We must bomb Iran, says US Republican guru

When I take time to think about the phrase WWIII, it brings nothing but fear and anxiety. By this I mean it is unfortunate that OUR government finds lives of American citizens and others to be justifiable loses when it comes to times of war and other issues. Having our government ready and willing to jump right into WWIII is no surprise to me at all, as it is the same gov't that MURDERED thousands of hard working American citizens, and 343 heroes on the day of September 11th 2001. WWIII is imminent, easily being within the next 10 years. I don't really know what else to add but that its obvious the government is working by itself and for itself, along with other private organizations towards a certain not yet known goal, with deception being one of their strongest weapons. I truly do, and think everyone else should fear for whats to come of our earth in the not so distant future.

Of course the people we have in power want to do this. There's two reasons.

First, a Democratic sweep is inevitable in 2008. Like it or not folks, they're going to get a firm majority in the legislature and the white house. So the current administration wants to make sure the manure heap is as deep as possible in order to bog down the Dems and hopefully play that to regain power in the next cycle. For example, check how the Somali conflict remains laid at Clinton's feet, though it was Bush Sr. who sent troops in right after the election.

This is of course, frightfully short-sighted, as it tends to be. But there's a reason for that.

The people making these plans are not the people who's lives will be at stake, one way or another. Saddam was the first head of state to die in a war since Hitler, and was the first to die by the hand of enemy forces since the 19th century. These people just tend to not be in a lot of danger. In this war, the Bush family is 100% safe. The Ayatollah and his folks are 100% safe. The only people doing the dying are the poor and middle class of each nation involved - moreso the Iranians, since it's happening on their doorsteps. Given that.. .why should the elite give a damn?

damn, dropping bombs is what the U.S does best. we should really keep an eye on Iran. hope we dont go to war with them. the media makes Iran sound so unstable, like they got nukes pointed at us right now. when is it too late to take action on Iran?

I wouldn't worry too much about the media editorials. Their job is to
create hype and fear. Which ever outlet does it the best gets the
most viewers/visitors and can command the highest dollar from
advertisers.

Just pay attention to what the administration is asking for in the way
of hardware, troops, etc. Those items give the best indication of what
is in the works. A pre-emptive NON-NUCLEAR strike against Iran's
nuclear facilities is likely to happen before Bush leaves office. Israel
hit Syria's nuclear production facility in it's early stage of construction
last month. Iran will get the same treatment once hard evidence is
in hand to justify the strike(s). -cwm

sucks that we can have nukes but tell other countries their not allowed. thats got to be the biggest double standard. i know they say Iran supports terrorism but do we really have proof of this notion? another war would be so costly. pretty sure we dont have all the resources to go for another war let alone finish up in Iraq. Bush is pushing for more money support in the middle east. does anyone think they might be asking for more cheddar bcuz Bush has secret plans to take care of Irans nuclear production? the U.S has air superiority but we definately dont have the man power for ground support. we cant afford another war.

reply to post by S.O.Blilbobby


That's exactly the way I feel. It's ridiculous to say that any nation that employs the practice of refining nuclear materials for WMD production must cease and desist or else face invasion/attack is ridiculous when you consider that both the United States AND Israel have nuclear weapons and continue to make more.

For my money, give me Israel as the bigger threat over Iran any day of the week. The Israeli government have shown that they are not above mass genocide.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox

First, a Democratic sweep is inevitable in 2008. Like it or not folks, they're going to get a firm majority in the legislature and the white house. So the current administration wants to make sure the manure heap is as deep as possible in order to bog down the Dems and hopefully play that to regain power in the next cycle. For example, check how the Somali conflict remains laid at Clinton's feet, though it was Bush Sr. who sent troops in right after the election.

If there is a next cycle I can't imagine what might happen 4-8 years down the road if Bush attacks Iran before leaving office.

reply to post by Techsnow


Very true. But, as I and others have said, one is a fool to truly believe that there is any difference between the Republicans and the Democrats. Ultimately, they are two different teams sponsored by the same company. No matter who wins THIS game, the sponsors win every time.


Jasn

Originally posted by SimiusDei
Why are we so eager to provoke Iran (and in turn Russia) to attack? Could it possibly be because war is good business for our government?

Probably because Israel is paranoid of any middle eastern country getting hold of nuclear weapons. They DID take it upon themselves to bomb Syria or whatever country it was recently anyway with those fly-overs because of their possibly having nuclear facilities. Israel can't really do that with Iran because all hell would break loose, so we have to again manipulate things to get what Israel wants.

Originally posted by SimiusDei
reply to post by Vipassana

 

Not for the United States. I agree with that whole heartedly.

If Israel wants to attack Iran, I say let them and let them do it ON THEIR OWN.

They have the the military strength and no one seems to be all worked up about them having nukes, let them use them. We just need to stay out of it.

Jasn

You must be a hell of a friend to have in a fight. But hey, you're right. Why should we care about helping the Israelis take out a mututal enemy, one that is dedicated to supporting terrorists and murderers?

Coward.

