Girl died as parents prayed instead of seeking help

So she actually saw a doctor up to three years of her life and then no doctors? That's ignorant to me. If you have faith like they did then why did they see a doctor at all? God gave us minds to become Doctors, scienctist, inventors etc... Just plain ignorant. I suppose we should pray to be rich, pray to become famous and on and on. People need to be responsible for theirselfs and quit waiting for God to help you. That's like waiting for the government to come and save you.

Wow thats an awesome story . I know we don't often agree on stuff . But have a star. I think that hit the nail on the head . Kudo's

Thanx. That means alot coming from you. I did notice though that her condition is treatable, not curable. Perhaps, they were waiting on God to cure her and they didn't want to drug her up in the mean time, but there is a fine line there and they crossed it. Prayer is a great thing, but ya gotsta use some common sense on these things.

reply to post by Christian Voice

LMAO! Thats great Was that in New Orleans, oh wait there was no boats or helicopters, (sorry could not resist)

I would not be surprise if these people are charged with criminally negligent homicide. But it is a slippery slope, when the government tells you, you have to do something.

But the bottom line is they acted irresponsibly, through negligence they denied her a chance to live. By denying her medical attention, it is the same as child abuse. So are we saying we do not want to our police to step in and stop the abuse of children?

We do pay our police to protect us, we pay them to protect our children don't we, or are some of you saying we pay them to protect them from others not ourselves? Think about it.

Poor Girl =(

You know, this had happen before. And it not going to be the last. They pray to God and ask for help and healing. But never get any answers from God. The problem with God. You have do things for him. Before he even think of doing anything for you. But on the other hand. People want God to do things for them. Before they do things for Gods. No one will do anything for the other. Unless the other does things for them.

Did they visit the sick? Visit those in prison, Give shelter to the homeless, Feed the hungar, give to the poor and cloth them? Meaning for God to answer your prayer. You had to put others well being before your own. You had to give up your own life.

Well if i was in there position . I think i would have prayed for the doctors to make the right choice . Or maybe prayed for god to send a doctor that would make the right choice . Or something along those lines . I mean if he "could cure her" Would it not be just as easy for him to "assist" the doctors?

Another great story i think is relative ..

Blond prays to god asking to win the lottery . Every week she doesn't win . This goes on for months as her family is starving and suffering .
She finally passes away and upon meeting god asked . "Why couldn't you just have let me win a few hundred too keep my family safe?"

He replied with
"It would have helped if you actually bought a ticket"

The moral . No one can help you if your not willing to help yourself.

Of all the conundrums, these are the hardest to analyze for me. I feel for children who, for all intents and purposes, must rely on their parents for help in all things. I feel for believers who, honestly see the exercise of their faith as the ultimate 'cure.' I suppose the easiest way for them to rationalize the loss of the child is that it was 'God's will.'

But I can't say that I would have respected their wishes if I had been there. I would have been guilty of kidnapping the child and taking her to a hospital.

I'm also torn in that I have little to no faith in the overall efficacy of western medicine, which I find to be more of a business than an art (let's not even go at the whole 'doctors are scientists' thing!)

The power to mandate medical treatment is a direct offshoot of the political influence the medical and pharmaceutical industry have in government. These people have yet to come to terms with the notion that all the petrochemical distillates they dream of forcing down out throats are in many (many) cases not much better than snake oil. Some even make you sicker than the illness they are meant to treat.

Who's to say (with any degree of certainty) that the girl would not have died regardless of medical help? It's semantic I know, but the challenge for me is to keep from assuming that rushing her to the local PhD would have made a difference (aside from the economic benefit to the doctors and pharmacists).

You know though at least this girl died knowing that her parents loved her.

Before anyone decides to attack that think about this. She knew what her parents taught her about love and religion and faith. She really knew nothing of doctors of medicine or treatments. She knew at the time that her parents were doing “what was best and everything they could do”. She understood that her parents were “trying” to help her. She knew her parents loved her (though they might have shown it in a different way).

Why do I say this? Well everyday a child dies at the hands of someone who is supposed to love and care for them but they die because of abuse of a worse type. These are those that die at the hands of someone who attacks them instead of showing love. These are the children who die seeing their “loved one” smothering them, punching them, cutting them , or worse.

True this girl died and it really sucks, and I feel terrible for her. But to her this was not known to be torture but pain due to illness. It was not like her parents were hurting her for kicks I really believe they may not fully understand where it might be wrong. Her parents were in the wrong and will live with that forever. But at least this girl died knowing someone loved her which I think is better than dyeing thinking your “loved one” hates you.

