Your Sigil Results, this stuff works!

Originally posted by dave420
reply to post by depth om

 

Fine. If you don't want to get to the bottom of this, and if it actually works, and prefer to live in a world where you don't know what works and what doesn't, then sure - let's just dive into this ignorance and hope for the best.

OR, we could try to learn about it, and see if we can use it to help people more than just wishing for lottery tickets and free burgers.

This is not a study. It's a forum for people to discuss their own personal results in an experiment they conducted on themselves. No one is saying they've discovered a new universal law of thermodynamics. People are just saying that whatever they've done has worked for them.

If I say that a lipstick looks great on me, are you going to want a study on that too? This is purely a subjective experience which people undertook for fun and out of curiosity, not to cause an upheaval in modern science, so lighten up.

Originally posted by sc2099


This is not a study. It's a forum for people to discuss their own personal results in an experiment they conducted on themselves. No one is saying they've discovered a new universal law of thermodynamics. People are just saying that whatever they've done has worked for them.

If I say that a lipstick looks great on me, are you going to want a study on that too? This is purely a subjective experience which people undertook for fun and out of curiosity, not to cause an upheaval in modern science, so lighten up.

Precisely! Could not have said it better!

If anyone wants to take part in a discussion on how sigils might work on a more profound level I suggest reading this:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by wayno


You're welcome! It's a pleasure to discuss such unusual subjects in such an intelligent manner with so many open-minded and creative people! So thank YOU!

reply to post by Cythraul


Cythraul, I have indeed been pondering the same thing!

Everything from Rennes-le-Chateau to the Nazca lines could be giant sigils. I believe that a lot of religious symbolism is too. Depending on what angle you look at sigils from, a lot of ancient architecture could also be based on the same idea, from sacred geometrical applications to certain temples resonating with certain mind altering frequencies.
You could even perhaps look at crop circles as "inverted" sigils in that they are the manifestation of ideas rather a symbol that would make ideas manifest.

Would you agree?

I thought sigils were for servitors.

I guess I was wrong.

What's a good one for a servitor and absorbing energy, like a mirror or twin?

If it works, I plan to have it tattooed on me.

reply to post by Ihavenoidea


No spirits, invocations or demons here. This is a thread about a simple way of influencing reality. Much along the lines of the Law of Attraction.

As far as this technique is concerned, it is advised to construct your own sigils rather then use somebody else's since you don't know what effect it was designed for or what it might mean to you.

You would be better off asking your question here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

although you're probably better off U2Uing the OP, thread is getting a little overwhelming.

Might I advise you to try the techniques here first? Or look up the threads on the Law of Attraction? Seems a lot safer to me.

reply to post by Kupios


No, this thread is about an alleged way to influence reality, completely devoid of any research, any study, any critical analysis at all. It seems to be just one more thread devoid of any paranormal study to appear in the paranormal study board.

I swear this board is going down-hill. There is no study, just people talking about spooky ghost stories like they're sat around a camp. No study, no learning, just spooky stories. Childish at best, destructive to the field at worst.

reply to post by dave420



Dave, would you mind very much defining the following two terms:


* research

* study

and specifying (= note the word, please) the criteria by which they can be identified as such - as well as the specific criteria by which "critical analysis" can be identified and validated?

I am not one to get angry very easily, but I must say I feel indignation whenever I witness off-hand dismissal of people who have devoted their entire life to nothing BUT study, research - of the highest order! - and to "critical thinking" (and doing the latter on their own, which is no small feat).

And I will gladly agree that, certainly in MY own perception - every bit as subjective as yours -, the site is becoming more and more unpleasant. It is probably more or less the same as before, but I am certainly finding the ignorance and aggressiveness, present in many threads alarmingly depressing and increasingly off-putting.








[edit on 26-5-2008 by Vanitas]

reply to post by Vanitas


Thank you for such a good response Vanitas.

Dave420,these threads, unless I'm mistaken, are based on discussion and the sharing of ideas and experiences. If you want to understand some of the theories behind sigils then go look at this thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...'

