The Growing Discontent

reply to post by volitionawareness

..which is why I believe we must implore the current ranking members of our armed forces, both at home and abroad, to actively and verbally join our cause.. or, perhaps, quietly organize within their own ranks to turn on their leaders who give the 'orders'..

You're asking them in effect to commit sedition, or even worse: treason. Think you'll get many takers with this 'well-thought-out' plan that you have?

Did you know that death is one possible penalty for treason?

Sorry, but the protest of whaaa, jsobecky, drumist69 and others necessitate that I suggest they reread ALL of my post in this thread before they allege that I call for some ill advised red neck charge of the light brigade. No where have I suggested nor called for a rebellious first strike attack; consistently I have stated that WE must be seen as executing a righteous revolution initiated by a second ‘Lexington Green’ style shot heard around the world. Had such respondents known history a tad bit better, they would have known the first shot there was received by the colonist in defense of the arms and magazine located in Lexington that the British had come to confiscate.

What I have pointed out, and will continue to do so, is that we have reached the point where we will soon be left with no choice; fight or surrender all to a life of servitude. All these over exaggerated calls for caution and reason sound as if mantras of either desperation to maintain at all cost the status quo (ignoring the obvious), or a psychosis bordering on fear, because any sane reading of the post I have made leave no doubt that I am NOT calling for rash action.

Of course, it could be just that the respondents have read only one or two post and charged off making crass generalizations. In which case let me suggest they read first and write later, as their post come off as nonsensical bombastic tilting at windmills.

reply to post by jsobecky


The U.S. govt. is and has been committing treason for some time now. Yet somehow we're the ones that are the problem? Come on man! Don't forget your history, our founding fathers were too considered traitors since originally they were British subjects before they became Americans.

Originally posted by SGTChas
Sorry, but the protest of whaaa, jsobecky, drumist69 and others necessitate that I suggest they reread ALL of my post in this thread before they allege that I call for some ill advised red neck charge of the light brigade.

Actually I don't think anyone was suggesting that you did, to be honest.

What I truly think is, that because of your passion for the subject, that OTHERS will see it that way...that for the most part people WILL react that way (not necessarily here) and that is what WOULD become the problem.

At least, I didn't view you as taking that position on it.


AB1

Folks, I think the arguments here area bit extreme in some instances.

I cannot see Americans assaulting Washington, and having to fight the military. Won't happen.

There will be a growing discontent, increasing daily, creating a desire to eliminate the current way of doing business.

An event will occur, in which many of the lawless will attempt to take advantage. Riots, burning of neighborhoods, a mindless destruction that will permeate most of the larger cities and even mid-sized cities to a significant degree.

Imagine what would happen tomorrow if suddenly someone got to Obama. Imagine the shock. The anger. The frustration of some elements of society. Imagine the riots.

And we're not talking about one or two. We'll see this build throughout the country. Our larger cities are the hubs of our commerce. Shut down, there will be no banking, no transfer of funds, no welfare checks, no food shipments, no transport of any commercial significance.

More shortages and outages will result in more riots, more plundering, more random killing and mayhem. The army is only so big, and can only be in one place at a time. Law enforcement will do exactly what they've done in other riot situations, and tend to their own while waiting for the violence to burn itself out. After all, the cavalry in times past has been riding hard to come in and assist.

This time, the cavalry won't be coming.

The rural areas will not be greatly affected, certainly not like our cities.

Anyone who's given this a bit of thought on how this will be corrected knows that history has shown again and again, that small bands of men who are armed and able, will at first secure their neighborhoods. Then neighborhoods will join for mutual security.

Those who would come to loot will be met with brutal force. Those who would transit through a neighborhood will not be allowed in.

Eventually, neighborhoods will increase order, join together, and towns will be restored. Then townships. Then counties. Then States.

At this point, the States, knowing full well the source of the problem they just suffered, will demand the Tenth Amendment be restored, and the Federal Government should more or less be restored to the original limitations of the Constitution.

States will demand that never again, will the Fed and it's abuses be allowed such power.

Our military? I'm not worried about our military, except when they attempt to go into some neighborhoods to restore order, where every blade of grass will have a gun behind it.

As long as they respect order and the letter of the Constitution, they will be accorded respect of the bulk of the population.

It's that 10%-15% of the population that will be the source of these ongoing problems, and of course, they will in turn be reduced as neighborhoods begin to restore their own brand of order.

