Was This A Message From Extraterrestrials??

If CC are not man made, and the verdict seems to be deadlocked on this one, then trying to find human reasons for a supposedly non-human action is bound to fail. What seems logical or illogical to us might be perfectly sensible to an alien.

Take the circles all at once from a burst of light theory. For all we know, they could be caused as a residual of the effort to contact the "home world" via some strange sub-space transmitter. We might be puzzling over some by-product of their communications device that they pay no mind to.

Has anyone seen the old movie "The God's Must Be Crazy"? It's about an Australian Aboriginal who finds a Coke bottle thrown from an airplane and seeks the answer to what it means.

*******I have since been corrected by an astute member that the movie cited above was in fact about a bushman from the Kalahari who found the Coke Bottle and undertook the adventure. Thanks to member JustMike for correcting my old memory from 1981. ********

[edit on 12-3-2008 by NGC2736]

[edit on 13-3-2008 by NGC2736]

It amazes me that some still look at crop circles and believe that all are made by our fellow men and so they can not be real or of origins beyond this world. The complexity of most crop circles are such that no person on this planet could possibly accomplish it in one night let alone accomplish them at all. And as sighted, there are other anomolies associated with them that well can not be duplicated either. And if it were our own people, then they are using technology that is not known to us and comes form the black projects world and well what would be the motive?

For those who would believe in ET's well many of them communicate in universal ways with mathmatics, symbols and diagrams. No one needs believe me, but I have in my life recieved what would be termed as symbols with loads of information and meaning from those who are not of this world. So I speak from knowledge of such, but that is my word and I can not take them out of my head to show anyone, but it is in my memory and I still very clearly remember how it took place.

But rest assured, that there are those that can read them and whom they are intended. There is a lot more that goes on than most of us are fully aware of when it comes to communications via symbols.

AS for radio signals from ET. I could say with confidence that more have been recieved and not told to us. It is often the nature of those who are working with grant money and such to often report back to those who allow them to do what they are doing in the first place. If not, then folks history books would tell a much different story of the history our world and science would share more than they do and well just about anything that is not shared would be common public knowledge.

The big thing is, why do we still allow such behavior to still persist?

I'm not suggesting that all crop circles are man made, but I would like to say that I think many of you don't give man enough credit. To say that it's 'impossible' for man to create some of these crop circles is ridiculous. No matter how complex they are, they are just designs in a field of corn or wheat, with planning the right team could accomplish any of the circles we've seen to date.

Don't try to use as evidence of ET's the 'fact' that man couldn't possibly have made some of these designs. Try to stick to things like the electromagnetic anomalies and lack of physical evidence.

We'll know for sure eventually, but it will really take a ship or 3 landing and saying hi.

reply to post by mikesingh
I find it unlikely. In the "reply" is a symbol meant to portray two helices. One with two rotations per n residues and the other with one. The pitch of these alpha helices would be such that hydrogen bonding would be disrupted, and the double helix would not form. Considering the fact that the presentation follows the convention of the original signal, this is something the "return signal" author was not aware of, meaning it is more likely the author is a hoaxer and not an extraterrestrial.

Originally posted by freighttrain

Originally posted by kennethmd
reply to post by jfj123

 

Try Epsilon Eridiani 10.5 Ly. But it is not comfirm. Gliese 876 15.3Ly. Have been comfirm. But haven't found any Earth like planet.

from my understand we have recently discovered hundereds of earth like planets with moons! did I not get this right?

you didn't, earthike has been inserted, they found hundreds of planets, inc one big earthlike planet that sits in the habitable zone of its star.

but most of what they find are gas giants, because at this distance they are the only ones producing the telling dimming of the stars light that tells you it's being orbited.

but proof of planets isn't even spectacular, common sense and science tells us pretty much every star will be orbited by at least a debri field if planet forming failed but simulations show planet forming should be pretty common and not that unlikely of an event.

[edit on 12/3/2008 by David2012]

Originally posted by David2012
well then they are very closeby, the signal cant have travelled further then 36 lightyears.
if they don't have a way around lightspeed and relativity issues then they can't be further then 18 lightyears away and their reply has taken 18 years to get back to us.

