Iran hands over copy's of blueprints for nuke warheads

reply to post by NJ Mooch

I hope everyone understands what Iran did by handing these documents over. They tried to make themselves look like good guys since they were offering up info, but this only proved that they had plans for a nuclear weapon.

So your hypothesis is that these guys are so stupid that they actually thought this would HELP their cause? I'm sorry, but I have alot of respect for the intelligence level of the Iranian people and I find that proposition insulting. Oh, and it 'IAEA'! Like 'International Atomic Energy Agency'.

Originally posted by downtown436
You can find out how exactly to build a nuke on the wikipedia. This is pure and simple warmongering.

Well no you couldn't even get close, get a clue. Or actually learn something about the subject. That goes for all the "brains" who think you can build a nuclear weapon by googling the plans.
Building a working weapon is infinately more complex than any layman descriptions you will find on the net

Originally posted by section8citizen
reply to post by dionysius9

 

The documents have not proved anything about intention. What it says is that they have knowledge of how to enrich uranium which could be used for nuclear power OR nuclear weapons. Thats it. It proves nothing and it disproves nothing. The documents are no big secret either, this is just the first time they have physically been turned over. Previously they have shown the documents but refused copies to be taken out of the country.

Actually that is incorrect, the documents according to the article specifically showing how to mold fissile material into warhead pits.

Also according to the IAEA from teh article "Both the IAEA and other experts have categorized the instructions outlined in the blueprints as having no value outside of a nuclear weapons program. "

The argument could also be made that it took them so long to hand the documnets over because they were doctoring them because they could reveal even more damaging informtaion about their plans.

If Iran really wants nuclear weapons maybe its motives are more political?

All five of the nations with permanent seats on the United Nations Security Council have operational ICBM systems: all have submarine-launched missiles, and Russia, the United States and China also have land-based missiles.

Wikipedia

With this kind of example you would expect other countries to gravitate towards going nuclear, if it brings you closer to such a prestigious position as having a seat on the UN Security Council. Everyone knows the use of nuclear weapons is suicide for both parties. I don’t imagine the majority of Iran is suicidal. I also think if we compared apples to apples we could dig up a lot more dirt on China and Russia then Iran. They’re just not in a position to bully like Iran, and of course our common interests: What would happen if China dumped all its U.S. stocks? I would bet it would be worse then Black Tuesday.

I really have no clue on Iran's true motives. Our leaders, and many others, are still in the old school thought that military conquest brings wealth and prosperity. Those days are over. Maybe one day they will realize that building weapons and killing leads to nothing but pain and despair, nothing else.

Originally posted by HimWhoHathAnEar

So your hypothesis is that these guys are so stupid that they actually thought this would HELP their cause? I'm sorry, but I have alot of respect for the intelligence level of the Iranian people and I find that proposition insulting. Oh, and it 'IAEA'! Like 'International Atomic Energy Agency'.

What does the intelligence of the Iranian people have to do with anything ? They don't run the country.

Man that was a good read...

/sarcasm

Geeze it amazes me at the close mindedness of some people, there is absolutely no proof of anything here. Remember when 'they' said there we're WMD's in Iraq and 'they' had that little canister of powder held by a puppet to represent the (actually useless) Anthrax the Saddam had, 'they' had every front page around the world on it for weeks leading up to the attack.

It is entirely possible that 'they' want to start sewing the seeds of doubt in the peoples minds (remembering you have to start small). It is entirely possible it is based on truth, it is entirely possible that Iran is developing nuclear weapons, however I have not been to Iran, nor have I seen their nuclear weapons programme first hand so who am I to comment? SURE I could give my opinion, but to go one step further and say my opinion is FACT... now that’s a little bit of a stretch.

Some great research done by some, and some hilariously idiotic responses by others. Always keeps me coming back for more.


In my opinion the why and the how the information got out is irrelevant - it is out now - whether it is true, not true, the interpretation - is also irrelevant as it is up to the general population to determine if the article is too far from the truth to be swallowed hook line and sinker.

