Postal workers in BNP leaflet row

Originally posted by blupblup


Are so blind that you don't see what is in front of your own face?

The BNP are a racist party.

The British National Party (BNP) is a far-right and whites-only political party in the United Kingdom.

And I'm afraid that quote is out of date by several years as shown here

The party, which is preparing for its biggest-ever electoral campaign, has chosen Sharif Abdel Gawad to fight Bowling and Bakerend ward in Bradford. It describes Mr Gawad as a “totally assimilated Greek Armenian” whose grandfather, an Armenian Christian, claimed asylum in Britain.

Times

Going by this article they changed party policy in 2004 or so?

The British National Party is drawing up plans to allow people from ethnic minorities to become members.

Guardian

Originally posted by solidshot

And I'm afraid that quote is out of date by several years as shown here

The party, which is preparing for its biggest-ever electoral campaign, has chosen Sharif Abdel Gawad to fight Bowling and Bakerend ward in Bradford. It describes Mr Gawad as a “totally assimilated Greek Armenian” whose grandfather, an Armenian Christian, claimed asylum in Britain.

Times

Going by this article they changed party policy in 2004 or so?

The British National Party is drawing up plans to allow people from ethnic minorities to become members.

Guardian

ALso, I wonder would the previous poster get so agitated by the BLACK POLICE ASSOCATION

that certainly sounds a RACIST organisation to me- I think the clue may even be in the name!

[edit on 21-5-2009 by blueorder]

Originally posted by Flighty
reply to post by blupblup

 

Just did read the thread and my post still stands.

Well then you'll understand that your point does not stand...

As this is not political, it's racial.

The leader of the BNP has been convicted of inciting racial hatred/distributing information likely to cause racial hatred before.

As you clearly have no idea what this is about.... i urge you to read up on it.

www.hopenothate.org.uk...

www.stopthebnp.org.uk...

These are not the only sites either... there is much info out there on the true nature of the BNP.

Research

Originally posted by blupblup
Well...as i keep pointing out...the majority (and I'm glad it is the majority) don't see the BNP as a political party....or even a serious one.

so in your world MAJORITY rules and minorities should be crushed out of the democratic sphere?!

Why should they be offered the same "level playing field"?

AS they are a non violent democratic party

They're not even playing the same game...

Yes they are, they are a political party standing for election.

Not my cup of tea, but that is the nature of demoracy, I despise Labour also.......

reply to post by solidshot


Yeah....and do you remember the controversy it caused..?

Including the resignation of the Bradford BNP organizer?

www.independent.co.uk...

And yeah.... it's funny why they had to "convince" most party members that he was in fact "white" according to their interpretation of white.

The selection was reported to have caused some dissent within parts of the BNP, however, it was defended by the BNP leadership who said "ordinary members can rest assured that Sharif Gawad is not a racial alien. Sharif, despite his name, is white and British and the British National Party is staying true to its core principles". "Mr Gawad fulfilled the BNP criteria of being "a member of the white European race of people", they affirmed.

Source

Originally posted by blueorder

ALso, I wonder would the previous poster get so agitated by the BLACK POLICE ASSOCATION

that certainly sounds a RACIST organisation to me- I think the clue may even be in the name!
[edit on 21-5-2009 by blueorder]

The BPA were set up BECAUSE of racism and racist abuse directed at black and Asian officers.

The Metropolitan Black Police association then formed following discussions between black staff and the MPS. The association, which formed in September 1994, was launched by the then MPS Commissioner. At the launch the Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police said, "I have made it clear where I stand. I see the formation of this Association as the only way forward".

This was as a last resort and because of abuse suffered by black and Asian officers...

NOT because of hatred or ignorance or intolerance.....in fact, exactly the opposite.

Originally posted by blueorder
so in your world MAJORITY rules and minorities should be crushed out of the democratic sphere?!

No...my point was that I'm glad that the MAJORITY can see these bigots for what they are.... it has nothing to do with "crushing the minority".

The BNP are a racist party.

Racism has no place in politics.

AS they are a non violent democratic party

Non-violent??

In 1998, Griffin, along with Paul Ballard, was convicted of violating section 19 of the Public Order Act 1986, relating to incitement to racial hatred...

which obviously leads to violence??

MANY BNP members have also been arrested for racial attacks and inciting racism..... what is non-violent about that??

