The EU is Illegal by UK Law

Originally posted by Freeborn
reply to post by Foppezao

 

The fact is there will never be a strong and truly effective European Union as long as a strong and independant United Kingdom remains.
Hence the systamatic dismantling of British society and culture.

The UK is under attack, both overtly and covertly, on all fronts....I get the impression that this country is about to explode and that the choices we make will have dramatic repercussions for generations to come.

The UK joined the EEG in 1973, the 6 founders were already well on their way, we launched the Euro without the Pound Sterling and look how strong it goes.. Don't forget the main axis lies between Berlin and Paris[Schuman/Monnet] were it al began.The EU does not need the UK, but the UK does need the EU, economically..[yet again the weight lies in Germany]And yes, there is a possibility that the EU might transform into a dictatorship, but why? because people want an EU president? and please don't come with the NWO, give me facts!
You still send representatives to the Parliament[which had become much more powerfull since the treaty of Maastricht], the council and the commission, stop sending clowns like nigel farage[he does not take our commission serious why should we take him serious] and get serious then..
This is no Star wars movie, this is the EU and things happen incremental over here, If you think your country and Metro's are under attack, don't blame Brussels [we like sharing intel with you about these things]and look some more to the east, middle earth were the Orcs live..[overtly and covertly yes]
2 Cytraul- i don't think the referendum was appropriate at that time, maybe the constitution came to early, but people were simply not voting for that treaty but with their underbelly, postpone or dont hold a referndum is what i say..










[edit on 19-2-2009 by Foppezao]

Did you help in writing the EU treaty, because just like the EU treaty, your post makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Only a idiot & someone completely devoid of any morals would sign up to the EU treaty, unfortunately, idiocy seems to be the norm in Europe these days, especially amongst politicians.

EU fails to have its accounts signed off for the 14th consecutive year – Might not be signed off before 2020 Roll up suckers, give us your money.

www.openeurope.org.uk...

EU Corruption and Waste
www.democracymovementsurrey.co.uk...

reply to post by Cythraul


Where I am from calling someone a puff is a minor homophobic remark, like a toned down version of the f*g word (for you americans).
----

Non the less to Pro-Union people, I can't wait to see you face when the EU ends up getting into a fight with the other Unions that are popping up or into some form of major disagreement with them and it will. They wont want to be ran by the EU and the EU wont want to be ran by them.

Originally posted by Cythraul
I'm rather stunned at how welcoming so many ATS members are of the EU. Most of you are viewing it through rose-tinted spectacles, not seeing it for what it really is - the 'EUSSR'. You walk readily into one of the NWO's most vital projects. Do you all think the NWO is also a good thing? For those who know that the NWO/EU should be apprehended, please speak up, because right now I'm losing hope for the future of the human race...

Not everyone buys into the ridiculous 'sinister New World Order' fantasies peddled for the past 20 years by demented obsessives like Alex Jones. Most of us see it for the disinformative stupidity it so clearly is. The EU is far from perfect, and has many corrupt elements, but all bureaucracies have inefficiencies and imperfections. The IDEA is good, the execution incomplete. Personally I would much rather live in the EU than a Europe fragmented and by nation states. Look where that situation led us for 500 years. At least we're making progress, not before time.

...your attitude does terrify me. National borders are the only thing preventing NWO dominance. ...

Here we go again. Sorry, but I am not buying this 'NWO' rubbish. It's ignorant and ill-informed, a fantasy bogeyman to frighten the children. Try to remain sane, please.

What's worse, tribalism, or an increased divide between the NWO elites and the rest of us? YOu see, your absence of tribalism will be filled by a global impoverishment. The NWO is not utopia. It'd be nice if it was. But read up about it

Yeah, I've been 'reading up' on this NWO idiocy for more than 20 years. I am not fooled by this ignorant, propagandist trash. Sorry.

Don't rely on your misconceptions about what the EU means for our future. You WILL be sorely, fatally disappointed. If we get a benevolent new world order, I'd be all for border-dissolution

Well, let's wait and see. The EU has such a high approval rating amongst its citizens that dissolution is now inconceivable. Fortunately.

Originally posted by bovarcher
The EU has such a high approval rating amongst its citizens that dissolution is now inconceivable. Fortunately.

Then they'll be happy to give us our referendum.

Unfortunately bovarcher, we no longer have the luxury of treating the NWO as fantasy. I used to be uncomfortable giving the idea any credence, until I spent some time digging for truth.


