ABC Special to Dismiss Idea of Using Guns for Self Defense?

Originally posted by MrAnonUK

It amazes me however that I see so many state others are "sheeple," yet I can so often see the same people condoning the possession of items perfected with only only the soul purpose being to kill another human being.

Did you proof read that before you hit submit? Guns weren't made for the sole purpose of killing another human being. Guns were made for hunting and protecting livestock and family. Yes they can be used to take a human life,but, so can any of my kitchen knives, my car, my baseball bat, or a brick on the side of the road can be picked up and used to kill. Guns do not kill people. They are only a tool used by OTHER PEOPLE to kill the same as any other weapon.

As you aren't even American why are you so worried about our guns or our constitution? Just because your countrymen sat and allowed your guns to be taken doesn't mean we should give up ours also. All of you not from America that has such a big problem with our guns should really try to come and take them from us. Oh wait, you can't.

Originally posted by MrAnonUK

I'm always dumbfounded by the ignorance repeated regarding this issue, is the majority of the world not proof enough. Or is the USA so great, so advanced, so different that the rules of others cannot be applied without total chaos.

I'm always dumbfounded by the ignorance of any populace that has allowed their government or ruling body to take their guns. That's worked out real well for those of you in the UK hasn't it.

All you need to do is look throughout history to see what can and has happened when a citizenry allows themselves to be unarmed.

Mod note: You are welcome to repost this without the personal attacks and insults. -- Majic

User note: Removed for the terms "unquestionable stature" and "stop crying, take a deep breathe," I'm unaware of any other issues regarding that response other than those, or am I incorrect and forgotten something else extraordinarily offensive and provocative?


[edit on 4/8/2009 by Majic]

[edit on 9-4-2009 by MrAnonUK]

reply to post by Simon_Boudreaux


Can you go into more detail please mate.

Edit: missed your first response... did you not the word I used, "perfected." I apologize if the word 'created' slipped out. I any event, that isn't the issue at hand merely you looking to poke holes in my writing.

[edit on 8-4-2009 by MrAnonUK]

[edit on 8-4-2009 by MrAnonUK]

reply to post by kettlebellysmith


yes martial arts are a great way to defend yourself- i have a few friends who are black belts.
but what good does that do you if i have a gun pointed at you and you are 30' away? if you can leap that far and kick me before i can squeeze that trigger all the power to ya- otherwise all that knowledge and training will be lost

Courtesy Is Mandatory

It should not be necessary to remind anyone of this, but courtesy is a necessary prerequisite for discussion of this and all topics on ATS.

It is no secret that gun control threads tend to get heated and acrimonious. There is nothing wrong with disagreement and passionate debate, as long as it's civil.

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Deny Ignorance.

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reply to post by MrAnonUK


More details of? The history of what happens or how it's worked out for you in the UK?

As you are from the UK you should already know that. History of what can happen with gun bans is simple enough just look at the past of the Soviet Union,Turkey,Germany,China,Guatemala,Uganda,Cambodia, and ask the Aussies about their crime rate since they were forced to give up their firearms. These are but a few examples. Google is your friend use it.

I even searched ATS for you and found this thread that goes into more detail about the countries I mentioned.
Link

Originally posted by MrAnonUK
reply to post by Simon_Boudreaux

 

Can you go into more detail please mate.

Edit: missed your first response... did you not the word I used, "perfected." I apologize if the word 'created' slipped out. I any event, that isn't the issue at hand merely you looking to poke holes in my writing.

Wasn't trying to poke holes in your writing at all mate, my apologies if it seemed that way. I was merely pointing out that guns weren't made for killing people. Or should I say that it wasn't the only reason for their invention.

reply to post by bigfoot1212

My uncle was a blackbelt in tae kwon do and also taught karate. One of his former students in the late 1980s was a rather small young Golden Gloves contender who couldn't defend himself in a streetfight which of course lots of jerks wanted to start so they could "fight" him. Training and street experience are not the same. The whole reason Mike Tyson blew up so big when he came out was because he had the 54-block which is a type of long punch used in both streetfighting and jailhouse brawling. Most boxers didn't know how to do it.

reply to post by bigfoot1212


Good point! Again, the same uncle was robbed at an ATM in Ohio by two armed men, not only disarmed them but beat the living hell out of both who were much taller and stronger, then got arrested for assaulting and robbing both of them because he kept their guns and took their wallets in retaliation. Until the cops watched the video! He was my idol!

I don't - I'm a live and let live person who got upset over a rose bush dying today.....

but if someone REALLY wanted to kill a bunch of people, and didn't have a gun to do it with, they could just poison them at the local buffet. You could just as easily sneak into a nursing home and shoot the residents up with drano as shoot them with a gun - might be quieter in fact.

It is the HUMAN WILL to do evil that is the problem. It is not the method they use. Guns and pens and razors and knives have no free will, they are neutral. Maybe the reason some people think it is guns is because people that are evil don't have any creativity these days. bleh

[edit on 8-4-2009 by hadriana]

I really want to know why Stossel isnt doing this. A few months ago on his blog he wrote about this very special and asked folks to send in their stories of self-defense. I've been looking forward to the special since then. Now that Diane Sawyer is doing the special my mind would be blown if it didnt come to the conclusion that all guns are inherently evil imbued with satanic powers by evil NRA cultists who have summoned said powers by slaughtering the stolen minority children of unwed and "under-employed" minority mothers.

