Rebuttal In Defiance Of The GFL

thanks for encapsulating my overall feelings of late InfaRedMan.
S+F sir

All I can say is I agree with the OP. I love reading a thread that has been throughly researched. Star and Flag for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bravo Bagar!

I applaud your comments and think you hit the nail right on the head, but more importantly you underscore the mindset you gotta bring to this area.

As painful as it is to wade thru the sad, sad offering sometimes served up... it's what it costs to go on this ride. It is what it is and that's just how it is.

OP, I feel your pain... but it's practically impossible to enforce your scheme without killing the golden goose.

I had a huge gap in participating, just lurked, but it comes around...

Guys, this thing is like a 100 year war.

You've just gotta suck it up.

One other note, in studying the nature of information, knowledge, (pseudo-) science, existence... yada yada yada...

(Hey, I'm on this epic odyssey... and it's a long OT subject)

But by exclusively focusing on a show me the artifacts mindset, it TOTALLY looks like we've missed the staggering anomalies that populate our framework.

Some of this stuff is basically soft evidence, but absolutely every bit as complelling as the real ( ) thing.

Being an absolute diehard skeptic the way I am, to constantly have access to these data 'reels'...

It becomes rather obvious that by trying to recover some kind of landing gear strut, that we are NOWHERE NEAR ASKING THE RIGHT QUESTIONS.

After 60 years of this (same) stuff... Is it time for a new approach?

I agree..... I also take a slightly different stance though. Maybe there should be a section on the forum that is called "Comic Relief" that is "freed" from the normal ATS-totalitarianism of decorum..... it could be a place where the Mods put posts like this latest Galactic Federation of Light crap, and those silly people who do numerology and make crazy predictions of terrorist attacks and things like that.... I mean posts like those aren't even worthy of being put into the Gray area or skunk works... right?

And it would also be the ultimate put down for a post, the place where "laughing stock" posts end up ... really... if it ends up in comic relief and everyone treated the posts that get put there as the flotsam they are it could really increase the integrity, meaningfulness, and wieght of the threads that don't get moved into that "comic relief" section.

And then maybe people would think twice about posting BS.

-Euclid

star and flag from me as well.

I've only been using this site for maybe 2 months now as i'm really interested in the topic of UFOS. And i gotta say, seeing a thread like that is a MAJOR TURNOFF to those who want to try to have some type of logical discussion. I seriously believe this will drive away newbies to this site who may be curious as i was...only to think this site is half full of crazies.

Would be great if these posts were just blocked out and deleted altogether, or at least moved to a more suitable area.

It kinda bums me out..with sightings on rise...the BS seems to be 10 times that.

Too bad that an interstellar organization like the Galactical federation of light is UNABLE to provide us some proof of their existance: no, they do prefer to share their message with some girl who makes Reiki.

"commander, we are approaching Earth, what now?: a mass landing on all the capitols?"

"mnaahhh: lets contact this girl, she will open the doors on this unknown world: she will speak for us because despite we are the galctic federation of light, we are unable to communicate with them, we need to channel someone, and this person is SPECIAL: yes, let's do so: all the rest of mankind will wait"

Because she's special, right? While we are a bunch of mere mortals, we have to wait the announcement of this person, of the new Messiah. Is this correct?

Originally posted by Defiant Human
Wouldn't it make sense for mods to just move the threads in question to more appropriate forums like "Skunk Works" or "The Gray Area" when they show up? Then everyone can have their free speech (which is important) and the more evidence based forums like "Aliens & UFO's" can run a little leaner and more productive.

I don't think we need any kind of limits on what kinds of ideas can be expressed on ATS, we just need those ideas to be in the appropriate forums.

Here, here, yikes and away! There are already guidelines in place to handle the questionable and truely fictional fiction, move it to the appropriate areas. Let those whom wish to write their unsupported stories, completely void of sensable rationale, proof or validation, and just move it over to the right area, who knows what artistic pieces could arise from their imagination. And keep the stories that do have sincere questions and supported photographic proof in tha areas outlined for them. The only real question that comes into play here is knowing when a thread crosses the line to be re-classified from one area or another. Yeah, there are some that are just too silly to really be taken seriously from the get-go and I see that everyone has their own threshold as to where that line is, or should be. And I do agree with the OP that it gets out of hand from time to time. But don't we all expect that, at least on some level to some extent here? I mean, I do want a serious discussion without the BS about so much of these things, but we all must keep our ears up about our topics and expect the party crashers to muscle in when they can. The key word is "discern". ok, I'll step off the box and let the next one speak.

