Aliens Are Real-Naturally! So Why The Fuss And Skepticism About UFO’s?

Hi five, Andre. Let's kill these skeptics' narrow-minded arguments! They are allowed their own opinion, but to force it upon other people and proclaim they can't be credible just because they don't have a degree in something... this is why we can't get anything done here... because too many skeptics scare people with their "educations", and people are afraid to stand up to science. A long time ago, we would've been beheaded by the skeptics. A kind and gentle breed, they are most certainly not.

Like I've been saying, religion is mass mind control, and modern science is the new religion.

There is probably infinite amount of universes too, like grains of sand on the beach. Remember all these galaxies and universes are made up in the 3rd dimension the physical realm. That's not including the possibility of other dimensions as well and so on.

reply to post by mikesingh


amazing !

you managed to write all that without crediting frank drake

drakes equation

further as you are claiming to be using logic , exactly how did you go from the acceptance that alien life almost certainly exists , to the catagoric claim that UFOs are intelligent EBE visitors

non sequitur

Originally posted by indierockalien.
We all know science is flawed. We all know our definitions of proof are flawed. To say that either one of those statements is false is to state that we know absolutely everything about the universe, and in whch case we would be God.

What makes you think that you aren't God? Science may be flawed, but that's perfectly the way it is; an annex of culminated knowledge. Proof of anything is in the imagination.

I'm not precise on where your previous statements were being directed, but for the record; yes, I do believe in extra-terrestrials. I believe in extra-terrestrials as much as I believe in the air that I breath. Philosophically I am an extra-terrestrial.

[edit on 28-10-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

reply to post by mikesingh


Hello mike, and great post. And thanks to all others who have posted your thoughts on this.

I really love the HST picture. "Galaxies in a small slice of the universe."

All I am going to say here is anything is possible. Don't ever let yourself believe otherwise.


As for the "Technological Revolution" of the last hundred years or so:

Has it really been much of a "Revolution"? or is it just that people have had more time on their hands to think of such things?

In the last 30 years or so that computers have been around, they have helped us out a lot, but are we not still trying to make a computer that has the same computing power that the human brain has? Last I heard, that hasn't been done yet.

I guess my point is that all of the technological advancements we've seen in that time came from only a small amount of people. Just think of what could be accomplished if everyone was thinking of ways to make things better. How much more advanced would we be if that were the case?

Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts
Internos, was your post trying to propel us to conclude is that there is no way possible stupid humans could have made the leap to the microchip without possible advanced alien intervention? Wrong, it's development is far from magic, and can be followed if you care to. Just because someone doesn't understand the technology, that does not mean that others do not. On the contrary, I know someone who can down a cupful of sand and crap a Pentium chip.

If that is not the intention of your post, can you clarify it for me...I am not grasping what you are trying to say.

IgnoreTheFacts, what about chill out and read what the other people writes?
WHY DON'T YOU STOP TO PUT IN OTHER'S MOUTH CLAIMS THAT THEY never did? Is it possible that despite other people understand what i write YOU ARE THE ONLY who finds some hidden messages? Are you looking for a CIVIL debate or for a WAR.? A war needs to be declared: declare it and let's fight. But refrain from make appears the people as isn't. You are NOT the only clever person here, just have respect for the other contributors. Pheraps your leak of knowledge in technology makes you appear as an IGNORANT and this is not easy to accept. But that's not my fault.
I made a question to ArMaP who, instead of you, was able to partially answer. You are the last person able to. Since you don't know what happened between the first transistor and the last microchip, you aren't able to contribute to this debate. I made a question to which ArMaP answered in a civil manner, and that you used to create a battle, a personal one. Anyway, i consider you a good contruibutor in ATS, one of the best, and i star your post almost always and ill keep staring them since you deserve it and i consider you PRECIOUS: do you consider precious someone else or do you think to be the ONE worthly of consideration?



[edit on 28/10/2007 by internos]

reply to post by indierockalien


I listen to people who say that they have seen aliens, I try to listen to all people, even people that say that they are being followed and that the noises they hear is because they have their nose connected to the modem (I knew some who said that) or that they are being followed on the train by the cows from the cow parade (there is a person that said it to my sister).

But what people say may or may not be real. People may have a interpretation of what they have seen or felt that is not strictly the reality of what happened, or people may even say things that only appeared to happen but that in reality never did.

Our perception of what surrounds us does not always follows reality, that is why 10 people that witness something may have 10 different ways of interpreting what happened, or they may interpret it the right way but they could only see it from their point of view (both physically and mentally) and could not understand the whole reality of it.

