Barack Obama Is Qualified To Be President... Isn't He? (by Jim Marrs)

Originally posted by maybereal11

Originally posted by sos37
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

 

Uh, yeah - "Certification of Live Birth" and "Certificate of Live Birth". Those are the same things. Both that is different from a birth certificate.

And again - we still have a forensics expert who maintains that the documents are fakes.

DanX asked why was the man's face pixelized out on the You-Tube video - I think this is obvious. It's a security precaution. If nothing else, the campaign taught us that those who question Obama are met with hostility. Look at what happened to Joe the Plumber. So if you, a forensics expert, maintain that these documents are forged and you show your face in public, you risk the following:

1. Obama-sympathetic powers that be compromising your current job and future job prospects
2. Death threats
3. Violence

I'm sure if a court called on this expert to testify, he would do so.

Okay...if the docs are fake and the Government of Hawaii is obviously in on it since they repeatedly validated the document...why didn't they originally produce a faked vault copy? Or do so now? In for a penny in for a pound?

Also...if the Gov of Hawaii is faking documents for Obama...what good would it do to see what will most certainly be a faked "vault copy"?

I like how you keep saying that what you want to see is the vault copy...while at the same time infering you won't trust anything you see from the Gov.

Like I said before, why would Obama respond to this nonsense? It will NEVER be enough for you Sos.

Hey, as we've just witnessed in the past two days, corruption can go high. Look at the governor of Illinois and where he is now.

I don't believe I've made any conclusions about the vaulted copy at all, because no one has seen it. Yes, I would love to see a photo of it, as would a lot of people. Also, I've never said with certainty that the COLB is a forgery, but I've pointed out that there is a forensics expert who HAS said just that.

The vault copy may state something completely different than what's on the COLB. How do we know the governor of Hawaii or anyone in the state dept. has actually looked upon the birth certificate with their own eyes, especially if it's locked away?

If the SCOTUS examined the documents from Hawaii and brought in their own team of document examiners, weighed the evidence or lack thereof then I would be satisfied at accepting whatever conclusion they came to.

What bothers me is Obama's insistence at doing nothing at resolving this issue when he SAYS that he wants unity in America. As this issue grows and takes on a life of its own, it's rapidly dividing America! And right now, the proportions may be small versus large, but the fact remains that Obama could achieve the unity he says he desires without court action. He has even to address the issue formally in a speech. Things like this are what make me skeptical of his intentions. Does he really care about unifying America or not?

reply to post by FlyersFan

Obama should release the locked up original Birth Certificate

JJJ said that?

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
JJJ said that?

NO. NO NO NO.

I separated what Jackson Jr. said and what I am saying.

I put the ******** line to show the separation.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
JJJ said that?

NO. NO NO NO.

I separated what Jackson Jr. said and what I am saying.

I put the ******** line to show the separation.

LOL alrighty, darn that would have been great though.

reply to post by danx


If it can be proven that John McCain isn't a natural born citizen, then of course he too would be ineligible for running for president in all future elections and possibly serving in the Senate.

The real conundrum - if Obama was found ineligible, and McCain was found ineligible, then we would be in a real spot wouldn't we? It would be Hilary in a runoff election versus ... hmmm ... I dunno, possibly Huckabee. At that point my head would be swimming. I think the rest of the country would resort to drinking, well all except for the PUMAs.

Originally posted by sos37
Uh, yeah - "Certification of Live Birth" and "Certificate of Live Birth". Those are the same things. Both that is different from a birth certificate.

Which is this? Note the title...

And again - we still have a forensics expert who maintains that the documents are fakes.

We have SOME DUDE who has shown NO qualifications or credentials AT ALL, yet you soak up his words like manna and call him an expert just because he says so... :shk: Your agenda is showing...

Originally posted by sos37
Also, I've never said with certainty that the COLB is a forgery, but I've pointed out that there is a forensics expert who HAS said just that.

And who is exactly that forensics expert? He doesn’t show his face, so most likely Polarik is not even his real name. Perhaps he’s not even a Dr. Perhaps he’s not even a forensics expert. See what I’m saying?

It just strikes me as odd that you would believe in a person that hides his identity, that we have no way of confirming his credentials, but wouldn’t believe factcheck’s analysis.

To me, it shows a predisposition to believe a certain theory of the story.

How do we know the governor of Hawaii or anyone in the state dept. has actually looked upon the birth certificate with their own eyes, especially if it's locked away?

Because she said she checked. Isn’t it good enough to believe her word? You believed that “forensics expert” at his word, and he doesn’t even have his job on the line.

YOu think with these new revelation about Obama's associates, the Court will be swayed to look more closely at the BC?

