Paul ~ Inventing a new saviour

Hey Christ ..I keep hearing you bring up the Law of One ..
Please tell me that your not referring to this ..
www.llresearch.org...

It is New Age mumbo jumbo from channellors ..

reply to post by justamomma


Thanks for the low blow, o truth holder. Stop comparing God toman like you continue to do, God did tell Moses that the linegae could be passed down from a woman! I quoted it and yet you deny that it was said.

In Numbers 26 we are introduced to Zelophehad. Zelophehad, we are told, had no sons, only daughters. In Numbers 27, following the death of Zelophehad, the daughters of Zelophehad came before Moses and argued their plight. Because their father had died with no sons, all of their rights of inheritance were to be lost and they felt this was unfair. So Moses prayed to God and God gave Moses an exception to the rule. The Lord told Moses that the inheritance CAN flow through a female, IF they fulfill two requirements. There must be no male offspring in the family (Num 27:8) and if the female offspring should marry, they must marry within their own tribe (Num 36:6).

Funny how Mary was able to fit this criteria and in doing so God blessed her with Jesus.

[edit on -06002009-01-23T10:37:50-06:00312009bAmerica/ChicagoFri, 23 Jan 2009 10:37:50 -0600, 1 by TheMythLives]

reply to post by justamomma

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by darkelf

 

So then who was the Son of man? If Jesus was the Son of G.d (as in the only begotten), who was the Son of man?

Jesus is the Son of God. He inherited His title Son of Man from His mother who was of the seed of Adam (man). This title denotes His humanity.

Other names:

Jesus - the English translation from the Greek Iesous. The Hebew equivalent is Yeshua which means salvation.

Christ- the English translation from the Greek Christos. The Hebew equivalent is Mashach which means anoint or consecrate. Consecrate means to make sacred. There were only three types of people who were anointed in the Tanakh; Kings, Priest and Prophets.

Exodus 29:5-7
And thou shalt take the garments, and put upon Aaron the coat, and the robe of the ephod, and the ephod, and the breastplate, and gird him with the curious girdle of the ephod:
And thou shalt put the mitre upon his head, and put the holy crown upon the mitre.
Then shalt thou take the anointing oil, and pour it upon his head, and anoint him.

1 Samuel 16:13
Then Samuel took the horn of oil, and anointed him in the midst of his brethren: and the Spirit of the LORD came upon David from that day forward. So Samuel rose up, and went to Ramah.

1 Kings 19:16
And Jehu the son of Nimshi shalt thou anoint to be king over Israel: and Elisha the son of Shaphat of Abelmeholah shalt thou anoint to be prophet in thy room.

Jesus was all three:

Luke 19:35-40
And they brought him to Jesus: and they cast their garments upon the colt, and they set Jesus thereon.
And as he went, they spread their clothes in the way.
And when he was come nigh, even now at the descent of the mount of Olives, the whole multitude of the disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen;
Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest.
And some of the Pharisees from among the multitude said unto him, Master, rebuke thy disciples.
And he answered and said unto them, I tell you that, if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out.
Hebrews 7:15-17
And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

Matthew 21:11
And the multitude said, This is Jesus the prophet of Nazareth of Galilee.

reply to post by justamomma

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by darkelf

 

Were you all even aware that the promised messiah was to be of the lineage of David and not by the mothers line, but by the line of the father?

Genesis 3:14-15
And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Isaiah 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Did you know that the only begotten Son is said to have a mother who was a Hittite and a father who was a Amorite? Did you know also that the promised messiah that is prophesied in Isaiah is said to be born of the two afore mentioned nations?

I couldn’t find it in Isaiah, however, I did find this from the prophet Ezekiel:

Ezekiel 16:3
And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD unto Jerusalem; Thy birth and thy nativity is of the land of Canaan; thy father was an Amorite, and thy mother an Hittite.

God is speaking to the inhabitants of Jerusalem (Israel) concerning their sins against Him. It is Israel who was born from an Amorite and a Hittite.

Genesis 14:13
And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew; for he dwelt in the plain of Mamre the Amorite, brother of Eshcol, and brother of Aner: and these were confederate with Abram.

Ambraham lived in the land of the Amorites.

Genesis 50:13
For his (Jacob) sons carried him into the land of Canaan, and buried him in the cave of the field of Machpelah, which Abraham bought with the field for a possession of a buryingplace of Ephron the Hittite, before Mamre. Parenthetical mine.

