My UFO meeting with Sr. Air Force personnel

Originally posted by pimppapa1977
Im active dutymilitary and have a decent security clearance.Ill leave it at that but in this meeting i wouldve had some kind of backup ie;tape recorder,a camera a friend outside waiting some kind of proof.As of now you have nothing to even prove of your meeting which would be a big break for all of us enthusiasts.Im not saying it didnt happen or trying to offend you in anyway.I have the utmost respect , unfortunately all this story does is make us look more unorganized and unrealistic.

his proof are his e-mails.

if he can show us the e-mails then there is some solid evidence

reply to post by fworkman


It's not being rude. He's not answering questions. If anyone if being rude, it's the Original Poster! If we want stories, we will go to the library or to a movie.

To the OP

Answer anything anyone has asked with any value or Please, and i do say please leave the fantasies in your head.

[edit on 24-6-2008 by gauncents]

reply to post by gauncents
Hey gauncents.. maybe you can spare an expensive digital camera for the photos you are ridiculing? Please... I trhough ATS is to deny ingnorance. Your comments are not contructive but they are rude.

You honestly went in there thinking that you'd get some sort of feedback that would help in moving the UFO community forward? A civilian with a shiny rock that's not been tested by any serious scientist, some paperwork that's been purchased over the internet, and knowledge of known UFO incidents is not going to impress anyone. And it most certainly will have no effect on someone that high up in the military.

It seems that they didn't offer you much feedback because they realized that you were nothing but a waste of their time.

[edit on 24-6-2008 by Impreza]

reply to post by Bunch


At least I do my promo the straightforward way. But ok, thats fine by me, next time I won't point out clear discrepancies and you can form an "opinion" based on what you want to believe, and not know. You see this as attacking (if I was in that mode you'd know it), and I'm trying to save the guy a long time of headache if he intends to stay active in research.

He wants to be taken seriously, yet his words try to convey more then what the event obviously was. Thats no kinda practice to get into. This is a volatile field, and thats better learned now. I commend him for even going to that degree to want to speak to someone in aeronautics, but it's the sensationalist and overblown presentation that doesn't work.

If you choose to believe a good story with all the sensation thats fine.
I'm not interested in belief. I think it's time this whole field moves past that, and ceases fooling around...it's time to get upfront and serious.

[edit on 24-6-2008 by jritzmann]

[edit on 24-6-2008 by gauncents]

I stand by my earlier post, in this thread, with a question from the other thread of Ufo_Reality's where there were inconsistancies in his OVERALL general story before and after his interview on the radio....I wasn't the only one who noticed them, just probably the only one with eggs to ask....

I just want to pose this question, since he chose not to answer it in this thread...and really didn't answer it in the last thread...

If you owned a site like ATS, or a minor site on just "UFOlogy" a blog, or whatever...

And a story you'd written, had elicited the response of the "secret service" by e-mail, asking you to "cease and desist" the posting of your story....and because you got 100-300 e-mails a day You happened to delete that "smoking gun" e-mail...all of that, is HIGHLY unlikely, first of all, you just have a UFO blog, give me a break, that the Secret Service would even CARE about your blog to begin with, 2ndly, would you ever EVER accidently delete an e-mail from the "Secret Service?" I don't know about you all but I'd make 30 copies of it right away...seriously, would ANYONE in this hobby/profession EVER delete an e-mail from the Secret Service?? And even if you did, it could be recovered....

That...along with the inconsistancies with his interview that night...

The fact we're left with a chunk of Obsidian, a photo of a "Reptilian", and M-12 documents he "bought".... seriously, if you were a serious UFO "investigator" and had a meeting of the type described...with "the big wigs"...
is this what you'd go armed with?? Outrageous. My 2 cents!

Originally posted by antar
Exactally! I was wondering myself why he would have chosen to go it alone unprepared, and without the support of a huge network of people who could have advised him.

Okay, this may sound silly and at the risk of appearing unpopular or even slightly antisocial I have to say it.

I don't have a HUGE network of people to advise or support me on anything in my life from UFO's to taxes.

If I went into that meeting should I have been able to get it...I can't think of one person other than my wife that would even indulge me enough to come along.

