Air France Plane down

the `old` coffin corner - the height where the speed of sound is coming down the clocks and your stall speed is coming up fast - ever notice why no one flies about FL400?

On Melbourne Centre on sunday, there was Virgin 737 at FL410.

Yet again, another Airbus...........they have a poor safety history....

Better than Boeing and Mcdonnell Douglas, newer Boeing and Airbus aircraft are about parity on each other, and that includes the A330; which has an absolute stellar record.

the time, money, and best mechanics, are only used on the planes of the wealthy and powerful... we peons have to know our place. we are cattle herded on planes to make profits for the wealthy, and if several hundred die..oh well.. that's the cost of doing business.

Not really. Here in Australia much of our government fleet is maintained by Qantas. As for the cost of doing business, it's cheaper to fly with fantastic safety than have fines or a plane go down - look at Qantas who has it's own specialised engineering department which managed to reduce IFSD rate FAR below average with GE CF6 engines.

why dont we fit planes with gps, we would know for sure then wouldn't we. its all a bit fishy maybe the first people to be saved by are friends from above, but lets face it we wont find out the truth. if it came down fast there would be debris floating around, if it came down under control surely atleast the person by the door would of got out.

Nearly all aircraft are GPS, and since the plane is a brand new A330, it certainly does.

did BA hide the 772 that came down in Heathrow? did the fact 7 boeing 777 have now crashed shake confidence?

Seven?

I also find it very weird the amount of different nationalities on the plane. 26 Germans going to Paris yet there was a lufthansa flight 30 mins beforehand?? Just asking??

Not everyone flies on there national airline, or else nobody would fly on Emirates............. Oh, and the Lufthansa flight was CARGO as it was flown by an Md-11.

A330 is a fly-by-wire aircraft - they don't have physical connection from the flight controls to the control surfaces. Complete electrical failure = zero control

IIRC, the rudder has manual reversion. Also, the engines are FADEC too.

How can other planes with their own radar not see it vanish?

Probably for the same reason weather radar cannot pick up light aircraft.

Hell, we can see what type of screw is on the wing of a moving 747 from top-secret military satellites...

Even the most optimistic estimations of top secret satellites don't show it even close to that. And what? You really think spy satellites can somehow monitor every single thing happening at every single moment?

No, this is a cover-up ... and It PAINS me that innocent people had to be involved.

No, you think it's a coverup because for some strange reason you don't know what weather radar is furthermore information is always scarce with plane crashes.

Realistically, it is a problem w/the design of the plane -- and AirFrance and Airbus are trying to spin media.

Wait till the investigation - premature conclusions are almost always wrong. So what evidence do you have that it is a problem with the design of the plane? None? Though so.

[edit on 2/6/2009 by C0bzz]

Good try CObzz.

I'm just waiting for someone to suggest abduction by aliens. It's almost useless trying to explain anything logical here.

This website is not denying ignorance... It's peddling and encouraging psychosis

reply to post by sy.gunson


They already did www.abovetopsecret.com...

I think they won't find anything of the plane, if what I posted is true and the Senegal gov was able to locate parts of it, that was hours ago, the plane can be all over the world or on some shore by now. (Just so I won't get off topic...)

[edit on 2-6-2009 by Raziel89]

I read yesterday that the cause for the accident may be an electrical short circuit cause by a bolt......the airplane was flying through a heavy storm.

Anyway, whta impresses me most is that we are in the 21st century and we still so undevelloped in some areas.
The region where the airplanes was is not covered by the radars and the coms rely only on long range radios. C'mon ?
Is this 1940 ?

Why cant they improve the track of comercial airplanes ?

Why dont they have some automated beacon that keep on working after some crash ?

Why dont they use a special paint for the airplane and its parts that would allow an easy find during night search ?

reply to post by Krpano


I think it has less to do with technology and more with politics of airspace and all that, I don't understand it that well so I can't really say though. And I think they were just about to enter the next radio range, the gap shouldn't be that wide (for high speed aircrafts) but I think other people can answer that better than me.

Also, the plane was visible after the crash as fires in the water. But at the ocean at night in terrible storm conditions, I think no amount of shine would help.

[edit on 2-6-2009 by Raziel89]

One thing that could have happened could be the same as the Helios Airways Flight 522, in which Oxygen was lost and everyone on board died of affixation, the plane continued to fly by itself for a while until it eventually crashed.

Same thing could of happened with the Air France, and that’s why no “Mayday” was sent out and why it’s hard to locate, as it could of kept flying for a while before crashing far off from where it was last seen.

Whatever happened, they'll start to find parts soon, the sun should be up soon in that area and then it shouldnt be long before parts wash up on shore or are spotted floating.

Mikey

Originally posted by sy.gunson
reply to post by Raziel89

 

Well if you hit turbulence in an aircraft at 470 knots or whatever speed we're talking then you get structural damage. That would likely include damage to wiring and systems.

