Russia/Georgia Situation News & Updates

Another year, another flare up in the Caucasus. It never gets boring with the likes of Saakashvili and his little "brave democratic stronghold", or circus as everyone else views it.


In all honesty though, I am a little skeptical about the scope of the recent attacks as presented by the media. While there definitely was a series of incidents, there is no indication yet that it is moving towards another war. Georgian troops have not been mobilized en masse as they had been last year. And even if they were - they do not even have the same capability and equipment as before - they gifted much of it to Russia thanks to their misguided adventure. Furthermore Saakashvilli was recently denied his request for military equipment by Washington, and Georgia hardly has the budget to purchase anything of much significance.

So Georgia simply cannot go to war. Last year they had an element of surprise and stood a remote chance of blocking off the Roki tunnel. That was the only trick Saakashvili had left, and now it is exhausted. Even a moron like him knows when the probability of him being strung up by a certain body part approaches one.



Saakashvili could stand to gain however from creating a minor flare-up short of war. It could give a sense of urgency to his request for military help from US. He does not have much time left with opposition calling for him to step down, so he needs to make himself out to be a victim again. The question is - will Obama's administration buy into his shenanigans. After Biden's "thought provoking" (read- "idiocy infested") speech in Georgia recently, Saakashvili could very well have his wishes granted.

So no war here.



As for those saying that Russia staged this or the media reports are false - what would Russia gain from such stunt? It already has the desired status quo. It has no interest of any incursions on undisputed Georgian territory (even if South Ossetian authorities make new claims).

Russian Subs Patrolling off East Coast of US

“Anytime the Russian Navy does something so out of the ordinary it is cause for worry,” said a senior Defense Department official who has been monitoring reports on the submarines’ activities.

So... they're up to something.... Maybe they're looking to take a bite out of Ukraine as well as Georgia.

Originally posted by TrueAmerican
reply to post by ZeroKnowledge

 

I want to show you a little article written by Russia Today. At least these people are openly talking about one-sided reporting, and at least attempting to do something about it.

Russia Today

Media spin is older than the media itself. It is as old as the notion of news. It has been in use ever since news began to circulate through word of mouth. Rumour and speculation were added to information; ideological presumptions were attached too, until the news was transformed, often giving contradictory messages.

The effect of ancient spin can easily be seen in the descriptions of the same events in different chronicles, and this is as true for Western culture as Eastern. For example, the Grunewald Battle is described differently in the accounts of the Teutonic (German) Order, in the Polish chronicles and in the accounts of the Western Russian principality of Smolensk. The ancient chronicles of Burma and Siam draw totally different pictures of the wars fought between the two nations over several centuries.

In our time, spin thrives in an age where most people get their information from television, radio and newspapers. In Israel, the majority of the population thinks that their country has just won a war against Hamas. In Gaza, notwithstanding the heavy losses, Hamas celebrates victory over Israel.

The internet has changed the world in that it provides an opportunity to look at events from an angle different from that portrayed in mainstream media. But then again, we all have views of our own, formed by the media or not, and so we choose the websites we visit according to our views, to our liking, and limit our own horizons as we do so.

Spin is not a monstrous tool of psychological warfare. Rather, spin is an integral part of human nature, because a human brain is built to receive, process and project information, and that is why most thoughts are true but every spoken word is a lie.

But the natural character of spin doesn't cancel the fact that when someone wants the public to think in a certain way about a certain event, and that someone has enough money, power and influence, the natural effect of spin can be multiplied to become a potent weapon. And it can be a most destructive one, capable of killing the truth, of changing the way events are recorded and go down in history.

Here on this page we will do our best to un-spin the armed conflicts that were shown to the public as having gone on in one way but in fact had been fought, won and lost in quite another one.

Evgeny Belenkiy, RT.

I would sooner trust a news organization like this who is listening to that sector of the public demanding unbiased reporting than the huge corporate media network White House parrots who snub their collective noses at any such assertions.

[edit on Tue Aug 4th 2009 by TrueAmerican]

Presuming the Russia today people have good intentions, how do you know they're not fooled into reporting one-sided propaganda?

Originally posted by john124
Russian Subs Patrolling off East Coast of US

“Anytime the Russian Navy does something so out of the ordinary it is cause for worry,” said a senior Defense Department official who has been monitoring reports on the submarines’ activities.

So... they're up to something....