Ok how about this: we give them an ultimatum. The GFL has finally posted a concrete date of PROOF and have essentially put all their eggs in one basket.

So what that means is when October 14 or 16 or whatever the date was that they claimed will be a massive fly over comes and if nothing happens then we ban them and never give them any credence ever again. And from that date forth the Mods treat them with increased severity and skepticism and ban/close any of their threads that are as hollow as the last one.

Everyone await the date on October and I say if the date comes and there is no massive sighting as they claim or if they attempt to retract their statement and use an excuse I say we have a massive boycott of them and boot them outta here.

Originally posted by David9176
... I seriously believe this will drive away newbies to this site who may be curious as i was...only to think this site is half full of crazies.

If a new person doesn't take the time to look through more material here and discover that which might be relevant to their search then maybe they would just be wasting their time. Beauty in the eye of the beholder, so to speak.

I do like Euclid's forum idea but then there is the question of determining the parameters for moving a post to comical area. Probably just another item for some to fret over.

I see IRM's point in all of this but it must fit into the big plan by the fact that it occurs.

Originally posted by euclid
I agree..... I also take a slightly different stance though. Maybe there should be a section on the forum that is called "Comic Relief" that is "freed" from the normal ATS-totalitarianism of decorum..... it could be a place where the Mods put posts like this latest Galactic Federation of Light crap, and those silly people who do numerology and make crazy predictions of terrorist attacks and things like that.... I mean posts like those aren't even worthy of being put into the Gray area or skunk works... right?

And it would also be the ultimate put down for a post, the place where "laughing stock" posts end up ... really... if it ends up in comic relief and everyone treated the posts that get put there as the flotsam they are it could really increase the integrity, meaningfulness, and wieght of the threads that don't get moved into that "comic relief" section.

And then maybe people would think twice about posting BS.

-Euclid

Now, I do like this idea! Comic relief! So many possibilities to achieve in doing this, if done proper like!!

Hmmmm, lets do it

Originally posted by euclid
I agree..... I also take a slightly different stance though. Maybe there should be a section on the forum that is called "Comic Relief" that is "freed" from the normal ATS-totalitarianism of decorum..... it could be a place where the Mods put posts like this latest Galactic Federation of Light crap, and those silly people who do numerology and make crazy predictions of terrorist attacks and things like that.... I mean posts like those aren't even worthy of being put into the Gray area or skunk works... right?

And it would also be the ultimate put down for a post, the place where "laughing stock" posts end up ... really... if it ends up in comic relief and everyone treated the posts that get put there as the flotsam they are it could really increase the integrity, meaningfulness, and wieght of the threads that don't get moved into that "comic relief" section.

And then maybe people would think twice about posting BS.

-Euclid

I endorse your idea here fully.


On a side note, Great thread, OP!! I may be a new member here, but only because it took me so long to register instead of lurking , and even I have noticed the sheer volume of bogus/ridiculous threads popping up lately.

starred and flagged.

reply to post by Fulcrum29


This is a good idea because even if GFL based subjects were banned but the GFL turned out to be real we would all know about it anyway because it would be all over the media etc and there would be millions of real photos, it's not as if preventing the subject from being posted would prevent any real life eventualities.

I read the entire first page of this thread and still had no idea what "GFL" was.... there was no link or description provided, just people saying it's bad . I had to piece things together and I assume you are all referring to this thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Lack of clarity fail.

Cool. Another loop of the vicious cycle.

Another thread about why people post to what many people believe are baseless UFO/ET threads and flag them to the top of the list is now flagged to the top of the list.

Bring on the next baseless UFO/ET thread.

Edit: sp

[edit on 8/6/2008 by roadgravel]

I'm sorry... I guess I was just a LITTLE too subtle.

The universe is basically LAUGHING at you 'show me the proof' (hardware ) guys.

The 'proof' is ALL around you, we simply ain't *cough* bright enough/quick enough to pick up on it.

It's the ultimate satire... We ARE the only intelligent life in the universe.



PS. Does anyone have a counter of how many times we've been thru these GFL thingies...

Fat fingers!

[edit on 6-8-2008 by golemina]

reply to post by golemina


Well.... I don't know about us being the only intelligent life in the multiverse. In fact I believe a lot of stuff that most of ya'll would think was BS. And I would too if I didn'y have first-hand experience of certain things. I experienced strange events throughout my life. I don't post them here because I don't have pictures - just my experiences. On the other hand because I had, and in some instances continue to have, strange experiences it did provide the impetus to look into many different paranormal phenomena, religions, philosophies, science.