I don't have any advisors.
Am I in the minority?

Do you guys have vast networks of people like in the "can you hear me now" commercials that follow you around or just show up whenever you want them?

I have friends and family don't get me wrong, but nothing like what you all are describing. I couldn't get ten of them to skip work or whatever to go with me to a meeting on UFO's. They would probably just laugh or politely decline.

Maybe some of you are taking your situations for granted, again remember we all are not in the same situations.



- Lee

Originally posted by A SINCLAIR
NICE PIECE OF FICTION!

Have you all lost your mind? Is this site becoming a huge joke where dreamers make up story after story? This story could only be bought by very immature minds. The Air Force met you why? What credentials do you have? If you DID have any real credentials I can guarantee that you wouldn't be risking them by posting stories like this here. DO you understand the level of sophistication with which our National Reconn Office runs? You don't remember which Agencies where present? You don't own a digital camera? PLEASE stop embarrassing yourself. Actually im embarrassed for you. I am also embarrassed for everyone that humored this post.

AS-

what does it matter what credentials he has?

for all i care he could be a garbage colector.

the point is if a civilion had any solid evidence that ET/UFO existed then the authoritys would want to examine what it was and if it was or wasnt enough evidence to jepedise top secret infomation.

thats why im assumng they would have met with ufo reality.

as for you sinclair.

you woldnt beleive if an alien was right infront of you.

i think the op should be given the benefit of the doubt on this but i wuld lke to see the emails from dr. butler

Just so you know, he works at Kroger, you know, paper, or plastic.

If you haven't read the thread, there you go.



[edit on 24-6-2008 by gauncents]

reply to post by gauncents
gauncent,

My hat is in my hand and I have been humbeled.

You are willing to back up your criticism with an offer to help provide evidence you seek and I am truly humbeled.

Thank you and please accept my apologies for my brashness.



You just offered to provide a digital camera to uforeality then you edited your post and removed the offer. Now I don't know if I should put my hat back on or not

[edit on 24-6-2008 by fworkman]

[edit on 24-6-2008 by fworkman]

Originally posted by jritzmann
At least I do my promo the straightforward way. But ok, thats fine by me, next time I won't point out clear discrepancies and you can form an "opinion" based on what you want to believe, and not know. You see this as attacking (if I was in that mode you'd know it), and I'm trying to save the guy a long time of headache if he intends to stay active in research.

He wants to be taken seriously, yet his words try to convey more then what the event obviously was. Thats no kinda practice to get into. This is a volatile field, and thats better learned now. I commend him for even going to that degree to want to speak to someone in aeronautics, but it's the sensationalist and overblown presentation that doesn't work.

If you choose to believe a good story with all the sensation thats fine.
I'm not interested in belief. I think it's time this whole field moves past that, and ceases fooling around...it's time to get upfront and serious.

Just quoted because I felt that this is the last thing that should be read within this thread.

Hi OP,

I am not sure if you are still reading this thread, but I have some questions in my head after reading 12 pages of Q&A by others.

What was the capacity you approached Dr. Butler with (Hello Sir, I am a reporter for.../independent investigator/joe six pack/something else)?

You said several times in your answers that "...there was no disclosure." Where you expecting one?

Also, what was the purpose in brining the letter from VP Dick Cheney, was it supposed to carry some "weight"?

If I may comment on some things now...

For someone who alleges to have spent 10 years researching UFOs, you do not appear to have established any protocol/process in your investigations.

I understand your excitement and nervousness before and during the meeting, but as you said "not a big deal"...all these people were strangers to you so you should not have had any worries about offending/not impressing them, who really cares at the end of the day, no?

Did it ever occur to you as an alleged investigator, that basic tools of the trade would be a pen, paper, camera, voice recorder? Especially as a future radio host, alertness is one of the characteristics of the good hosts, and ability to improvise is another.

The fact you met in a civilian facility would've warranted you requesting permission from the people you are meeting to bring in those tools, when you were setting up the meeting with them. (Unless you planned to turn this meeting into a folk story or an urban legend, filled with mystical descriptions and insinuations, which are not really factual items?)

Obviously you need a permission to put anyone on tape overtly, but it should not have been a big deal to ask for it during preparation stages?