Maybe they're looking to take a bite out of Ukraine as well as Georgia.

The media turns "Russian submarines exercising in the Atlantic" into "Russian Subs Patrolling off East Coast of US". Nice way to create a panic out of nothing. And what the heck does "the Russian Navy does something so out of the ordinary" mean? Just because the navy had no funds to conduct exercises in the past, and now they do, does not entail that there is something to worry about.

Medvedev calls Obama, discusses Georgia tensions

WASHINGTON — Russia's President Dmitry Medvedev called US President Barack Obama on Tuesday and the two leaders discussed the worsening situation in Georgia and tensions over ex-Soviet states, the White House said.

The call came as Georgia warned of the risk of a new war with Russia and Moscow raised the battle-readiness of its forces, ahead of the anniversary of their conflict over rebel South Ossetia.

"Russian President Medvedev called President Obama today to wish him happy birthday," the White House said in a press statement.

"During the call, the presidents discussed the situation in Georgia and the need to decrease tensions in the region.

"President Obama reiterated the importance of working through established crisis management mechanisms such as the Joint Incident Prevention and Response Mechanism and underscored the need for international monitors."

Obama, Medvedev discuss Georgia, arms control

MOSCOW — Russian President Dmitry Medvedev on Tuesday spoke with President Barack Obama about Georgia, just days before the anniversary of last year's Russia-Georgia war, a Kremlin statement said.

The two leaders shared a telephone conversation at Moscow's initiative, the statement said, adding they also discussed arms control, the Middle East and Iran.

"An exchange on opinions on the lessons of last year's Georgian crisis took place," the statement said, without elaborating.

Tension is mounting with the anniversary approaching. Georgia and Russia blame each other for recent provocations over the separatist-held, Moscow-friendly South Ossetia region of Georgia.

Russian troops have been put on increased combat readiness on South Ossetia's de facto border with Georgia, officials said Tuesday.

Don't let this distract us all from the important middle eastern issues.....

Biden calls Georgian President over Russia tensions

WASHINGTON — US Vice President Joe Biden called Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili to express concerns over rising tensions, nearly a year on from Georgia's war with Russia, the White House said.

The call came hours after US President Barack Obama discussed the rising tension in the region in a telephone conversation with Russia's President Dmitry Medvedev.

"Vice President Biden called Georgian President Saakashvili today to discuss the current situation in Georgia," the White House said in a statement.

"Vice President Biden expressed concern about the recent escalation in tensions and emphasized that all parties should avoid destabilizing actions.

"He also underscored the importance of having an objective international monitoring mission with access to both sides of the boundary line.

"Vice President Biden reiterated US support for Georgia's democracy."

US concerned over Russia, Georgia tension

WASHINGTON — US President Barack Obama and Vice President Joe Biden expressed concerns about fresh tensions between Russia and Georgia in telephone calls with the leaders of the rival ex-Soviet states.

The White House said Russian President Dmitry Medvedev called Obama to wish him a happy 48th birthday, and that the leaders discussed the need to ease rattled nerves in the region, a year on from a Russia-Georgia war.

Biden called Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili and expressed concern over the situation, as Georgia warned of the risk of a new war with Russia and Moscow raised the battle-readiness of its forces, ahead of the anniversary of their conflict over rebel South Ossetia.

"Russian President Medvedev called President Obama today to wish him happy birthday," the White House said in a press statement.

"During the call, the presidents discussed the situation in Georgia and the need to decrease tensions in the region.

"President Obama reiterated the importance of working through established crisis management mechanisms such as the Joint Incident Prevention and Response Mechanism and underscored the need for international monitors."

Later, the White House said Biden called Saakashvili to "discuss the current situation in Georgia."

"Vice President Biden expressed concern about the recent escalation in tensions and emphasized that all parties should avoid destabilizing actions.

"He also underscored the importance of having an objective international monitoring mission with access to both sides of the boundary line.

"Vice President Biden reiterated US support for Georgia's democracy."

Saakashvili had earlier called on the United States and the European Union to send a "clear message" to Moscow to help avert a new war, as both sides exchanged accusations of attacks and "provocations" in the region.

The Russian foreign ministry meanwhile said its forces had heightened their state of battle-readiness in South Ossetia.

"The situation is very worrying and the Georgian provocations ahead of the anniversary of last year's war are not halting," foreign ministry spokesman Andrei Nesterenko said in a statement.

