Farrakhan hails Obama as 'hope of entire world'

reply to post by Quazga

Since the vast (real vast) majority of people in power since the inception of the US have been white, they don't need representing.

To act as if Farakhan should include white folks in his "people who need to be represented" speech, is completely detached from the reality of the black experience. The black experience is that Whites have been represented well enough. Whether this is a fact or not is irrelevant.

You didn't really expect these comments to go unchallenged did you? Equal representation is the most salient part of "relevance" of this topic. Even if it is only in this forum.

To imply that hate speech is justified due the ancestral transgressions of the target only serves to perpetuate the chasm.

If I'm not mistaken, one of the primary motives for the formation of the USA was taxation without representation.

IMHO one of the most persistant misconceptions is that the USA is a democracy. It is a representative constitutional republic.

As such, to spout that any individual that may hold the office of the President is the "hope of entire world" is ludicris irregardless of their perceived messiah qualities.

Originally posted by kerontehe
reply to post by Quazga

 

Since the vast (real vast) majority of people in power since the inception of the US have been white, they don't need representing.

To act as if Farakhan should include white folks in his "people who need to be represented" speech, is completely detached from the reality of the black experience. The black experience is that Whites have been represented well enough. Whether this is a fact or not is irrelevant.

You didn't really expect these comments to go unchallenged did you? Equal representation is the most salient part of "relevance" of this topic. Even if it is only in this forum.

To imply that hate speech is justified due the ancestral transgressions of the target only serves to perpetuate the chasm.

I never implied it was justified, I said it was

1. Amazing anyone would make the case that Farakahn specifically should have been inclusive.

2. That to think he should, not only goes against logic (if you know the mans history at all), but also reeks of the fact that it is a classical "white" perspective which rails more against equal rights when they are the ones being excluded than when others are the ones being excluded. And one which doesn't understand how oblivious to their own racism they are...

Can we say Katrina?
"What I'm hearing which is sort of scary is that they all want to stay in Texas. Everybody is so overwhelmed by the hospitality. And so many of the people in the arena here, you know, were underprivileged anyway so this (chuckle) – this is working very well for them." –Former First Lady Barbara Bush, on the hurricane evacuees at the Astrodome in Houston, Sept. 5, 2005

Or maybe the fact that integration.white students are forcing black janitors to eat food they had urinated on as a means to show their distaste for Integration


You see, Farakahns lack of including white folks in his support for a leader who can finally represent the disadvantaged, doesn't seem as heinous as the oppression by whites which is still taking place.

Yes we all should aim for complete equality. But there won't be any until there is also social accountability.




[edit on 27-2-2008 by Quazga]

[edit on 27-2-2008 by Quazga]

reply to post by Quazga


So is what you are saying if a person has what you term a "classical white perspective" thay are a racist?

How does one obtain a "classical white perspective"?

Or a new age enlightened white perspective, or a black perspective, or a red perspective without being termed racist?

Or are we all racist in our own way; you know like xenophobia, gender bias, and religous intolerence?

Perhaps the real issue is how we catogorize individuals by grouping them together to remove some of their individuality and thereby justifying our own unique individual perspective.



[edit on 2/27/0808 by kerontehe]

Originally posted by kerontehe
reply to post by Quazga

 

So is what you are saying if a person has what you term a "classical white perspective" thay are a racist?

How does one obtain a "classical white perspective"?

Or a new age enlightened white perspective, or a black perspective, or a red perspective without being termed racist?

Or are we all racist in our own way; you know like xenophobia, gender bias, and religous intolerence?

Perhaps the real issue is how we catogorize individuals by grouping them together to remove some of their individuality and thereby justifying our own unique individual perspective.



[edit on 2/27/0808 by kerontehe]

Heh.. thats the whole point. The fact that this is seen as a "White perspective" means that those perceiving have been conditioned by their own experiences to this effect. And to be oblivious to that fact is, yes, interpreted as racism.