Also, not getting everyone's name, that was just a bit silly. If you have been gearing up towards this meeting, in all excitement to forget their names or not write them down...

What was the goal you had in your mind after the meeting, meaning what was the purpose of going through this experience?

The above is by no means an attack on your person, just my questions and observations, nor am I trying to pass a judgment on you.

Everyone does things differently and your apparent lack of experience in social interactions should not be taken against you. It is human to err...

Thanks!

yup the first thing I thought when I seen those pictures was obsidian, my uncle is a geologist and a university professor, i've seen rocks and minerals out the ying yang for the past 20 years... gut instincts are usually pretty close...

Anyways, the story itself sounds interesting... but yet what was the whole point? You didn't get anything out of it, no answers to anything, they refused to speak for a reason, it seems more like a waste of time, more then likely just put a target on your head, lol

reply to post by ufo reality
ok dude since the u2u isn't working i'll do it this way; i live near atlanta and i would like to see your artifact, i do have a 6 mega-pixel digital cam, and a scanner; u2u me if they get it back up.

as sir springer said, everyone needs to chill and actually read the thread and pay attention; i keep seeing a lot of obtuse comments and questions that have been addressed and a lot of oxymoronic and anal-retentive posts;

my ex-father in law was an electrical systems designer and worked for many different military and government contractors for over 40 years, had a passion for the unknown, and would not discuss anything related to ufo's,aliens, or any subject that he deemed covered by his security clearance, and i daresay he would have attended a meeting such as this just to see the artifact, just in case it did come from a wayward black ops boo boo.

and i know a geologist at west georgia university that would gladly look at your artifact. waiting on you,dude.

good post,but sometimes honesty and simplicity in things just lets the trolls and other assorted animals drool on the keyboard.

seeker

I for one am a person with a military background. If you are on base or off base but on Duty, you can be accounted for.

Op provides no names because he can't remember. No names, no checking, no proof, no substance in content.

Nothing but fiction.

I believe NGC2736 is good at giving time limits that don't mean anything.

Originally posted by ufo reality
I'll try to get some better pics of it, but like I said for some reason it doesn't want to shine in pictures.

Turn the flash off and use a light source that is away from the camera. Maybe try the sun as the light source from different positions as well. To me it looks exactly like obsidian, and is chipped like obsidian, but looking at a image that small, a person can't really tell. The images you provided could not be the original resolution, they've been downsized to thumbnails, for whatever reason. To give an example my camera phone has about 3x the resolution of those images, so there must be the originals some where. I wonder why someone who took the images would downsize them, and then give it to you..

I would like to know how you found this piece, and the story associated with it, or maybe point me to a place where you explained it already. Its not that hard to believe some people could set up this meeting, as they probably know as much as the average UFO researcher. I don't think most in the military or government are told anything, so they must be curious to any new information they can get.

reply to post by Freezer


Here's my first chance to deny ignorance all day!

THE OP DOESN'T OWN A CAMERA!

READ THE THREAD IF YOU WANT TO PARTICIPATE!

Yep, a self proclaimed ufologist without a camera.

Originally posted by ufo reality
One older guy sitting next to me pointed at the MJ-12 packet and said "you know you've got something labeled top secret there and you're not supposed to have it...?"

Originally posted by ufo reality
I understand. But I held the packet up to the guy and said do you want to look at these MJ-12 documents and he said "NO"

Originally posted by ufo reality
I found a well put together packet of all the documents as well as the documents re-written so they're easy to read on a web site called www.tellmewhereonearth.com

Hi ufo reality, is this the MJ-12 document that you brought with you?

If this meeting really did take place and I will give the OP the benefit of the doubt, the guy from Lockheed was probably there to make sure what you had wasn't part of a classified aircraft. Probably one that Lockheed is working on but the military doesn't have in service yet.

A person from Lockheed would better be able to identify such materials where as no one else could if it were a prototype.

My guess would be that they went into the meeting doubting that you had any UFO evidence but you may have found part of a downed top secret craft. When you gave your presentation you must have surprised them and mentioned some classified information that was true. They were probably shocked by the information you had.

Just a guess. Keep an eye out for any suspicious persons following you or tapping your phone line...hehe