Obama's administration is walking a tightrope between its desire to reset ties with Moscow and showing support for its ally Georgia, as tensions rise again between Moscow and Tbilisi.

Russia smashed a Georgian military offensive to recapture South Ossetia in a brief war in August last year, sending relations between Moscow and Washington during the final months of George W. Bush's administration to post-Cold War lows.

Biden risked irking Russia last month when he said in a speech in the ex-Soviet republic that Obama backed Georgia's aspiration to join NATO.

He also reiterated long-standing US policy on Georgia's territorial integrity, saying Washington sought a "free, secure, democratic, united Georgia."

Moscow has recognized two rebel regions of Georgia -- Abkhazia and South Ossetia -- as independent states, prompting condemnation from around the world.

The war erupted last year when an attempt by Georgian troops to retake South Ossetia was rebuffed by Russia. Moscow then sent troops and tanks deep into Georgian territory.

After the war, Russian forces mostly withdrew into South Ossetia and Abkhazia but Moscow then infuriated the West with the independence move.

The White House also said that Obama and Medvedev used Tuesday's conversation to discuss the need to "move forward quickly" on agreements reached at their summit last month in Moscow.

"In particular, the presidents reaffirmed their commitment to complete negotiations on a follow-on agreement to START by December of this year."

Obama and Medvedev signed a declaration in Moscow pledging to reach a new nuclear arms pact to replace the 1991 Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty.

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge


And i see no proof of Georgia shelling S. Ossetia. Russian federation pushed international observers out of this area, then it staged war games, then claims of land by leader of "independent" South Ossetia and now this.

There are still international observers in the area, namely EU monitors.


Russia backs EU, not U.S., role in Georgia



From the Link:

Source: Reuters
* Russia backs EU monitors in Georgia

* Lavrov says opposed to U.S. playing a role

* EU, United States aware of Georgia risks, Lavrov says

MOSCOW, Aug 5 (Reuters) - Moscow welcomes the work of EU monitors in Georgia, deployed in the Caucasus state a year ago after the Russian invasion, but is opposed to the United States having a role, Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said on Wednesday.

In a brief war last August, Russia crushed Georgia's attempt to retake its rebel province of South Ossetia. Moscow has recognised the independence of South Ossetia and another rebel region of Abkhazia, taking them under its security umbrella.

Under a peace deal brokered by French President Nicolas Sarkozy, the European Union has sent 240 unarmed monitors to Georgia to oversee a fragile ceasefire. Georgia now wants the United States to join the monitoring.

"The presence of EU monitors on Georgian territories bordering South Ossetia and Abkhazia is an important stabilising factor and we support such a presence," Lavrov told state-run television channel Vesti-24.


No one, except for Russia and Nicaragua, has so far recognised the independence of Abkhazia and South Ossetia. But Moscow, arguing that their separate status from Tbilisi must be recognised, has blocked access for monitors to both regions.

The monitors in turn complain that the lack of access restricts their ability to verify mutual accusations of blame for sporadic attacks on both sides of the de facto borders.

Russia sees the monitors as a force to prevent any concentration of Georgian forces in areas bordering South Ossetia and Abkhazia.


Georgia, keen to get Western support in its stand-off with Russia, asked the United States last month to join the EU monitoring mission -- although the EU itself has not made any such request to Washington.

Lavrov said the Georgian request was part of a plan to drag the United States into a confrontation.

"The idea is absolutely clear and we honestly told this to our U.S. colleagues," Lavrov said. "This is all about dragging Americans into Georgia and pitching them against the Russian military."

"After that, the Georgian masters of provocation... will try doing their traditional job," he added. "The risks of this are clear, Europe and the United States understand them."

The reason why EU monitors can not determine there has been Georgian shelling on South Ossetia is because there are no EU monitors in South Ossetia.


We will probably see Western Media swarm all over Georgia to see where the South Ossetian shells hit, but it does not fit the preferred view for the MSM to see where the Georgian shells hit in South Ossetia.


The Russian war games was a response to NATO war games in Georgia.

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
Georgia has nothing to gain from this war, it cannot take back the land because of Russian obvious military superiority.

You are correct, Georgia has nothing to gain but pain from this war, but Saakashvilli and his cohorts, in goading Russia to attack, would once again paint Russia as the aggressor and the big bad boy.