Therefore, when this event comes, individuals who share basic principle of justice, order, and rights, will be the initial front line troops IN THEIR OWN NEIGHBORHOODS. Because this will be where the battles will really be fought.

The end goal is restoration of the power and order within the individual STATES.

I never liked being a leader, but it's been forced on me a time or two, when events overcame us. Those who want to lead frequently cannot, in spite of great oratory and glowing vocabularies. They want to point.

Some of us actually had to get out front, go first, and lead. Because if we didn't, we were about to be completely screwed.

And those who didn't want to follow? Left behind.

In a state that requires constant action, you cannot afford to carry any baggage.

If the scenario goes down in some catastrophic event that acts as a catalyst, you may assume that the population will be significantly reduced.

Due to weakness, starvation, inability, confrontation, and summary justice, there will be a significant culling of our population.

Even a forest fire is overall beneficial to the land and the remaining forest.

But you better always be prepared to get by for at least 30-90 days. Because there will be nothing available.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by dooper]

reply to post by alphabetaone


Thank you sir for the benefit of the doubt, never would I be so foolish to call for or suggest such courses of action. As for others perception along those lines, to amend every word in fear that fools may misunderstand would be to remain silent. One need only look at some of what has been posted in response to my thread to ascertain that; they are the wise and wisdom dies with them

reply to post by dooper


It's interesting that you mention the neighborhoods Dooper, the reason I say is because in my father's neighborhood (a gated community) there have definetely been talks of forming a sort of small militia to help safeguard the community should it ever come to that. I myself will join them if it comes to pass, reason being because my neighborhood isn't as close knit and also had made plans to get our family together should it ever happen. Apparently some of his neighbors were concerned and wanted to know if enough people in the community would own weapons should we need them. Well they do have several hunters in there and a cop lives there too, so I'm sure they'd have enough, that's not counting those that have weapons for security and not for hunting.

reply to post by dooper


Bravo Dooper! A perfect short synopsis of the initial transitional period in the struggle against the totalitarian federal government; instigated by the soon coming attempt to confiscate weapons for which a black flag op will be used to justify. This coming weapons collection is not just an assumption, it is a prediction based on several Armed Services recent training programs and a couple of leaked OP order outlines; Lexington Green Part 2 is coming.

reply to post by Question

I'm as guilty as everyone else about not knowing all my neighbors, but recently I've made an effort to speak with them in general terms.

I always tell them that if they ever have trouble, and can't wait for the police, to either call or come get me, and I'll help.

That in turn, has given me opportunities to speak with some about watching out for each other.

I assure you, you can do the same, and you will be surprised at how many folks in your neighborhood are like-minded.

We have a few elderly folks here, a handful of combat vets, and overall, we could handle looters, rioters, and those who would prey on individual homes.

Hell, we'll just stack the dead in the streets at intersections as a warning. It's amazing how well this works.

Talk to some of your neighbors, and very gently, maybe on successive visits, bring up the subject of helping each other out.

It just may come in handy later.

reply to post by dooper


Plan, Plan and PLAN: The main thing will be to stay in small highly mobile teams of three to six men. Preposition supplies near regrouping areas that have been agreed to along covered lanes of retreat from your main staging areas. Plan at least 3 avenues of retreat with 3 regrouping areas along each. Only one regrouping area known by each member of the team other then the leader who knows all 3. Knowledge of terrain and defensible hard points will be crucial in devaluing the possible initial advantage in firepower. Maintain control of consumable stockpiles and trust no one much.

[edit on 5/5/2009 by SGTChas]

Originally posted by SGTChas
reply to post by whaaa

The point being that a nation of laws MUST equally enforce those laws or it becomes nothing more than a banana republic. If the cities burn because we return to a nation that maintains its borders as every other nation does, then save the innocent, hang the criminals and collect the illegals to ship them back.

[edit on 5/3/2009 by SGTChas]

I agree with you on all topics except the part about collecting the 'illegals' and shipping them back- This is going to open up a whole can of worms and seems contradictory to your ideals that you hold so dear.

Illegal immigrants will have to go underground, where they will be exploited in all manners in exchange for an opportunity to live in this country.

I don't believe in borders, by the way. They're simply artificial, an invention of the Elites and Royals to separate humanity.

With this logic, The Native Americans will have to kick out the Europeans, Africans, Asians, because we are illegal immigrants who stole their land from them.

