Massive financial bailout fails in the House

Why are people not asking WHY we need it?
Why are people not asking who was responsible, and who was overseeing the credit markets, and WHY they have gone kaput and why they aren't being held responsible?
Why aren't all the CEO's and executives assets and finances being immediately seized to pay for the problems there fraud created?
Why aren't the leaders and supervisors who were supposed to be over seeing it all being arrested, and put in prison, and having there finances and assets confiscated to pay for the problems they created?
Why don't people spend some time asking why every tax payer needs to pay 7k for someone elses mistakes, and the someone else gets to keep there millions they made from creating the problem.
What is it people don't understand, that the trillion dollar hole wasn't an accident, that the money is now in offshore accounts of the people who committed the fraud.
Take the money back, from those who stole it.

Originally posted by Interestinggg
Why are people not asking WHY we need it?
Why are people not asking who was responsible, and who was overseeing the credit markets, and WHY they have gone kaput and why they aren't being held responsible?
Why aren't all the CEO's and executives assets and finances being immediately seized to pay for the problems there fraud created?
Why aren't the leaders and supervisors who were supposed to be over seeing it all being arrested, and put in prison, and having there finances and assets confiscated to pay for the problems they created?
Why don't people spend some time asking why every tax payer needs to pay 7k for someone elses mistakes, and the someone else gets to keep there millions they made from creating the problem.
What is it people don't understand, that the trillion dollar hole wasn't an accident, that the money is now in offshore accounts of the people who committed the fraud.
Take the money back, from those who stole it.

And this is what bothers me. They want 700 Billion of our dollars and no heads are rolling. There needs to be heads rolling and Im not talking about the CEOs who lost their jobs and are getting golden parachutes. Im talking in the FED, the Government, AND in the industry. Heads need to roll plain and simple as that.

reply to post by mybigunit


I say its pretty much everyones problem. For example a neighbor of mine owned a home that cost around 300k and few months later took his family and ran, which led the bank to have a house in its hand when they prefer to have loans paid back instead. Many Americans are doing this. They are buying more than they can afford, and when its time to pay the bills they just take off running with lenders having IOUs in their hands for their effort. Now other Americans may not be able to get a loan for a car or for tuition because lenders cannot trust anybody now.

That vote restored my faith in America. If we can keep the pressure on. We the people. We can make this country about us again. We need to push for more oversight and more checks and balances and more transparancy and simplify the legal system. I mean if ignorance of the law is no excuse than you need to make the laws easy enough for an ignorant person to understand easily. We need to stick to the constitution and the bill of rights and lose the extra garbage in our government. Streamline everything. Keep fighting for the type of country this was supposed to be. Maybe in 4 years we can get Ron Paul in office and eliminate all these unnecessary arms of government like the Fed, and go back to a gold standard. Then we can pull out of all our wars and start rebuilding the infrastructure and rebuilding our manufacturing sector. Theres so much work that needs doing to convert to clean energy and improve communications. We need to focus on education and the sciences before we get left behind in a rapidly advancing technological world.

Originally posted by deltaboy
reply to post by mybigunit

 

I say its pretty much everyones problem. For example a neighbor of mine owned a home that cost around 300k and few months later took his family and ran, which led the bank to have a house in its hand when they prefer to have loans paid back instead. Many Americans are doing this. They are buying more than they can afford, and when its time to pay the bills they just take off running with lenders having IOUs in their hands for their effort. Now other Americans may not be able to get a loan for a car or for tuition because lenders cannot trust anybody now.

I agree but why cant Americans afford this all of a sudden. What people fail to mention is when the banks quit lending to eachother the foreclosure rate was only at around 3%. That means 97% of the loans where being paid on time when the banks decided to retract credit. So when the banks retracted the credit people started losing their jobs because the businesses could not get loans. The non ability to get loans is not new. Its been going on since Aug of last year its just being brought to the forefront because the banks want a payoff. This was all caused by the banks my friend trust me if they didnt retract the credit the way they did after that big credit boom this would not be happening and people would be still in there homes. Except for the 3% of course. Read up on monetary policy youll see what I mean.

I just lost my home. Landlord couldn't get a loan to keep it so were out. I haven't had insurance in years. I haven't gotten a vacation ever. I haven't gotten a raise ever. I can only imagine soon I will lose my job because they do not have the money for payroll. I hated that job anyway. A house is a house. I'll find another place. I'm in good health so who needs a doctor or a dentist. really I think my biggest gripe is that I work and I work and I work 50 hours a week and have nothing to show for it. No reward from the corporate sector for my years of service. They only ever demand that I do more in less time for the same money month after month after month. It's this type of greed and lack of compassion that brings out the ultra-violent knife wielding bomb building pyromaniac in people.

I'm surprised we have yet to see an army of the homeless wielding Molotov cocktails marching on city hall. People are probably too broke to give handouts so they can afford the vodka rags and lighters. Sad really.

All they need is 95 billion dollars which would be given to every working, tax paying citizen. Around 500,000 a piece for every couple or each individual. They can even tax that amount as usual. The Americans who get that money pays their mortgages off and the mortgage companies are saved. Others would by a house or spend that money in the economy and the economy would be booming. Instead of taking our tax dollars, they need to give it back and let the free market stay free of government control. I'm so glad the bill was not passed and I hope it doesn't. We don't need a socialized market controlled by the government and we don't need to bail out reckless companies. It's time to give back to the American people and let the sunshine in.

reply to post by Solarskye


Taking 300 million citizens...
$95,000,000,000 / 300,000,000 = $323 per person.

