium and right now the scales are tipped and some feel it is entirely too unfair.

You don't have to put a label on your beliefs to agree that America is in bad shape and the leadership is not getting control and they are not holding sacred the values that made us unique as a country to begin with.


Note....

I, in no way advocate violence. We still have a system here in the states that makes us great and I too agree that a disagreement or difference in idea or belief should be taken out on the ballot box.

Also see my signature....



[edit on 16-6-2009 by Digital_Reality]

From the Declaration of Independence, with some tweaks added, the charges against the King of England. See if they fit Barack Obama.



He has refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.


He has refused to pass other laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of representation in the legislature, a right inestimable to them, and formidable to tyrants only.



He has dissolved representative houses repeatedly, for opposing, with manly firmness, his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the legislative powers, incapable of annihilation, have returned to the people at large for their exercise; the state remaining, in the mean time, exposed to all the dangers of invasions from without and convulsions within.

He has endeavored to prevent the population of these states; for that purpose obstructing the laws for naturalization of foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migration hither, and raising the conditions of new appropriations of lands.

He has obstructed the administration of justice, by refusing his assent to laws for establishing judiciary powers.

He has made judges dependent on his will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.

He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

He has kept among us, in times of peace, standing armies, without the consent of our legislatures.

He has affected to render the military independent of, and superior to, the civil power.

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our Constitution and unacknowledged by our laws, giving his assent to their acts of pretended legislation:

For quartering large bodies of armed troops among us; (Note:
community organizers ).

For protecting them, by a mock trial, from punishment for any murders which they should commit on the inhabitants of these states;

For cutting off our trade with all parts of the world;

For imposing taxes on us without our consent;

For depriving us, in many cases, of the benefits of trial by jury;

For transporting us beyond seas, to be tried for pretended offenses;

For abolishing the free system of laws, establishing therein an arbitrary government, and enlarging its boundaries, so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these colonies;

For taking away our charters, abolishing our most valuable laws, and altering fundamentally the forms of our governments;

For suspending our own legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.

He has abdicated government here, by declaring us out of his protection and waging war against us.

He has plundered our seas, ravaged our coasts, burned our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.


He has constrained our fellow-citizens, taken captive on the high seas, to bear arms against their country, to become the executioners of their friends and brethren, or to fall themselves by their hands.

He has excited domestic insurrection among us (illegal immigration?), and has endeavored to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers the merciless Indian savages, whose known rule of warfare is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes, and conditions.

In every stage of these oppressions we have petitioned for redress in the most humble terms; our repeated petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.

Nor have we been wanting in our attentions to our British (liberal democratic ?) brethren. We have warned them, from time to time, of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity; and we have conjured them, by the ties of our common kindred, to disavow these usurpations which would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too, have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity which denounces our separation, and hold them as we hold the rest of mankind, enemies in war, in peace friends.

Why is it that when some idiot goes off half-cocked and kills someone because of personal beliefs, it's the right wing radio talk show host's fault? This is the typical leftist mentality of blaming someone else for another's shortcomings.

I've never seen a group of people so averse to accepting personal responsibility. If you did it, you own it. Stop trying to lay blame for some idiot's actions on a talk show host.

That's akin to me not paying taxes and blaming all the tax cheats in Obama's cabinet. They didn't pay, so why should I?

And no, I don't want civil war. I want Mr. Hope and Change to do the things he promised but I know that's not going to happen. That's why I didn't vote for him. He's another empty suit that lied to achieve his goal. That's why there's talk of revolt.

As for freedoms Obama has taken? None yet, but he's working awfully hard at it. Notice he hasn't done away with the Patriot Act. You guys screamed the loudest when it was implemented, but now that Obama's in office, you'll let it slide. Pathetic.

Originally posted by soldiermom
Why is it that when some idiot goes off half-cocked and kills someone because of personal beliefs, it's the right wing radio talk show host's fault? This is the typical leftist mentality of blaming someone else for another's shortcomings.

That has been common for centuries. They blame the rich for the poor, they rape the corporations and then blame them for job losses, tell everyone that they disserve a piece of the pie and propose a utopia that is unattainable.

I'm normally not a subscriber of bumper stickers, but the one that now rings true to me is the one that says "Vote Democrat - It's easier than working"

reply to post by Bearack



There's a bumper sticker that says that? Go figure.

Seriously, I'm sick to death of hearing leftists place blame on everyone else. Obama has mastered it. He's the biggest pass the buck president there ever was.

I'm amazed that the op's question was posed as a serious question. It's not a left or right matter. It's a matter of people ready to shed the ball and chain that is the government.

Politics aside Grover, aren't you sick of the infringements of your rights? Please don't claim there aren't any just because your guy's in office. There damn sure are and I'll be fair and give you that they started under Bush. Obama has done nothing to rectify policies put in place by Bush that you guys were apoplectic about at the time.

reply to post by MysterE


And yet even when you talk to a lot of people who describe themselves as conservative about policy they are for the most part surprisingly liberal.

I am amused by the reactions to this thread... for the most part the posters have attacked the thread as opposed to answering it.

A cursatory scroll down the recent threads at any given time will bring up some pretty extreme right threads and there have been more than a few that do advocate revolution. So no this is not an attack or trolling thread.

I have said repeatedly I am opposed to extremists of all stripes, left and right. AND I have also said in regards to the original article that the writer was overreacting... still it is a pertinent question because among other things there are not left leaning individuals gunning down doctors or shooting up the Holocaust museum etc... such acts are consistently from the right.

