Why do Atheists care about religion?

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
I hate using the ignore feature, but I just did.

I refuse to, it's cowardice.

I believe there is oblivion is waiting for all, however I would sooo love to be wrong. If I die with this belief and it turns out to be wrong, I will not be the fool, God would be for letting me live out my existence under the false impression.

That's a funny statement.
And just how many times have you been told that your false impression could be wrong?

It may not be. But I'm well aware that it mite be wrong because I can reason. The concept of God is not falsifiable, so I can't be honest and say it doesn't exist. But without evidence, I can't honestly have any reason to think it does. That is the point. I know my limitations, that is why it would be gods fault if I were to die thinking it didn't exist.


You're doing well at this whole "dodging the question" thing, btw.

[edit on 2-5-2009 by Welfhard]

Originally posted by Welfhard

Originally posted by spy66
As you say there is no evidence of what happens to us after death.
What if you are wrong!! wouldn't that make you the fool!

That is completely besides the point. I'm not talking about life after death, I'm talking about blue-jay's faith, (not in god but) in the idea that the bible is completely representative of God, a being not even proven to be existent, when there are thousands of other faiths that disagree. BlueJ then supposes that his/her faith is more correct than theirs with the statement "97% absolute truth is better than 50%".

I believe there is oblivion is waiting for all, however I would sooo love to be wrong. If I die with this belief and it turns out to be wrong, I will not be the fool, God would be for letting me live out my existence under the false impression.

But again, that's irrelevant.

If you read Jeremiah you will find that he mentions God as Energy and not as a being. He also mentions that energy and the universe works like a army with perfect order and function.

There is no chaos in changes or time when it comes to energy and matter.

When you hear or read about God you only see or hear the name. Without paying attention to what the name really represents in reality.

People tend to get lost when we give something a name.

The first thing people think is that a name is a shape and a shape with a human image must have a personality. Because God made us in his image.
This doesn't have to mean that we look like God at all. We are made in Gods image. God is not made in our image. There is a big difference here.

Originally posted by Welfhard

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
I hate using the ignore feature, but I just did.

I refuse to, it's cowardice.

Gawdzilla's Corollary to Shaker's Law: Nobody who says they've put you on "ignore" actually does.

reply to post by spy66


Do you know how many other religions will speak similarly? Yes I've read Jerimiah.

Saying that God = energy & the universe and saying that energy and the universe exists therefore God exists is silly. All your doing is redefining what God is to energy and then implying that it has a godly consciousness which in the end you need faith for still!

Faith is useless, I cannot stress that enough - it means nothing, it proves nothing and it can be blinding. It's just the stupidest thing.

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by spy66

 

Do you know how many other religions will speak similarly? Yes I've read Jerimiah.

Saying that God = energy & the universe and saying that energy and the universe exists therefore God exists is silly. All your doing is redefining what God is to energy and then implying that it has a godly consciousness which in the end you need faith for still!

Faith is useless, I cannot stress that enough - it means nothing, it proves nothing and it can be blinding. It's just the stupidest thing.

Well you are totally right i do. Because that is the whole clue.
You can't compare the Bible to science or evolution if you only treat the bible as a fictional story. No wonder you don't get it at all then.

You know your name is only a ID of who you are in the big picture. What you are made up of is a totally different matter. Can't you see the difference here at all.

We are made in Gods image. God is not made in our image. God is just a name a ID of a source.

[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]

reply to post by spy66


"You can't compare the Bible to science or evolution if you only treat the bible as a fictional story."

The problem is that the Bible IS a fictional story. That's just a fact.

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by spy66

 

Do you know how many other religions will speak similarly? Yes I've read Jerimiah.

Saying that God = energy & the universe and saying that energy and the universe exists therefore God exists is silly. All your doing is redefining what God is to energy and then implying that it has a godly consciousness which in the end you need faith for still!

Faith is useless, I cannot stress that enough - it means nothing, it proves nothing and it can be blinding. It's just the stupidest thing.

Well you are totally right i do.

BAM! You got your ass handed to you.

Because that is the whole clue.