Abraham bought this plot of land to bury Sarah. His wife Sarah was buried in the land of the Hittites. Why did Abraham bury his wife in the land of the Hittites? Was is because people were normally buried in the land of their ancestors? In Genesis 49:29 we read where Esau asked to be buried in the caves of his fathers as did Jacob.

Come on! Jesus was the lie... the man was the lie. The truth is greater than you will even G.d credit for and He (G.d) does NOT break any laws!

The Truth is greater than we mere mortals can comprehend. God broke no law. He fulfilled the Law!

He IS picking the snake (the deception) back up by the tail and turning it BACK into the staff (the law) to show the world that He alone is the ONLY true G.d... the G.d of Israel! Do you really want to be on the other side of that to realize the truth? It is all there written before you so that you will have no excuse to have fallen for the lie. It is the truth.

The God of Israel is the One and Only God. He is Elohim (plural). He is Father, Son and Spirit. He always was and will always be. It is all there written before you so that you will have no excuse to have fallen for the lie. It is the truth.



[edit on 1/23/2009 by darkelf]

reply to post by justamomma

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by darkelf

 

Strange.. a man is not a lamb.. actually, the strange thing is believing that a lamb does = a man.

John 1:29, 36
The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!

Genesis 22:8
And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

Ezekiel 45:15
And one lamb out of the flock, out of two hundred, out of the fat pastures of Israel; for a meat offering, and for a burnt offering, and for peace offerings, to make reconciliation for them, saith the Lord GOD. (emphasis mine)

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by justamomma

 

I am lost by what you said at the end of that sentence, but Jesus was the word made flesh, the living word of God. The prophets were not the word! They spoke it, there is a big difference. Jesus was not a prophet but the divine. Jesus spoke the word and grasped and understood it so well because he IS the Word! I cannot explain it any simpler than that..

Jesus was NOT the Word.. That is the image that will keep you trapped and blind to seeing that the Word, aka the Son of man HAS returned. You look for a man. Everyone is so willing to trust men... why is no one willing to trust G.d anymore??? You want the physical.. and the physical leads only to death! G.d is not physical.. He uses the physical to teach us... but we worship the physical.. it is silly logic.

How will you know Jesus? You have never met Him. Unless you know the Word, you will fall. The Word is not confined to flesh and blood.
[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

I do not worship a physical person. I serve a risen Savior. Just wanted to clarify.

Originally posted by TheMythLives
Refering to Jesus's lineage.

Evidently Matthew traces Jesus' legal lineage through His foster father Joseph, whereas Luke traces it back through the natural lineage of His mother Mary. Matthew records that an angel appeared to Joseph, Jesus' foster father.
Luke tells of the angel Gabriel appearing to Mary, Jesus' mother. Similarly, Matthew tells of the astrologers coming to visit the child Jesus, ";the king of the Jews", bringing costly gifts, whereas Luke tells of humble shepherds being invited to see the newborn Savior.

I have heard, that Matthew was a Jew and was writing to the Jews. Where Luke was a Gentile and was writing to Gentiles. There are a few differences in their accounts that appear to support this hypothesis.

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by Christ!

 

But see, we don't need to argue over Jesus' lineage because it does not matter. The sufferinig servant and the messiah was declared clearly in the Tanakh.. and I am not sure about everyone else.. but I don't see "Jesus" being named.. Thank G.d... because He will prove Himself by NOT using the hands of man. He will use the mouth of some, but you can not hear when your fingers are stuffed in your ears.

In the Tanakh, everywhere you see the word 'salvation' you see the name Yeshua. This is the Hebrew word for salvation.

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by Christ!

Originally posted by justamomma
*

Please explain, in your words, or any words, the Truth.

Thanks,

Christ!

[edit on 22-1-2009 by Christ!]

I have been. It is not my fault that you all don't recognize it. I am stating clearly the Truth. The truth is there is only one Saviour.. only one Redeemer.. only one G.d. It is Him.. it is not a man. He does not change.. our perspective may change.. but our assurance is that HE does not.

YES! It's just that you only see God as one when we see Elohim the plural nature of God. I understand that you don't accept Jesus as part of the Godhead, but do you accept God's Spirit as seperate from God but also God?

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by justamomma

 

So a tree busting into flames sponatneously happens in nature? A world Wide flood? The creation of man from the dirt of the earth? The creation of woman from rib bone? Or a plague killing all the Egyptian babies? Moses cane turning into a serpent.. yep that all happens in nature...