So you have two peoples, A and B. A goes around subjugating B. Then many generations after this stops, descendants of A go around still acting as subjugators. Enough of this occurs to a descendant of B that anytime they are slighted by those of lineage A, they can't help but to see it as racism, instead of perhaps someone just being rude.

Then all of a sudden the descendant of B hears descendant of A claim that they feel discriminated against because of something someone said...not did.

Yes, this is classic in so many master/slave relationships which carry on through generations. And the fact that some people don't see this, makes them guilt of the unintended prejudice. No matter how well intentioned they are, until they wake up to this, they will be wasting their time talking about equality among those who have only recently acquired it.


For example, a close friend of mine tells me of times when he wasn't allowed to stop at a hotel on a long trip, because their were not any black hotels in Alabama. And he was taking his life in his hands making the trip at night. This isn't some text book, this is my friend. He has a difficult time not getting emotionally upset when he hears about how some white folks feel discriminated against, although he believes strongly in equal rights. It's just that he lived under a very extreme form of discrimination.

Think about how survivors of the depression feel about slackers who complain... it's not the same, but an analog to it.



[edit on 27-2-2008 by Quazga]

[edit on 27-2-2008 by Quazga]

reply to post by Quazga
I understand now.

I have two black legal godsons that lived with me for a while and now live on a buffalo ranch in Texas. In addition to that, I grew up in an area of the Oklahoma/Arkansas border where being a halfbreed [I'm slightly more than half Cherokee] was only considered by most of my contemporaries to be slightly above the social status of blacks. So yes I have no trouble empathizing with others who have felt discrimination.

I still hope however unlikely that we will get through this election year without a general outbreak of renewed hostilities.

I even expect that this forum may help at least a little in that regard by giving us a way to express with civility our differences and maybe even facilitate a narrowing of our philosophical varities.

[edit on 2/27/0808 by kerontehe]

Originally posted by kerontehe
reply to post by Quazga

 

I understand now.

I have two black legal godsons that lived with me for a while and now live on a buffalo ranch in Texas. In addition to that, I grew up in an area of the Oklahoma/Arkansas border where being a halfbreed [I'm slightly more than half Cherokee] was only considered by most of my contemporaries to be slightly above the social status of blacks. So yes I have no trouble empathizing with others who have felt discrimination.

I still hope however unlikely that we will get through this election year without a general outbreak of renewed hostilities.

Oh I think we will. I don't see this election being about old ways. I see this as a harbinger of change in the way campaigns are ran. I'm seeing a lot of stuff which I can't believe is happening. On both sides of the aisle. For once, the extremists in society are being ignored. Anyway, I'll step down off my soapbox now.

A wolf in sheeps clothes. What has Osama said he'd actually do???????????????????????????????????? CHANGE What?????????????
for better or worse. 1 has to be careful what they wish for it isin't always greener on the other side.
& as far as "how does Rush say it" Oh Yea Kalipso Louie does anyone really take him seariously. Just another fanatic.

Originally posted by Quazga
See this is how blind people usually are on these matters.

WHat is this, you just post sentences which mean exactly the opposite now?

Since the vast (real vast) majority of people in power since the inception of the US have been white, they don't need representing.

Until recently the US has been 90%+ white, who do you think would be in power, AND, in terms of individuals you do realise that the vas AND I MEAN REAL VAST majority of whites have no POWER, INFLUENCE etc- some dirt poor white boy gets excluded because of the colour of his skin, while you bow down to anyone with black skin, from Michael Jordan to Oprah, simply because they are black

You are being racist and you are dehumanising people into false groups

To act as if Farakhan should include white folks in his "people who need to be represented" speech, is completely detached from the reality of the black experience.

There ya go again, "black experience" how dare you assume the "Black experience" for every single black that has ever lived, and how dare you somehow give them victimhood status above somebody who is white, even though that white person may have a black boss!

Total racist, dehumanising Bull s**t- people like Farakhan have more POWER, MONEY and INFLUENCE than many (if no MOST) WHITES!

Good little white uncle toms like yourself just nod in compliance

The black experience is that Whites have been represented well enough. Whether this is a fact or not is irrelevant.