According to the reply, if it is the Sol system depicted Earth is one of the planets they inhabit. So all they need is Internet access.

but tbh I think it's a hoax, if actual life out there would respond they would have sent a signal back using the same method we used to get it to them, because that is the only way they could be certain we were abe to receive their reply.

That's assuming they're not already well aware of us.

this sounds to me like an inside joke tbh.

And as to making cropcircles from lightyears away as a valid communications device is doubtfull, one must look from their perspective.

you just received a transmission from 18 lightyears away containing details of a civilization and decide to reply.
Now what do you know about their communications technology? you know they could send this type of radio transmission. It figures to send the reply back using the same type of transmission. You're certain they can receive it.

The problem is we didn't send the message to a system 18 light years away, it was a tight-beam transmission to a star cluster some 25,000 light years away. So either they get the message a little over 25k years in the future and come (or send messages) back in time, it was intercepted, or they have Internet access.

on the other hand, somehow making cropcircles remotely on some alien's planet doesn't sound like a good idea for a few reasons.

1 - you don't know if they see like you do, maybe they use echolocation, who knows, so visual communication is an uncertainty whereas you know they could send radiotransmissions for sure.

The message we sent was an image. Of course we can see.

2 - actually altering anything physically on an alien's planet could be misinterpreted and be undisirable or even concidered hostile or morally unacceptable to the alien species who send a message into space, they might frown apon it because they didn't invite you to interfere on their planet's surface. Would you risk such a misunderstanding on first contact?

I'm not convinced they're benign anyway.

Sorry to pick your post apart like that man. I don't mean to offend.

I think if we are to assume that this is a reply of non-human origin, the fact that it came in the form of a crop formation strongly suggests they are also behind some, if not most, of the rest of the crop formations. So this is nothing new for them. In this case we just gave them a protocol with which to 'ping back' so to speak. I think the Cymatics argument is rather compelling to explain the other forms.

I've been thinking about why they would choose to make their drawings in the crops. Maybe the temporary nature is part of the message, as in here's today's lesson, better pay attention and take notes because we have a lot of ground to cover(no pun intended I promise) and there will be a test.

I'm trying really hard not to anthropomorphize these creatures, but doesn't there seem to be a lot of oneupsmanship in the message? Like 'our DNA is 4 nucleotides more efficient than yours, and yet we have more base pairs' or 'we outnumber you by 8 billion or so, and we have more planets AND bigger brains!'

I say 'That's like, your opinion, man'

EDIT: math error and forgot to explain the edit
[edit on 13-3-2008 by Zelun]

[edit on 13-3-2008 by Zelun]

The Chilface crop circle reminds me a bit of Robbie Williams

This clip stands out.
If it is a fake, it's the best fake I have ever seen.

Comments?

Originally posted by vfrickey
There's a diagram of OUR solar system. NOT an alien solar system. OUR solar system.

Oops.

Oops too!! It seems you haven't gone through the thread. I know it's a pain, so I'm referring you to my post to answer your question. And NO. We do not have nine planets!!

Here

Cheers!

Originally posted by Raud
If it is a fake, it's the best fake I have ever seen.
Comments?

Yes.

Olivers Castle Hoax - Investigations

Oliver's Castle video: John Wabe filmed confession - Flown to CPR offices. "I did it and why"

The Oliver's castle video controversy exposed

UFO forming crop circles caught on tape (the fake one)

TinWiki | Crop circles | Oliver's castle video hoax


[edit on 13/3/2008 by internos]

Originally posted by rizla
I saw a vid where where some observers were videoing a field where a crop circle appeared at dawn. All they observed was a quick flash.