It is all allegorical. It depicts the truth and does so in a way so that we do not fall for the lies and worship images.

The Tanakh was written by scribes while in babylonian custody. The Torah was not written by a man who stood on a mountain and actually received the 10 commandments written in stone by the finger of G.d. It was an allegory depicting the Truth.. helping us to decipher the lies from the truth.

You know the story of the ugly duckling. You know the truth from that allegory right? Do you actually believe there was a duck that was crying and complaining to other animals that he was ugly? No, you know it is simply an allegory depicting a truth about ourselves. It is that simple.

I am Jonah in the belly of the whale. It was my heart of stone that the Laws of G.d were written and sealed by the finger of G.d. I am a disciple of the Word of the LORD. I am His child and these are the stories that He uses to teach me the truths.

This is where I disagree. I take God's Word in a literal sense, but also see the allegories. I stated before that I learned from a Rabbi many years ago to take the Word of God seriously. It is both literal and allegorical.

Originally posted by pureevil81
reply to post by justamomma

 

Excellent post!!!

star for you.

Justamomma, you are making this more clear than I ever could, yet they still dont understand.

Is everyone waiting for a MAN to come back riding a cloud to save you.... Oh dear.

No, we are waiting for God in the form of Jesus to come back riding a cloud. . . to set up His Kingdom and to rule and reign forever.

Since I won't be on again until after tomorrow evening, I though I'd try to get these posted today.

Originally posted by darkelf
No, we are waiting for God in the form of Jesus to come back riding a cloud. . . to set up His Kingdom and to rule and reign forever.

Sounds like you are waiting for the anti-christ. Waiting for that political figure that is going to change the world physically.

New religion - Christianity - check.

Not gonna be happy until this religion is accepted around the world - check.

Waiting for a political/physical power to change everything - check.

Unable to see or understand the kingdom of god is within, and is thus still waiting - check.

He cometh with clouds ...(clouds are symbolic in meaning here Justamomma )
Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they [also] which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

HEBREW meaning ..
1) a cloud, a large dense multitude, a throng

a) used to denote a great shapeless collection of vapour obscuring the heavens as opposed to a particular and definite masses of vapour with some form or shape

b) a cloud in the sky


A MULTITUDE >....which is the Inumerable company of angels ...
Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

Hbr 12:20 (For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:

Hbr 12:21 And so terrible was the sight, [that] Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake
Hbr 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,


Very similar to when the Lord came to the Mountain to speak to the children of Israel .
Deu 33:2 And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand [went] a fiery law for them.

Exd 19:13 There shall not an hand touch it, but he shall surely be stoned, or shot through; whether [it be] beast or man, it shall not live: when the trumpet soundeth long, they shall come up to the mount.

Exd 19:16 And it came to pass on the third day in the morning, that there were thunders and lightnings, and a thick cloud upon the mount, and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud; so that all the people that [was] in the camp trembled.

Originally posted by badmedia

Originally posted by darkelf
No, we are waiting for God in the form of Jesus to come back riding a cloud. . . to set up His Kingdom and to rule and reign forever.

Sounds like you are waiting for the anti-christ. Waiting for that political figure that is going to change the world physically.

New religion - Christianity - check.

Not gonna be happy until this religion is accepted around the world - check.

Waiting for a political/physical power to change everything - check.

Unable to see or understand the kingdom of god is within, and is thus still waiting - check.

NOT ..as the Antichrist will already be here and will be ruling when the Lord comes back ..if you knew scripture (which you dont care to know) you would know this ..
The Antichrist comes as a political leader (as a mere man) ask Justammoma ..thats what she has been saying ...a leader will come from the Jews who will be just a man (they even say it could be anyone ..even Justamomma)
And it is he who will lead the Nations AGAINST CHRIST when he comes ..(according to scriptures) ................

Rev 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who [is] like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty [and] two months.

Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
((((((((WHAT IS THAT NAME of GOD he blasphemines ?? YES JESUS ))))

Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
(((((((Notice here it says THE WHOLE EARTH shall worship him WHOSE NAMES ARE NOT WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE ...your name is written down in this book when you believe and accept Jesus as your saviour)))NOTICE THE ONLY ONES WHO will worship this BEAST is those whose names are not written in that book of life>>)))T

Rev 13:9 If any man have an ear, let him hear

If you have an ear to hear ...then hear it ...........

reply to post by Simplynoone


Very well put Simplynoone. The Antichirst will lie and perform false miralces. He will bash the son of God and God himself, he will proclaim himself as the most high and demand that all nations kneel before him.