Iran is a committed state-sponsor of terrorism. They helped to establish Hezbollah in the 1980s, and have provided them material support ever since. What's more, they are providing advanced weaponry to terrorist/insurgent groups in Iraq, so if you don't think we are already fighting a proxy war with Iran, you haven't read the news lately.

The real concern, as I stated above, is that if Iran develops nuclear technology, and thus nuclear weaponry, they will provide it to Islamic terrorist organizations to carry out attacks against "unfriendly" states. At this point, that would probably include most of Western Europe, and the US. The Cold War remained so chilly thanks to the concept of MAD and second strike capabilities. If an NGO, such as Al Qaeda, were to set off a nuke in a foreign power, who should be attacked in response? Iran? Syria? Who knows where it might have come from. It would destabilize the world, nevermind just the Mid East region.

Its incredibly UNLIKELY that if Iran were to develop nukes, they would launch an attack from their nation. One missile comes out of Iran, 30 missiles would come flying back at them.

Originally posted by SimiusDei

For my money, give me Israel as the bigger threat over Iran any day of the week. The Israeli government have shown that they are not above mass genocide.

Which mass genocide are you referring to? Just curious, as I must've missed the news that day. Perhaps the Palestinian issue? Truly, the Israelis never had a reason to attack these peace-loving pacifists. Israel has also never been threatened by her "peaceful" neighbors, or had state-sponsored terrorist groups kill countless numbers of innocent civilians, right?

Israel has given up land, a resource beyond measure in this tiny nation, to try to broker peace, and received nothing but rocket attacks in return. What's more, Israel is one of the fiercest friends to the United States, thanks to the strong connections between the two people. The Mossad and Shin Bet have done alot of help the US develop intelligence in the region as well, but they're still a threat to us right?

Quite honestly, the Israelis have shown restraint beyond measure in their reactions.

Originally posted by BloodthirstyCapitalist

Israel has given up land, a resource beyond measure in this tiny nation, to try to broker peace, and received nothing but rocket attacks in return. What's more, Israel is one of the fiercest friends to the United States, thanks to the strong connections between the two people. The Mossad and Shin Bet have done alot of help the US develop intelligence in the region as well, but they're still a threat to us right?

Quite honestly, the Israelis have shown restraint beyond measure in their reactions.

which land have they given up? The land which on any map printed prior to 1948 quite clearly says "Palestine". Hmm so they are giving up land they stole in the first place......how big of them!

For those who are saying Iran is far behind in the Nuclear business. Check this out..

1. Russia Backs Up Iran - youtube.com...

2. Big Russian Nuclear Bomb - youtube.com...

3. Iranian Nuclear Facilities - youtube.com...

4. Who's The Fool? - youtube.com...

5. Dr. Bill Wattenburg Nuclear Attack On American Soil - www.youtube.com...

WWIII, it's already here its just a matter of when it takes off.

[edit on 29-10-2007 by J R O]

reply to post by S.O.Blilbobby

Originally posted by SimiusDei
reply to post by S.O.Blilbobby

 

That's exactly the way I feel. It's ridiculous to say that any nation that employs the practice of refining nuclear materials for WMD production must cease and desist or else face invasion/attack is ridiculous when you consider that both the United States AND Israel have nuclear weapons and continue to make more.

For my money, give me Israel as the bigger threat over Iran any day of the week. The Israeli government have shown that they are not above mass genocide.

You guys seem to think that this attitude is held by the US and Israel only. That is far from the truth. Some major nations (Germany, France, and Spain, for example) are even more opposed to Iran having nukes than we are. See this link for verification:

pewglobal.org...

This is not a simple case of employing a double standard - it is far more complex than that. No sane person wants to witness a nuclear firestorm. Unfortunately, that does not include terrorist organizations, who would detonate a suitcase nuke with no second thought.

And SimiusDei, you say that "The Israeli government have shown that they are not above mass genocide." That is an outrageous statement, imo. I call for you to back it up with facts.

So interesting that the Republicans are making these statements. I cant imagine that any party wants to start a world war. Though I don't believe that Iran will be backing down anytime soon and it may come to that. The Republican party should be a bit more careful when they say things like this to the media.

This is why I hate republicans, they are bunch war hungry greedy bastards.

Originally posted by BloodthirstyCapitalist

You must be a hell of a friend to have in a fight. But hey, you're right. Why should we care about helping the Israelis take out a mututal enemy,

what do you mean helping? we are going to do it for them. And what do you mean mutual enemy? iran has never threatened the US in any way except in response to threats. ironically the US was more friendly with iran when it was headed by an autocratic dictator than now with an elected leader. The hypocrisy continues.

one that is dedicated to supporting terrorists and murderers?

ohh you mean just like the terrorists the US supports..??
Like Mujahedeen-e-Khalq ?? who sits at number 27 on the state departments own list of foreign terrorist organizations and has been since 1997 www.state.gov...

heres a nice article to read.
www.cnn.com...
ohh and thats not all, dont forget these guys, Jundullah which have links to al-qaeda (i couldnt make this stuff up if i wanted to)
en.wikipedia.org...-2

and here we are supporting them, blogs.abcnews.com...
we condem terrorism but impose the double standard when they are terrorizing our enemies. maybe they spelled it wrong maybe its the "war OF terrorism"