Pilots are taught to reduce speed when penetrating turbulence but that's a dilema if you can't reduce speed because the air is so thin.

Ok, so what you are saying is that a 2005 airbus can not withstand turbulence at speeds a little above or at cruise speed. These planes can handle almost any type of turbulence and also a lot of lightning strikes, its no problem for this plane type (A330-200). Something else or a series of very unlikely events must have coincided to take down this airbus, it is a mystery so far.

You gotta love how the media makes up stuff.
They are now claiming that family members sent loved ones text messages before the plane went down.

Common sense and logic would tell you that this didn’t happen, for several reasons..... one, if the pilots didn’t have time to call for help and it happened so sudden, there is no way people had time to get their phone from their bags, switch them on and send a text.

Not to mention they where 35,000 feet in the sky, over the Atlantic Ocean.... which would have had no mobile phone single.

I hate when the media leave out the facts and make up their own.

Mikey

reply to post by Mikey84


>Yep, media at its worst, pure fabrications and speculation to sell more. I hate it too.

Originally posted by hitmen
The webbots predicted people disappearing and mysterious islands appearing. I cant link the link for this yet but I will try and dig around.

Slightly off topic but as for islands appearing there was this one in March in Tonga 69.64.78.143...

and then this one also from tonga

I'm not up on the webbots predictions however planes go down all the time it's just the amount of the suspected loss of life and the strange way that this story unfolded and was reported that intrigues me.

My son is a pilot and it's something that is always in the back of my mind.

My heart goes out for all the families and people concerned.

Lets hope for a speedy closure for them with regards to finding the plane and then let the investigations take place.

Alo ha,
I have been told the plane may be on land in Venezuela, near Palencho.
It had a major electrical malfunction, hit wing first.
Source- intuitive in Hawaii.
Bill

Why isn't the Media speculating about a possible terrorist attack?

reply to post by mrgalleria


and why was it flying more than 2000 miles of course?

learninglatinamerica.wikispaces.com...

see the bit at the top labeled `venezuela` - and see the big yellow bit called `brazil`

now draw a line fron rio de janeiro to salvador - thats the direction teh airplane was flying - and kpp going till the middle of teh atlantic ocean when it stopp transmitting.

Alo ha,
Once they go down that road, it's hard to turn back.

See This topic for updates on Paris false flag operation:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Bill

Alo ha,
This info about Venezuela is not based on logical deduction.
It is the opinion of an expert intuitive.
I know this person identified the approximate location
of a plane that had been missing in Hawaii for several days.
Bill

Originally posted by Mikey84
You gotta love how the media makes up stuff.
They are now claiming that family members sent loved ones text messages before the plane went down.

Common sense and logic would tell you that this didn’t happen, for several reasons..... one, if the pilots didn’t have time to call for help and it happened so sudden, there is no way people had time to get their phone from their bags, switch them on and send a text.

Not to mention they where 35,000 feet in the sky, over the Atlantic Ocean.... which would have had no mobile phone single.

I hate when the media leave out the facts and make up their own.

Mikey

They were probably text messemging from "LOST" island. This will help explain the points.

Anyway, no news after 20 hours

Terrible tragedy....

No hallmarks of a terrorist attack.

It's in the middle of the Atlantic somewhere after suffering catastrophic electrical failure. The failure probably knocked out all radio transmissions, hence no mayday...

The Atlantic is a big place, and from the planes last known location it could have crashed anywhere in a vast area.....

I don't believe there is any conspiracy here....just a dreadful accident.

Alo ha,
The plane that was missing in Hawaii is listed here:
www.kpua.net...
It went down on Tuesday, was found Sunday, June 22, 2008.

Here you can find the Air France press releases, Flight Air France 447 Rio de Janeiro - Paris-Charles de Gaulle, if anyone have relatives or related on the missing flight.

Sigh, dread.

reply to post by reugen


At these altitudes the air is usually calm.

There is something called CAT or Clear Air Turbulence. Aircraft can and do hit turbulence without being totally destroyed. What we're talking about here is a cascade of one problem building into another.

Turbulence and even structural damage from turbulence by itself is generally not enough to fell an aircraft.

Throw in depressurisation and electrical failure at night and then a survivable emergency becomes a disaster.

This was not just any turbulence either. These were towering Cummulonimbus "CB" clouds. CB are huge columns of superheated tropical air rising to very high altitudes in surrounding stable cool air. Inside CB clouds you can find updrafts and down drafts of 2000 feet per minute.

Aircraft flying into CBs can and do get torn apart in seconds. If there is one thing all pilots try to avoid it is CB

I don't know how high the CBs were on the flightpath but the aircraft was at 35,000ft and CBs can reach 50,000ft in the tropics.

It is not one single cause, but rather the compounding of several things.