"The beast was given a mouth to utter proud words and blasphemies and to exercise his authority for forty-two months. He opened his mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven. He was given power to make war against the saints and to conquer them. And he was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation. All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast--all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world."

reply to post by badmedia


The antichrist will not only change the world physically but spiritually,but destroying peoples faith in there savior. The coming of christ will not only all at ONCE change the world physically, but Spiritually as well, all in one. Ushering in his fathers Kingdom and renewing the souls of many.

[edit on -06002009-01-23T12:14:53-06:00312009bAmerica/ChicagoFri, 23 Jan 2009 12:14:53 -0600, 1 by TheMythLives]

reply to post by Simplynoone


Hear it? Look around and you will see it. The new religion since Jesus is already here. It is called Christianity.

Was it created politically? YES.

Was there a political shepherd? YES, that is what this thread has been about.

Has this religion done things that are completely against the teachings of Jesus? YES.

Beast = government. Has this religion embraced government? YES. Paul even says so directly. However, it was the people of the earth who DEMANDED a king/government from God.

Did this religion make war with the saints? YES, it killed anyone who didn't go along. And still to this day seeks to kill and convert everyone to this religion. Is not happy until that day. Won't be happy until everyone worships Jesus the idol as God.

You keep talking about things that are "coming" because you are too blind to see the majority of it has already happened. Because for some odd reason, you look at every other religion and belief as being wrong by default - except for your own! Which TADA, is exactly what those who become deceived must actually do.

I'm not sure what part of "Prince of this world" you did not understand. If the prince of this world was coming, then who do you think the King of this world is? Who was able to offer Jesus this world? And yet, you don't even realize that the religion you have was created by and during the reign of this King/Prince. NOT during the time of Jesus. So if this is not the kingdom of Jesus, and he doesn't have power, and talks about we will have little strength, then how in the world does this new religion suddenly start taking hold and have all the power to do the things that it's done? Especially during a time when Jesus says - you will be persecuted. And this is the entity that does the persecution.

And you may say, I'm not catholic. But you still follow the religion. You still interpret Jesus based on Paul.

You've accepted 1+1=2 as truth, rather than understanding A+B=C. And this is deception. Satan wants you to be stuck in such a lack of understanding, so that he can simulate 1+1=2 for you. Satan can be 1+1=2 for you, he has no chance in hell of ever being A+B=C. He can only ever be separate for you, and so you must accept a separate entity as God(1+1=2). Instead of recognizing the god that is within you(A + B = C).

If you are awaiting for the father/Jesus to descend, hope instead that he descends within you and among your clouds of confusion.

I will post this again ...this is the Jewish version of the Messiah who is to come .
The Moshiach

The moshiach will be a great political leader descended from King David (Jeremiah 23:5). The moshiach is often referred to as "moshiach ben David" (moshiach, son of David). He will be well-versed in Jewish law, and observant of its commandments (Isaiah 11:2-5). He will be a charismatic leader, inspiring others to follow his example. He will be a great military leader, who will win battles for Israel. He will be a great judge, who makes righteous decisions (Jeremiah 33:15). But above all, he will be a human being, not a god, demi-god or other supernatural being.

It has been said that in every generation, a person is born with the potential to be the moshiach. If the time is right for the messianic age within that person's lifetime, then that person will be the moshiach. But if that person dies before he completes the mission of the moshiach, then that person is not the moshiach.
www.jewfaq.org...

Orthodox beliefs what the Messiah will do
Mishneh Torah, Hilchot Melachim XI - XII.

The King Messiah will in some future time come, restore the kingdom of David to its former power, build the Temple, bring together the scattered of Israel, and all the ancient laws will again be in force. Sacrifices will be offered, and years of release and Jubilees will be kept as prescribed in the Torah. Whoever does not believe in him, or does not hope for his coming, shows a lack of faith not only in the prophets, but also in the Torah. For the Torah testifies concerning him in the words: 'And the L-rd your God will again bring back your captivity, and show mercy unto you, and again gather you from all the nations...If your outcasts be at the ends of the heavens, from there will the L-rd gather you...and the L-rd will bring you into the land which your fathers possessed...'(Deut. 30:3-5)


You must not imagine that the messiah must prove his messianity by signs and miracles, doing something unexpected, bringing the dead to life, or similar things. The principle thing is this: the statutes and precepts of our Torah remain forever, and nothing can be added to them or taken from them.