These illegal immigrants are escaping something, otherwise they wouldn't have come- just as my ancestors left Western Europe- because of Poverty, War, Starvation, violence. In fact one branch of my family tree left Scotland possibly because they were kicked off by an invading 'Lord' who wanted to expand his Fiefdom.

The term 'Illegal' Immigrant is rubbish.

We were ALL immigrants.

The Native Americans let us stay- If they didn't- they would have kicked out the first wave of immigrants.

We SHOULD let these illegal immigrants stay, grant them full rights to protect their families, otherwise criminals will take advantage of them.

We will emerge a stronger nation as a result.

Originally posted by Question
reply to post by jsobecky

 

The U.S. govt. is and has been committing treason for some time now. Yet somehow we're the ones that are the problem? Come on man! Don't forget your history, our founding fathers were too considered traitors since originally they were British subjects before they became Americans.

amen: this 'old-boy' network philosophy is so irrelevent today.. the global elite have raped the nations of the world and used the militaries as its bitch for decades; men and women in uniform will only take so much.. they are human beings, and once they realize they are being sacrificed they will turn on the higher-ups, and they should; the old 'rules' of military rank mean nothing in this age of tyranny..

..sedition is no longer relevant!! because of the real treason taking place at the top..

reply to post by star in a jar


Star, I read you idea that there should be no borders, and if you'll excuse my chiken**it analogy, let me ask you this.

Does you home have doors?

Do those doors have locks?

Can anyone just come in and make themselves at home?

Nope.

And that's why we have fences, borders, and nationalities.

Just the way it is.

Originally posted by Ranger_Ric
Impending doom.

You must forgive me if I do not share the same optimism as some of you but I am a realist above all else. Any intelligent person with knowledge of history can see what is unfolding and know in their hearts what almost certainly will follow. The outcome is known only to God but the conflict is all but written in stone at this point. I can not imagine a plausible scenario that could head it off.

Scenario; The star Nemesis shows up, causing massive destruction on Earth. The Elite herd all of us not picked to go underground, into the already built FEMA concentration camps. Giving us the 'tag' on our hand or forehead, or removing our recalcitrant heads. Since those same Elite already know about and are preparing for their own survival at our expense, they no longer consider themselves under the 'old' morality or codes of ethics. So murdering millions is ok in that frame of thinking. They are just trying to 'save' mankind.



Your last hope of our corrupt politicians seeing the light and fearing the anger of the population they govern is no comfort. I can tell by your words and style that you are not gullible enough to actually believe that will be the case.

I predict it will be a short revolution as revolutions go. I also predict the military and the police will be largely on our side operating in both overt and covert roles.

These monsters have already thought of that, and are prepared by shuffling troops around the world, so that noone is asked to fire on their own people. Just some 'stinkin foreigner'. As far as the tax collectors in blue, what year were they last on the side of law and order, and for the people? Gangstes don't give a hoot about anyone else but themselves. And I predict NO revolution. We will be too busy trying to stay alive.

I believe the militant left will be all but exterminated, they have no idea, not even a concept of the wrath about to be poured upon them. Unfortunately, due to our own very nature, the non-combatant left, even the ones in open support roles will be spared. They will live to regroup and begin anew with their subversive, long term tactics. The media will switch sides as soon as there is a hint of their side losing. Our side, foolishly, will spare their lives so our children or grand children or great grand children will be forced to fight the same battle again in the future.

Indeed, a storm is approaching. I may or may not emerge from the other side of that storm but it is my my hope and my duty as an American citizen to see that my nation does.

In the past, I would concur with you. But this is not a human conspiracy; it is straight from hell. Know when our 'fearless leader', probably Prince Charlie, brokers a mideast peace treaty for seven years, we have only 3 1/2 years left of current history. All the events unfolding have been foretold and preached about for thousands of years, and few are aware of that. It is all happening exactly as written, and as laughed about by more 'brilliant' and wise descendants of monkeys. Shortly after that dwarf star just misses Earth, the 'city' of Babylon the Great, possibly New York, or the Vatican, will get nuked. I suspect New York, and the rest of America invaded and subjugated.
But take heart, their will be peace on Earth, real peace, for a thousand years after the coming calamity. This has been talked about and written for a long, long time. Now that it is happening, it is not so pleasant to say 'see, I told you so'. It is disheartening to not have more that understand.
Underground is not the place to survive. It is within walking distance of Jerusalem. Shortly, there will appear on the world scene, two supposed prophets. Most will hate them until they are murdered. Not me, I can't wait to meet them!
And, people, realize that there IS a gun to your head, and the despot Napolitano would be really happy to use it. So be careful what you say...