"It was not my intention to doubt that, the Doctrines of the Illuminati, and principles of Jacobinism had not spread in the United States. On the contrary, no one is more truly satisfied of this fact than I am."
President George Washington, October 24, 1798, in a letter to George Washington Snyder

"[The New World Order] cannot happen without U.S. participation, as we are the most significant single component. Yes, there will be a New World Order, and it will force the United States to change it's perceptions."
- Henry Kissenger, World Affairs Council Press Conference, Regent Beverly Wilshire Hotel , April 19th 1994

"Further global progress is now possible only through a quest for universal consensus in the movement towards a new world order."
Mikhail Gorbachev, in an address at the United Nations (December 1988)

"If we do not follow the dictates of our inner moral compass and stand up for human life, then his lawlessness will threaten the peace and democracy of the emerging new world order we now see, this long dreamed-of vision we've all worked toward for so long."
President George Bush (January 1991)

Do people understand that when someone mentions a New World Order they might mean a new shift in the balance of power and a new "regime" [in the broad sense ]of norms and values in world politics, not a single world government after some apocalyptic stage.
There is a difference between government and governance in the broad sense of the word.

for example, when the Cold war ended, Bush senior talked about a NWO as in a new "regime" of power politics and power balance post-cold war

but i am afraid this opinion is way to "conservative" for this site, its sure is less exciting.




[edit on 19-2-2009 by Foppezao]

reply to post by Foppezao

If that were true, wouldn't it make more sense to refer to "new world values", or "new world methods"?

"New world order" clearly implies eventual world government - particularly when coupled with the other pieces of the puzzle such as the EU and increasing discussion of a "new world currency" by everyone from Chinese to EU officials.

"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws."
Mayer Amschel Rothschild

reply to post by Cythraul


I would ask you to step away slightly from Alex Jones. The man has been shown to sensationalize and lie under certain circumstances. Be very careful in believing people without proof.

On the other hand lets be clear and worry slightly about the EU. I myself love some aspects of the EU but there are other areas that worry me. I think a good union would be one that respects sovereignty whilst allowing trade. Sadly we are dictated to by Europe and many are against it.

The worst part of it for me is that people claim that Europe is all for a union and yet don't show the many countries against the EU constitution. Without voting on the constitution how can we possibly present this as a democratic governance?

The simple fact is that we haven't been given this choice, especially here in the UK. We have had legal loopholes abused and Gordon Brown has been the main instigator of it all. He relabeled the EU constitution as a treaty which still seems to contain almost the same laws and controls. That for me is the most disgusting part of it all.

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984

I agree largely with your post. But your presumptions about me and Alex Jones are a little distasteful. I'm only vaguely familiar with him. Do you think he is the only person preaching about the New World Order? Do you not think there are multiple gigabytes worth of websites (not to mention books) presenting similar information?

Originally posted by Cythraul
reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984

 

I agree largely with your post. But your presumptions about me and Alex Jones are a little distasteful. I'm only vaguely familiar with him. Do you think he is the only person preaching about the New World Order? Do you not think there are multiple gigabytes worth of websites (not to mention books) presenting similar information?

You mentioned Alex and linked to him. You will forgive me in thinking you are a die hard supporter i hope. You mentioned a documentary of his that is only partly correct. Therefore i could write you off as an Alex Jones extremist.

Your very relevant points are given less credence when you reference a large body of work that includes many easily refutable arguments. That is all i meant. Just because there are many websites and books presenting information does not make them correct. The last book i read presented the idea that reptilians are controlling all of our thoughts so i cannot accept all books as truth.

I believe certain people have to much power, i believe that certain lobbies have a ridiculous amount of influence, i believe certain people can control stock markets with their friends help. However we must separate the reality from belief. The above stated ideas of mine ar easily traceable.

What worries me is that most people won't see the fact that the wealthy can control entire countries by simply threatening to remove their financial support.

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
You mentioned Alex and linked to him. You will forgive me in thinking you are a die hard supporter i hope. You mentioned a documentary of his that is only partly correct. Therefore i could write you off as an Alex Jones extremist.

I did? In this thread? I think you may be mistaken. I've not referred to him. But I forgive you nevertheless . Just checked back and first and only mention of "Alex Jones" was made by bovarcher.

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
Your very relevant points are given less credence when you reference a large body of work that includes many easily refutable arguments. That is all i meant. Just because there are many websites and books presenting information does not make them correct.

Of course not and I'd never claim so. My point there was simply to establish that one could come to similar conclusions as Alex Jones without following his word specifically.

I agree with the last part of your post. Money talks, but what I've personally concluded from that is that there are certain hidden (and not so hidden figures) who have amounted more wealth than many nations even. In such a situation, the policies, laws and leanings of certain nations can (and have been) bought. Centralisation of power = ultimate power, so for me, logic suggests the emergence of a one-world shadow government. I.e. the "New World Order". Please don't take me for an imbecile who prattles on about conspiracy theories without having pondered and researched. For a start, you'd have to treat a large section of ATS members similarly. We're just going to have to agree to disagree on the reality of an NWO.