I think that America has a number of reasons for wanting to go to war with Iran, one of which - the economic factors of having a majorly oil rich country trading oil in something other than the US dollar. 'They' can only blame the state of the US nay the World economy on the sub prime mortgage crisis (or what ever it is up to now) for so long, fact is as long as Iran trades in the Euro direct to Russia and China, ALOT of $money$ that COULD be financing the war on terror OR the interest rates in the states OR lining the pocket of some rich bureaucrat is being lost.

But then again 'they' could actually be protecting the world and it could be as black and white as it is on TV. Who am I to say?...

Don’t you find it interesting that while the USD goes down and down and down and down the Chinese Yuan which has been sold off against the USD for a very long time grows? There have been times when the USD was weak in the past but the Yuan was always at the same level against the USD good times or bad - not the case any more and it continues to grow against a lot of other currencies also even more so those that are based on the USD like the AUD and NZD etc.

Well there i go again - sure sure it COULD be that black and white.. But like I said who am I to say?

Food for thought guys =) peace out

Blurry

EDIT: my uber spelling....

[edit on 14-11-2007 by blurryone]

The IAEA have been demanding this document for 2 years now. I wonder why the Iranians held onto it?! More to the point why did they have it in the first place. Even during the Iraq war Khomeini wrote in his memoirs that Iran needed an atomic weapon to secure the regime. Some people just will do anything to turn a blind eye to this. Carry on blaming American "propaganda" all you like, you'll fooling yourselves.

reply to post by mad scientist


Absolutely, the Iranian people are miles apart from the harline rulers. Have you seen how they rule with an iron hand? Iran has one of the largest suicide rates in the world and THE highest drug users, particularly with the youth who are so oppressed and controlled that they turn to drug addiction. Imagine living in a country where you are told what to watch, what to wear, who to socialise with, what to believe in...

you do not `need` `pits for making a kiltoton class weapon - ask South Africa , they had 5 devices - all gun type and non with shaped or molded uranium pits.


they are used for implosion devices - and other than teh chinese who uses uranium in there fusion weapons , everyone else uses plutonium.

Is it possible that this released information is bait to provoke a US\Israel attack, and that Iran has a defense strategy they are confident in?

patrickbateman
Absolutely, the Iranian people are miles apart from the harline rulers. Have you seen how they rule with an iron hand? Iran has one of the largest suicide rates in the world and THE highest drug users, particularly with the youth who are so oppressed and controlled that they turn to drug addiction. Imagine living in a country where you are told what to watch, what to wear, who to socialise with, what to believe in...

This just sounds like more Anti Iranian propaganda. I don't know how you can single out a single country for suicides and drug problems. Just about every country on Earth has serious drug related problems as well as high suicide rates. The way you talk you would think that every Iranian has a republican guard behind them 24/7 pointing a gun at their heads dictating what they can and can't do. This couldn't be further from the truth.

World suicide rates.
www.who.int...
nitawriter.wordpress.com...
www.asianews.it...

Drug Usage
www.infoplease.com...
www.magicalplaces.eu...

VIENNA: The CIA, using a double-agent Russian scientist, may have handed a blueprint for a nuclear bomb to Iran.

www.freerepublic.com...

American's living in Iran
www.washingtonpost.com...
www.iranian.com...


pc540.blogspot.com...

This book is insane. I didn't think I would find a book worse than "Reading Lolita in Tehran" by Azar Nafisi, but boy was I wrong. These books are complete misrepresentations of the Iran that I know and love. I am an Iranian-American who was born in the USA and has had the privilage of living in BOTH Iran and America. True, Iran is not an ideal or perfect country, but the amount to which these books demonize Iran is just WRONG. As a matter of fact, I am taking a semester off school to go live/work in Iran and I will be starting a blog & hopefully publishing a book about my experiences. The only way you can know how Iran really is, is to travel there. So instead of sitting in your cozy Western homes, go see the damn place.