Also, we have to think of those people that say things that they know that are not real, they just like to say it for some reason, but the fact that they are also talking does not make it the truth.

And yes, I know that science is flawed, and the reason science is flawed is because it is made by common people, people with their own flaws, like all of us. So, why should I believe in one person that might have even more flaws than others instead of believing other flawed people? Why should I believe thousands of people instead of a different group of thousands of people?

In conclusion, I try to listen to all people to have the biggest amount of information, but that does not mean that I believe what people tell just because they said it, if that was the case I would have to believe and disbelieve in many things at the same time. So, to consider that something is real, I have to make use of my own flawed senses and, when that is not possible, what other people say, but in that case I can only consider it real if what all the people say about it is consistent in itself and makes sense with what other people (that apparently are saying the same thing) say about it.

Originally posted by _Phoenix_
The odds are, aliens are most likely real, you are right!
Thus if a alien race was more advance than us, and could travel many light years in minutes etc, they would have millions of planets to explore, 1 planet could take hundreds of years to explore and understand.

This therefore would make it less possible that an alien race would choose our planet, because they are so busy elsewhere.

Yes! Millions of planets to explore! So why Earth? Well, why not? WE may be one of those millions! And remember, as I mentioned in the opening post, there are more advanced civilizations in this universe than all the grains of sand on Earth. So what are the odds that a few have visited/visiting us? You tell me!

Originally posted by GeeGee
You know, I bet they're having the same exact argument on another primitive planet right now.

Right! And probably on 'ATS' too!! Hey! Do they serve beer there?

Cheers!

[edit on 28-10-2007 by mikesingh]

Why is it that billions of people believe in something they have never seen and have no proof of.(GOD) While millions of people have seen UFO's and have even been 'taken up' into the space-ships yet they are considered to be on the fringe?
I believe it's almost harvest time.
Imagine: Your growing a field of corn and its just about ready to be harvested yet in the distance you see a hail storm coming. Your corn won't be officailly ready until a few more days but the storm approaching in a few hours will completely destroy your corn crop. You would hurry to pick as much corn a possible in order to save what you can of the crop you worked so hard and waited so patiently for. Same thing here. In my opinion anyway.

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
amazing !
you managed to write all that without crediting frank drake

Frank who? I've heard of him in school, almost half a century ago! The world has changed dude.

The Drake equation? i_a, you’re a little out of sync. Because it’s obsolete, as it refers only to our galaxy. The new kid on the block is Dr Aczel, whose calculations include the universe as a whole. So there's no credit to Frankie here!

The Drake equation is obsolete in comparison with Dr. Amir D. Aczel's calculations.
The Drake equation states that: N = R* x fp x ne x fl x fi x fc x L
where:
N is the total number of civilizations in our Milky Way Galaxy with which we might expect to be able to communicate at any given time,
and:
R* is the rate of star formation in our galaxy (1 - 10/y)
fp is the fraction of those stars that have planets (0.1 - 0.5)
ne is average number of planets that can potentially support life per star that has planets (1 - 3)
fl is the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop life (0.1 - 1)
fi is the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop intelligent life (0.01 - 1)
fc is the fraction of the above that are willing and able to communicate (0.1 - 1)
L is the expected lifetime of such a civilization (103 - 106)

According to Drake's estimated calculations N = 10,000.
In other words there are 10,000 communicative civilizations in the Milky Way Galaxy.

“Probability 1” goes far beyond what was explored with the Drake equation. Drake's equation refers only to our galaxy, whereas Dr. Amir Aczel's calculations refer to the universe as a whole.

P (life on at least one planet outside the earth) = 1 - (0.99999999999995) ^30,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 = a number indistinguishable from 1.
1 = 100% probability that advanced extraterrestrial civilizations exist elsewhere.
groups.yahoo.com...

So the next time you wanna throw the usual caustic comments around, do take the time to brush up your outdated knowledge, a little of which is a dangerous thing!!

Cheers!


[edit on 28-10-2007 by mikesingh]

reply to post by mikesingh


only a backpeddling twit would argue that drakes equation does not scale to the universe as a whole - there is nothing new in aczels work

and now you bring him up - why no credit to him ?

a casual reader wou;d think you thought it up yourself - rather dishonest - but hey thats you

PS - brilliant selective quoting - your evasion of the observation that your " logical " apporoach falls apart had to go unanswered , didnt it

reply to post by mikesingh


It still just a probability,not a reality. There is nothing you can say to change that fact.