How would you suggest, dave420, studying something so intrinsically linked to perception? The nature of perception is by no means understood and we know for a fact that the observer in any experiment is having an effect on the observed. This is a problem in every area of research.

Go look at this thread and try and suggest a way to research the phenomena that many people are clearly experiencing:
www.abovetopsecret.com...'

If you really don't like this thread dave420, then why keep coming back? You have already voiced your opinion for all to see so why reiterate it again and again? Is it in the name of preventing discussion of a subject you happen to not agree with? This is all your continued persistence is doing.

reply to post by Vanitas


I've already outlined a very basic experiment that can easily be performed.

Don't get me wrong - my intentions for calling people out on this lazy thinking is because it's damaging to the field.

We're talking about something that has physical effects on reality, right? If that's the case, then it's very easy to test it. And until it's been tested, in a scientific sense (a controlled experiment, hypothesis outlined beforehand, a control group, and resulting in consistent outcomes), it's just a hypothesis. People seem to forget that, and leap all over claims without any real study at all.

Studying something does not mean just reading what people have written before. Obviously the information has to come from somewhere, and unless it originated from a scientifically-rigorous experiment, it doesn't mean squat.

Of course that raises the bar for these hypotheses, and poorly-formed hypotheses simply can't stand up to the testing, or if they do, are always found to be bunk.

Surely we should get to the bottom of this sigil stuff, and the first step is experimentation. Until that happens, this discussion will only be filled with gum-flapping guesswork.

If that sounds rude, I'm sorry. It doesn't change the fact that every single useful theory science has given us has passed the very same tests very easily.

I dismiss these claims out of hand because not doing so is the very height of irrationality. Until they are substantiated, they're meaningless.

reply to post by Kupios


Why am I still here? Because I'm trying to help you. That's all. I want to understand this as much as everyone else, but unlike the rest of you believers, I actually need evidence.

This sigil stuff is NOT based on perception. The claims we see here are that it directly affects our reality, by getting us things we desire. That is the most easily-testable hypothesis out there. It doesn't require expensive equipment or lab time, just a two groups of people and some patience. That's it.

No-one has learned ANYTHING from this thread, they've only heard stories from people. No-one is closer to understanding this sigil stuff after 16 pages of anecdotes.

There is no discussion to stifle - all we have is people passing stories around. No-one can learn from that. I'm suggesting something that we can actually learn from, that we can actually study, that we can actually use, in full understanding that it will work. Why are you so opposed to that? Because it spoils your fun when you play otherworldly-esoteric-knowledge-having super-mystic?

reply to post by dave420


This thread is not here to explain how sigils work. The title of the thread is "Your Sigil Results, this stuff works!" and it is no more than that: an invitation to share experiences.

Why don't you A: try a few sigils, and B: to a study yourself and tell us how it goes. You are equally well placed to do so and you also have the motivation and skepticism necessary. At least try it out first.

Why are YOU so opposed to people sharing stories? Even if you think they are simply "otherworldly-esoteric-knowledge-having super-mystic" crazy people. Everyone has read the title of the thread and from it has known what to expect.

reply to post by dave420

Surely we should get to the bottom of this sigil stuff, and the first step is experimentation.

fine, but as you don't want to do it, and neither do any of us apparently, the point is moot.
Go talk to some researcher, and be sure to give him/her appropriate funding too by the way, or he/she won't do it either.
In the meantime just keep your trap closed because to continue to complain proves only that you want to b**ch.
Consider this if you can: should that research ever get done, the possibility exists that it will prove that there is something to doing Sigils, in which case, if it is true then, it has always been true.
In that case, all those who are giving it a try will be gaining benefit all along. Those who wait for proof will have gained nothing in the interim.
Should the research come out negative, then nothing is lost; especially for those who got results on their own, for reasons that will remain unknown.
I repeat, no one believes at this point that you have anyone's benefit at heart and are being obtuse and obstinate for the sake of it.