You can't compare the Bible to science or evolution if you only treat the bible as a fictional story. No wonder you don't get it at all then.

And why would I treat it as anything else? It is scientifically wrong, it's historically wrong, it has human authors.... It goes on and on.

You know your name is only a ID of who you are in the big picture. What you are made up of is a totally different matter. Can't you see the difference here at all.

Of course, labels and materials/compositions. However that suggests nothing about a deity.

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by spy66

 

"You can't compare the Bible to science or evolution if you only treat the bible as a fictional story."

The problem is that the Bible IS a fictional story. That's just a fact.

It is for you. And you share that fact with the rest of your clan. Not much anybody can do about that. And that is a fact.

The fact is that you dont believe in God that's all. That doesn't bother me at all.

You can argue >Gods non existence to your eyes pope out for all i care, its not my lose if you don't get it.

But you will never convince me that God doesn't exist no matter how hard you try,because you can't produce any facts that he doesn't exist.

You can't produce any more facts of Gods non existence then i can prove to you that God does exist. Because you think God is a man or a magician that is you re scale of knowledge in this matter.

How can some one argue with you or your kind?

reply to post by Welfhard

that is why it would be gods fault if I were to die thinking it didn't exist.

Priceless

An atheist blames God for not letting him develop any faith.

You are blaming the the wrong spirit entity, he is the guy that is not letting you develop any faith, and it's working.

Originally posted by Welfhard

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by spy66

 

Do you know how many other religions will speak similarly? Yes I've read Jerimiah.

Saying that God = energy & the universe and saying that energy and the universe exists therefore God exists is silly. All your doing is redefining what God is to energy and then implying that it has a godly consciousness which in the end you need faith for still!

Faith is useless, I cannot stress that enough - it means nothing, it proves nothing and it can be blinding. It's just the stupidest thing.

Well you are totally right i do.

BAM! You got your ass handed to you.

Because that is the whole clue.

You can't compare the Bible to science or evolution if you only treat the bible as a fictional story. No wonder you don't get it at all then.

And why would I treat it as anything else? It is scientifically wrong, it's historically wrong, it has human authors.... It goes on and on.

You know your name is only a ID of who you are in the big picture. What you are made up of is a totally different matter. Can't you see the difference here at all.

Of course, labels and materials/compositions. However that suggests nothing about a deity.

You dont understand science all that much. And you for sure dont know anything about what God is.

That is the only facts you can tell anybody.

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
reply to post by Welfhard

 

that is why it would be gods fault if I were to die thinking it didn't exist.

Priceless

An atheist blames God for not letting him develop any faith.

You are blaming the the wrong spirit entity, he is the guy that is not letting you develop any faith, and it's working.

If God is real and it wants me to believe that, then it needs to do something. Doing nothing helps no one, and here I am, looking and not finding, how is that my fault?

If God wants me to believe, then it's god's responsibility.

and you're still dodging the question...

reply to post by spy66


"But you will never convince me that God doesn't exist no matter how hard you try,because you can't produce any facts that he doesn't exist. "


Do you believe in Thor? An? Zeus? Why not? You can't prove they don't exist, so why aren't you worshiping them? Why take a chance that you haven't got the right one? Because you were programmed to believe in the Abrahamic god, no other reason. You've been told what to believe and you won't deviate from those instructions. Otherwise, there's no different amongst them.

Originally posted by spy66
You dont understand science all that much.

Well firstly, you have no idea. Secondly, God has nothing to do with science. Science is about understanding naturalistic law and the phenomena they produce. God is a concept, so when you say "you know nothing about god." One must ask both "Which God?" and "What is the God you're referring to?"

So again, "Quod Gratis asseritur, Gratis negatur." That which is suggested with no reason may be denied with no reason.

[edit on 2-5-2009 by Welfhard]

Originally posted by Welfhard

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
reply to post by Welfhard

 

that is why it would be gods fault if I were to die thinking it didn't exist.

Priceless

An atheist blames God for not letting him develop any faith.

You are blaming the the wrong spirit entity, he is the guy that is not letting you develop any faith, and it's working.

If God is real and it wants me to believe that, then it needs to do something. Doing nothing helps no one, and here I am, looking and not finding, how is that my fault?