Yes they are, they are a political party standing for election.
Not my cup of tea, but that is the nature of demoracy, I despise Labour also.......

Only because they have had to hide their agenda and peddle their racist filth in more subtle ways and do all the "sieg heil" crap behind closed doors... doesn't mean they don't do it...

They have had to wise up.....

Originally posted by blupblup
The BPA were set up BECAUSE of racism and racist abuse directed at black and Asian officers.

what a ridiculous justification, like a white fella joining the KKK because he got attacked by a black person

Counter alleged racism by setting up a RACIST organisation- yeah that works

Blupblup, why not go get your pitchfork and torch now?

Seriously, you are the poster child for the NWO - no free speech, no free thought. Everyone will be identical, there are no differences between anyone - nobody is allowed an independent say.

I don't vote BNP. I'd vote UKIP, personally. I don't advocate deciding party membership and policies by race.

However!

I would not dream of telling them they may not do it. If they want to try, go for it, and if people vote for them, fine, i'll vote the other way, but this is a DEMOCRACY and therefore they are entitled to put forward their views and opinions - if you don't like it, don't vote for it.

But for God's sake, shut up you whining liberal Nazi fascist. Not everyone holds your values, so stop insisting everyone must! You are literally one step away from Hitler, and that one step will vanish when you start trotting off the 'racists' to concentration camps instead of Jews...

Originally posted by blupblup
No...my point was that I'm glad that the MAJORITY can see these bigots for what they are.... it has nothing to do with "crushing the minority".

The BNP are a racist party.

Racism has no place in politics.

I think people decide what has a "place" in politics and your definition AS SHOWN ABOVE clearly differs from mine and many others- if you are so sure the British people think so little of the BNP then why are you afraid for them to have the same rights as other parties?

Non-violent??

In 1998, Griffin, along with Paul Ballard, was convicted of violating section 19 of the Public Order Act 1986, relating to incitement to racial hatred...

which obviously leads to violence??

MANY BNP members have also been arrested for racial attacks and inciting racism..... what is non-violent about that??

That is your reasoning, do you know that Labour party members have been arrested for violence, breaking the law etc, does that make Labour a "violent" party- super reasoning, pat yourself on the back with an anti fa sticker

Only because they have had to hide their agenda and peddle their racist filth in more subtle ways and do all the "sieg heil" crap behind closed doors... doesn't mean they don't do it...

They have had to wise up.....

So they are damned if they do, damned if they don't- again retarded reasoninbg.

If you are so confident then let them test themselves at the ballot box.

What a great choice we have eh, we could elect self serving fraudsters who have sold our country to the EU and abandoned any notion of dealing with immigration

Spare me your false righteousness, BNP aint great, neither are Labour or the Tories

reply to post by blupblup


What may have eventuated in the past has nothing to do with this current batch of pamphlets.

And even the Royal Mail says they have a legal responsibility to deliver the mail.

Royal Mail said it would be working with employees as sensitively as it could but emphasised that it had legal obligations, under the Representation of People Act.

I'm not interested in the history of the BNP party because this isn't what the threads about.
It's about the delivery of BNP election pamphlets and whether they should be delivered or not, based on the current content.

Why haven't the people who are spitting at and assaulting postal workers getting a knock on the door from the local bobby?
This is still a democracy and while a party is legal and following the rules, (the guy hasn't been arrested over this current batch , so he's obviously cleaned up his act) then the mail should be delivered.

If there was anything offensive written in these pamphlets they would be pulled and the BNP would be sued again.
This hasn't happened ......

Originally posted by blueorder
what a ridiculous justification, like a white fella joining the KKK because he got attacked by a black person

Counter alleged racism by setting up a RACIST organisation- yeah that works

What???

It's nothing like that at all...the BPA are not a racist group...
They were set up BECAUSE of racial abuse suffered by black and asian officers?

How is that not clear to you?

You have no clue...

And if tables were turned and whites were the minority and suffered abuse and discrimination on the scale that black and Asian officers did.... i would have no trouble setting up a WPA at all.


The police force in the UK is institutionally racist.

They HAD to set this up because of the abuse suffered by the aforementioned officers.

www.nbpa.co.uk...


Again....research... it's the best way to educate yourself.
Otherwise you are embracing ignorance...... not denying it.