Saakashvilli believes this will internationally isolate Russia in the process, and strengthen his position, hoping for NATO to wage war against Russia for him.


What Saakashvilli does not take into account is that Russia is an important strategic partner to NATO, and Russia can not be ignored.

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
Russian leader on the other hand promissed to hang Saakashvilli by his body parts, and having Georgia under Russian control would eliminate threat of alternative oil/gas rout into EU.

Then why waste time? Why did Russian tanks not go straight on to Tblisi last year, drag Saakashvili from his presidential residence, and lynch him?



By taking military action also, Russia knows how it will be portrayed by the media.


Russia does indeed want Saakashvilli gone. But why use tanks when the Georgian opposition grows stronger and may drive him out?

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
So i bet that this is re-run of Winter War from 1939, when USSR claimed that much weaker Finland shelled its forces as a casus belli.

There was a Georgian aggressor from that war, and one from last year's war, and possibly this new war.



Russia are no angels, they have their own backyard as America has it's backyard, but Saakashvili's Georgia is not Hungary '56 or Czechoslovakia '68.

[edit on 5-8-2009 by Regensturm]

Found this... can't find any other source... if maloy can confirm...

Romanian ship to take part in BLACKSEAFOR activation

The ‘Commodore Horia Macellariu’ corvette has left the Mangalia military harbour yesterday evening in order to take part in the activation of the Black Sea Naval Cooperation Task Group (BLACKSEAFOR) from August 4 to August 27. Apart from the Romanian ship, frigates TCG Barbaros (Turkey) and GSG Sokhumi (Georgia), command ship Slavutich (Ukraine), Landing Ship RFS Tsezar Kunikov (Russian Federation) and corvette Smeli (Bulgaria) will take part in this activation.

The activities of the BLACKSEAFOR Naval Group will consist of counter-mine naval exercises, search and rescue operations, humanitarian assistance and environmental protection. The BLACKSEAFOR Group is conceived as a ‘on call’ force and is activated twice a year in order to take part in naval exercises. The command of the group, exercised in conformity with the protocol that established the task group, is held in succession by the six riparian states that contribute with forces: Bulgaria, Georgia, Romania, Russian Federation, Ukraine and Turkey.

I find it weird that a wargame would start now, and Georgia/Russia are in it...

reply to post by infinite




Well said. One can only hope that NATO sees their plaything Saakashvili for what he really is now, and realise supporting this warmongering nationalistic and attention-seeking bully could bring a world of hurt.


As I've said before, it's the Georgian people I feel sorry for. If Saakashvili gets what he wants, and Russia reacts to his warmongering, it will be the civillians who suffer in the warzone.

reply to post by Vitchilo




Coincidental indeed.....I remember an old aide to Yeltsin say last year that if people thought the war between Russia and Georgia was bad, then they will have seen nothing yet if a Russia-Ukraine war breaks out, as it would be in his words, "WW3".


I could see Ukraine siding with Georgia in a war this time should a new war start, they already arm them and have issues with Russia. I think also you could see civil war in Ukraine (Ukraine has a ethnic Russian population).



It's a tinderbox alright.

reply to post by Regensturm


I doubt that. But I'll wait for maloy comments to talk. He have family there and know the whole area...

Ukraine only support it's government at 4%... so I'm pretty sure they would not be able to pull off a war against Russia for little Georgia...

Head of Russian Construction Firm Becomes S.Ossetia PM

The parliament of breakaway South Ossetia approved Vadim Brovtsev as new head of the government on August 5.

Brovtsev, who replaced on the post former Russian tax official Aslanbek Bulatsev, is a general director of a Chelyabinsk-based construction firm Vermikulit. According to Russian daily Kommersant, this company is among those construction firms engaged in Olympic infrastructure constructions in Sochi.

EDIT: UPDATE : Russia accuses Georgia of trying to destabilize Caucasus

Russia's foreign minister accused on Wednesday the Georgian leader of attempting to destabilize the Caucasus region by inviting U.S. observers to join the EU's monitoring mission.

The EU Monitoring Mission in Georgia (EUMM) is the only remaining international mission in the country, observing military activities on the border with Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

"The scheme behind this is perfectly clear, and we have openly told our American colleagues about this. The plan is to attract Americans to Georgia and place U.S. observers alongside Russian soldiers. And from there, the masters of provocations, plenty of which are available to [Georgian President Mikheil] Saakashvili, will try to do their usual work," Sergei Lavrov told the Vesti television channel.