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
reply to post by Cythraul

 

Well hang on a second. I don't like the fact that our laws are dictated by Europe so much, however being a part of Europe isn't always a bad things .It does help trade and some other small areas.

Utter tosh. Do you think the French, Germans, Italians, Spanish etc are going to stop selling us their goods and services? Of course not, and why? Well basically because we Brits are their best customers, that's why.

What you are seeing within the EU is a DICTATORSHIP in action. The French and Dutch both voted NO to the Constitution yet Barosa and his henchmen just carried on as if nothing happened. Next up was the Irish vote, a YES vote would have sealed the deal forever, a NO vote would have sunk the EU, forever, but guess what, the NO vote won and they carried on. Now the Irish have been given sweeteners to get the YES vote that the EU requires. It's absolutely sickening that we're suposed to live in a Democracy, anyone that thinks that then you're living in cloud cuckoo land. Didn't I read somewhere that Gordon Brown called Barosa after the Irish NO vote and told them to just dismiss it and carry on regardless? That alone has me seething and the TOTALITARIAN DICTATORSHIP that most think is a conspiracy is well and truly on it's way. Good luck because I'm almost ready to jump ship (hopefully) and get out while I still can.



Chuffer

reply to post by Chuffer


Did i ever say that it isn't a dictatorship? Did i not say that i really don't like having laws dictated by the EU? Calm down before you post something. There are some, small benefits of the EU but the current way it is run is rather worrying especially with the situations you mentioned. It bothers me greatly that when the Irish said no, the government went into propaganda overdrive, saying that the people didn't understand the constitution (because we people are so dumb huh) and proceeded to set up a new vote after indoctrinating the people. I wonder what the result will be this time?

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
reply to post by Chuffer

 

Did i ever say that it isn't a dictatorship? Did i not say that i really don't like having laws dictated by the EU? Calm down before you post something. There are some, small benefits of the EU but the current way it is run is rather worrying especially with the situations you mentioned. It bothers me greatly that when the Irish said no, the government went into propaganda overdrive, saying that the people didn't understand the constitution (because we people are so dumb huh) and proceeded to set up a new vote after indoctrinating the people. I wonder what the result will be this time?

In case you missed it I was referring to your point about TRADE and as I pointed out trade would still happen, irrespective of whether we are in the EU or not.

As an update Barosa and his henchmen must have been working overtime on the Irish as the last I heard the vote was going the way they originally wanted to the YES camp. It'll be a sad sad day for the whole of Europe when this happens, mark my words.

Originally posted by Chuffer
As an update Barosa and his henchmen must have been working overtime on the Irish as the last I heard the vote was going the way they originally wanted to the YES camp. It'll be a sad sad day for the whole of Europe when this happens, mark my words.

I can only agree on that point. An EU constitution is wrong on many levels. If it was just a virtual carbon copy of the American constitution which dealt with rights and freedoms i would be all for it actually. It isn't that though as i'm sure you're aware, it's a tome of useless, interfering rubbish.

The fact that the Irish said no and now, after a long stream of propaganda they are seemingly accepting it i find very worry as it's a real sign of our times. The people say no to something and the government figure out a way to push it through.

Why a Europe for the People, by the People is urgently needed.

www.eu-referendum.org...

Talking about opposing the EU treaty is not enough. It's time to take action. You can start by signing the petition.

For all of you convinced that the EU represents a utopian union which will enhance the lives of everyone, heed the words of a man who lived through the USSR and now sees exactly the same foreboding signs in the form of the EU. Just because we're part of the "Western" world, does not mean that we're immune to tyranny. Wake up!

A British prime minister [I think] back in the 1960's said 'you've never had it so good' looking back at those times, I think he was right, plenty of jobs, low inflation, low loan interest, no conspiracy theorys, no NWO, how lovely it must have all been, no GM crops, no web or net, no influx of foreign wokers, my the UK really did have it good, oh for a time machine!

You never know, maybe people are waking up. With the fiasco over MP's expenses and the fact that the popularity of our MP's is at an all time low, it just goes to show that we still have the power to change things. Hopefully once we've sorted out our own MP's and Parliament, the EU & MEP's are next. With all the fraud & corruption within the EU, it's well overdue for a spring clean. Roll on the EU elections.

www.europarl.europa.eu...



[edit on 21-5-2009 by kindred]

reply to post by kindred

Indeed. Problem is, many people will jump into the arms of the UKIP, whilst their MEPs are engaged in similar looting of the public's money. Though, the problem this time is that it's not just British taxpayer's money, but money taken from across the European Union.