BREAKING: Prophet Yahweh TRIES TO TWIST Challenge to Summon UFOs For ATS and FAILS

This whole silliness is the very reason that the UFO investigative community is, to most people, chuck full of lunatics and escapees from circus sideshows. There are real mysteries out there to be explored and investigated. Aliens? Doubt it. Mysteries? Oh, yeah. Let us concentrate on these, and leave fake "prophets" to stew in their own idiocy.

Just to add, no matter how stringent the challenge parameters are, "prophet yahweh" would still be able to wiggle out, by saying something along the lines of "the spiritual angst present drove god away" or some such drivel. There is no win/win here, it would be lose/lose.



[edit on 6/17/2008 by seagull]

Email response from Prophet

-----------------------
from the desk of:

PROPHET YAHWEH

Dear ATS,

Just for the record, I want nothing I say, in any communications with you, ever, under any and all circumstances, to be considered verbally binding legally.

Any thing is I say is to be considered as only evaluating possibilities, suggesting ideas, and exploring options that no party will be bound to legally.

Neither do I consider anything said by anyone from the ATS forum or ATS itself to be legally binding.

Nothing will be legally binding, in any way whatsoever, by any party involved, until such time that we have signed a legally binding contract drafted by our attorney’s.

With this understood, let me say that I pray that Springer re-consider the following demand that he posted at the ATS forum:

“There is no negotiation, the terms are simple.”

Let me submit the following for consideration by ATS:

1.) As a general rule, I don’t like summoning for some one’s production who blasphemes my religion and the Creator I serve, and who slanders, libels, and defames my character, on a consistent basis, to members of his group.

2.) As a general rule, I don’t like summoning for some one who is not really qualified to produce a production and is really an amateur.

3.) Because of this, my summons will be done in my own production that I am willing to “consider” a joint venture with ATS.

4.) The details of this is open to negotiations that will not be considered legally binding until drafted in contract form, by our attorney’s and signed by both me and ATS.

5. Once we have complete our negotiations on the course of action, and have signed a legal contract, I will send put out a press release, to the world’s media, announcing my acceptance of ATS’ challenge for me to prove my ability to summon UFOs.

6.) In the PR, it will be made known to the world that my UFO summons attempt be simulcast live to the world via the Internet and, if possible, a mainstream network television news channel.

7.) It will also be made known, in the PR, that my live UFO summons, over the Internet, be pay-per-view for the world at large.

8.) The amount of money ATS receives to cover its expenses, and for participating in a joint venture with me, will be decided upon in our negotiations.

9.) Rights of ownership of the final production, UFO event security, production decisions, distribution rights, and all other issues, will also be decided upon in our negotiations.

10.) Now, that all this has been made known, the question is if Mr. Springer will re-consider his demands are non-negotiable and enters into direct negotiations with me, and our attorney’s, publicly on the ATS forum site.

11.) If Springer is willing to drop his demands and enter into negotiations, then let the terms for how the negotiations be conducted be decided in the current thread about ATS challenge.

12.) After the terms have been agreed upon, then let Springer create a thread on his ATS forum that no one can post to but him, me, and our attorney’s.

13.) This way, the public can see every word we are considering for a “possible joint venture” between me and ATS.

14.) If Springer changes his mind and is willing to enter into discussion on how our negotiations will be conducted, let him create a private thread that no one can post to but him and me.

15.) If the private thread is started, then Springer is to send me an email with the link to it so that I can start posting my concerns there for him to read and all ATS to monitor.

16.) If he decides not to change his mind, and refuses to enter into negotiations about a joint venture with me, then I have no choice but to leave the door open, based on the words of this email, until he decides to change his mind, if ever.

PROPHET YAHWEH
Seer of Yahweh
Master UFO Caller
-----------------------


Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeek.

At this point I'd like to drop right out of my "middle-man" role here if at all possible. This is turning into something that should really get hashed out privately with attorneys and PR firms and whatnot..... *sigh*

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
Email response from Prophet

7.) It will also be made known, in the PR, that my live UFO summons, over the Internet, be pay-per-view for the world at large.

I was unaware all the top prophets offer their 'miracles' on a pay-per-view basis...