Again with the "Black experience" crap, you are just a racist, each person has an individual experience, and racism is either GOOD or BAD, not just good because some black racist tells you it is for blacks to get some "POWER"

So to actually be upset that whites were not mentioned is, and I stand by this, a classic "white" perspective. Racist or not, it's the reality of the situation.

I'm no upset, Farakhan is just a two bob divisionist racist, and, LIKE it or not, it is black leaders like him that keep the black "COMMUNITY" mired in dependency, broken families and crime- REALITY

You want to act as if we are all one big happy family and everyone should just get on board with that. You feel everyone should be inclusive when they are striving for representation. But that is a quixotic mission.

All I did was pointed out, CORRECTLY, the racist nature of Farakhan, and uncle tom nodding dog status you have- as for "happy family" bs, spare me, if anyone wants to put racist guilt on my 10 month old daughter for being white I will slap the head off them.

Ultimately, white votes are required, so dis "whitey" all you want, whitey can turn you know.......

Originally posted by Quazga


I never implied it was justified, I said it was

1. Amazing anyone would make the case that Farakahn specifically should have been inclusive.

what people did was just confirm that Farakhan is a racist, and your point is more messed up than michael jackson's face, that is like saying

"don't call the KKK racist, because you don't expect them to be pro black"

2. That to think he should, not only goes against logic (if you know the mans history at all),

see above

but also reeks of the fact that it is a classical "white" perspective

a racist comment

which rails more against equal rights when they are the ones being excluded than when others are the ones being excluded.

Lies, a black man was simply called for the racist he was, you being the uncle tom reverse racist cannot stand that and therefore respond with gibberish on this forum- racism is either bad all the time or good, if you make it "good" because some black dude indulges in it, it is still racist

*pats TOm*

Can we say Katrina?
"What I'm hearing which is sort of scary is that they all want to stay in Texas. Everybody is so overwhelmed by the hospitality. And so many of the people in the arena here, you know, were underprivileged anyway so this (chuckle) – this is working very well for them." –Former First Lady Barbara Bush, on the hurricane evacuees at the Astrodome in Houston, Sept. 5, 2005

Lovely quote about this natural disaster in a city below sea level, but absoloutely NO racist aspect to it...........

If you WANT to talk about racism and Katrina, how about this

news.bbc.co.uk...

"Filthy toilets

"We rode that storm out and then decided to go to New Orleans. We didn't realise the storm was heading that way."

He said of his eventual Superdome refuge: "There was a lot of heat from the people in there, people shouting racial abuse about us being white.

"The army warned us to keep our bags close to us and to grip them tight."

Or maybe the fact that integration.white students are forcing black janitors to eat food they had urinated on as a means to show their distaste for Integration

nasty case, though hardly justification for placing blacks above the racist line.....


www.guardian.co.uk...

"Nearly half of all victims of racially motivated murders in the last decade have been white, according to official figures released by the Home Office."


news.bbc.co.uk...

"Three men have been jailed for life after they were found guilty of the racially-motivated murder of white Glasgow teenager Kriss Donald. "


en.wikipedia.org...

"The Carr brothers, 22-year-old Reginald and 20-year-old Jonathan, already had serious criminal records when they began their spree. On December 8, 2000, having recently arrived in Wichita, they committed armed robbery against 23-year-old assistant baseball coach Andrew Schreiber. Three days later, they shot and mortally wounded 55-year-old cellist and librarian Ann Walenta as she tried to escape from them in her car.

