Radical Homosexual Terrorism

reply to post by Bigwhammy


And you don't find the fact that they used "itsy bitsy pieces" a little non-threatening? I mean really, I can't even imagine an organized gay terrorist cell. Although, it might make a good HBO show.

And dangit asmeone2, stop making me star your posts! Too freakin funny!

reply to post by Bigwhammy


And the American Founders were terrorists for killing innocent British soldiers.

Perhaps these Bash Back fellows are claiming themselves to be terrorists, their methods are certainly light in the terror department. I would go more in the realms of affronting and irritating.

There is always going to be social upheaval and unrest when things are perceived as needing to change by certain subsections of society. The Women's Lib and Equal Rights movements both had their share of physical protests, and laws were broken in both cases.

The law is not necessarily Just. It is just the law.

So you want a real social war? Bring it! We can f--- you
up while we're ----ing each other.

Oh my goodness, how kinky, certain people on certain markets would pay a lot of money go blind to that!

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


Say that on an airplane and see how amusing it is...

Ok one final note in contast to the hate rant from Bash Back the churches press release...

The leadership of Mount Hope Church does not attempt to identify the church as antihomosexual, anti-choice, or right wing. The church does take the Bible at face value and believes what the Bible says to be the truth. According to the Bible, Mount Hope Church believes fornication, stealing, homosexuality, drunkenness, and lying are sins. No sin greater than the next. Mount Hope Church strives to follow Jesus’ example of loving the sinner but not the sin while helping people change their lives for God’s glory and their improved quality of life. Mount Hope Church also recognizes that to each person God grants freewill.

www.mounthopechurch.org...


Good Night.



[edit on 11/18/2008 by Bigwhammy]

Terrorism is mostly being used against homosexuals.

The FBI reported more than 7,600 hate crimes incidents in 2007, down about 1 percent from the previous year. The decline was driven by decreases in the two largest categories of hate crimes — crimes against race and religion.
But incidents linked to prejudice against sexual orientation, the third-largest category, increased about 6 percent, the report found.

FBI: hate crimes 2007

Nearly four in 10 gay men and about one in eight lesbians and bisexuals in the United States have been the target of violence or a property crime because of their sexual orientation, according to a new study by University of California, Davis, psychology professor Gregory Herek.

anti gay hate crimes widespread

Another huge participant in this 'terrorism':

Christian Churches that teach their children to fear homosexuals simply because of their orientation.

reply to post by Bigwhammy


My point my friend of tolerance and empathy was not to amuse you.

But to show you how absurd your statement was. You said the case was officially closed. That our argument that this was not terrorism was completely dismantled.

Why? Because they gave themselves the label and declared it?

[edit on 19-11-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]

reply to post by Bigwhammy


From that quote:

The leadership of Mount Hope Church does not attempt to identify the church as antihomosexual, anti-choice, or right wing. The church does take the Bible at face value and believes what the Bible says to be the truth.

Church agreeing to the interpretation of the Bible about homosexuality makes it anti-homosexual.

The sad thing is that the Bible is misinterpreted to oppose homosexuality.

Bad interpretations of the Bible plant seeds and are copied everywhere. Sure many Christians are tolerant, but bigotry due to bad interpretations rear it's ugly head in some places.

Pull out the root and this problem is solved.

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
Another huge participant in this 'terrorism':

Christian Churches that teach their children to fear homosexuals simply because of their orientation.

A few years ago, there was this really cool guy that used to work were I work. The guy was gay. He was also extremely intelligent and had a great sense of humor. I have always considered him to be a good friend.

After my weekend off, I returned to work to find out that he had quit. When I asked why, I was informed that several of my co-workers had been throwing things at him, calling him terrible names, and just being generally abusive towards him...all because he was gay.

The people who acted that way were all godless, non-theistic, atheists and agnostic types. And the only person there who bothered to raise hell about their hateful actions was me...a Christian. Yep...go figure that one out.

reply to post by Lightmare


Wow, you really should pat yourself on the back. Instead of actively taking a role in stopping Christians from gay bashing, you are a hero and have cleared all Christians because you did what? You did not stick up for him, you did not defend him, you did not help him with these bullies. You did not know until after he quit that it had even happend.

Hooray for you. You were absent and know some bigoted atheists. Want another star for pretending Christians are not at the root of this? How about for doing nothing to help or stop any of it?

reply to post by Lightmare


That's great of you That you didn't partake in that hate.



