There are no Aliens visiting this Earth

A wise person once said...

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absense.

In the same vein that you want to claim there are no aliens visiting earth, you most certainly cannot prove that there aren't.

Think about it

hi u4ria let me correct you many people do know whether the evidence is from presidents astronauts pilots military radar the moon mars anomalies crop circles abductees of all ages photoraphs videotape the biggest unsolved murder case-the cattle mutalations its all conclusive and overwelming when put together you wont know unless you look and thats the way its supposed to be.start with the bible ufo connection.com for a concise list of presidentual/astronaut quotes confirming et is here-and always was i might start a course soon stay tuned to ats

Great discussion, but consider...

Most of the skeptics on ATS are simply 'reformed believers'. They may have once had strong 'beliefs', but after 20 years or so of looking into it with great expectations, just couldn't find anything concrete. One reason is that along the way they were exposed to the common hoaxes and misidentifications, and they were exposed to a lot of science.

Now, 'science' is not perfect. But the best scientists try to form 'testable hypotheses'. They look at real 'data' and then try to make a best guess that fits the facts then see if it flies.

Some are 'disappointed believers'. Those would be similar to the viewers of shows like Geraldo Rivera's 'Al Capone's Vault', or the Voronzeh, Russia report of 1989. Too often they look at what is shown and realize it's fake or just a story with 'holes' in it.

Someone mentioned 'Psuedoskeptics'. Now those are like Peter Byrne. They wear suede shoes, hushpuppies (hence the root word 'suedo') and cravats and Safari leisure suits and entice investors to part with their money funding his trips into the jungles of Tibet. He brings back great travelogue footage, and it 'sells' to the Networks, but there's just 'footprints', or pictures of empty jungle, saying 'ooh, the spaceship was here, see the broken branches?'. All gloss and no substance. In fact most of these guys don't believe there's a cryptid, or an alien that they're hunting. After all they're big cowards; would they really be in the jungle looking for a 10ft tall hominid if they really thought one was lurking out there? Nope.

Then there's the 'Pseudoskeptic'. (Note the different spelling). The difference between the true skeptic and the pseudoskeptic is like the difference between atheist and agnostic.

The true skeptic says there's not enough proof, or that the assertion has not yet been proved, rather than that the claim has been disproved.

The ATS type of skeptic, the reformed, or disappointed type, says "I'd like to believe, I have a hunch, but I just can't find enough solid evidence besides 'claims' and 'stories'". Here, we even end up having a few hunches as to why it's not possible.

We're more the type of skeptic that says "I'm hard to persuade, but go ahead and try, I'll listen". They often have a good background in science and are pretty logical.

BTW, in case you think I made up one of those terms, just Google.
Psuedoscience - 28,900 links
Pseudoscience - 1, 070,000 links
Reformed Skeptic - 105,000 links
Reformed Believer - 22,000 links (if you subtract most of the religion-based terms) One who has been converted out of a former belief.

One of the things I'm a 'reformed skeptic' on is traditional medicine. I prefer to use (often in addition to trad. medicine) alternate therapies, such as diet, supplementation and exercise.








[edit on 10-3-2008 by Badge01]

Originally posted by Breadfan
Dude, I don't think there's anything convenient with me wanting to see an alien in flesh and refusing to bow down to the conspiracy theories. Forget about the cover up myths. If aliens were here, noone could stop them to show up. Period. And simple as that.

I agree -- there is nothing convenient with that.
What is convenient is that you choose to mix up myths with facts.
It's a fact that there are many former government officials (Military, Air Force etc) that say such 'conspiracy theories' are infact truth.

If you want, I can give you some links? I'm talking mainstream coverage too if you don't trust anything else.

These are sane men and women that happen to be the most likely candidates for witnessing the type of evidence in which you seek.

If aliens were here, noone could stop them to show up. Period. And simple as that.

Now whose basing their beliefs on presumptions? We don't know a thing. All we know is that whatever convincing evidence there is, points towards a coverup. And that alone gives credence to the possibility of aliens visiting Earth -- while also a possible explanation as to why you're unable to see them.