Originally posted by 0010110011101
The right always wants war, civil or uncivil.

It's a very scary thought but I agree with you, I believe they do want another civil war and I think Gun and Ammunition sales (and shortages) show just how close we may be getting.

People are getting so riled up by Limbaugh. Free speech is a bitch.

To paraphrase the left. "You won. Get over it." The situation is the LEFT is now the Establishment, not the RIGHT and they do not know how to handle it yet. Until recently all I have heard is how we are teabagging if we protest, how racist we are if we are against Obama (I am from the South Side of Chicago and believe ANYONE regardless of color who comes from the Chicago Machine is a crook regardless of color), how violent and dangerous we are if we believe in the 2nd amendment, how ignorant we are if we believe in religion, and I can go on and on. The left not only attacks us but as seen with the Sarah Palin and Letterman thing attacks our kids. You list us as terrorists and than tell us you want us to sit down and work with you (only so long as we do EXACTLY what you want.) The left is starting to demonize the right just as the Nazi's demonized the Jews in order to gain support before they sent them to the camps. This article is an example. As to this NOT being a trolling or attack thread on the right. Have you stopped beating your wife yet?
As to if we WANT a civil war the answer is no. However if you brand us as criminals and terrorists, prevent us from peaceful protest, and attack us and our kids because we do not agree with you what choice will we have? Obama ALLOWS the New Black Pathers to intimidate voters with violence and lets them go. He removes Attorney Generals for investigating fraud from his supporters, He even confiscates peoples retirement money to give it to his supporters(GM stock and the Union) in violation of contract law.
The one hope I have for this country is Obama but not like you probably think. Before Obama took office from those I know on the left I was under constant attack, not for my ideas or beliefs, but because I was against Obama. Since he has taken office those people have been slowly learning. I say learning but that may be the wrong word. Now they are beginning to listen to what I have to say before attacking me and they are beginning to agree for they are finally stopping their knee jerk reaction when I mention the anointed one and actually hear what I am saying. This was not possible before Obama actually took office. If this continues maybe just maybe we will BE ABLE to sit down with the left and solve our problems. I think that is why Obama is rushing so much to get his legislation through so fast. He does not want his supporters to have time to realise what is actually happening and wake up.

Sure, I have been thinking of starting it actually. All it would really take is a person that has held no political office, never been a bigwig at a major corporation or meet any of the "qualifications" of being a President make a serious bid for the office.

I am talking about a common man, that appeals to the common man to either lose the election or be eliminated by trickery or assassination. Obama is not this man despite trying to be seen in this light.

So instead of a politician going for it, an honest to God American. One that says the right things and seems to have the potential to get it done. When the elites destroy this person to the point of becoming a martyr, then the war can begin. Because then the people will realize that they have been fooled and lied to all this time. The only other way would be for a state to say "NO!" and put their foot down and the federal gov't over reacts.

To answer your question directly - No, the Right does not want a civil war.

The Right wants a responsible government that treats people fairly, is fiscally responsible and follows the constitution. The Right does NOT want the government we have now. We have a government full of lying, cheating, self centered hypocrites that are enriching themselves and their "friends." We have legislators that ignore the will of the people and enact laws that benefit special interest groups that give them tons of money. We have political handlers that rig elections, twist people's words and live in a world where talking points and perception matter more than truth. We have judges that ignore the constitution and statutory law to render judgments that promote their political agenda. The Right, and hopefully many on the Left want none of these things.

The next few months or years are critical. One possibility is that the people of the US can take back their government by peaceful means and move to a more centrist ideology rather than the extreme, take no prisoners, left-right divide that exists now. This is what we all need to hope, pray and work to achieve.

The second possibility is that those currently in power continue on as they have for the last 20 years or so. This path will lead to more extremism on all sides. The political and social dialogue will become more course and confrontational. Demonstrations of all kinds will become more violent. Sooner or later there will be an incident that leads to the death of not one or two, but a few 10s or 100s of people. It won't really matter that much who is at fault or who shoots first. Once this happens, the genie will be out of the bottle. Once there is a perception that the "other side" shed the innocent blood of "our people" the civil war will have started.

I truly don't think that ANYONE on the Left or the Right wants civil war. But I also believe that both sides have positions or beliefs that they see as non-negotiable. The more one side gains power and oppresses the other side (it doesn't really matter which one) the more the other side will become desperate. This is the danger.

[edit on 16-6-2009 by itguysrule]

What I find sad is that so many people really believe in the idea of a "two-party system."Sorry to say,folks but we have all been lied to for a very long time there is no "Democrat or Republican" parties anymore those names are just labels meant to maintain the illusion.

I think the left is itching for a civil war personally. I mean seriously the government is getting more confrontational every day and way more corrupt. I thought the bush admin took the medal of the year for corruption but Obomba is outdoing Him by leaps and bounds. I really love all these news casts where they blame the right wing extremist for all of the worlds problems when its a corrupt evil government. You people on the left act like a bigger government is the greatest thing on earth but yet You provide no money for it. The left acts like they were the ones that abolished slavery but yet they are enslaving 89 million people in this country. So please keep pointing the fingers at the right but when it does happen the right will have so many excuses that You will be sorry for all the evil tyranny that You have heaped upon all of our heads.

[edit on 17-6-2009 by jkm1864]