If God wants me to believe, then it's god's responsibility.

and you're still dodging the question...

You just don't have what it takes to believe in God. That's not Gods problem that is your problem. If your knowledge only tells you that God is fiction then that is the clue to your understanding and it ends there for you.

reply to post by Welfhard

I didn't think I was dodging the question, but anyways let me elaborate then.

Well the only answer I have for you on this is one belief structure, will be verified as the absolute truth in the future.

We will find what within 100% of the belief structure was right and what was wrong. I know some are wrong because some have been wrong in the past and then corrected.

But because it turns out to be the closest to the truth of reality it wins.

Originally posted by Welfhard

Originally posted by spy66
You dont understand science all that much.

Well firstly, you have no idea. Secondly, God has nothing to do with science. Science is about understanding naturalistic law and the phenomena they produce. God is a concept, so when you say "you know nothing about god." One must ask both "Which God?" and "What is the God you're referring to?"

So again, "Quod Gratis asseritur, Gratis negatur." That which is suggested with no reason may be denied with no reason.

[edit on 2-5-2009 by Welfhard]

Well i do know. Because i can see God as something you don't understand at all. You don't even know what purpose a name has. You only see the name and not the source. Because your ignorant to the source because you don't understand it. So you only focus on the name in your own way and use it as a argument.



[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
reply to post by Welfhard

 

I didn't think I was dodging the question, but anyways let me elaborate then.

Well the only answer I have for you on this is one belief structure, will be verified as the absolute truth in the future.

So why assume? Again you have faith that it will when other people have just as much faith that their faith will be proven right in the future too. It's a week argument cos it doesn't show anything other than people are willing to believe out of hope rather than wisdom.

It's asinine, people have faith that a god exists, then, to them, their perception of god confirms their faith in god. It's just silly.

Please... I have better things to do than squander my time talking about the pointlessness of faith to a preacher-parrot like putting my hands in the toaster and burning them..

[edit on 2-5-2009 by Welfhard]

Originally posted by spy66
Well i do know. Because i can see God as something you don't understand at all. You don't even know what purpose a name has. You only see the name and not the source. Because your ignorant to the source because you don't understand it. So you only focus on the name in your own way and use it as a argument.

You don't know, you have an opinion and no amount believing otherwise will change that fact. A name has one purpose, to label. What is more important it the make-up of that which the label is applied to. But with god, we have no evidence that there is a make-up making the existance of the label as pointless as the label of unicorns and centaurs.

Originally posted by Gawdzilla
reply to post by spy66

 

"But you will never convince me that God doesn't exist no matter how hard you try,because you can't produce any facts that he doesn't exist. "


Do you believe in Thor? An? Zeus? Why not? You can't prove they don't exist, so why aren't you worshiping them? Why take a chance that you haven't got the right one? Because you were programmed to believe in the Abrahamic god, no other reason. You've been told what to believe and you won't deviate from those instructions. Otherwise, there's no different amongst them.

To begin with No one has pushed me to believe in anything. My beliefs are personal. I can't share any of them with you. Because to you or anybody else they wouldn't make sense.

I know about old legends like Thor, Medusa, Cesar and so on, all wanting to be Gods.

But even i can see the problem here as you do. I don't say that i worship any of them do i?

Where do you get that impression from?

Originally posted by Welfhard

Originally posted by spy66
Well i do know. Because i can see God as something you don't understand at all. You don't even know what purpose a name has. You only see the name and not the source. Because your ignorant to the source because you don't understand it. So you only focus on the name in your own way and use it as a argument.

You don't know, you have an opinion and no amount believing otherwise will change that fact. A name has one purpose, to label. What is more important it the make-up of that which the label is applied to. But with god, we have no evidence that there is a make-up making the existance of the label as pointless as the label of unicorns and centaurs.

Well its like i said before!
To you this will only seam like a personal opinion. Because you dont have what it takes to know yet. Your going to have to wait until some one of your kind can present the facts for you. In a way that only you can understand.

Knowledge is not only what you read but it is also what you can make out of what you read on your own.





[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]