[edit on 14-11-2007 by kindred]

This means absolutely nothing for the following reasons:

1) We gave them these plans.
2) Copy machines exist.
3) You could probably get the instruction for a working nuke off the internet.

www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...

Bill Clinton did it.

Wiped off the ... huh?

reply to post by kindred



Ok now your trying to take my argument to the extreme to debunk it. If that makes you comfortable. all i'll say is that have witnessed it.

[edit on 14-11-2007 by patrickbateman]

dbl post

plz delete

I saw this article yesterday and decided not to submit it as news, because quite frankly it's not news. It was reported over 2 years ago that Iran had these documents and the reason they're giving them up now is that the IAEA demanded them as part of the inspection process. If they didn't comply, THEN we'd have something to complain about. I'm not one who denies Iran is trying to build a nuclear weapon, but this is no smoking gun.

Only stumason and NJMooch seem to have done any research on this story.

Lets look at this objectively

The following countries possess nuclear weapons.

USA
Russia
China
France
UK
India
Pakistan
North Korea
Israel.

Now I'd wager the following countries know how to make nuclear weapons and have the manufacturing facilities/technological base to do so, should they choose.

Argentina (had a weapons programme)
Brazil (had a weapons programme)
South Africa (built weapons - only country to unilaterally disarm its nuclear stockpile)
Japan
Germany
Denmark
Belgium
Israel
Sweden
Libya (had a weapons programme)
Iraq (actually, probably not any more)
Iran
Italy
Saudi Arabia
Ukraine
Australia
Canada
Malaysia
Thailand
Spain
Taiwan (possibly a very well kept secret)

So...why aren't we all supposed to be up in arms about anyone but Iran?

reply to post by neformore


Not quite...Australia does not at this point, have the technology or desire to either enrich nuclear material to weapons grade, or indeed build said weapons....

There is only one nuclear reactor in Australia, at Lucas Heights near Sydney...Said reactor is largely used to make medical isotopes and for experimental purposes...

However, the Government earlier in 2007 did mention the possibility of Australia starting its own enrichment industry for fuel, given we hold enough of the raw stuff..

Given the change of government here soon, this is not likely to happen for a very long time

Nice post tho, BTW A good list mostly of countries who could, should, would...etc...

As an aside, I could care less if the Iranians have nukes...There is only one nation who should fear same, and we know who that is...

The question is, why do some americans get their undies in a knot whenever Israel is threatened ? I honestly don't get it...

They've been leaching billions of dollars a year off your country since its inception for nothing in return...

Why would the US honestly care if Israel got itself burned to a cinder by its neighbors as a direct consequence of its greedy, land grabbing hypocritical actions in the region since its inception ?

I say let the Iranians have nuclear weapons unless a certain other nation in that region is prepared to give its nuclear weapons up..

Me, from almost 10,000 miles away, I could not care if the nations in that regions destroy each other....Means nothing to me at all..

Give Iran the green light to develop nukes !!!

Originally posted by Sky watcher
We give out more aid than any country on the planet and we are spit on.

Yeah, this is one of my biggest beefs.

So many contries will come running to us with their hands out begging for food and medicine etc. But then nwver think twice about stabbing us in the back.

I think America needs to stop trying to run the world.

But they also need to be a little more discriminating when they hand out aid to anyone who come running with their hands streached out.

I'm sick of all this petty schoolboy arguments about whether Iran is allowed a nuclear weapon or not.

Either BAN ALL NUKES, or allow other countries to have them. I cannot face another country like Iraq losing over 1 MILLION civilians over a phony threat of some phony weapons to boost some phony presidents bank account or satanic agenda.

I challenge all those spending their free time looking for evidence that Iran has nukes, to make an Iranian friend instead.

reply to post by adjay


Do you mean like this
Adjay ?

Absolutely....A lil understanding of each others situation and culture might just go a huge way...nice post