SETI Waste of Time & Money

If you ask me i personally think that they are looking in a very narrow frequency band for a signal. They are assuming that a civilization will broardcast at a frequency close to the frequency of the hydrogen atom ... .thats why they call it "listening to the hydrogen line" apparently...
because thats where the universe is at its quietest .....

.. think about it ... it its where its the quietest ... there must be a reason for that !!!! .... granted, if its quiet thena signal would be easiest to send/recieve ... but still ......

my 2 cents

Originally posted by scepticsRus
If you ask me i personally think that they are looking in a very narrow frequency band for a signal.

I agree. And SETI@home is trying to address that issue with something new called Astropulse. It looks for more and looks across more frequencies. (and the work units take forever as well. And by new, I'm pretty sure it started last month.)

[edit on 2-10-2008 by GrayFox]

[edit on 3-10-2008 by GrayFox]

In the end I feel that we should not get our hopes up in receiving a signal because in all likely hood it was not meant for our ears, and more likely it was just a broadcast of the 90th Alien Olympics and we just happened to receive a random signal.

Or, perhaps less likely but no less eerily, it was the broadcast of the Human (or should I say Super-human?) Olympics of 1936...
(Yes, I've watched "Contact". )

Bottom-line: I think you're probably right, at least concerning the cost-effectiveness and actual usefulness of SETI.
I've been running it since 2001, and will probably continue running it for some time, but my actual interest in it has waned long ago.





[edit on 2-10-2008 by Vanitas]

Well, any signal (even accidental) would be good, wouldn't it? I mean, something's better than nothing. It would still be an amazing discovery.

I still just think it would be wrong to give up... because detection methods will only improve. It's very sad and discouraging that no ETI signals have been positively confirmed yet, but that doesn't mean it can't happen tomorrow or next month.

Also, concerning Astropulse work units....
You get less credit comparatively than if you'd been doing many regular work units, plus they take forever (the one I have now said 84 hrs!).... but it's still in beta and it's for the cause!

[edit on 3-10-2008 by GrayFox]

[edit on 3-10-2008 by GrayFox]

Originally posted by GrayFox
Well, any signal (even accidental) would be good, wouldn't it? I mean, something's better than nothing. It would still be an amazing discovery.

But wasnt the " WOW " signal a good hint?

I mean if they want proof they need to expand the project.
Let's put as much effort into it, say as much as the moon program or the Manhatten project.
What could be more of an Earth shattering discovery?

Originally posted by Vanitas

I've been running it since 2001, and will probably continue running it for some time, but my actual interest in it has waned long ago.

We used to run that at my last place of work but the management did not like the idea so we had to stop we had over 300 puters running it this was a tech support location in Maryland.
oh well.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
But wasnt the " WOW " signal a good hint?

I mean if they want proof they need to expand the project.
Let's put as much effort into it, say as much as the moon program or the Manhatten project.
What could be more of an Earth shattering discovery?

Believe me, I agree. That doesn't make SETI a waste of time and money though. We could do much, much more.... but at least we're still doing something. And about the Wow! signal and Radio source SHGb02+14a.... see my somewhat recent topic about those.

reply to post by GrayFox



Thanks.

Another consideration would be that those signals could have been terraquads of information in a 2 to 5 second burst that we at the time and even with todays quadcore and limited computing power could not and still may not be able to decipher, Again we could have received their version of the Encyclopedia Galatica.

Possible scenario : They heard all our early Radio and TV signals realized we were here, Then sent us a message and now they are waiting for a signal but no, We are listing for them again and meanwhile they are waiting for our reply.

I forgot to post the Astropulse info page.

setiathome.berkeley.edu...

If they heard/saw our television/radio signals, then they'd need to be able to refine distorted signals or they'd need to hear it as they're passing by our star (on one of their ships). By the time an ordinary TV broadcast reaches their planet it would be very extremely distorted. But then again, maybe they'd have the equipment to detect things like that. Here's a somewhat recent article I found about the subject.

news.bbc.co.uk...

And here's a scary quote....

But if aliens can watch our television, there might be a problem. Astronomer Carl Sagan, in his book Contact, suggested the first high-powered television broadcast the aliens would have picked up would be Hitler's broadcasts at the Nuremburg rallies.

[edit on 13-10-2008 by GrayFox]

I disagree with SETI being a waste of time and money. My reasoning is that if we were able to pickup the "WOW" signal and confirm it the impact on society would be massive. Knowing that we are not alone and confirming it would give a serious boost to our society. To know that if someone else made it and we can make it ourselves would give much hope and dispel a lot of doom and gloom. To know that we are not alone would bring a lot of comfort.

Originally posted by scepticsRus
they call it "listening to the hydrogen line" apparently...
because thats where the universe is at its quietest .....

.. think about it ... it its where its the quietest ... there must be a reason for that !!!! .... granted, if its quiet thena signal would be easiest to send/recieve ... but still ......

LOL maybe it's the quietest becuase nobody uses it!

Or

We with our limited ability cannot destinguish between a true signal and background garbage on the other bandwidths or spectrums

reply to post by GrayFox


Thanks Gray
Good stuff there

well my dad saw a UFO before I was born (up close and personel!). It was pretty clear to him, not to mention massive, silent and super fast.

Its like playing the lotto isnt it? if you dont play; your never going to win. I think they should be looking at other means of communication than radiowaves though.

we badly need LHC to descover some amazing thing about matter that allows us to break the rules, like these aliens obviously do!!

reply to post by virraszto


Your right about that!