He said deploying U.S. observers would be "simply inappropriate," running counter to the peace plan drawn up by the presidents of Russia and France after last August's Russia-Georgia war.

Russian troop numbers to reach 3,000 in S. Ossetia, Abkhazia

Russia's deputy foreign minister said on Wednesday that Russia's military contingent in the former Georgian republics of South Ossetia and Abkhazia will number 1,500 personnel in each republic by the end of the year.

The Russian General Staff had earlier said 3,700 personnel would be deployed in each South Ossetia and Abkhazia to protect the region, but in mid-June Gen. Nikolai Makarov said the figure was "too large" and it would be reduced.

"Presently there are some 1,000 Russian military personnel in Abkhazia and up to 800 in South Ossetia. By the end of the year there will be 1,500 Russian military personnel in each of the republics," Grigory Karasin said during a press conference at RIA Novosti.

[edit on 5-8-2009 by Vitchilo]

reply to post by Vitchilo



I hope I'm wrong, but as we all know from history there's nothing like a war to try to get people to rally around the leader, like Saakashvili is trying now in Georgia.


I don't think Yuschenko has the authority as you said to wage a war, but telling the populace that they are at the mercy of the Russian bear is all it takes to rally some people and evoke old nationalist feelings.



It could be the ploy to try and join NATO or get NATO on side against Russia in a conflict.


A NATO-Russia war is what some governments in the region want to see.



There could lie the danger.



Hopefully maloy can shed more light on whether this is an issue.



Ukraine, Russia expel diplomats


From the Link:

KIEV, Ukraine, July 30 (UPI) -- Russia and Ukraine exchanged expulsions of their diplomats in an apparent dispute over activities of the Russian Black Sea fleet, officials in Kiev said.

The Ukrainian Foreign Ministry is analyzing a Russian document on Moscow's decision to expel two Ukrainian diplomats in retaliation for the Kiev government's expulsion of two Russian diplomats, the Ukrinform news agency said Thursday.

Yuriy Kostenko, acting Ukrainian foreign minister, said diplomats must not get involved in internal affairs of a host country, Ukrinform said. The diplomat offered no further details.

Last week, Ukraine expelled a Russian embassy diplomat i Kiev in charge of the Russian Black Sea fleet and the Russian consul in the Black Sea port of Odessa.

On Wednesday, Russia asked the Ukraine consul in St. Petersburg, Russia, and an adviser in the Ukrainian embassy in Moscow to leave Russia.

Mentions the Russian Black Sea Fleet, and now we have the article about the naval exercises you posted......




[edit on 5-8-2009 by Regensturm]

[edit on 5-8-2009 by Regensturm]

[edit on 5-8-2009 by Regensturm]

" A top Russian diplomat says the United States is quietly rearming the Georgian military, and he warns the U.S. move will force Moscow to react. Deputy Foreign Minister Grigori Karasin leveled the accusation Wednesday in Moscow. He did not describe the weapons, nor indicate what form Russia's response would take. General Anatoly Nogovitsin says Russia's armed forces are alarmed by Georgia's military buildup "

reply to post by TheCoffinman


Could you please provide a source for that?

Thanks.

Russia's General Staff suspects Georgia planning new attack


From the link:

MOSCOW, August 5 (RIA Novosti) - Russia's General Staff suspects Georgia of planning new military action, despite being incapable of any aggression at the current time, a senior Russian military official said on Wednesday.

Col. Gen. Anatoly Nogovitsyn, the deputy chief of the General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces, said that unnamed third countries were continuing to help Georgia rebuild its military potential.

"As for weapons they are indeed being supplied, and financing is underway...Georgia has funds to develop its armed forces," he said, adding that "unfortunately, Georgia is restoring its military potential at a fast rate."

Nogovitsyn described Russia's key task as preventing a new conflict.

"Today, we are trying to prevent a new conflict and will do everything possible to stop it taking place. This is our key task now," he said.

According to Nogovitsyn, Russia has no plans to reinforce its military presence in both South Ossetia and Abkhazia. Moscow recognized the independence of the two former Georgian republics soon after last August's war with Georgia over South Ossetia.

"We do not see any need for increasing the operating contingent," he said.