Hi Rizla,

I'm just quoting from your post as an example of several that refer to a "flash of light" that appears to be related to the formation of a crop circle... You did not draw conclusions on that report so what follows in no way is "aimed" at you

What strikes me is that very commonly, people who do try to explain such phenomena seem to imply that the "aliens" (if any) are functioning entirely within the same time and space frames of reference that we do. That is, if it took only a "flash" (fractions of a second) for the event from our perspective, then "they" must have completed the task within that same short space of time. Well perhaps they did, but on the other hand, why should we assume that they exist solely within our "dimensions"? For all we know, what seems like an eyeblink to us could be much "longer" to them. If we want to push the limits a bit, we could even accept the possibility that they somehow enveloped or enclosed the target area within an alternative dimension (for want of a better phrase) where "they" could spend as long as they pleased working on it, then they released it again back into our "normal" space/time.

Okay, that could all be off the wall, but the point I'm making is simply that it might not be a bad idea to consider such perspectives. If these beings are capable of interstellar travel (as some assume) then it's not beyond the bounds of possibility that they can manipulate space and time in some ways.

I'll try and illustrate by reference to the movie "Antz". (You may recall it. Animated film; the ant with the huge glasses had Woody Allen's voice and mannerisms.) There was a scene where this ant's "girl" got (unknowingly) stepped on by what we perceived as a human, but to the ants was something totally outside their understanding. So there she is, stuck to a piece of chewing gum on the sole of this shoe and yelling for help, and the "Woody" ant is staring at it and trying to take all this in as the "thing" very slowly moves along.

Verrry slowly...

For me, that was one of the cleverest things in the whole movie: the concept of differences of perspective in relation to action and even the perception of time. -- And that's just an illustration that still keeps within the same space/time continuum.

JM

reply to post by internos


While I haven't read all those links yet, (thanks by the way) from what I know of the Olivers Castle hoax I believe it was an attempt to discredit Colin Andrews the top researcher in the field. Fortunately Col is pretty switched on and didn't take the bait.

Here's an interesting video from Colin. The ball of light is extremely difficult to see here, but I have seen this in high quality and it is definitely there. You can see a slightly larger version at google vid, not much better though.

Google Video Link

Many people are hung up on the simplistic argument of whether the formations are man made or otherwise, Let me emphasize, you're missing the real mystery, It runs much deeper and the answer, as Colin has told me, may lie in the human subconscious. I have no problem with people making crop circles, except those who are intentionally trying to fool people, the serious crop circle creators are not doing it for this reason. For some of them it's as much of mystery for them as it is the audience. Anomalous energy readings have been recorded from man made circles and people have also been healed from entering into man made formations, whether this is a placebo effect I don't know, all I'm saying is it is not as simple as human vs ET.
From my perspective there's exist a certain extent of denial from both sides of the fence, people trying to fit things into their desired framework whether completely human in origin or those that believe it cannot possibly be made by man.

[edit on 13-3-2008 by squiz]

Originally posted by squiz
reply to post by internos

 

While I haven't read all those links yet, (thanks by the way) from what I know of the Olivers Castle hoax I believe it was an attempt to discredit Colin Andrews the top researcher in the field. Fortunately Col is pretty switched on and didn't take the bait.

I don't know the story behind what's know, confirmed and cofessed to be a hoax. I know that John Wabe confessed that he was the author of the hoax, and that was enough for me. And i have no problems in trusting you: it would not be the first time that someone makes to handle a hoax to a researcher in order to discredit him.

Here's an interesting video from Colin. The ball of light is extremely difficult to see here, but I have seen this in high quality and it is definitely there. You can see a slightly larger version at google vid, not much better though.

And that's an interesting video, if you ask me Has it been discussed here before?

Many people are hung up on the simplistic argument of whether the formations are man made or otherwise, Let me emphasize, you're missing the real mystery, It runs much deeper and the answer, as Colin has told me, may lie in the human subconscious.

Who are you refering to ?
As you can see, i'm avoiding to post in this thread because soon or later it will become a battle between people who claim that all the CC are genuine and people who claim that all them are man made. And in MY opinion, both these sides are wrong. There's much to study on this specific matter, and there are many serious researchers who take very seriously the whole phenomenon.

I have no problem with people making crop circles, except those who are intentionally trying to fool people, the serious crop circle creators are not doing it for this reason. For some of them it's as much of mystery for them as it is the audience. Anomalous energy readings have been recorded from man made circles and people have also been healed from entering into man made formations, whether this is a placebo effect I don't know, all I'm saying is it is not as simple as human vs ET.
From my perspective there's exist a certain extent of denial from both sides of the fence, people trying to fit things into their desired framework whether completely human in origin or those that believe it cannot possibly be made by man.

