NSA archives: Flight 93 shot down

Originally posted by ThroatYogurt
You are wrong on all your accounts. The FDR PROVES where the flight went. The CVR PROVES what was going on. The phones calls to loved ones PROVES what was going on and what happened.

Its just too bad there is a governemnt doucument that states Flight 93 was intercepted, which conflicts with the official story.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


Hey Ultima...bump your gums all you want. If you can't produce the evidence. It does not exist.

Originally posted by ThroatYogurt
Hey Ultima...bump your gums all you want. If you can't produce the evidence. It does not exist.

Thats so funny, since you cannot post any actual reports or physical evidence to support your claim or the official story.

I have shown prove of the document and have requested a unclassified copy so i can finally put an end to you and other believers fantasy world.

Originally posted by ThroatYogurt
Hey Ultima...bump your gums all you want. If you can't produce the evidence. It does not exist.

Speaking of evidence, when are you going to psot any to support your claims or the official story?

Where as there is NO physical evidence of explosives in the WTC, it is not the same with Flight 93. It was headed for the Capital of the US and it was shot down. There was plenty of time to shoot it down. What I always find so funny is that people will believe one gov't document to support their theory but discredit others that do not fit. You have to seperate emotion from fact.

I mean, what is a better headline.....

US SHOOTS DOWN CIVILIAN AIRLINER
or

LET'S ROLL



This is a no brainer. This is the coverup. However, the passengers were made heroes and the world swallowed it. There was large pieces of debris for miles.

link to debris field

There was a 9 mile an hour wind reported that day. Tell me how it blew debris, including human remains and parts of an airline seat into Indian Lake, over 2 miles away. How did it blow awayan engine.



If you took the time to lookin into Mineta, Cheney and when the order was given, you might have more insight into what a conspiracy and a cover up are.



[edit on 19-8-2008 by esdad71]

[edit on 19-8-2008 by esdad71]

reply to post by ULTIMA1

WOW you claim to work for the NSA?
You dont even know the difference between "de" and "un" classified?
You are using the wrong term.
A document becomes "declassified" not "unclassified"/
Infact you need to check a dictionary because you are using the wrong word.

Originally posted by TheBobert
A document becomes "declassified" not "unclassified"/
Infact you need to check a dictionary because you are using the wrong word.

NO you misunderstood what i was stating. I was aksing for an unclassified version.

So that means either a unclassified document or onw that had been declassified.




[edit on 19-8-2008 by ULTIMA1]

Originally posted by ULTIMA1

Originally posted by TheBobert
A document becomes "declassified" not "unclassified"/
Infact you need to check a dictionary because you are using the wrong word.

NO you misunderstood what i was stating. I was aksing for an unclassified version.

So that means either a unclassified document or one that had been declassified.




[edit on 19-8-2008 by ULTIMA1]

I just talked tot he FOIA office toady.

They stated that soneone else requested the Flight 93 information that live in New Jersey.

I should be getting the documents before long.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


I'll second that.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


Lets be clear. Some guy named Wayne says that there are NSA archives that say that flight 93 was shot down making this AT BEST, 2nd or 3rd person hearsay.

Real evidence would be the declassified doc which I hope to see soon.

Hey Ultima...bump your gums all you want. If you can't produce the evidence. It does not exist.

I know this may be a bit off-topic / target, but after feeling my brain melt and leak out my ears, I had to comment.

I am a little puzzled by your statement. Without proof, it doesn't exist? I have experiences in my childhood that I know I experienced ( and are a bit on the paranormal side ) but at the time, I wasn't carrying a digital camera ( a few years before they were invented ) or a digital recorder, etc to record it. ( I didn't know what to think about it until years later anyway )

So, are you going to say because I don't have proof, evidence, hard documents, that what I witnessed or experienced didn't exist? ( and in that point, I should be locked up in the rubber room for believing it did )

The government has always been known to cover ( or attempt to ) cover its tracks, destroy evidence ( wasn't that in the news about a government official taking items from the Archives and destroying or hiding them??? )

As for if this guy works for ( worked for, has access to, etc ) the NSA - they have a website that talks about what the NSA does ... there have been books written about the NSA ( One I own. Its fictional, but the author clearly states they were in touch, anonymously anyway ) with NSA agents so their book was more authentic.

I have grown tired of people demanding evidence when they may not be able to. My BIL's ( Brother-In-Law ) brother worked as a government contractor building military vehicles and such. The company he worked for I thought was a food warehouse ( company was called FMC, if I recall - been a few years ) ... the front office showed nothing to say what it was.

Only when we got a brief tour and saw military vehicles in various stages and I realized the fenced / razor wired area meant something did it get pieced together.

Its hard for us, as humans, to take something as truth. Religious people have been following a BOOK for hundreds / thousands of years that state all these miracles and supposed happenings to come. Without PROOF, they believe. Without EVIDENCE, they believe.

Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

reply to post by mtmouse32


I think the point is that without the doc, we have no way of knowing whether it does or does not exist. He can claim it exists all he wants but without the doc, his claim only means as much as his reputation

So as it stands right now, there is no evidence that what he claims is in the document, is accurate. The document # may exist but who knows what's really in it.

reply to post by mtmouse32


Let's be honest, we have no way of knowing if he even works for the NSA and don't you think if he did, they would be a bit upset because he's discussing top secret docs here?

And do you really think they'd release a "smoking gun" document or even let him see it? That document, if real, could hurt a lot of very powerful people who would not allow themselves to be burned by someone like ultima so what do you think would happen to him if this doc was really what he says it is???

Originally posted by mtmouse32
I am a little puzzled by your statement. Without proof, it doesn't exist? I have experiences in my childhood that I know I experienced ( and are a bit on the paranormal side ) but at the time, I wasn't carrying a digital camera ( a few years before they were invented ) or a digital recorder, etc to record it. ( I didn't know what to think about it until years later anyway )

So, are you going to say because I don't have proof, evidence, hard documents, that what I witnessed or experienced didn't exist? ( and in that point, I should be locked up in the rubber room for believing it did )

Look at it from my point of view. I have never experienced an event I would class as paranormal. We have no actual physical evidence of any ever occuring and in fact the human mind is well known to be susceptible to various delusions which explain paranormal events (near-death experiences, pareidolia etc).

Now, there are two options here, we can say
a) It may have happened
b) It didn't happen

The first option is fine, and is in fact the position most people take including myself. However, when trying to use this in any sort of positive claim the situation is a little different.

Say for example you claim to me "Paranormal events occur". I ask you for evidence to substantiate that claim and you refer me to your personal experiences. Now, the two choices from before have changed slightly. If we are to accept that it could have happened, we accept that no testable evidence is required to prove an event. This undermines the very foundations of science.

It is not such a simple choice, I accept that in fact paranormal events could occur and we simply don't have evidence for them, but I cannot use that in any sort of argument, for the very reason that we don't have evidence of them.

I'm not trying to claim ULTIMAs evidence doesn't exist, but unless we can actually see it, unless we can confirm either through an authoritative source or viewing the document and associated details ourself, we must treat it as if it does not exist. Otherwise we are giving weight to pure speculation without testable evidence.

Its hard for us, as humans, to take something as truth. Religious people have been following a BOOK for hundreds / thousands of years that state all these miracles and supposed happenings to come. Without PROOF, they believe. Without EVIDENCE, they believe.

Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

Not really, it makes me quite sad.

Originally posted by jfj123
So as it stands right now, there is no evidence that what he claims is in the document, is accurate. The document # may exist but who knows what's really in it.

Why would i bother to request the document if it dod not have anything in it?

You forget i have access to the document that states Flight 93 was intercepted (which contridicts the official reports) and follow up reports state more.


WHY ARE YOU BELEIVERS SO AFRAID OF THE TRUTH?

Originally posted by ULTIMA1


You forget i have access to the document that states Flight 93 was intercepted

NO Ultima. You DO NOT. You are not telling the truth and you know it.

Let's make a deal. You fail to produce the NSA document that shows Flight 93 was intercepted (by a jet fighter) and you leave ATS.

If you DO produce the document, I will personaly deliver it to CNN,MSNBC,FOX,CBS,ABC,BBC, Alex Jones, Steven Jones, Bridget Jones...etc...

THEN I will become a truther!

deal?

Originally posted by ThroatYogurt
Let's make a deal. You fail to produce the NSA document that shows Flight 93 was intercepted (by a jet fighter) and you leave ATS.

How about when i post the document you post a thread and apologize, stating the the official story has been proven wrong on this account. THEN EXPLAIN WHY YOU ARE AFRAID OF THE TRUTH AND THEN YOU LEAVE ATS FOREVER.

Are you man enough to accept that deal? If so i will explain the deal to the mods.


[edit on 3-9-2008 by ULTIMA1]

reply to post by ULTIMA1


Deal... as long as you agree to your side. That YOU will leave. No good-bye song.. not thread... you can just dissapear like a fart in a cool ocean breeze.

There will have to be a time limit on your posting this information. I think January 2nd 2009 is fair. Do you?

Originally posted by ThroatYogurt
Deal... as long as you agree to your side. That YOU will leave. No good-bye song.. not thread... you can just dissapear like a fart in a cool ocean breeze.

There will have to be a time limit on your posting this information. I think January 2nd 2009 is fair. Do you?

As long as you agree to post a thread to apologize, state the official story is wrong, why you are afraid of the truth and then leave.

Do you want me to state it to the mods to keep it fair?