Are there any real americans left in politics?

Originally posted by sos37
If it can be proven that John McCain isn't a natural born citizen, then of course he too would be ineligible for running for president in all future elections and possibly serving in the Senate.

Just so you know, both Donofrio and Wrotnowski are disputing that McCain is a “natural born” citizen.

As a note: McCain would be allowed to serve in the Senate. You only have to a US citizen (for at least 9 years) to be a Senator. A “natural born” citizen is not a requirement.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
Jessie Jackson Jr. gave a very good press conference about an hour ago.
To paraphrase him - Public service means private sacrifice.

This Jesse Jackson Jr.?

abcnews.go.com...

Chicago Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr., D-Ill., is the anonymous "Senate Candidate No. 5" whose emissaries Illinois Gov. Rod Blagojevich reportedly offered up to $1 million to name him to the U.S. Senate, his attorney confirmed today after it was reported earlier on ABCNews.com "The Blotter".

reply to post by sos37


The "forensics expert", being Polarik, never handled the actual and original Certification of Live Birth that was available at Obama's campaign headquarters in Chicago. All Polarik did was analyze digital images of the COLB. If he were a true forensics expert he would have exercised prudence and due diligence by taking a trip to Chicago to view the actual document just as Factcheck.org did.

Doesn't it strike you as strange that one who claims to be a documents expert doesn't actually analyze the actual document in question?

And this question highlights the claims made by all of those who have filed suit against Obama on this issue. None of them did as Factcheck.org did. None of them went the distance to vet the actual document that Factcheck.org made clear was available at Obama's campaign headquarters in Chicago. One would think that at least Berg would have done so since he portrays himself as being someone who would go the distance to uncover the truth. But he didn't and neither did the others.

All who have legally challenged Obama on his birth certificate have based their legal complaints and claims on Internet hearsay. Andy Martin and Jerome Corsi flew all the way to Hawaii to challenge Hawaii's department of health, but neither could take a trip to Chicago, with document experts in tow, to view Obama's Certification of Live Birth first hand?

deleted - fake video

[edit on 12/10/08 by redhatty]

reply to post by redhatty


EDIT: fake video deleted

[edit on 10-12-2008 by rapinbatsisaltherage]

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

We have SOME DUDE who has shown NO qualifications or credentials AT ALL, yet you soak up his words like manna and call him an expert just because he says so... :shk: Your agenda is showing...

You know, the only reason I give the forensics expert any credibility is because of all the other oddities that go along with this saga. If it was just a case of a forensics expert saying, "hey the COLB is a forgery" and nothing else else was odd about this issue then I would give him far less credit. It's true I cannot prove him to be credible, but you also cannot prove him to be a liar as you don't possess the evidence to do so.

But the facts remain:

* A judge in Hawaii specifically gave instructions for the media not to be able to get ahold of the birth certificate;

* Men from the Sheriff's office were posted to presumably guard and brush off questions about the birth certificate;

* Despite the number of suits filed on this issue, Obama has yet to make one public comment or respond in any of the suits, including the one in California where a judge has found that the plaintiffs have standing to sue;

* Berg claims to have a recording of Obama's grandmother saying that Obama Jr. was born in Kenya and that she was in the hospital when it happened;

* Jerome Corsi's papers were mysteriously misplaced by Kenyan officials who then detained him without access to any communications devices for hours;

Don't you get it yet? Again, if it were only one of these inconsistencies sticking out, it would be easy to dismiss. But when they pile up like this, it starts to look more and more weird. The weirder it looks, the more people want answers. Isn't this the very reason a site like ATS exists in the first place???

reply to post by sos37

It's true I cannot prove him to be credible, but you also cannot prove him to be a liar as you don't possess the evidence to do so.

So we should just believe he is being truthful? The burden of proof is on him to prove what he says is the truth, he has not. So far he has just stated something with no credible evidence to back up his claims, and with out confirming he is who he claims to be. First he must produce his proof, then we can attempt to counter it, so far there is nothing to counter. So far he is just a man making statements that contain no substantial evidence.

Originally posted by sos37
* A judge in Hawaii specifically gave instructions for the media not to be able to get ahold of the birth certificate;

WHAT? What are you talking about? This is the first I've heard of this. Source, please.

* Men from the Sheriff's office were posted to presumably guard and brush off questions about the birth certificate;

Same thing. First I've heard of it. Source?

* Despite the number of suits filed on this issue, Obama has yet to make one public comment or respond in any of the suits, including the one in California where a judge has found that the plaintiffs have standing to sue;

He responded to the charges on his website.

* Berg claims
...
* Jerome Corsi's
...
Don't you get it yet?

I totally get it.

