Petition for new Consciousness Forum

to have a viable forum where we can discuss 'new' consciousness we would have to deny our ignorance regarding drugs and drug use considering it's mans fastest way to change consciousness...

I have always found that to be the down-fall of this website; the fact they 'deny ignorance' yet disallow any intelligent discussion on drugs/drug use.

Originally posted by PuRe EnErGy
I have always found that to be the down-fall of this website; the fact they 'deny ignorance' yet disallow any intelligent discussion on drugs/drug use.

Well it's understandable. They are covering their tracks. You do know drug use is illegal in most countries, therefore they can't be seen to be encouraging or promoting such activities.

True, I like the idea

Thanks for all of your support. I think we have a very good shot at having this forum be created.

I would be surprised if this thread hasn't received attention from the 3 amigos.

I forgot to mention last night why I posted those links. I wanted to show what kind of ideas would be talked about in a Consciousness forum.

To the member who suggested philosophy: Yes, that would definitely be covered, but I do not think its the best idea to call it such. We would be dealing with philosophical ideas, but not exclusively. Comprendes?

I am willing to support this idea.

Count me in Biggie!

I'm all for this forum too, it's a great idea.

Man, I'm stoked about the amount of interest this is generating!!

Has anyone gotten a response from the staff yet, a U2U, an email, anything....? biggie smalls?

Originally posted by biggie smalls
To the member who suggested philosophy: Yes, that would definitely be covered, but I do not think its the best idea to call it such. We would be dealing with philosophical ideas, but not exclusively. Comprendes?

Si, yo comprendo.

No worries. So long as we don't have to go into the paranormal or skunkworks forum to discuss Consciousness Theory.

Great idea on this and I hope it gets started very soon. This is definitely an important topic.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by masqua

 

I understand the academic association with "Consciousness" studies, but at least half of us werent thinking about drugs or pure academic psychology when petitioning for the forum. We were thinking of discussions in the line of esoteric studies, metaphysics, buddhist thought, meditation, channeling, the new agey "quantum physics" interpretation and so forth.

Just saying

[edit on 18-1-2008 by Skyfloating]

Some of the interesting new scientific studies on meditation show physiological changes in the mind, and they are also at times chemical ones, so why differentiate between the chemical changes that are internal vs external? Not that we want to support drug taking, but there are some really fascinating theories about consciousness and different plants throughout history, so why limit ourselves? Why not keep it open for discussion? Also, "traditional" psychology is changing. ACT, a new psychological treatment is based on eastern philosophy, and with evolutionary psychology the whole field is evolving rapidly. Lets not let artificial boundaries prevent us from looking at everything relevant to consciousness. Saying "this is" and "this isnt" worth exploring is very limiting. Some junk is going to seep in, but surely we are discriminating and intelligent enough to notice and select which threads we are going to choose to participate in.

I love science, philosophy, and religion, and I notice a convergance in the fields. Why not participate in that?

Edit: I just noticed someone saying that the board itself prefers no discussion on drug use of any kind. Thats odd. No allowable mention of the '___' studies by Leary and company? No discussion of how Shamans have used certain plants? I dont mean a "whoa dude, that was radical" kind of discussion, but a nice scientific discussion of the subject as it pertains to consciouness throughout history. (Including some very interesting scientific attempts to induce mystical experiences in people using various external means.)

[edit on 20-1-2008 by Illusionsaregrander]

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


I am assuming that the staff has been aware of this request for some time and that "yes" or "no" answer is given because they are not sure of it themselves. There are several reasons they may not be sure. One of them is drug-talk...which would cut the popularity of this website in half and put off many people. Since the mind can produce altered states without substance-intake, there´s no necessity for talking drugs. And if some really feel the compulsion to talk drugs they can talk in coded words such as "This is what Terence McKenna has to say about altered states...".


I think we will get our forum soon enough (and in the improbable case that we dont get our forum we can always say "Hey, consciousness is not something to be talked about anyway...its something to be experienced)

Originally posted by Skyfloating

One of them is drug-talk...which would cut the popularity of this website in half and put off many people. Since the mind can produce altered states without substance-intake, there´s no necessity for talking drugs.

Oh I can certainly see how this digressing into a discussion of street drugs would be annoying or off putting, but from a purely scientific point of view we should be completely clear that "drugs" is an artificial label. It is impossible to discuss consciousness without brushing up against the subject to some degree. Think about the food restrictions many groups advocate, and why, chemically, they may do so. How some groups advocate abstaining from substance use and abuse, etc. How can you really discuss the nuts and bolts of consciousness, which at least here on Earth occurs in a bio-chemical machine, and completely avoid chemistry? Thats my issue with those sorts of limitations. Whether we like the idea or not, consciousness IS affected by chemistry, whether those chemicals are produced in the body "naturally," or ingested either in the form of food or more traditional "drug" sources.

I just think we the members together with the moderators are capable of shutting down the sort of threads that go too far off into street drug land without making the entire line of discussion taboo. I could be wrong, it wouldnt be the first time.

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


I have to say I agree with you, and I agree with them. We should be open to discussing everything but I know what they're getting at.