Anyone who is unbiased enough to look at statistics. To read the FBI stats. Or the countless surveys nationwide. Or listen to the testimonies of gay people on ATS... or actually listen to the gay community itself...

Will see a consistent pattern. The stats will show, the surveys will show, the people will say; the intolerance, fear, anger, and even hate that is against them, is primarily from Christians, because of Christian beliefs.

[edit on 19-11-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]

A final note from me on this thread. While I admit I like use eye catching thread titles and am not above the occasional hyperbole. I feel the criminality involved, (destruction of property, false fire alarm, lewd conduct), is what separates this action from the classification of a protest.

The fact that the group proudly labels themselves as terrorist makes it a mute point as far as I am concerned. Yet I was astonished to see a few would still attempt to belabor the point. In reflecting on this perplexing state of affairs, I have come to a realization. Einsteins theory aside, the perception of terrorism is relative to the eye of the observer.

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.

After all, there was cheering in the streets in most Muslim nations on 9/12. I watched them in disgust on the nightly news. They were genuinely pleased with the death and destruction. This situation is a microcosm, but the same rule applies. It delineates the values of the observers. One look at the two statements released by the two opposing parties will let you know who stands for what...

Those who do not perceive the criminal acts of Bash Back as terrorist activity, are on this side:

Bash Back! is devoted to exposing, confronting, challenging,
and smashing our oppressors to itsy bitsy pieces. We're
fixing to tear this world of heteronormative control to
shreds. We are everywhere and will meet you at every
opportunity. There are now BB! Chapters in Milwaukee,
Chicago, Colorado, Memphis, Upstate New York, Lansing,
DC, Philly, and Olympia. It won't be long before we come
for you !
bashbacknews.wordpress.com...

Now that sounds like a threat of terrorism to me, clearly many at ATS do not think so. I have a hard time understanding those individuals because I do not share their values. It is my belief that each little decision between right and wrong we make in life defines who we are. I side with the group that released this statement:

The leadership of Mount Hope Church does not attempt to identify the church as antihomosexual, anti-choice, or right wing. The church does take the Bible at face value and believes what the Bible says to be the truth. According to the Bible, Mount Hope Church believes fornication, stealing, homosexuality, drunkenness, and lying are sins. No sin greater than the next. Mount Hope Church strives to follow Jesus’ example of loving the sinner but not the sin while helping people change their lives for God’s glory and their improved quality of life. Mount Hope Church also recognizes that to each person God grants freewill. www.mounthopechurch.org...

You may say words are cheap, but let me remind you. Bash back is committing criminal acts while invading a peaceful worship service. The church did not retaliate but prayed for the group to find peace. Their actions, as well as their words flow out of their hearts. What you might consider, is the stance you entrenched yourself in while defending this group, defines your heart as well.

Good day!









[edit on 11/19/2008 by Bigwhammy]

Originally posted by Lightmare

A few years ago, there was this really cool guy that used to work were I work. The guy was gay. He was also extremely intelligent and had a great sense of humor. I have always considered him to be a good friend.

After my weekend off, I returned to work to find out that he had quit. When I asked why, I was informed that several of my co-workers had been throwing things at him, calling him terrible names, and just being generally abusive towards him...all because he was gay.

The people who acted that way were all godless, non-theistic, atheists and agnostic types. And the only person there who bothered to raise hell about their hateful actions was me...a Christian. Yep...go figure that one out.

Hmmmm - that many atheist/agnostics all together in one place - against one gay guy - defended by a lonely Christian.

Seems a bit odd to me.

Of all the people I've known Wiccans and Atheists - - have been the most straight forward and kindest.

I didn't have time to read the thread but the Title caught my eye

"radical homosexual terrorism"

Is someone attacking Fashion designers?

What's going on? Babs didn't die did she?

I am ready to finish up here too.

For the record, I'll say that it is not possible to legislate morality. And there can never be freedom for either church or state until separated.

We know that you call us terrorists because our very
existence terrorizes you. This makes us proud, but you ain't
seen nothing yet. Nevertheless, we must remind ourselves
that your bizarre delusions are not enough to liberate us
from patriarchy. One day, soon enough, the secret Tranny
sleeper operatives posing as your spouses will wake, and oh
what a day that will be!

bashbacknews.wordpress.com...

The bolded bit is very funny. Ph4ar teh gay ladyboiz!