[edit on 21/5/09 by blupblup]

Originally posted by The Last Man on Earth
Blupblup, why not go get your pitchfork and torch now?

Seriously, you are the poster child for the NWO - no free speech, no free thought. Everyone will be identical, there are no differences between anyone - nobody is allowed an independent say.

I don't vote BNP. I'd vote UKIP, personally. I don't advocate deciding party membership and policies by race.

Yes that's right.

Because i am against racism and find the BNP to be a disgusting group of ignorant ***** ..... that must mean i am all for the NWO.

I think you are painting a rather distorted picture of my views...

I love diversity and love my country and love multiculturalism.... which is exactly why your whole

"no free speech, no free thought. Everyone will be identical, there are no differences between anyone - nobody is allowed an independent say."

Is absolutely against what i am talking about.
I don't get how you can arrive at that conclusions because i am against the BNP and against racism??

Very strange....

Originally posted by blupblup
What???

it was perfectly clear

It's nothing like that at all...the BPA are not a racist group...

So if they are not a racist group, why do they have the word "BLACK" in their name, duh?!!

They were set up BECAUSE of racial abuse suffered by black and asian officers?

That is the justification given for it being set up, same way as someone could JUSTIFY voting BNP because a black man mugged him- both are racist

You have no clue...

You don't even think rationally as the above situation highlights- you are so blinded by your own "liberal" fascism that you are inherently "good" and anyone opposing you is wrong- even though the BPA is specially as RACE based organisation, same as the KKK!

And if tables were turned and whites were the minority and suffered abuse and discrimination on the scale that black and Asian officers did.... i would have no trouble setting up a WPA at all.

The WPA would be a racist organisation

The police force in the UK is institutionally racist.

utter "liberal" fascist nonsense- invididuals may be racist, but the organisation is not, although the BPA specifically IS racist

They HAD to set this up because of the abuse suffered by the aforementioned officers.

no they didn't, they chose to counter ALLEGED racism by setting up an overtly RACIST and exclusive organisation

Again....research... it's the best way to educate yourself.
Otherwise you are embracing ignorance...... not denying it.
[edit on 21/5/09 by blupblup]

stunningly funny considering your abandonment of reason and asertion that an organisation which specifies a race in it's name and is specifically for one particular race, is not racist


Yeah, pat 2 anti fa stickers on yer back

Originally posted by blupblupBecause i am against racism

yet support race based police organisations buwahahahah

I think you are painting a rather distorted picture of my views...

y
you distort them yourself

I love diversity and love my country and love multiculturalism

what meaningless gibberish- every country has diversity as, whisper it, every human being is "diverse"- you class "diverse" on a group basis, whether it be religion or race- classic fascist behaviour

.. which is exactly why your whole

"no free speech, no free thought. Everyone will be identical, there are no differences between anyone - nobody is allowed an independent say."

Is absolutely against what i am talking about.
I don't get how you can arrive at that conclusions because i am against the BNP and against racism??

Very strange....

you actually do not understand what you are arguing for or against- words lose meaning with you, your liberal fascism blinds you

Originally posted by blupblup


I would prefer you put the whole quote mate (as i just did above)...so as not to make me look like i was saying i thought what hitler did was a good or right thing... (as you tried to do...very sly)

Not my intention at all.
No attempt at being 'sly' at all.

Stop making assumptions about people and their intentions.

I thought you were a little bit better than that but obviously not....shame.

Just intended to point out the difference in approach.
Far right instantly equates to Hitler and the horrific crimes committed in his name.
Hence justification for the vilification and censorship of right wing parties.
The same process is not applied to left-wing parties.
Socialist Workers Party doesn't equally equate to Stalin or Mao.
Why the difference in approach.
All three men committed horrific acts and murdered millions between them.
So why the different approaches?
Because people just want to ignore the blot on the utopian, PC driven nonsense that is SWP propoganda.

Well...as i keep pointing out...the majority (and I'm glad it is the majority) don't see the BNP as a political party....or even a serious one

Everyone I know thinks they are a 'Political Party', even those who absolutely despise them.
What is your definition of a 'Political Party'?
en.wikipedia.org...
Think that pretty much fit's the bill.

Why should they be offered the same "level playing field"?

They're not even playing the same game...

Because allegedly we live in a democracy where free speech is allowed, even if we disagree with it.
Pretty straight forward in my book and ANY restrictions on free speech should be discouraged and resisted.