I hope Stossel makes some sort of statement regarding this. Friday night is his time slot even so WTF ABC.

its a very easy thing to figure out. Let's break it down:

1) criminals are paranoid people by nature, and they wouldnt go into a situation unless they had some confidence they would come out on top. Carrying a weapon with them increases their chances of survival

2) chances are, if a criminal breaks into your home, with their dubious connections, they will most likely be carrying a gun, even if guns are outlawed in that area.

3) any government with ill-intent for their citizenry obviously would not want the common man carrying a gun. Guns put you on a level playing field with the forces the government could potentially utilize against their people. Remember, a corrupt governments greatest potential threat is from within, at the hands of oppressed citizens who make a stand. No guns means no resistance is possible.

4)Guns don't kill people. The person pulling the trigger is the killer. Murder has been around long long before gun powder was invented. Man will find a way to kill man if it is in his heart to do so

anyway those are some of my initial thoughts on ther matter...

i once heard a wise black man say


"Do you think there would have been slavery in America, if Africans would have had guns back in Africa?" (before slavery, however i don't think guns were around then, but you get his point)


and i couldn't help but think, hmm, hes right, kinda hard to take over a nation who can easily defend themselves.

now there trying to take away our guns, yaaay we all get to try out slavery.

[edit on 8-4-2009 by dkman222]

ABC has a long history of being anti-gun and pro-abortion.

Great logic, good job! Thanks Diane!

reply to post by MrAnonUK

I see that you live in the UK. You have your laws, and we have ours. Yours may work for you, but ours work for us.

Whenever a hawk gets hungry, there's nothing like a fat, defenseless dove.

And whether you like the current state of mankind's rancid condition, whether or not you think reason and talking will get you by, logic doesn't change fact.

In a land where many have teeth and claws of a predator, unless you have teeth and claws of your own, you're just going to be prey.

It's not logical, it's not nice.

Just the brutal truth.

In 2005 the following occurred:
The criminally insane drove cars.
Drug abusers drove cars.
Confused and tired people drove cars.
Cars were used in a large percentage of crimes committed.
39,189 people died while participating in automobile related events.

Can someone email Diane Sawyer ?

The criminals in the article below died of acute failure of the victim selection process.
self defence works
findarticles.com...

I am a Vietnam veteran and would not have a problem with shooting criminals.

And i have made arrests at gun point when i was a federal security officer and since as a civilian.

If a criminal wants to make a acute failure of the victim selection process with me i will show him the error of his ways.

Originally posted by yellowcard

Originally posted by LockwithnoKey
ABC is holding true to it's nickname...

Another B.s. Company!

Well, John Stossel is actually really good...I wish he was doing the investigative reporting, his are usually very good...in fact, I wonder why he isn't doing it? Probably finds it to be just as ridiculous as everyone here.

[edit on 8-4-2009 by yellowcard]

When I saw this promo I thought the same thing as the OP. Also, the fact that ABC is bringing out their own 'big gun' Diane Sawyer to report this story I realized that this is indeed a show meant to scare the public into thinking the 2nd Amendment is antiquated.

This show needs to be watched and carefully scrutinized by knowledgeable ATS'ers. I would watch, but I don't own a gun and have never wanted to, so I don't qualify. Also, watching any MSM broadcasts tend to make me really, really sick afterwards.

The banksters that own both fed.gov and the media have the propaganda in full swing.

Look for this to all play into it being "hope for change and the passage of a common sense gun law," like HR45.

This will be played out against all of these shooting by saying, "if you are a law abiding citizen why would you mind registering your weapons with fed.gov?"

First comes registration, then confiscation...

If this progresses things are going to get ugly.

Whatever the outcome it is clear the PTB propaganda machine is in full on Goebel mode.

How about some real data instead of Brady Bunch number manipulation?

Fact Sheet: The Real Story On Kids’ Deaths
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Cause Number Number
(ages 0-14) (ages 0-4)
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Motor-vehicle 2,591 819
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
drowning 943 568
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Fires and flames 593 327
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Mechanical suffocation 601 508
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
ingestion of food, object* 169 169
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Firearms 86 19
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––––––––––––––––––––––––––
source: Figures are for 2000. national safety Council, injury Facts:
2003 edition, at 10-11, 129.
*the “ingestion of food, object” category is underreported in the first
column since the nsC did not include death rates for “5 to 14 years.”

source: Figures are for 2000. national safety Council, injury Facts:
2003 edition, at 10-11, 129.

1995 Fatal Accident Totals
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Motor-vehicle 43,900
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Falls 12,600
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Poisonings 10,600
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
drownings 4,500
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Fires 4,100
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Choking 2,800
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Firearms 1,400*
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
* accounts for 1.5% of fatal accidents.
source: the national Center for health statistics

Or perhaps we should look at banning doctors and big pharma? Or big pharmas influence on unecessary procedures?

1999 Accidental
Medical Deaths
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––
unnecessary surgery 12,000
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––
Medication errors 7,000
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––
Other errors 20,000
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––
infections 80,000
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––
negative effect of drugs 106,000
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––
–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– –––
source: Journal of the american Medical assoc.

Would banning guns save lives or simply make it easier to control a populace?