In fact, I sent an email (pretty angry too) to the contact department of SETI (with no return), and described how ludicrous it was searching the heavens for radio signals! I just couldn't believe how idiotic it was.

The OP is right, its a waste of time, money and not to mention resources and able astronomers!

I believe 100% that governments around the world, already have proof of ET life (here or otherwise). They are not telling us because of the shear fact that we are living in a primitive fossil fuel driven world.

If 100% of the worlds people (sheeple) knew that aliens were flying around on craft that defy all logical thinking. They would soon realize that technology like that must be available. We would demand flying cars and green living!

Such BS!

They want to control us.....Its really that simple.....

So your right when saying its just a show,
"hey look, we have been trying to find other intelligent life, but hey, you wont know the difference!.......have a good day, thanks for the interest."



Nice thread

reply to post by SLAYER69


First I’ll start by saying that most of the scientific community who specializes in communications, believe the “wow” signal to either be a probe in flight, sending data back to its source or an undetected astrological body in motion, reflecting a distorted earth signal back to us. However the actual type of signal that was detected seemed atypical and far too advanced to be the latter of the two, considering position, relative to direction and the mathematically perceived distance.

Secondly, any feasible scientific research cannot be considered a waste of resources if it puts an analytical or innovative mind to work for an honest days pay, regardless of personal belief that any unassociated person or third party observer may harbor.

Scientific research, by definition, is to prove or disprove a theory. But it has often yielded unforeseen results that were of greater value than the intended research was expected to yield. It can also be said that scientific research has often produced fantastic returns on investments that were not always immediately apparent and that it is possible for the results of a study to exceed the capacity of understanding at the time of the research, even by those who initiate the original theories.

Einstein, Newton, Galileo, Noble, Tesla, Edison, Marconi, Da Vinci, are just a few who have all made scientific contributions that were not completely understood or realized at the actual time of their relevant fruition. In some cases, the entire applicability of a theory or discovery was not fully understood by the public or peers until long after the author had passed away.

It should be noted that the means of data collection, maintenance, analysis and control, proposed out of necessity by the scientists of SETI to continue operations and work around their limitations have helped lead to a unique and originally unforeseen adaptation of data correlation. This adaptation has now been successfully incorporated into database formats of process by software engineers expanding the effectiveness of extremely large database collections that were once considered far too large to be of any realistic use to anyone.

The scientific community in general, as well as others, have already benefited from this unforeseen advancement, which includes the Medical community, Education, Law Enforcement, Military and other government agencies, etc. So, this alone has made the SETI program worth the efforts, but this research has also aided in advancements of digital broadcasting and encryption technology, cellular and satellite communications and a potential list of other things not yet realized. Sufficed to say, even if they detect nothing more than the faint sizzle of a dying ember from across the void, with no joyous choir from the center of the galaxy or scientific information from a distant nebula on vast untapped energy resources, the SETI project has proven to be a tremendous and invaluable success.

An interesting side note here, at the time this OP thread was posted, the most likely astrological neighbor of interest was 40 light years away, but now there is a newly discovered neighbor only 10.5 light years away, This may provide for some additional possibilities in communication formats testing not previously considered.

Seven years and God only knows how much money, give that to the poor and you could get a better response, heck I wonder what keeps them from getting cabin fever in that place......lol.. ...........Silence seven years (modern day monks)...............................

reply to post by rikk7111


your ignorance knows no bounds

Originally posted by eaganthorn


Einstein, Newton, Galileo, Noble, Tesla, Edison, Marconi, Da Vinci, are just a few who have all made scientific contributions that were not completely understood or realized at the actual time of their relevant fruition. In some cases, the entire applicability of a theory or discovery was not fully understood by the public or peers until long after the author had passed away.

Very true!

I understand what you are saying and agree, However we could and should be doing a much better job. Rubbing two sticks together will create friction and may create fire but it wont split the atom.


If we had major commitment from the US and other world Governments we could in theory find out a hell of a lot sooner. If we deployed some of our more advanced Military technology to this endeaver.

It just seems to me that we have our priority's all screwed up here.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
I understand what you are saying and agree, However we could and should be doing a much better job.
If we had major commitment from the US and other world Governments we could in theory find out a hell of a lot sooner.

So very true!! The effort could and should be intensified, but it is because of the political nature of this topic that it has become improbable if not impossible to gain government support with all the counter productive hyperbole. Suffice to say that people like Glenda Good-blossom and the Galactic Federation of Love and Happiness aren’t really helping.

Government agencies have traditionally scoffed in the open and public forums about the functional concept of SETI but will happily use any and all benefits from the research, not to mention the keen interest and participation any time there is a questionable “ping” recorded. It comes across as “We think your search is pointless and will never amount to anything of importance.”, but then they lean in and whisper, “But when you do find something, make sure you call us first”.

There are some other aspects to the issue that go unannounced. There have been many signals recorded over the years that have been identified as terrestrial in origin and classified by the DOD, even though they appear to emanate from a point that shouldn’t have any equipment, these are “darks” and there are a lot of them. It would be easier to work around if the DOD would simply say, “We have classified equipment at these positions!” and present a list of coordinates and say “don’t look here, don’t record there”, but they won’t do that as it is a security issue.

Anyway, the search is valid and can produce so much knowledge, information and advancements but is such a political step child.

Originally posted by eaganthorn

There are some other aspects to the issue that go unannounced. There have been many signals recorded over the years that have been identified as terrestrial in origin and classified by the DOD

Here is a small update I found the other day


Here you go

[edit on 13-11-2008 by SLAYER69]