Looking back at the conflict ahead of the first anniversary this Saturday in which 64 Russian soldiers, including 15 peacekeepers, were killed, Nogovitsyn said Georgian planes camouflaged with Russian insignia had attacked refugees.

"It has been established that Georgia twice used Russian aircraft insignia on its Su-25(Frogfoot) planes: on August 8 when it bombed a column of vehicles carrying refugees from Tskhinvali [South Ossetia's capital],... and on August 9 [when it attacked] a column of Russian troops moving along the Dzara road [from Tskhinvali]," the military official said.

He said the evidence had been submitted to the international community and Moscow was still waiting for the European Union to suggest a punishment for Georgia.

"What is most depressing is those countries that with the help of the EU mission have received a comprehensive report that Georgia and the Georgian leadership was the aggressor and should be punished, have yet to react," the military official said.

Georgia denies claim of "aggressive rearming"


From the link:

Source: Reuters
* Russia: Georgian offensive would be "suicidal"

* Georgia says security forces subject to EU monitoring

* Saakashvili speaks to U.S. Vice President Biden

By Matt Robinson and Dmitry Solovyov

TBILISI/MOSCOW, Aug 5 (Reuters) - Georgia on Wednesday dismissed as a "myth" Russian accusations that it was aggressively rearming and said it was in contact with ally Washington to defuse tensions over rebel South Ossetia.

Russia crushed a Georgian assault on the breakaway territory in August last year, and tensions have grown ahead of Friday's first anniversary, with accusations from both sides of gun and mortar fire on South Ossetia's border.

Moscow on Wednesday again expressed concern that Georgia was rearming with Western help, but said it did not believe the former Soviet republic was capable of launching another offensive against South Ossetia.

"As a military man, I will be forthright: if there is an (act of) aggression, there will be an adequate response," Anatoly Nogovitsyn, Russia's deputy chief of general staff, told a news conference after the army on Tuesday stepped up the combat readiness of troops in the rebel region.

"Today we do not see any ability (of Georgia) to launch such aggression. And the political situation has radically changed. Not to understand this and continue acting according to the old schemes is just suicidal (for Georgia's leadership)."

Russia controls the borders of South Ossetia and Georgia's other rebel Black Sea region of Abkhazia -- which Moscow recognised as independent states after last year's war -- and has kept more than 7,000 troops in both since the war. The five-day conflict, when Russia repelled the Georgian assault and sent tanks into Georgia proper, shook Western confidence in oil and gas routes running through the South Caucasus.

Russia's assault last year worsened relations with Washington. But those tensions have eased since with meetings between President Barack Obama and his Russian counterpart Dmitry Medvedev, as well as attempts to make progress on a new nuclear arms treaty.

DIPLOMACY

Washington says it has focused on improving the education and professional standards of Georgia's military, not on resupplying it with equipment lost in the 2008 war.

U.S. Vice President Joe Biden discussed the situation with Georgian leader Mikheil Saakashvili on Tuesday, after Presidents Obama and Medvedev spoke by phone. Georgian National Security Council secretary Eka Tkeshelashvili said Biden told him of Washington's "preventive diplomacy so the situation does not deteriorate".

Tkeshelashvili told a news briefing Moscow was trying to create "a myth of Georgia's aggression and aggressive rearmament".

Georgia is focused on rebuilding its "defensive capacities" in line with NATO standards, she said, and any Georgian military movements are monitored by 240 European Union observers.

"Any military base, any police station, any movement of our military or even police forces at any time without prior notification can be monitored and can be observed and assessed by the (EU monitoring) mission," Tkeshelashvili said.

Nogovitsyn said Georgia was trying to escalate tensions to win support from the West.

"This is being done to present Russia as an enemy, and as long as there is an enemy, they ask for help and rearm. Here is the gist of the problem," he said.

The war of words continue.



Key highlights: Russia says no plans to reinforce military presence in South Ossetia and Abkhazia, accuses unnamed third countries of re-arming Georgia, says they have evidence of Georgian air attacks on civillians and Russian military while bearing the Russian flag in war, and warns Georgia of response to aggression.


Georgia, for it's part, says Moscow's accusations of Georgian aggression and aggressive re-armament was a myth, and says it is simply rebuilding it's defensive capacities in line with NATO standards

[edit on 5-8-2009 by Regensturm]

reply to post by ArMaP


I wanted a source as well.