If you despise the thoughts and ideals of the BNP so much then actively work to oppose them, (as you seem to be doing very well here on ATS).

How do you know i don't?

There are a few groups who are fighting against these bigots....

Please don't assume anything.

I merely meant to say that you seem to be very passionate about this and seem to be doing a very good job of getting your point of view across, (despite not agreeing with a lot of it)

Censorship of any kind is abhorent.
That is exactly what those Nazi's you so obviously depsise so much did.
Can't you see the similarities?

The way to oppose something is to speak out and to counter their arguements, not to ban them.

If you are then I respect you for having the strength of your convictions to do something positive rather than to just sit and moan.

No assumption was made at all, except by you possibly?

I have made my personal views known previously, I will not repeat myself.
Suffice to say we need a catalyst to provoke and stimulate honest and open discussion and debate on various important issues.

And i have read them.... and per your "we need a good debate about important issues" line.... i totally agree with you.

But i don't think that using the BNP as a short term fix will help in the long run.

I understand that people are pissed off with the way things are in the UK.... i really do... but punishing "non-whites" is not going to help anyone or ultimately, achieve anything.

Hell, I never want a BNP government, (I despise Party Politics as a whole, it is outdated and has failed us miserably!)
But, and it is a massive but, they are striking a chord with the general population at present with their concerns on immigration, the EU etc which the major parties are completely ignoring.
A sizeable vote for the BNP will acts as a catalyst to provoke debate.
It is sad that it has come to this but both the major political parties and our current electoral and government processes have let us down so much and have led us to this awful place.

Please do not make accusations in future without seeking clarification, some things are simply mis-interpreted, other's are just errors of judgement or genuine mistakes.


Edit to add quite a bit because I have fat fingers and hit the wrong button!

[edit on 21/5/09 by Freeborn]

Originally posted by blueorder
I think people decide what has a "place" in politics and your definition AS SHOWN ABOVE clearly differs from mine and many others- if you are so sure the British people think so little of the BNP then why are you afraid for them to have the same rights as other parties?

How am i afraid to let the people decide and let them vote?
They WILL be getting votes at the polls soon..... we'll see.

I am against racism in general.... the BNP for me... personifies racism.
They are the epitome of everything i am personally and morally against.

They are disgusting.

That is your reasoning, do you know that Labour party members have been arrested for violence, breaking the law etc, does that make Labour a "violent" party- super reasoning, pat yourself on the back with an anti fa sticker

Yes...and it's fantastic reasoning too.
If the LEADER of a political party has been convicted of a racist crime... i think that says a lot.
The fact that you don't.....well that troubles me.

And your other example is pathetic....

Some labour or torie MP gets caught speeding or caught with a hooker...that's quite bad.... but it's not HATE CRIMES..... it's not inciting RACIAL HATRED is it??

So they are damned if they do, damned if they don't- again retarded reasoninbg.
If you are so confident then let them test themselves at the ballot box.
What a great choice we have eh, we could elect self serving fraudsters who have sold our country to the EU and abandoned any notion of dealing with immigration
Spare me your false righteousness, BNP aint great, neither are Labour or the Tories

Yes...of course my reasoning, in your opinion, is "retarded".

Because it's logical, just and not racist.
I wouldn't expect you to be able to understand.

I don't like labour or tories either.... doesn't mean i'm gonna go vote in the next Adolf Hitler though....

reply to post by Freeborn


Not really sure why....but your post is all messed up.

Apart from the first 2 quotes...

all other quotes and responses are mine?

How about you answer my points....and I'll afford you the same courtesy

Originally posted by blueorder
stunningly funny considering your abandonment of reason and asertion that an organisation which specifies a race in it's name and is specifically for one particular race, is not racist

Er....stunningly funny indeed...

I guess you didn't read the link i provided about the BPA.

About the BLACK and ASIAN officers it defends...

One race??

You have no clue man..... so ignorant.

Anyway....you don't have any points.... your logic is pretty ridiculous too.
So until you have a point, i will save my responses for those who actually know a little something.

AS they are a non violent democratic party

Who is the BNP? omg you are kidding right?

I am against racism in general.... the BNP for me... personifies racism.

Agrees, 100%. I am against racism 100%, Is why I would never vote for the BNP at all.