What a joke

reply to post by MrdDstrbr


I just wanted to point out that this is the very reason why springer may not have wanted to deal with this guy in the first place.

Plus, I've heard of prophets using weird language, but "legalese"?

This guy stinks of corruption...." I'll do it, but only this way".... CRAP!

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr

Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeek.

At this point I'd like to drop right out of my "middle-man" role here if at all possible. This is turning into something that should really get hashed out privately with attorneys and PR firms and whatnot..... *sigh*

No bleeping way, you started these shenanigans!

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
All I can say is that Prophet seems VERY confident that he can pass the "ATS Test".

I think ATS has no choice now but to test him out!! Or risk losing face....

Agreed. A challenge was offered and he ACCEPTED. Everyone and their mother is calling him a fraud but he accepted this challenge and ATS had better pony up and meet him on it. The onus is on ATS now to fulfill it's side of the challenge. Bite your tongue on calling him a fraud until afterwards because the ball is in Springer and Co.'s court. What. Will. You. Do?

reply to post by schrodingers dog


Can we please just allow him to post in the thread. It's going to take forever to resolve anything this way, going through me and Youtube emails....

reply to post by MrdDstrbr

Ouch. Well, I don't mean to step on anyone's religion, ever, but the Prophet needs to understand that he is the one under investigation here, and "pay-per-view" doesn't exactly look good for his cause.

Contacting world media agencies, and broadcasting this whole ordeal for the world to see can only help PY, furthering his name and "status." When I read this, all I see is someone trying to make a quick buck off of some unsuspecting internet saps. Even if an investigation is done and ATS proves PY a fraud, he will still have walked away with his goal acomplished -- his name known, intrest in him sparked anew, and money in his pocket. It's all corrupt, and it's stunk from the very begining.

In all honesty, I didn't really expect anything less, though.
Much respect to Springer for his responses and willingness to set a challenge, but my vote is to let this die. I don't want to be part of anything that puts this guy in the limelight or cash in his wallet.



[edit on 17-6-2008 by kholdstare]

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
reply to post by schrodingers dog

 

Can we please just allow him to post in the thread. It's going to take forever to resolve anything this way, going through me and Youtube emails....

I don't know, we need to check with OUR lawyers!

I think Ramon's response shows that this won't happen.

He wants a pay per view event? The only thing I can see coming from this is that we will learn the details of his shenanigans and we will be asked to sign documents stating that we will never discuss the manner in which the ufos are produced.

It sounds to me like he's looking to use our name and reputation in the field to give his own claims some credence. I can't see how we'd win here and no, ripping off people willing to pay for the show is not a win in my eyes.

Originally posted by jasonjnelson
Plus, I've heard of prophets using weird language, but "legalese"?

This guy stinks of corruption...." I'll do it, but only this way".... CRAP!

Well, obviously he has already gotten advice from his lawyer about this.
Which is a pretty smart thing for him to do, actually. I don't blame him.

This is getting way over my head though. I'd like Springer and Prophet to find some way to communicate directly with each other about this.

My terms are clear Ramon and non negotiable you will not use The Above Network, LLC as a PR tool for your scam.

You agree to my few terms and we'll talk in September or October, no contracts no B.S.

Anything other than that and I am done here.

Springer...

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
Well, obviously he has already gotten advice from his lawyer about this.
Which is a pretty smart thing for him to do, actually. I don't blame him.

"Smart thing"??????

What the heck does a lawyer have to do with this? Other than the obvious....."I want my money".....

After that last goofy email you showed us, you're still going to offer some kind of support for this charlatan? Shame on you.

Originally posted by kholdstare
reply to post by MrdDstrbr

 

Ouch. Well, I don't mean to step on anyone's religion, ever, but the Prophet needs to understand that he is the one under investigation here.

Contacting world media agencies, and broadcasting this whole ordeal for the world to see can only help PY, furthering his name and "status." When I read this, all I see is someone trying to make a quick buck off of some unsuspecting internet saps. Even if an investigation is done and ATS proves PY a fraud, he will still have walked away with his goal acomplished -- his name known, intrest in him sparked anew, and money in his pocket.

In all honesty, I didn't really expect anything less, though.
Much respect to Springer for his responses and willingness to set a challenge, but my vote is to let this die.