Perhaps you should look into becoming an Air Force pilot?
...otherwise, tough luck mate.

[edit on 10/3/08 by Navieko]

Originally posted by neformore
A wise person once said...

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absense.

I agree.

In the same vein that you want to claim there are no aliens visiting earth, you most certainly cannot prove that there aren't.

Think about it

You know, with all due respect, that's bordering with philosophy and although I don't have anything against it, that discipline itself is capable of stretching a 1 inch chewing gum to a 2 miles long airstrip.

With that said, let's try getting back to this very moment of our time.
Reality is, right now, I claim there are NO aliens visiting our planet, for my proof is absense of proof of their existance.

I can't find one nor I will never ever (most likely

Originally posted by Navieko
What is convenient is that you choose to mix up myths with facts.
It's a fact that there are many former government officials (Military, Air Force etc) that say such 'conspiracy theories' are infact truth.

If you want, I can give you some links? I'm talking mainstream coverage too if you don't trust anything else.

These are sane men and women that happen to be the most likely candidates for witnessing the type of evidence in which you seek.

I know about the Disclosure Project but it won't cut it for me anymore.
I'm not questioning the sanity of those witnesess, I'm rather puzzled, that very sanity of theirs is a proof of either good acting or strong beliefs.
However...well..what can I say? It just not enough for me. It's a heresay on a national mainstream media level - as far as I'm concerned and it will remain so untill I finally see some aliens in flesh and blood. Do I ask something out of order? Is my demand outlandish? I don't think so.
You tell me there's a Santa, show me the Santa.

Now whose basing their beliefs on presumptions? We don't know a thing. All we know is that whatever convincing evidence there is, points towards a coverup. And that alone gives credence to the possibility of aliens visiting Earth -- while also a possible explanation as to why you're unable to see them.
[edit on 10/3/08 by Navieko]

If some out of space beings were advanced enough to reach our planet, be it this way or another, I very much doubt they would be stopped by some goverement. ie. forbidden to show up.
It's an absurd thing to say and we both know it.

It's like visiting a forest full of squirrels and there u have a group of goverement funded squirrels who are standing in front of human visitors, forbidding them to see the rest of the squirrels.

Those squirrels would be shot dead with pack of Wolf Match rimfire ammo and thrown to dogs for a snack.

This is how I presume (of course I could be wrong) aliens are more advanced then us. If they can come here and observe us, what's to stop them to show up?

I think that argument is even worse then claiming gov is responsible for a cover up.

Originally posted by neformore
A wise person once said...

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absense.

In the same vein that you want to claim there are no aliens visiting earth, you most certainly cannot prove that there aren't.

Think about it

Ok, who was this wise person? You must know since you are quoting them.

Personally, I find it a cute twist of words to be used by people who cannot prove that something exists that we cannot see, touch or feel. They have no evidence, so this is their backup.

Think about that one!

i wasn't here 300 million years ago but those dinosaurs whose remains we have found and that perished 65 million years ago looked very alien to me.

Originally posted by Breadfan
Reality is, right now, I claim there are NO aliens visiting our planet, for my proof is absense of proof of their existance.

But you have no idea really. You're trying to make a definitive out of it and, simply, you can't.

You don't know what aliens look like. You have no idea what they may be capable of, what size they are etc. In short, quite simply you just don't know.

And if you don't know something its scientifically wrong to say its not happening.

What you are saying, in real terms, is that *you* believe that there are no aliens visiting earth. You can't make it any more definitive than your personal belief.

I'd point you at cases like Cash/Landrum, the Belgian Triangle UFO flap and the DSP Satellite Fast Walker incident and say "think again"

Originally posted by yahn goodey
i wasn't here 300 million years ago but those dinosaurs whose remains we have found and that perished 65 million years ago looked very alien to me.

So whats your point? are you saying they are aliens?

Originally posted by Enthralled Fan
Ok, who was this wise person? You must know since you are quoting them.

Carl Sagan

He also said

If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe.