So, the group say that people are calling them terrorists (like whammy), Bash Back say this is because the very fact gays exist terrorises some people (probably).

The fact their very existence terrorises people makes them proud. That appears to be a fair reading. They are just young LGBT anarchists f*ing 'stuff' up. The more attention they get, the happier they will be.

However, the 'terrorism' sourced from people being 'different' also has dreadful outcomes for some, a week after a group of people were heinously offended:

Syracuse man was killed for being gay, police say
by Matt Michael / The Post-Standard
Sunday November 16, 2008, 12:31 PM

SYRACUSE, NY - Dwight R. DeLee shot and killed Moses "Teish" Cannon with a .22-caliber rifle Friday night because he didn't like that Cannon was openly gay, Syracuse police said.

ze linky

On the other point that Mount Hope is supposedly not homophobic, anti-choice, right-wing...

...the fact the youth group associated with the church producing a 'Hell House' in 2004 could illustrate its homophobic or anti-choice nature.

lansinghoh.com...

Use webarchive. Jan 29 2005 identifies Mount Hope.

A haunted house in Lansing, Michigan, billing itself as being rated "R" for "realistic", has some patrons phoning the local Sheriff's office to lodge complaints about what's going on behind the walls.

Many visitors of the House, which is being put on by the youth group of Mount Hope Church, have said that this organization is using the attraction as a propaganda tool. Under the guise of harmless Halloween recreation, the House includes dramatizations of the effects of drunk driving, a date rape, Islamic militants executing hostages, and what appears to be a demon priest presiding over a gay marriage.

The Sheriff's department is unable to do anything for the unsuspecting patrons and their children because, of course, the house is protected under freedom of speech. However, many find it troubling that none of the advertisements or the website promoting the House of Horrors make any mention of who is putting on the house or what kind of "horrors" are being dramatized, and that the only restriction for entrance is that children under the age of 11 must be accompanied by a parent or legal guardian.

linky

Right-wing? Probably, heh. But not really relevant anyway.

The Bash Back group are responding to the widespread homophobic and heteronormative nature of society, and they are targetting the mormon church (a fair target for their aims) and assemblies of god (another fair target). Whether you think direct action such as yelling 'Jesus was a homo', spreading a flag, kissing, flinging condoms and leaflets around, and graffiti/vandalism is appropriate is a reasonable question. I think probably not. But when LGBT individuals are being repeatedly targetted for hate crimes, it barely registers on the WTF scale. Oh noes, people were confused and offended!

'Terrorism'? Not on your nelly. But I understand some people's inherent tendency to mentally nail themselves to a cross.

Anyway, hopefully I'm outta here too. Catch y'all another time.

[edit on 19-11-2008 by melatonin]

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo

Wow, you really should pat yourself on the back. Instead of actively taking a role in stopping Christians from gay bashing, you are a hero and have cleared all Christians because you did what? You did not stick up for him, you did not defend him, you did not help him with these bullies. You did not know until after he quit that it had even happend.

Hooray for you. You were absent and know some bigoted atheists. Want another star for pretending Christians are not at the root of this? How about for doing nothing to help or stop any of it?

What the hell was I supposed to do about it since I wasn't there? When I returned to work and found out what happened, I did confront the pricks who did it. Do you know what happened then? They accused me of being gay for sticking up for him. What can I say, my co-workers are a bunch of idiots.

Speaking of which, you seem to be lacking in your ability to comprehend what you are reading. Perhaps an adult literacy program would benefit you.
www.readinghorizons.com...
I say that because you totally missed the point I was trying to make with my previous post. My point was basically that, despite the fact that Christians disapprove of the gay lifestyle, all of the hatred and abusive behavior that I have seen directed at gay people has been done by people with NO religious backround at all. And I see no reason why Christians should be held responsible for the actions of people who do not share our beliefs.

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
The stats will show, the surveys will show, the people will say; the intolerance, fear, anger, and even hate that is against them, is primarily from Christians, because of Christian beliefs.

Well, my personal experiences tell a VERY different story than your stats and surveys. So I'm not sure what to tell you on that.

I will say this though. Gay people, or gay men anyways, have a lot more to fear from the big, mean, beer guzzling, tough guy types than they do from any church going Christians. I say that because these "tough guys" see homosexuality as a form of weakness and a threat to their masculinity. Why? I have no idea. But that has been my observation from as far back as my highschool years all the way up to the present time. And no religious beliefs need to be present for that type of bigotry. It is largely due to a social stigma that has nothing to do with any religion.