Hey people,

Let's just stick to the topic and just discuss the sigils and our member's experiences with them.

Thanks.

reply to post by TheBandit795


Thank you!
Nice to know someone's keeping an eye on things!

Bandit795, what about your sigil experiences?

reply to post by TheBandit795


That's fine - can we make a new board called "Paranormal Stories", and move this thread there, then? There is literally no studying going on here in the slightest. Some of us on ATS want to learn about this stuff, to actually study it (in the academic sense), and threads like this are not evidence, beyond the anecdotal. I try to point out the futility of discussions like this, and everyone gets all defensive. The only reason someone would have a problem with suggesting proper study of something is if they feel it's not going to be enjoyable studying it, or if they think it's going to turn out to be incorrect, and they have a vested interest in it (such as desperately wanting it to be true). You never get a scientist saying "oh let's not study that - let's just keep telling stories about it". That's the complete antithesis of study, yet here we are, on page 16 or 17, of a thread devoid of study.

I'm the only person here actually on-topic - everyone else is making baseless assertions, including a massive one in the thread title.

If we don't want to try to learn anything, then fine - let's just keep trotting out these campfire stories and never know a single thing about sigil. That's fine. If this stuff is so good, then you owe it to yourselves, and your fellow man, to understand it fully, given the awesome power some folks here claim it has. To not do so would be a most heinous act, an act of barbarity towards your fellow man, towards everyone suffering, towards anyone in pain.

But I guess it's more fun to tell everyone about a lottery ticket you won after scribbling a shape down than to actually put hard work into study, with the posibility of finding out that this sigil stuff doesn't work.

[edit on 26/5/08 by dave420]

Hey great thread kupios, I have never heard of sigils until reading this, I watched the video with Grant Morrison and decided to try it for myself, so I did all the steps, charged it, then burned it, my question is how long do these usually take to manifest? I realize it is never the same, but on average, what do you think?

reply to post by cgrfan


Depending on what you ask for, according to Morrison, it takes either 3 days, 3 weeks or 3 months. I have had a wide variety from a few days to a few weeks. Don't say what it is that you asked for but try a few and come back and post your results!

Glad you enjoy the thread!

Alright, thanks!
Also, after doing all the steps, I am a little confused on what to do in the end.
I have read you need to "forget" about it, do I forget about the sigil, what I asked for, or what do I do now?? Thanks for the help!

reply to post by cgrfan


I know this is all a little confusing but ultimately it's all down to what works best for you. Grant Morrison's site has a section called POP Magik, taken I think from a book of his on sigils. The section on the site, two parts, explains a lot about how he recommends doing sigils. You can also look up O. Spare's techniques too. Here is my advice, try a few different ways and see what works best though.

Put yourself in a state of "magical consciousness" attained by asking yourself for 5 to 10 minutes what every little thing around you might mean symbolically for you and your life.

Formulate your desire, making sure there are no negative interpretations (asking for an inheritance implies someone's death etc... ). Lovingly work on your sigil to make it look magical.

Now you charge the sigil in a state of heightened emotionality of your choice, ranging from focusing on the symbol during meditation, exhaustion, orgasm, intense fear etc... This, I have found, does not necessarily help everyone.The two people I know who have had the best sigil results didn't know about charging!

Disposing of the sigil. Some say to keep it under your mattress, some say return it to the element connected to your desire (i.e. love to water by flushing it or throwing down a drain, or air by throwing out the window... ). I feel it's best to do whatever you FEEL is symbolically powerful and appropriate and experiment. I have done a range of things from eating, cutting up, keeping in my wallet etc.

Finally, forget about it. The idea being to avoid conscious thought interfering with the process. Easier said than done but a very good idea mentioned by Bandit795 is to something completely different justafterwards like the washing up (dishes).

Experiment and do what feels right. Take a look at this thread too:

www.abovetopsecret.com...'

Hope that helps! Have fun!