I think he had a point there

Originally posted by Breadfan
Do I ask something out of order? Is my demand outlandish? I don't think so.
You tell me there's a Santa, show me the Santa.

Oh please...
You and I both know using this analogy is very wrong in this argument... I've already explained why, you should know.

If some out of space beings were advanced enough to reach our planet, be it this way or another, I very much doubt they would be stopped by some goverement. ie. forbidden to show up.
It's an absurd thing to say and we both know it.

You've misunderstood me. When I said "we don't know a thing" -- I meant, we don't have a single idea why aliens might be coming down in the first place. How can we presume the government would need or want to 'stop them' in the first place? How are we to know they aren't working with eachother? ...or the government has no say in the matter at all, and it's just the aliens preventing themselves from being made public? There are just far too many possibilities -- infact infinite possibilities, for us to be making presumptions.

All we can go on is what we've got. If that's not enough for you, theres nothing I can do. But to ignore that and say there is no possibility of aliens visiting Earth just because you don't know what to make of the claims of many ex government officials -- is being silly. I could say ignorant, but I know you're not that dumb. Your just sick and tired of searching, and I can understand that. But unfortunately thats life at the moment -- it comes with the curiosity.

[edit on 10/3/08 by Navieko]

Originally posted by Breadfan

Originally posted by Mark Roazhar

I've never been to Texas. All the photographs could be faked
If you live in Texas, or think you do, leave now as the state will fail to exist

Just because of the failure of evidence, doesnt take away belief.

You don't believe that Texas exists? Ok. I'm gonna ask someone who lives in Texas to pick you up at the airport and drive you there.

I don't think you can compare Texas, which is an existing US state for a fact, with an almost abstract theory of aliens visiting our planet, taking people, interacting with them, making embrios etc.

This is just plain reaching and you don't do your camp a favour by throwing arguments like these into the mixture.

You should read your post, as you have misunderstood my 'belief'
I never said that I don't believe Texas exists, just that since I have no evidence it exists, therefore it does not, which was founded on your initial argument (ie, no evidence = no existence).
It would be silly of me not to believe in the existance of Texas

Belief doesnt enter into it. Belief wasnt what you were looking for, but evidence.

The point Im making is, Texas does exist. People will testify it's there, they have photos etc. Just because I have no proofof it, doesnt stop it from being so.
In the same way, people testify that aliens exist from personal encounters, (fuzzy) pictures, just because you say they dont exist, will not stop it from happening

As for who is in my camp, I camp alone

[edit on 10-3-2008 by Mark Roazhar]

Originally posted by neformore

You don't know what aliens look like. You have no idea what they may be capable of, what size they are etc. In short, quite simply you just don't know.

But aren't you just assuming all of this? Why would a person care to know what size aliens are if it hasn't been proven that they actually exist?

And if you don't know something its scientifically wrong to say its not happening.

How has science proven aliens exist? Really, did I miss something on the news last night where scientists proved the existance of aliens?

What you are saying, in real terms, is that *you* believe that there are no aliens visiting earth. You can't make it any more definitive than your personal belief.

And you know something the rest of us don't? It appears you have a belief that aliens exist. Where is your proof or evidence?

I'd point you at cases like Cash/Landrum, the Belgian Triangle UFO flap and the DSP Satellite Fast Walker incident and say "think again"

Ok, I swear, I once saw Santa come down the chimney when I was about 5 years old. I have a picture of it some place. Him emerging, that somebody took to put in a photo album. Does that mean Santa is real?

reply to post by neformore


I love Carl Sagan. I have read all his books, and am a huge fan of Cosmos.

I don't disbelieve that aliens of some sort exist somewhere in the universe

I just don't believe they have visited us.

If you can show me where they have, with proof or evidence, I would greatly appreciate it.

Thanks

Originally posted by Enthralled Fan


Now this is a twisting turn of events......,Do you have any proof of this?

I hope to gosh, for your benefit, that what you put out here is true. But I guess otherwise if and when you die, there is nothing.

In other words, you have no proof of anything you said here.

Can we call it beliefs, since you have no proof or evidence?