Originally posted by Annee
Hmmmm - that many atheist/agnostics all together in one place - against one gay guy - defended by a lonely Christian.

Seems a bit odd to me.

Of all the people I've known Wiccans and Atheists - - have been the most straight forward and kindest.

Are you calling me a liar? If so, you had better be damn sure that you know what you are talking about before you start spouting off such IGNORANT accusations.

I work at a restaurant. Not the corporate type, but a small business. The place tends to employ some of the more rough types of people who don't really fit in the more corporate places. And yes, most of the people that I work with are atheist and agnostic. The ones who were being abusive to the gay guy were those "tough guy" types that I mentioned while responding to Lucid Lunacy. So there you have it. The whole thing was due to a social stigma which had NOTHING to do with religion at all.



[edit on 11/19/2008 by Lightmare]

[edit on 11/19/2008 by Lightmare]

Originally posted by Lightmare

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo

Wow, you really should pat yourself on the back. Instead of actively taking a role in stopping Christians from gay bashing, you are a hero and have cleared all Christians because you did what? You did not stick up for him, you did not defend him, you did not help him with these bullies. You did not know until after he quit that it had even happend.

Hooray for you. You were absent and know some bigoted atheists. Want another star for pretending Christians are not at the root of this? How about for doing nothing to help or stop any of it?

What the hell was I supposed to do about it since I wasn't there? When I returned to work and found out what happened, I did confront the pricks who did it. Do you know what happened then? They accused me of being gay for sticking up for him. ......blah blah blah.

Nothing, you were not there. I just would then not expect you to come to this board and brag about how great that was of you. What is it we should be proud of you for again? Showing up on Monday and starting a fight? Bragging about it here as if it was some meaningful gesture to help the opressed gay people? Please, you are the one who told us all how this story made you a hero. Go on, explain the part that I missed.

And the only person there who bothered to raise hell about their hateful actions was me...a Christian. Yep...go figure that one out.

Ah, my hero. Go figure, a lowly Christian would go out of his way to defend this poor gay man. Good for you. Tell us more about what a great Christian you are for um... getting mad after the fact. Seriously, all you did was be human. You did less than most respectable normal compassionate people would do and then go on to promote yourself as an example of a good Christian for it? I don't get it.

[edit on 19-11-2008 by angel of lightangelo]

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo
Nothing, you were not there. I just would then not expect you to come to this board and brag about how great that was of you. What is it we should be proud of you for again? Showing up on Monday and starting a fight? Bragging about it here as if it was some meaningful gesture to help the opressed gay people? Please, you are the one who told us all how this story made you a hero. Go on, explain the part that I missed.

Umm... where did I ever say it made me a hero? Those are your words...not mine. You're not making yourself look very smart here. You know that, right? You're still missing the entire point. It's not about me. It is about the way people keep making the FALSE assumption that Christians are hellbent on oppressing gays while everyone else treats them like gold all the time. The situation that I explained about, however, shows that assumption to be completely false.

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo
Ah, my hero. Go figure, a lowly Christian would go out of his way to defend this poor gay man. Good for you. Tell us more about what a great Christian you are for um... getting mad after the fact. Seriously, all you did was be human. You did less than most respectable normal compassionate people would do and then go on to promote yourself as an example of a good Christian for it?

Again. It is NOT about me being a "good Christian" or the "hero". Its about showing why a common assumtion is actually quite false! IT IS NOT ABOUT ME AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!

Are you really that dense or are you just pretending to be? You know what...don't answer that. I don't want to know.

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo
I don't get it

Obviously




[edit on 11/19/2008 by Lightmare]

[edit on 11/19/2008 by Lightmare]

Originally posted by Lightmare
It is about the way people keep making the FALSE assumption that Christians are hellbent on oppressing gays...
The situation that I explained about, however, shows that assumption to be completely false.

Shows the assumption to be completely false!?!?

Come on man. What are you talking about?

Your one isolated instance some how nullifies the well known nation wide persecution from the religious (primarily Christians) against LGBT in the US?? Your one isolated instance proves the FBI reports, the testimonies of gay ATS members, countless surveys from the gay community itself... to be completely false??

The USA doesn't orbit around your life man.

[edit on 19-11-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]