If, therefore, a descendant of David earnestly studies the Torah, observes what the written and oral Torah enjoins, causes all Israelites to act similarly, exhorts those who are lax in the performance of the commandments, and fights the wars of the L-rd, he may possibly be the messiah. If he does not succeed, or is killed in war, it is certain that he is not the messiah promised in the Torah. He is like all the other noble and good kings of the House of David who have died, and God only caused him to rise in order to try us thereby, as it is said, `And of the wise some will stumble, and through them the people will be tested, purified, and made white, till the time of the end comes; for there is yet a vision for an appointed time.' (Dan. 11:35).


Also, Jesus the Nazarene, who imagined that he would be messiah and was killed, is alluded to in the book of Daniel, as it is said, `And the sons of the transgressors among thy people will rise, in order to establish a vision, and will stumble' (Dan. 11:14). Can there be a greater stumbling then this? All the prophets said that messiah will be a redeemer and a savior to the Israelites, will bring together their outcasts, and will strengthen their obedience to the Divine precepts, but he (Jesus) caused destruction by the sword to Israel, the dispersion of those left, and their humiliation. He changed the law, and misled many people to worship a being beside God.


But the thoughts of the Creator of the universe cannot be understood by any human being, for the ways of men are not His ways, nor their thoughts His thoughts. For all the events connected with Jesus, and with Mohammed that rose after him, served only to pave the way for the King Messiah, who will reform all mankind and lead them to the unanimous service of God, as it is said, 'For then will I turn to the peoples a pure language, that all may call by the name of God, and serve him unanimously' (Zeph. 3:9).


How can this be done? Almost all people have through them (Jesus and Mohammed) become acquainted with the idea of messiah, with the words of the Torah and the Divine precepts. Through them the knowledge of the Bible spread even unto the remotest islands and unto many nations 'uncircumcised' in heart and uncircumcised in flesh. These nations seek to justify their disobedience to the precepts of the Torah. Some of them say that these precepts are Divine, but are not in force at present, and were never intended to be permanent laws. Others maintain that they must not be taken literally, as they are mere symbols, the meaning of which has already been explained by their 'messiah'. But when the true King Messiah will rise, he will prosper, be high and exalted. All will then at once know that it was falsehood what their fathers have inherited, and that their prophets and their teachers have misled them.


It is not because they desired to have dominion over all lands and nations and be honored by all people, or because they desired to have plenty to eat and drink and other pleasures, that the wise men and the prophets longed for the days of the messiah, but because they would then be at leisure to study the Torah and its teachings without being interrupted by any oppressor, and would thus make themselves worthy of life in the World to Come.


There will not be in those days any famine, war, jealousy, or quarrel, because the good things will be in plenty and even luxuries will be found everywhere. All people will busy themselves with trying to know the L-rd. Therefore, the Israelites will be great sages, knowing things which are at present hidden. They will obtain a knowledge of their Creator as far as possible by human understanding; `For the earth shall be full with the knowledge of the L-rd as the waters cover the sea.' (Isaiah 11:9).
judaism.about.com...://www.jewsforjudaism.org


Sounds alot like what the Antichrist will be like ...





[edit on 23-1-2009 by Simplynoone]

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by badmedia

 

The antichrist will not only change the world physically but spiritually,but destroying peoples faith in there savior. The coming of christ will not only all at ONCE change the world physically, but Spiritually as well, all in one. Ushering in his fathers Kingdom and renewing the souls of many.

Funny, because Paul and the church destroyed my faith in Jesus as a child. I looked at their hypocrisy, their dogma and so on, and all I saw was ignorance, not enlightenment. Completely rejected it.

When I did actually become awakened by the father, Jesus and religion were far away from me. I wanted nothing to do with such things at all. And yet, after the father and the holy spirit taught me - suddenly I can and do see the truth in the words of Jesus.

Furthermore, I have never seen anything physically ever change. That is not how the world changes physically. I can see "through" people, but I do not physically see it with the 2 eyes. I see it from understanding things differently. I can see the lies they speak and the deception of what they say very clearly. It completely changed how I see the world physically and spiritually, but it doesn't change your 2 eyes.