Their crime spree culminated on December 14, when they invaded a home and subjected five young men and women to robbery, sexual abuse, and murder. The brothers broke into a house chosen nearly at random where Brad Heyka, Heather Muller, Aaron Sander, Jason Befort and a young woman identified as "H.G.", all in their twenties, were spending the night. Initially scouring the house for valuables, they forced their hostages to strip naked, bound and detained them, and subjected them to various forms of sexual humiliation, including rape and sodomy. They also forced the men to engage in sexual acts with the women, and the women with each other. They then drove the victims to ATMs to empty their bank accounts, before finally bringing them to a snowy deserted soccer complex on the outskirts of town and shooting them execution-style in the backs of their heads, leaving them for dead. The Carr brothers then drove Befort's truck over the bodies. Muller was a pre-school at St. Thomas Aquinas Catholic School. Every year the school awards a deserving 8th grade student the Heather Muller Love of Mary Award.
The case gained notoriety among white nationalists and conservatives because both perpetrators were black and all seven victims were white.[6] Since there was no evidence of racial motivation, Sedgwick County District Attorney Nola Foulston decided not to treat the incident as a hate crime. David Horowitz, Michelle Malkin, and Thomas Sowell stated that the crime did not garner much airtime or space in the national mainstream media due to political correctness.[7][8]

White nationalists have highlighted the races of the perpetrators (black) and those of the victims (white) to draw attention to white separatism and black-on-white violent crimes. They stated that had the races of the perpetrators and the victims been reversed, the reactions of the mass media would have been very different, and the hate crime angle would have been assumed outright. Local politicians began playing the case for political gain.[2]"

You see, Farakahns lack of including white folks in his support for a leader who can finally represent the disadvantaged, doesn't seem as heinous as the oppression by whites which is still taking place.

A racist statement on every count, for justifying Farakahan's racism and for making that racist comment about whites oppressing people- tell that to the white woman raped and murdered above, that is REAL POWER AND OPPRESSION.

I obviously cannot express fully my feelings towards you, due to internet rules, but suffice to say, I hope I meet such a person as you with similar views in real life!

Yes we all should aim for complete equality. But there won't be any until there is also social accountability.

there will never be "equality", not two humans have equal skills, and your racist views on "accountability", only make it MORE, not LESS likely to improve the lot of the "BLACK EXPERIENCE"

Someone like you would be a nodding dog for Mugabe

[edit on 28-2-2008 by blueorder]

[edit on 28-2-2008 by blueorder]

Did you hear Barack HUSSEIN Obama being asked about Farrahkan's support? Obama stumbled across his words at first ... seemed he was forced to say he wouldn't accept Farrahkan's support! Yeah, right!! All of this talk about Barack Hussein Obama and him saving us is pure garbage. I'm scared of what the experienced lil man will do to this country! Why is the world in such awe of Obama? Makes me sick!

Who cares what Fairycon says? He is just another delusional religionist. Delusion is delusion regardless of whether it spouts racist screed or is bubbling over with the feigned love of an imaginary deity. At least Fairycon is honest about hating whites. When are white christians going to grow a spine and admit they really hate non-whites. If they are going to say it in their actions they may as well say it with their mouths as well. 'JeZeus loves you but don't you dare move into my neighborhood.'

reply to post by blueorder


You have completely mis understood anything I said. Must be because of your filter...

I never called anyone racist or above the "racist line"

You might want to go back and read...

The OP got what I was saying, take a a look at his post too...







[edit on 28-2-2008 by Quazga]

Originally posted by LilituWhen are white christians going to grow a spine and admit they really hate non-whites. If they are going to say it in their actions they may as well say it with their mouths as well. 'JeZeus loves you but don't you dare move into my neighborhood.'

"white christians", what all of them, or just a portion of them, or some you have interviewed


And "asian" christians, "asian" muslims, "black" christians etc etc what about them

Originally posted by Quazga

You have completely mis understood anything I said. Must be because of your filter...

no, I understood it, and commented on it, again with the racial ephitets.....

I never called anyone racist or above the "racist line"

Again you don't understand, you are being racist and backing up racists like Farakhan, he elevates "victimhood" on the basis of skin colour- to him my 10 month old daughter is nothing more than "white" and is a POWER CONTROLLER, whereas, Oprah Winfrey, who has riches beyond most white peoples dreams is a victim- that is your friend, this is what you bow down to infront of your racist black friends, that is your choice, if you want to live your life bent over like some guilt ridden freak, but this is one guilt free white boy

You might want to go back and read...

once was bad enough

reply to post by blueorder


Actually I think you and I agree on one thing, however, I don't think you understand what I am saying at all when it comes to how descendants of oppressors are viewed when they claim they are being discriminated because they weren't included in a speech from someone who claims to represent the descendants of the oppressed people.