Thanks for sharing your beliefs, once again supporting the OP in the fact that you prove NOTHING!

It's true to the best of my belief, but I've never said that when someone dies, there is nothing. From people, I find continuous experiences, testimonies, and memories about the after life and reincarnation. But, it appears that those experiences are "created" for their Earthly belief systems.

If every person (don't matter what their belief system is) that died is contacted by "God", then we may assume that "God" exists or the experience is artificially created by those(aliens, light beings, interdimensional beings, etc...) who control souls like a computer would control people in a matrix. But, every person that dies or has an out of the body experience DOESN'T contact "God", so we may then KNOW that those "God" experiences are being artificially created for only those that believe don't matter if they "supported a religion" or not.

My take on things is that a lot of the really good sci-fi movies are based on the truth and are shown to us (the masses) because they (the human powers that be) want us to know that general idea of real truthful information. So yes, there is a real matrix, but it involves something WAY more advanced that just an assembly of computer chips. The mere fact that String Theory, Worm Holes, Star Gates, Time Travel, interdimensional travel, and souls that are only able to enter ONE body(their body) through there free will during an OBE(Out of the Body Experience) MEANS that this so called "reality" is being artificially controlled or even more so that this "reality" is completely articial in the first place!

[edit on 10-3-2008 by realanswers]

Originally posted by Enthralled Fan
If you can show me where they have, with proof or evidence, I would greatly appreciate it.

Thanks

I suppose then you too "don't know what to make" of the many ex government officials that offer their word? To most, it might not be the ultimate 'smoking bullet' type of proof that will turn the world upsidedown... but we are merely discussing the possibilities, afterall, noone knows anything for certain.

Originally posted by realanswers

so we may then KNOW that those "God" experiences are being artificially created for only those that believe don't matter if they "supported a religion" or not.

And it just couldn't simply be a chemical reaction in the brain at the time of death, huh? Why does the natural fact that people die, have to become something mysterious, including aliens and the matrix? People just die, and what ever happens at the time, I would think, is a personal matter for anyone who takes the journey. Anyone who has died, and come back hasn't really died, now, have they? If they had, they wouldn't be able to come back and explain away the chemical reaction they had to death. Last time I checked, no person who is really dead has been around to explain what being dead is really like. If you have information on somebody who is actually dead, who has explained it all, I would love to hear it. A person being dead for a short period of time, then being revived, in my opinion, does not qualify as a dead person. They are here and now to tell a fantastic story, now, aren't they?

on things is that a lot of the really good sci-fi movies are based on the truth and are shown to us (the masses) because they (the human powers that be) want us to know that general idea of real truthful information.

Uhm, there is a reason that Sci-fi is considered fiction. If they were based on truth, they wouldn't be catagorized as fiction. Who are the powers that be, by the way. I am really curious about that comment.

In regards to your Matrix theory, do you have any proof or evidence? Why can't things just be what they are, without there having to be an ulterior motive to it?

Thanks

Originally posted by Navieko

I suppose then you too "don't know what to make" of the many ex government officials that offer their word? To most, it might not be the ultimate 'smoking bullet' type of proof that will turn the world upsidedown... but we are merely discussing the possibilities, afterall, noone knows anything for certain.

Well, here is my thought on this one. "Ex" being the key word here. Who wouldn't make up a bunch of lies, no longer being employed, to make a few bucks?

Pretty much a no brainer in my opinion.

Originally posted by Enthralled Fan
Well, here is my thought on this one. "Ex" being the key word here. Who wouldn't make up a bunch of lies, no longer being employed, to make a few bucks?

Pretty much a no brainer in my opinion.

As far as I know, most of these people don't make anything in trying to expose the coverup. I'm not just talking about the few who bring their story to Larry King or whatnot... I'm talking about those that are more likely to spend money in getting the truth out rather than make a few bucks.

www.abc.net.au...

Trust me... there are many cases I could find where the 'ex' or 'bucks' aren't a factor. I suggest you do some reading up...

[edit on 10/3/08 by Navieko]