When living in a cooperate "western" world one is expected to respond in turn to protect ones own assists now or in the future.

If this guy was picked for disclosure or is unaware he is being used as one.. he knows very well that he would be left out to dry "if" he is proven to be able to do what is considered impossible until proven other wise.

As I said in another thread.. Governments and Religions will be in turmoil if and when society is exposed to the "truth". This man proves how volatile and weak some are to what they interpret as "real" goal for themselves and those around them.

We are using our own "beliefs" and "views" in what we think these "beings" may view our and their existence. We have no ideal of the outcome. Only that we still need to pay our bills and taxes if we wish to meet out needs.

Short term pain, for long term gain

[edit on 17-6-2008 by Willbert]

I need an answer!! Why should this guy even attempt a summoning without some promise of payment? If I was doing it I would charge at least minimum wage for my efforts. The bible says, " a laborer is worthy of his hire".
The whole idea that he has to summon something and then come back and try to cash in on it later is gambling on his part. Isn't this how Tesla died nearly broke? Who was it, Edison or Westinghouse (or some such)that had a verbal agreement with Tesla. Tesla delivered and didn't get his 50,000 dollars.
I can attempt to signal a UFO with a beacon bot, for minimum wage. Somebody has to pay for the bot (me) and the electricity (me also). Don't give me any garbage about how I will become rich and famous if I succeed. I have already had some success with this crap and don't have one dime to show for it. Better off to mop a floor, or mow someone's lawn.

Originally posted by Crakeur
I think Ramon's response shows that this won't happen.

He wants a pay per view event? The only thing I can see coming from this is that we will learn the details of his shenanigans and we will be asked to sign documents stating that we will never discuss the manner in which the ufos are produced.

It sounds to me like he's looking to use our name and reputation in the field to give his own claims some credence. I can't see how we'd win here and no, ripping off people willing to pay for the show is not a win in my eyes.

I think you owe to the ATS name to at least meet him half way on this. Nothing is binding until you sign it. All he is asking for is exposure for himself, and whether or not he is a fraud is not really important at this point. Expenses are expected with this type of joint venture, and it isn't unreasonable to expect that he be able to recoup his losses and perhaps make a living off of what he does.

He is confidant that he is a 'prophet', and he has accepted a general challenge. If he were to be made out a fraud, he would be ruined. And who better to look over his claims but the ever critical and extremely unforgiving bunch ATS is?

If he indeed wants you to sign a contract stating you will not reveal the methods used, then don't sign it and tell us that it was so, and we will believe you. If it is not, then I don't see why you are backing away from this as. You have the right to read over the contract and decide whether or not it is acceptable to you. The only thing going on here that I can see is ATS being very apprehensive and instead of stating so, you are taking shots at his credibility without even exploring the challenge.

The way I see it, if ATS does not do it's best to make this happen in the fairest, most unbiased way possible then you come across as having no real desire to seek truth and would be happier with the speculation and wild ideas that go on.

Do it. Make the legal thread public, so we may see the agreements and boundaries.

Originally posted by MrPenny

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
Well, obviously he has already gotten advice from his lawyer about this.
Which is a pretty smart thing for him to do, actually. I don't blame him.

"Smart thing"??????

What the heck does a lawyer have to do with this? Other than the obvious....."I want my money".....

After that last goofy email you showed us, you're still going to offer some kind of support for this charlatan? Shame on you.

I'm wondering if you own a business or have you ever negotiated with an employer or institution?

The majority of workers take what they can so as to meet bills.. and sometimes they do above and beyond of whats asked of them because their being choked by bills.

With freedom comes choices and who does not believe that ones freedom is worth keeping, which means we would need to fight for it too..

He's only using tools which our society put in place to safeguard his interests..

What are "your" interests? I'm guessing not him...

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

1.) As a general rule, I don’t like summoning for some one’s production who blasphemes my religion and the Creator I serve, and who slanders, libels, and defames my character, on a consistent basis, to members of his group.

This is out number one. He can claim he was unable to do this because we don't believe him or his "religion"

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)
2.) As a general rule, I don’t like summoning for some one who is not really qualified to produce a production and is really an amateur.