1 - (0.99999999999995) ^30,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 is STILL not 1 I dont care how indistinguishable someone wants to claim it is. An alien in front of all of humanity turns that ridiculously high number of PROBABILITY above into a 1, a REALITY, period.

You can stuff a sentence with all of the ifs, woulds, shoulds, coulds, maybe's and might be's but they will never change this fact. Besides, Aczel and Drake are both quantifying life OUT there, not alien life here and whether or not it has anything to do with UFOs. Big difference. Now continue using the woulds coulds shoulds maybes and ifs until you are blue in the face, if it helps you believe.....

[edit on 28-10-2007 by Lost_Mind]

Originally posted by Lost_Mind
It still just a probability,not a reality. There is nothing you can say to change that fact.

Agreed! So then God is just a probability, not a reality. But you still pray to that wise old man! Why? Where's the evidence? But 95% of humanity believes and prays to HIM. Belief? Blind faith? Praying to a concept which is probably beyond human understanding?

But why is it easier to believe in HIS existence than the probability of advanced alien civilizations in this enormous universe?

Cheers!

reply to post by ArMaP



Hey man, I respect some skeptics with an open mind... but I was aiming that more towards someone who just jumps up and shouts "GIVE ME EVIDENCE, OR I DON'T BELIEVE YOU!!!!". That type of skeptic, and there are quite a bumload of those guys on here, and to be honest, if you haven't experienced it for yourself, you have the right to be hesitant about believing it... but let's not degenerate this into a "No evidence, so don't waste our times" mudslinging session, because I think testimony from people who at least prove that they can hold a rational conversation saying they've been there done that, should be more widely utilized as witness testimony, and less as a scratching post for skeptics.

That's all I'm saying.

I didn't mean offense, and I should've been clearer with my statement. Sowwy.

reply to post by mikesingh


Well, see, I dont believe in god or anything else for that matter. I am, for the most part, a humanist. And I think that statistically speaking there is even less of a probability "he" exists. There is at least a physical platform from which to begin with regarding alien life - you cant base statistical probabilities on a belief system. I dont pray to a mythical essence of divinty for answers in my life - I am in control of that, only me. I am the only one responsible for my actions both right and wrong.

That is the one of the fallacies of a belief system, they prove nothing. They sure do make a lot of people feel good though, eh? And that is fine by me, whatever shakes that rattle for ya.



[edit on 28-10-2007 by Lost_Mind]

reply to post by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal


Never said I wasn't God... heheheh... just kidding, but yeah I know what you mean. I meant lke, we aren't in that state of pure knowledge and understanding yet, not even close...according to Michio Kaku (spelled right?), we aren't even a type 1 civilization yet. So what do we really even know? I think most science observes the physical effects of other as-yet-unmeasurable causes, which they themselves could be as yet unknown effects of even more bizzare as-yet-unknown causes, and maybe that streches into infinity... and eventually our modern science will be pretty much obsolete... So I have a hard time taking science seriously when I know that the evolution of science has only just begun, really.



[edit on 28-10-2007 by indierockalien]

I think my presence here isn't helping. I'll let you go about arguing drake's equation. I'm gunna go with what I know on this one, duuuuuuudes.

IgnoreTheFacts, thank you for your U2u.
Well: i think i won't loose points if NOW i apologize for what i wrote against you. I've been wrong, and my bad english doesn't help me in order to make my points. I think you are one of the BEST contributors here on ATS and your post in a thread started by me are AN HONOUR. Remember, IgnoreTheFacts: i follow your statemnts post by post, and i consider you one of the most clever PERSONS here on ats. Maybe i loss the control in the moment i felt to be attacked by you.This is a my fault and i'm ready to pay for it: EVEN to be BANNED, if this measure is required. My question was the one of a person who works for 35+ years on microchips and related hardware. My question was: can we rebuild step by step what really happened between the first transistor and the last microchip? My question was an humble one, i make my statements ALWAYS by the ignorant point of view. Since now i've been wrong, i ask to the mods to be warned for what i wrote against you.



[edit on 28/10/2007 by internos]

[edit on 28/10/2007 by internos]

Kaku and his type I , II , III civilization classifications - it shouldnt need pointing out , but ................

they are only a concept , there is no evidence that any exist

sure an alien civilization [ if it exists ] might conform to his criteria - but its equally likley that it will not

so please do not use the label as evidence

God created people not Aliens.

Do you have DNA or any protoplasm evidence.

Well perhaps some people have said so but peer review has never
been established or Aliens interviewed on FOX NEWS.

UFOs are just Tesla blitz craft.