[edit on 5-5-2009 by Gregarious]

reply to post by SGTChas


I agree, there is a growing perception that revolution is coming, to several countries.

I said it last year and I'll say it again. All it will take is one riot cop to take action that is deemed unjust, and to have that shown. And a cascade of similar will create rising unrest which will lead to revolution.

But, while this might be inevitable, you have to also consider what the response by government will be and when such a response would come. Those who wish for change will be deemed as being the enemy, and the US government will take action to stop it.

You might just want to walk in a protest march to voice your anger at the way the administration admits torture is a crime but then fails to punish those who committed such, but they will see you as an "enemy combatant" under the right circumstances.

And if that marching crowd becomes millions strong, what will they do to distract you? What will the government do in an effort to solidify following and force capitulation?

I truly feel that the American people need to be very cautious right now. The US government could destroy all dissent, but that distraction will likely cost many innocent lives. When the movement toward a real revolution reaches a certain point, and when there are truly millions following, expect an event intended to distract the media and force your hand.

The numbers who will see through such a ploy will be small, and then the revolution is probably over.

The only way to do it safely is through individual states pulling away from the union through public pressure. Sure, the government will likely try to prevent this by creating (or allowing) an event to distract the population or change opinion, but the numbers wishing to continue that revolution will be larger if it's more peaceful than a pitchfork rebellion from the start.

Originally posted by SGTChas
The point being that a nation of laws MUST equally enforce those laws or it becomes nothing more than a banana republic. If the cities burn because we return to a nation that maintains its borders as every other nation does, then save the innocent, hang the criminals and collect the illegals to ship them back.

how do you define "illegal" especially in a time of unrest. what happens if a CITIZEN who is a first generation LEGAL migrant has had his papers destroyed while his house or bank safe deposit box was burnt down? that CITIZEN will obviously have an accent and what happens if he's looking hispanic or middle eastern?

food for thought. justice is not as simple as you'd like it to be.

reply to post by DarkSecret


The indigenous people of America can save us all a lot of trouble.

They should just kick everyone that was not born on a reservation in the last fifty years out of the country. Everyone that wishes admission will have to petition for re-entry.

This would return the country to a true "legal" state and all those people goinig around bragging about their "true" heritage can just go back to that wonderful country that they truly love.

Originally posted by NightSkyeB4Dawn
reply to post by DarkSecret

 

The indigenous people of America can save us all a lot of trouble.

They should just kick everyone that was not born on a reservation in the last fifty years out of the country. Everyone that wishes admission will have to petition for re-entry.

This would return the country to a true "legal" state and all those people goinig around bragging about their "true" heritage can just go back to that wonderful country that they truly love.

well if it's up to the Native Americans then why not go back to the people living here before Chris Columbus set foot in the Americas?

it's totally unrealistic to randomly "kick out" people. there are legal ways to come and if people came here legally I'd assume they have the right to stay just like the sons and daughters of the first colonists.

I apologize, but due to the length of my post, it will require two posts.


I feel in my heart that the biggest problem will be what alphabetaone said: people will all have their different stances and not be able to decide amongst how things are to be.

What needs to be done is simplification. Obviously, the goal of leadership is not to make everyone involved happy, but to make everyone feel as they matter. So whatever the plan, it can not be that far advanced, that far reaching, that people will start to see it as simply a left-ring or right-wing agenda; whomever holds the more power in its creation.

What we obviously need at the basis of the Revolution, and we need everyone to understand it, is The Bill of Rights. This of course should be followed with the remaining Constitution, albeit revised.

Without an understanding of that concept, SUCCESSFUL revolution is not possible.

The question as to whether or not military would serve the citizens, is negligent. Most will, some will not. Deals will be made with certain ones and promises of safety, power, or influence with others. However, I do know that even within the military right now, there are those that are ready to turn at the drop of the dime. I have been in contact with one such brigade, and the emotions are generally the same.




The Plan

Now what is the plan? The plan right now is to wait. As SGTChas put it, the "Lexington Green" situation is the most probably set off. However, before, during, and after that said situation, it will take loads of preparation, and even more cooperation in order to get something moving that won't be just either A.) a quickly quelled pitchfork revolution or B.) a situation that will result in total anarchy and chaos.