Raist

Lock those ignorant fools up. They do not deserve the fortune of being able to create life, since they are too stupid to care for it. Another reason I detest organized religion, and if there were a hell, I hope they burn there for watching their child suffer when relief was only a phone call away, even if they couldn't afford the treatment, there is help available. They make me sick.

reply to post by Raist


A kid locked in a car in 90* weather thinks the same thing . That don't make it right . Its still abuse, whether the kid knew it or not . We do.

My cat dont know that kicking him is bad/wrong. That dont give me the right to stomp on his head. Im sure he would even still love me after he recovered .

[But at least this girl died knowing someone loved her which I think is better than dyeing thinking your “loved one” hates you. ]

Yeah cause taking her to a doctor would have proved how much her parents hated her. Foolish pride.

[edit on 26-3-2008 by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR]

if my child was dying no amount of cost or being able to afford something would stop me. one can afford anything given enough time. plus they cant deny help based on being able to pay.

you are helped and they will work out a payment plan with you.

its how all health care works for the non insured.

I believe if someone is on their deathbed, you send for help no matter you convictions..

But I have no right to press my views on others. Those who shun medical attention for religious reasons and not through malice should not be prosecuted for any crime. Thats my stance. The Government can stay out of it.

reply to post by Raist


Raist,

Abosultely fantastic post there man

btw: is that raistlin majere?

[edit on 033131p://26u54 by Lucid Lunacy]

Lock those ignorant fools up. They do not deserve the fortune of being able to create life, since they are too stupid to care for it. Another reason I detest organized religion, and if there were a hell, I hope they burn there for watching their child suffer when relief was only a phone call away, even if they couldn't afford the treatment, there is help available. They make me sick.

Whoa, hold on there skippy.
That went way over the top. Why don't you try and walk a few steps in their shoes for a sec. Her parents didn't stab her in her eyeballs, they prayed for her. While it was perhaps a lack of vision, or sheer stubbornness, they messed up. I'm sure they had no intention of having their daughter die. Saying they should burn in hell is just a straight down right callous and rediculous thing to say.

reply to post by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR


Reread my post, nowhere did I say it was right, in fact I said the parents were in the wrong.

You missed the point on the rest of the post apparently. Check out the other forms of abuse and maybe you can understand why this was a “better” way for her to go than the other ways I was speaking about.

Again I never said the parents were in the right.

Raist

Here is a short video from 'whywontgodhealamputees.com'. I am posting it here for both contemplation and humor. It is relevant because it talks about prayer. It's from an atheist viewpoint, which I am not, but it does bring up some very good points about Christianity.



[edit on 033131p://26u13 by Lucid Lunacy]

You know i change my stance . Let them weed themselfs out of the gene pool .
Saves me from having to deal with them later. BUT i still think they should be tried and there other kids taken away . Maybe give them a chance to not turn out as deranged as there parents.

To raist . If i read wrong sorry . But there is NO "Better form of abuse" sorry .

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


Thank you,

I try to keep up with child issues as much as I can. Daily I see were parents and loved ones have purposefully harmed and killed a child, and all I can do is shake my head and hope the child understood that someone would love them. It tears me up to see or hear of a child coming to harm.

The only thing I can say about this case is that the parents were not intending the child’s death. They were showing her love (though in an odd way). I am in no way excusing what they did, but at least the girl seems to have lived happily. I would rather a child die happy than in the other ways they can die. There are more forms of abuse than just physical or even sexual. Having a “loved one” harm you purposefully is much worse than one doing so without intending to.

Raist

reply to post by Raist


Well on that note .(Since were speculating) Maybe they didn't want to bring her in cause they were sexually abusing her . And they thought the doctors would see it.
Do you think there defence would/should still hold up ?
I mean if its there right to chose what there kids get treated for and not treated for . Where is the line ?



[edit on 26-3-2008 by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR]

Raist,

I agree with your sentiments exactly. I don't believe in the "christian science" approach at all, but more importantly is that this child knew she was loved by her parents. That means alot.

I myself grew up in a foster care home that later became a residential care home for the medically fragile. We primarily took in infants and toddlers. I was exposed to the worst of humanity, and especially the worst of parents. I saw many die that were not loved by their birth parents. In fact, we took in this one infant who became healthier then the doctors speculated he ever would, a few years later he was sent back to his mom. The mom beat him to near-death and left him to die in the summer heat., all because he was "misbehaving". That's worse then what's being described in this article no doubt about it.

On a side note: lemme know what you think of that video mr. majere?

reply to post by Christian Voice


Don't like it, OH WELL. TOO BAD. Need a tissue? Again, if there is a hell, they should burn in it for ETERNITY.

[edit on 26-3-2008 by 27jd]