See, until you can understand how these atrocitiescause distrust of the white race, then you can never move past racism.

You sound like the people Stephen Colbert is parodying when he says "I don't see race, I've moved past that".



[edit on 28-2-2008 by Quazga]

[edit on 28-2-2008 by Quazga]

Originally posted by kerontehe
Though I don't really feel Obama is any better or worse than any other leading candidate, the messianic flavor of some of his supporters really strike a nerve in me.

It's depressing to me.

People think because a man is colored and tries to speak like Martin Luther King that he is the answer.

He's not. He's a politician. Another actor. And he's not even black. He's half black and half jewish Only in America would they take a half-black, half-jewish man and tell him 'you are going to get the Black vote because you're colored'.

And it works. It really works. People gobble it up. They love it. They are so blinded by their own racial and ethnic brainwashing that they will do anything to vote in a Black president.

Obama is playing this country like a fiddle... is he really going to 'change' things? Since when is the American political system about change?

Just another gigantic joke being played on America. The saddest thing is seeing how fervently people are falling for it.

Originally posted by Quazga
Actually I think you and I agree on one thing, however, I don't think you understand what I am saying at all when it comes to how descendants of oppressors are viewed when they claim they are being discriminated because they weren't included in a speech from someone who claims to represent the descendants of the oppressed people.

we all can claim oppression, if we dig into ancestry, but if we legitimise it, and legitimise it on race, we are racist and idiotic.

I owe nothing to someone, purely on the basis that they have black skin and I have white skin, they can kiss my white ass

See, until you can understand how these atrocitiescause distrust of the white race, then you can never move past racism.

You are incorrect I have moved past racism, you and your black racist friends haven't= tell them to grow balls, take responsibility for their own actions or else the black "experience" will continue to be stunted

You sound like the people Stephen Colbert is parodying when he says "I don't see race, I've moved past that".

No I don't if I see a black fella, I know he is black, and if he expects me to accept his racist donning of a victimhood shroud over a historical claim for "oppression" the again, kiss this lad's white ass

This is what other posters call themselves awakened for...

Fools see color Fools see facts and dont act on them, Fools know they are fools and fool themselves into thinking they are becomeing unfoolish.

Stop with the racist crap QUAZI MOTO GA OK.

Just like every other president... things never change. They never will. The president is in control of only somethings. Once elected president... the secrets of our entire history are told to them... That is why things dont change...because they know they cant change these things or worse things will happen. and because what we are doing is working and will work. We just have to be strong and hold strong and stop being stupid racist morons. SO HUSH UP AND GET BACK ON TRACK... please..? Im not really even asking...

I just uncomplicated President History for you and your going to find something else to say arent you? Obama cant change a thing... congress has to inact it and then wait until hes not president anymore for the next guy to say no i like it the way it is, so then they keep it. Get off the couch, run for office and then I will listen to you. Its easier said then done.

[edit on 28-2-2008 by rjmelter]

AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH BULL#!
I only wish people woke up and realised that it is people like Ron Paul who was voting against everything bad that has happened t America for over 20 years. They have it good with obama and hilary. black man, woman! What more could they ask for? Well whoever the NWO want in they can just kill the other one and blame it on the same person that killed JFK, who was that, oh the NWO! Well unfortunately unless Ron Paul continues his campaign after getting his seat back then we are "ALL" (the whole world) #ED! No matter what happens learn to love those around you and not take anything personal in this world. Watch videos or let me email you a whole list of documents and videos to awaken you and those around you! A good start is checking out my youtube channel! A lot of quality videos on there!
au.youtube.com...
Peace light and love to all!
widgetdownunda

And he is also spreading a misconception that America is everything. No country wants America to do good as well as bad to them.
Everyone is powerful, some are much more powerful,. only thing is they don't show off.