Springer has been deemed an amateur, he doesn't like to summon for amateurs. Seems to me he'll summon for as many pay per view paying amateurs as he can muster. Somewhat contradictory but this is out number 2 in the event he can't do it.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

3.) Because of this, my summons will be done in my own production that I am willing to “consider” a joint venture with ATS.

Translation: ATS can pay for everything, I'll provide my mad summoning skillz.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

4.) The details of this is open to negotiations that will not be considered legally binding until drafted in contract form, by our attorney’s and signed by both me and ATS.

I'm going to need attorneys to draw up contracts to ensure that you don't tell anyone how I "summon" ufos.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

5. Once we have complete our negotiations on the course of action, and have signed a legal contract, I will send put out a press release, to the world’s media, announcing my acceptance of ATS’ challenge for me to prove my ability to summon UFOs.

I will advertise the pay per view event, forever destroying ATS reputation in the ufo and alien arena.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

6.) In the PR, it will be made known to the world that my UFO summons attempt be simulcast live to the world via the Internet and, if possible, a mainstream network television news channel.

see above

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

7.) It will also be made known, in the PR, that my live UFO summons, over the Internet, be pay-per-view for the world at large.

see above again.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

8.) The amount of money ATS receives to cover its expenses, and for participating in a joint venture with me, will be decided upon in our negotiations.

There's money to be made and Ramon is looking to lure us in by dangling some of it in front of us.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)
9.) Rights of ownership of the final production, UFO event security, production decisions, distribution rights, and all other issues, will also be decided upon in our negotiations.

Springer, baby, we can make money on this via pay per view and then release dvd's and license out the clips to documentary makers and we can profit from this well after the original summoning.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

10.) Now, that all this has been made known, the question is if Mr. Springer will re-consider his demands are non-negotiable and enters into direct negotiations with me, and our attorney’s, publicly on the ATS forum site.

So, Springer, ready to whore yourself out to the almighty dollar? C'mon, man, make it easier for me to summon and we can get rich!

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

11.) If Springer is willing to drop his demands and enter into negotiations, then let the terms for how the negotiations be conducted be decided in the current thread about ATS challenge.

Did I mention it would be easier for me if you didn't enforce such strict requirements? Seriously man, how can we make money if you make it look like I have to actually prove to you that this is real? Let's do it my way and laugh about it later.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)
12.) After the terms have been agreed upon, then let Springer create a thread on his ATS forum that no one can post to but him, me, and our attorney’s.

Fine, then at least let me post here.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

13.) This way, the public can see every word we are considering for a “possible joint venture” between me and ATS.

This way I can convince your members to try and convince you to make this easier for me so I can get the pay per view thing going.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)
14.) If Springer changes his mind and is willing to enter into discussion on how our negotiations will be conducted, let him create a private thread that no one can post to but him and me.

Did I mention that I want to be able to post here so we can let your members see that I tried everything to get you to put up the money, under my terms, to put a pay per view show on?

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

15.) If the private thread is started, then Springer is to send me an email with the link to it so that I can start posting my concerns there for him to read and all ATS to monitor.

Dude, if, by some really odd chance, you do decide to let me post here, could you send me a link because, for some reason, I can't access the site.

Originally suggested by Ramon(Prophet)

16.) If he decides not to change his mind, and refuses to enter into negotiations about a joint venture with me, then I have no choice but to leave the door open, based on the words of this email, until he decides to change his mind, if ever.

I will never shut the door on letting a legitimate organization work with me to show the world that I can summon ufos, provided they let me do my thing, my way, my location, on pay per view.

Legally speaking there never was a challenge. Springer's comments were taken, without his consent, to an audience he did not intend to speak to. No worries there.

PY response is a typical passive resistant method of negotiation. If he is met with silence he can proceed no further. However, I would urge the owners to seek legal measures to ensure that PY does not reference ATS in any future way that is not in accordance with the intent of the intermediated exchange.

There was never any direct contact - key point. You were never duly represented - key point.

What a joke...this guy obviously wants to become famous through ATS. You could just see through him, he is charlatan. If he got the so call "power" or "gift" to summon UFO's he would have gone to CNN and summon it for them