Originally posted by rapinbatsisaltherage
reply to post by sos37

 

It's true I cannot prove him to be credible, but you also cannot prove him to be a liar as you don't possess the evidence to do so.

So we should just believe he is being truthful? The burden of proof is on him to prove what he says is the truth, he has not. [miche has deleted the rest for brevity.]

I find it incredibly funny that as a plebian the burden of proof is on me to submit several forms of ID for a minimum wage job. The burden of proof for the guy with the ability to nuke the world is dependent on the number of people that would dress him in purple.

I think Obama is a great guy and I certainly like him better than McCain (disagree with both on policy though) but you've only gelled my belief in the BS nature of it all. We may as well become Barbarians and take what we wish after each battle.

I say this as somebody who grew up dirt poor, worked hard, supported myself until I got the rest of my comfort as a wife. As broke as my Goodwill shopping family was, I still think that class is a bull# issue dividing all of us. Take earning capability out of the equation and then I see the class war. Those who wish to rule and those who care not to.

reply to post by micheshi

The burden of proof for the guy with the ability to nuke the world is dependent on the number of people that would dress him in purple.

Ignoring the tangents- how has Obama failed the burden of proof? He’s proved he’s a US citizen. He has ample documentation to prove everything the constitution requires of him. The burden of proof is now on those who claim his documentation is false or not sufficient.

reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage


I didn't say that President Elect Obama failed. I only articulated that if I were questioned about the legitimacy of my personhood in say, the bar/food service industry, I'd be required to pony up much more. If I want to go into a federal courts building (under Real ID which has admittedly been blocked on a state level), I'd have to produce more. I'm only pointing out that the person with an ability greater than mine to destroy should have the same burden of proof.

Again, I think Obama is heads/shoulders above McCain and even my party's nominee, Bob Barr. I just didn't like his policy enough to vote for him. I did like him enough to send him words of encouragement way back in the primary stage of it all.

This is- for many of us anyway- about an elected (by pop. vote as we all know that pop. vote doesn't pick the prez) official being above review. I'm not well known here but I've been pretty vocal and public elsewhere. I spoke against the Obama=Anti-Christ crud here:\ladyliberty.wordpress.com...

and while I was defending my right to post a sign (not Obama related) in my own yard, I said that the whole prez race was a popularity contest here:

ladyliberty.wordpress.com...

and, I actually told the attorney by email and on the phone that my sign in East TX could have said, "Obama eats babies and nobody would have complained!" The HOA prez/atty agreed and dropped the matter so I didn't choose to publish the rest of the email exchange.

I do hope that you understand that I'm not one who would denigrate the Obama family for partisan sport. Hell, our government has screwed all of us so badly that even if Obama weren't eligible, we could bring it to a vote immediately, perhaps get some Run Off Voting rules in place- ANYTHING- but let's do something with knowledge and some sort of unity. (To be clear, unity to me = something a little more than 60/40. Oh, and sometimes I have a little wine and get preachy.)

Edit for this:
Ignoring the tangents- how has Obama failed the burden of proof? He’s proved he’s a US citizen.

Hell, I didn't get to the core of what you asked. (Did I mention that I ate a great steak and drank a fine Malbec?) Yes, Obama is a citizen; that's never been in question. The question is if he's a citizen eligible for the presidency. That one's not so clear in a positive or negative manner. Now I'm wondering if my brother in law- born in Canada of Indian parents who were American later- is eligible to run for prez. He's certainly qualified (Stanford trained doc and BRILLIANT!) but would he be eligible? Hell my husband is qualified (another Ivy League doc) though I'd never vote for him (he likes Obama's policies.) but even he might not be eligible even though he was born in the Mid-West as an American. His parents mayn't have been citizens long enough before his birth to make him eligible.

Just sayin'.





[edit on 10-12-2008 by micheshi]

Originally posted by sos37
The real conundrum - if Obama was found ineligible, and McCain was found ineligible, then we would be in a real spot wouldn't we? It would be Hilary in a runoff election versus ... hmmm ... I dunno, possibly Huckabee. At that point my head would be swimming.

No according to the 20th Amendment, if the president elect were declared ineligible or died before taking office, Biden would be sworn in as POTUS.

Section 3.
If, at the time fixed for the beginning of the term of the President, the President elect shall have died, the Vice President elect shall become President. If a President shall not have been chosen before the time fixed for the beginning of his term, or if the President elect shall have failed to qualify, then the Vice President elect shall act as President until a President shall have qualified; and the Congress may by law provide for the case wherein neither a President elect nor a Vice President shall have qualified, declaring who shall then act as President, or the manner in which one who is to act shall be selected, and such person shall act accordingly until a President or Vice President shall have qualified.

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