Originally posted by mecheng
reply to post by Solarskye

 

Taking 300 million citizens...
$95,000,000,000 / 300,000,000 = $323 per person.

Working, tax paying citizens. Married couple get 500,000 and single get 500,000. It's not 300,000,000.

reply to post by Mdv2


Well, we are all relieved to know the DJIA came back 495 points, so most of the trillion has been recouped. Creating a Market King named Paulson won't solve the problems facing our economy.

Stocks go up and down. That's why it's called "Playing the Market."

Pushing another trillion into the banks pockets doesn't translate to their lending that money back to credit worthy consumers. It is more likely to begin a trend towards hyperinflation. There is neither gold nor silver backing our currency.

The Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac bailout was definitely inevitable, but will not by itself assist Americans with distressed mortgages. The credit rating agencies played a role, as did lending to unqualified borrowers.

Deregulation of the lending industry caused a huge amount of damage as well. Throwing money at a problem of this magnitude should require lengthy Congressional hearings. If anyone has the jitters about the market, they should sell until the economic issues are resolved. Generally, we need to hear from economists on Capitol Hill prior to taking action of this magnitude. If and when any credible economist prescribes such action, the cure should specifically target the problem. Root causes should be addressed in the process. This should not be a panic driven vote.

Originally posted by mecheng
reply to post by Solarskye

 

Taking 300 million citizens...
$95,000,000,000 / 300,000,000 = $323 per person.

I dont think he was including children. I think he was talking about tax paying adults. Not lazy non paying adults and not children.

reply to post by Solarskye


ok... 138 million taxpayers

$97,000,000,000 / 138,000,000 = $703 per taxpayer... still not quite the $500k you (and I) were hoping for.

Now if you took the $700 billion and split it up between the taxpayers, we'd each get $5072.

[edit on 30-9-2008 by mecheng]

All they need is 95 billion dollars which would be given to every working, tax paying citizen. Around 500,000 a piece for every couple or each individual

Hmmm no.

500.000 to 200 millions taxpayers? 100 trillions. So... NOT!

But I agree on the principle that this money could be use on taxpayers instead of greedy bankers.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
reply to post by jam321

 

Start naming off every american citizen that took out a loan they had no means to pay back. They are, after all, the ones who willingly went into the contracts.

People, as well as the business owners, should pay for their mistakes. The CEO's didn't force these people to sign or even ask for a loan to buy a house. These people came in, and signed up for something they couldn't pay for. They are just as much, if not more, responsible for the current situation.

Would you please stop pushing this BS lie? It's not the citizen homeowners bad mortgages that are collapsing the investment banks, it's actually the commercial mortgage portfolios, the business mortgage defaults which are causing the real damage.

This continued talking point of trying to push all the blame onto the taxpayers is a ruse, period. They know telling the truth about where the damage is coming from will only fuel more taxpayers to oppose the bailout.

The people who defaulted on their mortgages WILL pay, they're losing their homes. What about the predatory lending? What about the quadrillions in derivatives built on top of these mortgages using fraud? That's where the real threat to our economy is coming from.

Lehman Brothers CFO admits commercial mortgages killed them

We need a solution but we need a REAL solution. This bailout as constructed is just a cover up, a way for Paulsen to buy up the fraud filled securities and make them go away without anyone paying for their crimes.

We have alternate plans, some endorsed by groups of 200 non partisan economists. I say either debate and implement a real solution or nothing. The big banks dropped the market to try and goose the Congress into passing the bailout, I highly doubt they will allow it to completely collapse.

Maybe the big banks should start lending with the billions they've been given instead of using the money to buy up other banks and shore up their Swiss bank accounts.

Why don't you read up on some of the alternative plans and start explaining to us why the bail out is a better alternative? So far all you've done is call for the taxpayers to be punished.

reply to post by guyopitz

We need to push for more oversight and more checks and balances and more transparancy and simplify the legal system.

I have to agree with you. The only problem is that government already has many of these things and can't even handle what they got.
I believe once the turmoil is over you will see the same ol sh--.

Well I tried anyway. Wasn't trying to be greedy though. Thanks for the help.

Originally posted by nfotech
Why don't you read up on some of the alternative plans

Haven't gone to look at the alternatives yet, but one big question, do any of the alternatives that you are aware of also force the banks to become BASEL II compliant? Because if they don't they are not a real solution. We cannot have international credit without BASEL II compliance.

That means no foreign trade...including OIL unless you have cash (not credit) for the purchase

The choices here are like the devil and the deep blue sea, The Republicans want the unfettered unregulated access to the henhouse, Dems want socialized banking and and economical controls. It all adds up to debt slavery for everyone. A third option would be payoff the mortgages. of everyone with a balloon mortgage. then those people would start taking out loans for other things and buying durable goods,trickle up ecomonics!

reply to post by guyopitz


I'm sorry to hear of your misfortune. Its truly tragic to read.

reply to post by nfotech

Paulson said there was greater urgency to create a new system to dispose of the assets of a failing financial firm in a way that would not cause broad economic distress. He acknowledged that too will take time.

source

Paulson own words...to dispose of the assets....


your words

Paulsen to buy up the fraud filled securities and make them go away without anyone paying for their crimes.

Must say you pretty much hit it on the nail