As said, i agree: i've just pointed out that that specific video was a confirmed hoax, no matter its actual purpose
i absolutely agree with your view, and i guess that some phenomena related to some CC are unexplainable at all.

[edit on 13/3/2008 by internos]

Here is an interesting website for you all to check out....

Big business cashing in on crop circles?

Interesting to say the least.

Originally posted by internos

Who are you refering to ?

As you can see, i'm avoiding to post in this thread because soon or later it will become a battle between people who claim that all the CC are genuine and people who claim that all them are man made. And in MY opinion, both these sides are wrong. There's much to study on this specific matter, and there are many serious researchers who take very seriously the whole phenomenon.

No one in particular, you pretty much gave a similar answer I would give as well. I also take it very seriously and am willing to listen to what the circle makers have to say, and believe me the mystery doesn't stop there. The opinions amongst the people who make them are as varied as the posts are here, however many, nearly all of the serious guys have experienced anomalous events.

And yes that video has been discussed briefly here before, twice that I know of but sadly it is one of those compelling things that slipped beneath the radar.

[edit on 13-3-2008 by squiz]

Originally posted by JustMike
For me, that was one of the cleverest things in the whole movie: the concept of differences of perspective in relation to action and even the perception of time. -- And that's just an illustration that still keeps within the same space/time continuum.
JM

Why just ETs? Take the everyday examples of the simple house fly. Scientists, who have studied the movements of these insects, contend that time for them moves much faster in a linear fashion and a fly swatter would seem like something coming at them in slo-mo! And at the other end of the spectrum is the snail, where time moves extremely slowly (normal for them of course), but they may not be able to see a house fly at all!!

Now were talking of linear time as we know it, the fourth dimension. What if ETs have the technology to bend time into multiple dimensions? That’s probably why we don’t see some of those complex CCs being made!

But hey! Where these CCs are concerned, I have an open mind, until there’s proof, one way or the other!!

Cheers!

Another little interesting morsel of information, most UFO buffs know that Laurence Rockefeller was very interested in the phenomena, he also invested money into scientific research into crop circles.

U.S billionare funds crop circle research

The article says that Doug and Dave claimed to have started the hoax. Wrong!

In 1686 an even earlier British account of geometric areas of flattened plants is found in A Natural History of Staffordshire, written by Professor Robert Plot, LLD, the first "keeper" of Oxford's Ashmolean Museum and a professor of chemistry at Oxford. Professor Plot describes not just circles, but flattened areas "obtaining three parts of a circle, others being Semicircular, some of them Quadrants." These various designs were found both in "arable grounds" and in "open pastures ... And not only in a single, but sometimes in double and treble Circle[s], one within the other."

In July, 1880 the prestigious science journal Nature (Vol. 22, pp. 290-291) published a letter from British spectroscopist J. Rand Capron in which he described his discovery and subsequent examination of multiple circular areas of flattened wheat on a farm in southern England. He describes areas of crop "forming ... circular spots [with] a few standing stalks as a centre, some prostrate stalks with their heads arranged pretty evently in a direction forming a circle round the centre, and outside these a circular wall of stalks which [have] not suffered." Capron suggested that these flattened circles were the result of "some cyclonic wind action" and enclosed a sketch of the "most perfect" of these circles which, unfortunately, Nature did not publish.

link

Here's a possible reference apparently from two thousand years ago, although I can't confirm if this is legit, not my area.

...a book entitled "The Dead Sea Scrolls Uncovered" by Robert Eisenman & Michael Wise (Penguin 1993 ISBN 0 14 02.3250 8). This I= s a dry, academic work, detailing the manuscripts found at Qumran, in the Middle East, during the 1940s and 1950s. While a few were immediately published for all to see, many more were kept secret for over 35 years by researchers jealously guarding their exclusive hold over these documents. But these two open-minded and determined researchers published over 50 documents, including photographs, translations and interpretations of the manuscripts....