Truth is really stranger than fiction.... I believe that almost 95% of REAL paranormal phenomena can be explained by quantum mechanics. Do I believe that there are aliens out "there"... yes. Do I think there is GFL as described in "those" posts.... hell no.

I'm actually a skeptic.... who has had some very strange experiences.... but I can smell BS a mile away - so when people post BS we should have a bucket for it. I think that bucket should be comic relief so that we can all have a good laugh and take pot shots at goofy posts.

Since ATS won't provide unlimited Ignores.... please give the Comic Relief section and put all the GFL, predictions of UFO landings, terrorist attacks, zeta-talk, channelers, etc in there so we can rip it up. Some people need a place to vent and fly off the handle and not risk point deductions and banning.


-Euclid

[edit on 6-8-2008 by euclid]

I agree with the OP

I have Starred & Flagged this thread because, like a lot of people on ATS, I am sick of all the BS hoaxes & lame stories that are getting on the front page as "Hottest Topics".

I brought this subject up last week in the ATS issue Thread:

ATS Issue Thread

I agree totally. I get tired of going through crap threads that almost make me embarrassed to read! Look up in the sky this night at so and so place and you will see big ships as aliens have told me , or Aug 8 aliens(GFL) will come to visit... There are a lot of interesting posts here and I love this site although I almost never post. I also have a thread I started a while back where i was a little to excited about what appeared to only be a meteor. So I know how easy it is to just post something without pictures or further research, but some of these posts drive me nuts...


Peace

[edit on 6-8-2008 by chaostheoryd]

I know what I'm about to say is gonna sound like fightin' words

but I can't help myself

just like people can't help feeding the trolls

to me - the serious threads, the "quality" threads - seem to blink and glow - they stand out from the rest - they may as well actually be blinking and glowing - bright red

I make a bad choice sometimes - and it turns out to be something decidedly less than what I was after

but I just don't get the problem - and after being here - on purpose - for over a month now - I have to say - I've read enough of these "quality issue" threads enough to really get it - this is driving people nuts

and making them just crazy angry in some cases

but - I still see trying to control this situation - however you decide to do it - as being the death knell of the whole damn thing

and trying to eliminate the trolls, the spammers, the hoaxers - even if we could do it - should we?

I know that's a philosophical question - and no one's in the mood

this is about ridding the site of "extra" stuff - so we won't be annoyed - or have to sort thru so much BS

but controlling information - no matter how inane that information is - no matter how useless, annoying, infuriating, ugly, dishonest - is still censorship - and if we actually assign value to this site - NOT censoring has to be front and center

god knows how long we're even going to be allowed to enjoy this form of communication - this forum, the internet - this free thinking, free flowing exchange of ideas and information (yes – a little paranoid about that)

this particular form of communication has never existed before in the history of mankind

I realize the Gutenberg press was pretty cool – this goes even beyond that

I’m not absolutely sure – but I’m pretty sure – the serious business of UFO research is not going to be harmed in the least by people who think Prince Charles is a lizard

what people seem to want is some sort of exclusive club – where they can share their thoughts with like-minded individuals – and not have to waste time or rub elbows with people who aren’t capable of appreciating how valuable their thoughts and opinions really are

on a site that’s so concerned about the NWO, the Illuminati - exclusion of the masses and a denial of their basic rights by nefarious groups - decisions being made for the many by the few

well - just seems a little ironic

we have met the Illuminati – and they is us

why is it so hard to just not feed the trolls?

why can’t people walk away?

why sacrifice what’s important for convenience?

there is a number of problems that are created by fraudulent claims.

1. new people who come here and see some of the garbage may actually think we all believe it.

2. creates confusion and muddys the waters when most here are looking for clarity of whats really going on.

3. either by accident or design these fraudulent threads are doing the governments work for them by burying potentially real threads and creating more skeptisism.

4. devalues ATS and its members.

im not sure censorship is the answer, maybe creating a new position with in ATS get those with the most critical of minds who dont automatically cry "HOAX" to question the OP either in u2u or in the thread if the person appears genuine allow other members to post if the OP comes across as some kid or tool looking for mischief delete the thread.

automatically closing a thread because of lack of evidence doesnt mean the claim thats been made is false so its wrong to close every thread where the OP doesnt have photos or whatever.