Typed in a few of the words he was quoting into a search engine, and got this:


Russia Charges US Is Rearming Georgia



From the Link:

Russia Charges US Is Rearming Georgia
By VOA News
05 August 2009


A top Russian diplomat says the United States is quietly rearming the Georgian military, and he warns the U.S. move will force Moscow to react.



Deputy Foreign Minister Grigori Karasin leveled the accusation Wednesday in Moscow. He did not describe the weapons, nor indicate what form Russia's response would take.

A top Russian general says Moscow is not planning any offensive in the Caucasus as the anniversary of last year's brief war with Georgia approaches on Friday. However, General Anatoly Nogovitsin says Russia's armed forces are alarmed by Georgia's military buildup.

U.S. Assistant Secretary of Defense Alexander Vershbow told a U.S. Senate panel Tuesday that U.S. resources are currently aimed at training Georgian forces. But he said other forms of help could be offered in the future.

Tuesday, President Barack Obama and Russian counterpart Dmitri Medvedev spoke by telephone about reducing tensions in Georgia.

U.S. Vice President Joe Biden also telephoned Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili. Biden stressed the need to avoid actions that could further destabilize the region.

Moscow has warned it will use "all available force" to protect the pro-Russian populations of South Ossetia and a second breakaway territory, Abkhazia.

Georgian President Saakashvili told the Reuters news agency Sunday that he knows Georgia can not use the military to retake control of South Ossetia or Abkhazia.

Russian forces swept into Georgia August 7, 2008, following Georgian attempts to regain control of breakaway South Ossetia by force. Georgia said it only shelled South Ossetian targets after Russian forces invaded.

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov Wednesday called the war an "unforgiveable adventure" launched by Mr. Saakashvili. He told Russian television hundreds of lives were lost in the conflict, which he described as a tragedy for the Georgian people.

Moscow later recognized both territories as independent countries, despite strong protests from Western governments.

reply to post by maloy

s for those saying that Russia staged this or the media reports are false - what would Russia gain from such stunt? It already has the desired status quo. It has no interest of any incursions on undisputed Georgian territory (even if South Ossetian authorities make new claims).

Russia has nothing to gain. Russian leaders - do.
A: It would stop this
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Baku_pipelines.svg
which is a threat to current energy-"black-mailing" policy.
B: Russian leaders (aka Putin and those behind him) clearly stated that they want Saakashvilli out. And hanged, as a nice bonus. And recent attempt to use Georgian opposition to Saakashvilli failed.
By the way, if Russian federation was not interested in war, Kokoyto would not be allowed to talk about moving borders. At least Russian foreign ministry would soften his statement by their own counter-statement. But to South Osetian war drums Russian war drums were added by all kinds of threatening statements. Saakashvilli openly said he does not want war. Could be lying and he wants to hang by his privates. But Russian leaders did not even say that. They are busy threatening and warning Georgia.


[edit on 5-8-2009 by ZeroKnowledge]

reply to post by Vitchilo


There is no need to worry about Ukraine jumping into this mess. The sea exercises you mention are not really about military tasks but more of a research and cooperation mission, which is of little political importance.

Ukraine as a nation, as well as Yuschenko's administration - are facing a crisis as it is right now. Ukraine is virtually bankrupt, while Yuschenko will definitely be finished politically after this term. Ukraine realizes that it has to uphold good relations with Russia if it is to rebound economical. Furthermore the ethnical Russian and pro-Russian population is far too large to ignore and brush aside.

There may be some differences and issues between Ukraine and Russia, but nothing serious enough to give rise to a conflict. This is of course as long as Ukraine's leadership maintains some degree of sanity. Yuschenko is idiot, but he is no psycho like Saakashvili. Neither is Timoshenko. As of now, there is no threat of any type of conflict between Russia and Ukraine. And it will stay that way as long as NATO and US military stays the heck away from Ukraine.

What Ukraine and Russia currently have are shaky relations. But this is very different from hostile relations. There may be elements in both countries that are unfriendly towards each other, but in the broader picture Ukraine is still too close to Russia economically and culturally for this rift to become a major problem.



As for recent Georgian events - looks like nothing will come of them. These are just after-shocks of last year's war. One of the reasons why these minor clashes continue, is US's insistance on holding military exercises in Georgia this summer, and Russia's reactionary exercises. It won't quiet down anytime soon, but there are no signs of escalation either.

[edit on 5-8-2009 by maloy]