One of the documented fragments is known as "The Birth of Noah" (4Q534-536). The Qumran community regarded Noah very highly. According to Eisenman and Wise, Noah is represented as a "Wisdom figure, or one who understands the Secret Mysteries"; "Noah is ... one who is involved in Heavenly 'ascents' or 'journeying' or at least one who 'knows' the Mysteries of 'the Highest Angels'."

Further on, in the actual translation of the fragments of the parchment, is the following (dots indicate missing portions; square brackets indicate places where Eisenman and Wise have interpreted and filled in small gaps) "... will be ... [H]oly Ones will remem[ber ...] ... lig[hts] will be revealed to him ... they [will] teach him everything that ... human [Wi]sdom, and every wise ma[n] ... in the lands (?), and he shall be great.."

And, later: "... of the hand, two ... it lef[t] a mark from ... barley [and] lentils = on ... and tiny marks on his thigh ... [After tw]o years he will be able to discern one thing from another ... In his youth he will be ... all of the= m ... [like a ma]n who does not know anyth[ing, until] the time when he sha= ll have come to know the Three Books. [Th]en he will become wise and will be disc[rete ...] a vision will come to him while upon [his] knees (in prayer). And with his father and his forefa[th]ers ... life and old age; = he will acquire counsel and prudence, [and] he will know the Secrets of mankind. His Understanding will spread to all peoples, and he will know t= he Secrets of all living things." (p.p. 33-37.)

source

Of course you can read many things into it, still very interesting don't ya think. Was Noah an abductee ?

Oh and sorry Internos I just realized you must have thought my above post was intended for you, only the first part concerning Olivers castle.

[edit on 13-3-2008 by squiz]

reply to post by squiz


Have a star for your last post:

i've found an article on Ufologie.net about that and other possible connections with the CC in te past

Considerable evidence shows that crop circles have been known throughout Earth's history. The Dead Sea Scrolls' Book of Noah and several works of medieval literature mention them. Many ancient stone carvings, including one at Stonehenge, seem remarkably similar to the shapes in the fields.

Crop circles appear all over the world. About 10,000 instances from various countries have been reported in the last 20 years, but the most aesthetically advanced ones are in the Wessex area of southern England.

More / Source : Ufologie.net

Crop Circles: Messages from Beyond?

This is one of the most intriguing facets of the phenomenon, IMHO ...

[edit on 13/3/2008 by internos]

I really think this is fake. Let me throw out my thoughts, I've only read the first page of replies, sorry for any repetition...

- all crop circles ever are 100% man made. Why would aliens leave us a message etched in our food supply, and in a way that we could easily make ourselves. They will NEVER be taken seriously.

- Anyway, given my first point, crop circles are an exclusively human association with alien messages. It is part of human culture that an alien race would not be privy to given the message sent by Arecibo. A real reply would definitely be sent via radio. Given that it would be pretty much impossible for the hoaxer to send a radio message from anywhere other than Earth, the only other form of alien communication we know of are crop circles...

- I wouldn't put it past someone with the intelligence to create a reply to go ahead and make a crop circle of it. That is not a good point towards the legitimacy of the message.

- looking at the message itself, the solar system on there is our solar system right? And to me it looks like earth mars and jupiter are raised. What are they trying to say? that they come from here? or that they are living on those 3 planets?

- Why would it take them 20 odd years to reply to this message if they are living on our doorstep?

- And if they are so close why reply to that message in particular? They would have heard every single broadcast we have ever made... reply to something more important...

Its a big load of baloney if you ask me

Originally posted by NGC2736

Has anyone seen the old movie "The God's Must Be Crazy"? It's about an Australian Aboriginal who finds a Coke bottle thrown from an airplane and seeks the answer to what it means.

[edit on 12-3-2008 by NGC2736]

Actually you are so very wrong.... the film is about a South African "Hottentot" native who gets hit on the head by a Coke bottle and searches for the "Gods" who dropped it on him, this search takes him to the Mountains of the Moon, in Equatorial Africa. Definately not Australian.