Iran is a committed state-sponsor of terrorism. They helped to establish Hezbollah in the 1980s, and have provided them material support ever since.

kinda like the US did with the taliban? or the mujahedeen?
whats even worse is that since the taliban was formed iran has been a big ENEMY of the taliban. since the taliban is a sunni extremist group and iran is predominantly shi'ite. Irans ambassador said

""Iran has suffered greatly from Taliban's terrorism and in addition to the diplomats and the IRNA reporter they martyred in 1998 in Mazar Sharif, today, too, terrorist groups affiliated to Taliban penetrate every now and then through Iran's porous eastern borders and martyr our civilians and disciplinary forces, kidnapping some foreign tourists, as well."

www.kavkazcenter.com...
if the us was smart iran could have been a powerful ALLY in the war against the taliban.

What's more, they are providing advanced weaponry to terrorist/insurgent groups in Iraq, so if you don't think we are already fighting a proxy war with Iran, you haven't read the news lately.

and if you dont think we are fighting a proxy war for israel you havent been reading the news either.

The real concern, as I stated above, is that if Iran develops nuclear technology, and thus nuclear weaponry, they will provide it to Islamic terrorist organizations to carry out attacks against "unfriendly" states. At this point, that would probably include most of Western Europe, and the US. The Cold War remained so chilly thanks to the concept of MAD and second strike capabilities. If an NGO, such as Al Qaeda, were to set off a nuke in a foreign power, who should be attacked in response? Iran? Syria? Who knows where it might have come from. It would destabilize the world, nevermind just the Mid East region.

Its incredibly UNLIKELY that if Iran were to develop nukes, they would launch an attack from their nation. One missile comes out of Iran, 30 missiles would come flying back at them.

i really dont think iran is dumb enough to hand off a nuclear weapon to a terrorist group, from what i understand about nuclear material, it has a "signature" and that signature could be traced back to the source and iran would be bombed anyways. (whether the attack came from irans dirt or a terrorist group supplied by iran.) so either way iran loses, so why would they even try?

the truth is the whole iran thing is protection for israel and a hedge against russia, its like the cold war all over again. The control (either directly or by having US friendly regimes) in that region is a very important goal coming into the 21st century in a economic battle against russia and china, the country with the most control over energy will prevail in this larger game of chess, thats why china and russia have been trying to block sanctions, because they have huge energy deals with iran.

reply to post by turbokid


Iran has never threatened the United States in anyway? Wasn't it Iran who started the whole game off in the first place. Attacking by force United States territory (US Embassy) at the time of the revolution and holding hostages!!?

Also, the regime in Iran's main goal is to spread the revolution globally, this is repeated time and time again by the regime there. Wouldn't a nuclear detterant help their cause?

Originally posted by patrickbateman
reply to post by turbokid

 

Iran has never threatened the United States in anyway? Wasn't it Iran who started the whole game off in the first place. Attacking by force United States territory (US Embassy) at the time of the revolution and holding hostages!!?

No, BEFORE that in 1953 the US helped start a riot and stage a coup to oust a democratically elected leader and install the shah of iran (a dictator) read that again we overthrew an elected leader and installed a dictator..
the terrible leadership led to the 1979 revolution you speak of.

heres a great link to read.
en.wikipedia.org...

Also, the regime in Iran's main goal is to spread the revolution globally, this is repeated time and time again by the regime there. Wouldn't a nuclear detterant help their cause?

then why havent they made a single inch of progress since 1979? the revolution began and ended within irans borders, to rid itself from a puppet leader who didnt belong there. Just like what will happen in iraq and afghanistan in the future)
also if they do seek a nuclear deterrant, its because of years of threats and past actions by british and american governemnts in the name of oil profits. but like i said before even if iran builds a weapon and uses it they are done, and if they hand it off to a terrorist organization iran is done. do you really think they are that stupid? given past lies from the US government and the propaganda puked all over the tv, i trust what the US says very little when i comes to iran. And i cant believe what the US and Britan have gotten away with in the past. its like modern day imperialism.
(imperialism worked out great for the roman empire)

reply to post by turbokid



I agree 100% the worst thing the US did was remove the democracy of Mossadeq. Granted a complete disaster! Although not a fully fledged democracy under the Shah and far from perfect, social freedoms did exist and Iranians had better lives for it. But when you compare it with the current theocratic regime it really did serve its people better.

As for progress in spreading the revolution then the signs are visible already...Hezbollah are now a major force in Lebannon and have capitalised on the propaganda war spurned by the capture of Israeli soldiers. Also Iran's influence in Syria and Iraq are quite substantial. Try following commentary on the Revolutionary Guards and Friday prayers and you will see through their own admission that their primary objective is to spread the revolution, those were even the words of Khomeini. A nuclear arsenal is the ultimate weapon in securing the future of this very domestically unpopular regime. They have quashed internal dissent through extreme methods and the only opposition they face is the likes of the US.

Also, if you don't believe what the US has to say about Iran thats fine, then ask their own ex-patriots..



[edit on 31-10-2007 by patrickbateman]