Interesting, this book I have this psychologist in the 60's was interested in learning meditation/philosophy from monks and such in the east. He had this one guru who was like...in another world it seemed. Anyways he gave this guru a pile of drugs and he said he swallowed it, enough to mess you up REAL bad... and nothing happened to the guy. Interesting.

We have the power to shape our reality with our thoughts and intentions I believe. One who grasps these concepts could eliminate the effects of any substance I believe.

I think the guys here find drug talk not to hold much relevance because of the lack of control and understanding under the influence. Meditation is being aware of everything, to a higher level then usual to the meditator, rather with drugs I guess it's more of a pseudo-meditative experience. Whatever the case may be I'm fine with relevant drug discussions but I guess it's against the rules. I think we want to be open about everything here regardless, even if it personally bothers ME if I think the forum strays from the real issues.

Ahh whatever, I'm easy

This forum must be made regardless!! We NEED it.

anyways...

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Yes, true. But I´ll refrain from saying anymore about it until the forum is up.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by Illusionsaregrander

 

"Hey, consciousness is not something to be talked about anyway...its something to be experienced

)

That's right. I believe talking about it just makes me want to experience it even more, or rather, it gives me new directions on how I wish to experience it.

Also a great thread for the staff to look at when considering the request, (aside from the amount of support from the members, regardless), would be this thread:Psychic "Aura" caught on tape

It has an interesting video, but what I find more interesting is the video on the 2nd or last page posted by a member about this healer. Watch him use his energy to give people shocks and light paper on fire. Even if you were to say it was a match that burned the paper...it would have to be covered in gasoline because it burns FAST. I think thats a great video. The guy in the video found out they published it and he got furious and refused to continue treating them, they didn't speak to him for 10 years until he contacted them... he was away for 2 years on a meditation... he said to them that times were changing, and basically the old secrets don't need to be kept secret anymore essentially. Qi-gong is awesome.

Anyways, I think those 2 videos are great, and would sure make me think twice.

I have mixed feelings on this idea.

Right now, Paranormal covers three topics: ESP/Magic, Ghosts/Spirits/Interdimensional Beings, and Consciousness, whether by design or not. There is significant crossover between the three topics. Hell, OOBE's cover all three simultaneously and that thread is stickied. The paranormal forum isn't exactly bursting with activity to require it being split up. After all, Consciousness discussion without ESP or spirituality belongs in the Science forums. The question is not if people are interested in this subject, the question is whether it will be viable and independent enough to deseve it's own forum.

reply to post by Esoterica


I think it could most definitely stand on its own.

Hypnosis, meditation, prayer, magick, higher states of consciousness, remote viewing, astral projections and OOBEs etc - there's tonnes of important content there that isn't necessarily "Paranormal" but all fits under "Consciousness"

reply to post by MrdDstrbr

How are magic, remote viewing, and astral projection not paranormal? And if these are not paranormal, wht the heck is?

reply to post by Esoterica


Well...if consciousness/spirituality threads are no longer moved to the BTS Faith-section (read: christian section) then we could settle for that forum.

One problem arises when hermetic occult science threads are moved into the lions pit

Another arises when you want to talk ontology, integral consciousness, holistic arts and transcendence in a forum about ghosts and vampires. Two different worlds there.

Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
reply to post by Esoterica

 

I think it could most definitely stand on its own.

Hypnosis, meditation, prayer, magick, higher states of consciousness, remote viewing, astral projections and OOBEs etc - there's tonnes of important content there that isn't necessarily "Paranormal" but all fits under "Consciousness"

I agree...

I get a bit tired of having to post it under paranormal. Most of my posts are meditations, OBEs etc.

As soon as you post anything about spirituality in BTS, it automatically ends up being a discussion about religion. Quite frustrating really.

Here is my vote!!



oh just wanted to add, another forum I go to have a Spiritual and Psychic Development tab and I think apart from the Rant section, it gets the most hits.

It also has a header for Religion which is great cos it seems to keep it just Spiritual Development without getting into Religious debates.





[edit on 20-1-2008 by Thurisaz]

reply to post by Skyfloating


don't forget mummies!

Yeah, I don't like how these things get moved to these ultra-christian forums. It would be ok if other religions were discussed but I don't see much if any of it. I've decided to leave all relgions alone but I don't like how these things get grouped with it. Most of us don't really consider it a religion. It's more an art-form, a science, a philosophy, there are no rules and customs. The rules are limited only to limitations we have placed upon ourselves. It's also different from religion in the way that..we don't follow a certain way and assume those are the answers, and thats that. For us it's more of a practise, we keep refining our beliefs based on accumulated insight.

And it's not paranormal if every person on earth is capable of telekinesis, power of attraction, telepathy, energy control and a whole range of other things. You aren't born like some sort of gifted freak, but let me rephrase that for a second.. We are ALL born with this knowledge, it's just a matter of finding it, finding it within ourselves... practise and insight.

This is no religion. I'd sooner settle with the title of occult science.. it would be more accurate anyway.

It is a wonderfully insightful, and purely productive experience that resonates outward and affects the world and beyond.