It would start at the neighborhood level as others have put it. Neighbors, families, friends, all banding together to first secure their neighborhoods. Once that occurs swiftly and quietly, communication and quick rendezvous must be established. All of those willing and able to fight must report to designated locations for each state and prepare.

From there even larger rendezvous must be set. Quadrants must be established and groups separated for tactical advancement. Strategic points and strongholds in each state must be targeted first, starting with of course, weapons storage facilities in order to arm the people with the best possible supplies for the greatest chance of success.

This can be accomplished either by brute force if need be, or by the work of someone on the inside working to help the people. It will not be a step by step undertaking, each group would advance at once on every possible location. Even those that would choose to defend the PTB and their institutions would not stand a chance against so great a number as I foresee.

There will be skirmishes all over, and those that are not on detail to take the strategic points mentioned above, will be out and about to protect the citizens. The women, the children, the elderly, whether they be still in their homes or in shelters set up be the insurgence.

The communication is the key. We need to establish baselines and have an understanding where each quadrants units lie. When we are sure that we have stabilized, the last target, should be Washington itself.

Obviously by this point, the surplus of protection and the remaining PTB will have been stockaded in the capital. Others will have already fled. The final battle, in my eyes, will require the most careful planning, simply because of the want to leave standing the history of our forefathers upon the capital. Our single purpose would be to enter, remove those from power, instill control over Congress and all government institutions, and above all, provide a signal to the people that we have prevailed. For it is then that hope will return and morale and dignity will give those still fighting an extra edge, or in the case of opposition, a demoralization to end the fight.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by gwydionblack]

The Aftermath and The Grand Design

The country will be in a state of controlled anarchy from this point forth. Small quells may continue and thus militia and military cannot be disbanded at this point.

The quadrants that were created will be required to send 6 representatives. Estimating that their will be 6 quadrants or so, 36 is a fair number of representatives. Most will be the leaders of the assaults, other will be those held in high regard, just as it was in the days of our forefathers.

The First United Council will meet in Washington to discuss the future plans, ratify the amendments to the Constitution, and develop a time line of work to be accomplished. Upon the end of the Council, five of each quadrants council members will return to ensure that progress is being made on the appointed work and changes. The remaining council member in Washington will remain as a liaison to the quadrant, keeping in full contact and able to make votes and decisions based only on the confirmation of the quadrants representatives.

It should be noted by now that state lines are practically abolished. To deal with 50 separate governing bodies would be impossible and thus it is simplified. Borders would have to be closed from all sides, staking militia and military in order to prevent immigrants from arriving. This is not a permanent thing by any means, but a necessity in order to restore order.

The only things that are allowed to cross the borders are ministers of other countries or crucial imports, necessary for our health and survival. We must work first to fend and rely on ourselves before becoming a major player in the world market. Thus is the cost of revolution.



When all is said and done and things start patching up they way they should be, more issues of lesser importance will be welcomed onto the plate to achieve. General laws with consistent punishments will of course have to be filed, the worst punishment I believe, being exile from the nation. After having fought and risked your life for the freedoms you attain, one must know to behave morally and ethically for the risk of it all being for nothing in their eyes.

Eventually, once group rebuilding efforts are in place and well underway, and agriculture has reached a place of abundance, we would be able to start dealing with immigrants, more imports and exports, and of course treatises with other governments. Heavy laws against corporations and banking systems will be a sad, yet required thing, if only to prevent the mistakes of our past.




The End Benefit

The end benefit, my good people, is what every single person here, regardless of which side you represent is looking for. True democracy where the people literally run themselves. A self sustaining nation that can rely on itself in times of need, and with the foremost principals being those three things that everyone has the right to: Life, Liberty, and the Persuit of Happiness.

Will is be hard? There is no doubt in my mind that it will be the hardest times that anyone living today in this country has felt. But in the end, it is the rewards that will speak for themselves. Truthful government will be open to the people and there will be no secrets. The Bill of Rights will be posted on every lamp post and telephone poll, not as a reminder of the things we are missing but as the WORD OF LAW.

And finally, the people of the world will be able to look on and those who call it the "greatest country in the world" will finally be right. The people here will know it. The people all around will know it. Simply because we will be given the greatest thing a human being can attain:

True and absolute freedom.




-Gwyd

[edit on 5-5-2009 by gwydionblack]