a very real conspiracy

This is how to go about creating civil war (warning, foul language)
www.lukecole.com...

And this little juicy bit of propaganda, backed by "studies" (you gotta wonder, who is doing the studies and what their affiliations are)
en.wikipedia.org...

It isn't that these ideas are either wrong or semi-wrong or even right. It's that it's being used like a sledge hammer to ostracize and demonize only one sector of the population--christians (who, btw, live in blue states too).

Now let's stop and think about this for a moment. What happens if a very bad bomb does go off in one or more major US cities? Since we will not be able to agree on who actually did it, the theory will be put forth that the repubs and their white christian lackeys did it to get rid of the undesirable democrats and young patriots in the major cities. civil war will be afoot.

Anyone that can't afford to airlift their white christian family to safety, will be the cannon fodder of the "young patriots" spoken of by Naomi (who are really just fresh new faces on the democratic scene, who haven't the faintest idea that they are being manipulated). This in turn will give the gov an excuse to pull out all the jams and THEN the nation will self destruct.

but first, it requires people like Naomi to drum up support. can't have a revolution without an enemy. and you must know by now, they're being brainwashed to believe the enemy is anyone who doesn't agree with them on every single ideological or moral point.

that my friends, is also tyranny.



[edit on 18-10-2007 by undo]

AWESOME VIDEO FINALY WE CAN AGREE ON WHAT TO DO LETS ALL VOTE RON PAUL

Originally posted by captainplanet
reply to post by undo

 

I think you're saying you agree with the politics, and that you think Christians will be the next target. I’m not going to call that wrong. But if we stick to the constitution, that’s not legal. Religion has no place in politics. That’s what this is about, fixing it.

Anything that mixes religion with politics is wrong, it‘s propaganda, vote it away. If you think your particular religion makes you special, please step off the political stage and read my other thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Perception is a powerful thing, and you hear the word Christian a lot. That’s what she’s talking about, don’t let it happen to you. Stop thinking Democrat and Republican, nothing is black and white. Start thinking Freedom. It’s all their to distract you from it, it‘s a step.

It's too late. Look around ATS. The battle cry is: The christians are at fault. They hate islamics, the environment, freedom, they want to run your life for you (even if most of them have no time to run their own lives, much less yours). They hate jews. They don't like sex, drugs and rock'n'roll. They aren't progressive. They have lower IQs. They are halting the progress of evolution. I mean, afterall, wasn't the Pope a friend of Hitler and Musolini? (the pope represents all christians everywhere, according to the stereotype, which I might add is a very convenient tool that's been used to the point of obscenity over the last 200 years. the popes do whatever the freak they want and then all christians everywhere are blamed for it. they suffer the consequences, while the vatican just goes on and on. probably the biggest single enemy of christendom are the guys at the top, who make the rest of us into walking targets on a daily basis, the end goal of which is to provide the impetus for our self destruction of our own free will, out of our misplaced sense of moral and social outrage, while playing on our vanity, pride and prejudices. It's all so transparent once you realize it for what it is).

This happened to Iraq and the muslims. What makes you think they will stop with islam? Christians will be next. Who blamed the christians for setting fire to Rome and what happened next? You can see it on the news, in the papers, in the universities. Can't you read between the lines?

(Addendum: It isn't that what she's saying about the 10 steps is incorrect. The incorrect part is where she tries to claim the voice of the masses, is the solution. You familar with mob mentality? The We the People concept is not We the mob. We the mob can be swayed all over the place by a few well-placed offers for monetary advantage or assistance. Don't tell me they no longer teach what the actual structure of our government is supposed to be? )

Superb video. She was articulate and well researched, and I believe her drive because of her old friend.

Flagged for bravery! Stand up America!

I have been familiar with Wolf's thesis for about a month now and I completely agree with it. I had not seen the video so thanks to the OP for posting. However, I think that this thread is seriously getting off topic by injecting religion into the discussion at all. This thread really proves Wolf's point that they factionalize us in order to have a culprit to blame and distract us.

Agreement or concensus will not be achieved when it comes to religion (or its purposes) and society will literally self-destruct by fighting amongst ourselves. This is exactly what the "Powers That Be" want - for us to be so busy squabbling amongst ourselves that we don't see the dog that will bite us on the a$$.

The focus, I think, needs to be on identifying and recognizing the method by which they control us. Fear. The tool they use is data and information.

Just look at the last 24 hour news cycle: MRSA (gasp! - the superbug), pedophiles, "Planet in Peril", oil prices, and the economy. All little tidbits of information that act collectively to shock our psyches and make us fearful and dependent on the government to protect us. We gladly turn over our liberties and freedoms in order to ensure a little safety and security. It's a farse.

So rather than fight about which faction of our victimized citizenry is scaring us the most, bothering us the most or offending us the most - we need to turn our eyes to the real villain (The Powers That Be) and educate everyone we know about the tactics they use to control and oppress us.

I have linked these before and I will continue to do so until everyone who comes to ATS is familiar with them. Everyone on ATS needs to read these three threads:

The Shock Doctrine: Disaster Capitalism (making money off of chaos):
www.abovetopsecret.com...'

Silent Weopons For Quiet Wars (mind and behaviorial control through data and information):
www.abovetopsecret.com...'

The Report From Iron Mountain: Fact Disguised As Fiction? (on the profitabilty of war)
www.abovetopsecret.com...

whenever the word "fascist" is used, the religion has already been injected. she used it a few times and implied it many more times by referring to Hitler, who everyone has been told was a christian and a fascist. and even though he got devotees on the basis of his platform being more morally palatable to the average joe and joelene, he was definitely not a christian.

the point is, if you invoke it, it has a subliminal effect on the hearer.

reply to post by undo


I understand your point, though I disagree that facism must necessarily imply a religous context. But, maybe for the purpose of educating people with this thread, religion should be discussed only in the broader sense - as a tool of the PTB - and not get too specific regarding religous philosophies and factions, ie: let's not get into who's right, who's wrong, who is doing what to whom, atheism, etc. That is the surest way to kill this thread and it is too important.

[edit on 18/10/2007 by kosmicjack]

[edit on 18/10/2007 by kosmicjack]

Originally posted by captainplanet
reply to post by undo

 

Anything that mixes religion with politics is wrong, it‘s propaganda, vote it away. If you think your particular religion makes you special, please step off the political stage and read my other thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I agree with this, however - the word religion is misunderstood and mis-used. If you're talking about the dogmatic cults that people follow - judaism, christianity, buddhism, islam etc etc then yes, it has no place in politics. But then again - it has no place in this world in my opinion.

However, the Urantia Book explain that religion is merely ones personal relationship with his/her philosophical ideas and higher ideals of God. In other words... and example would be:
your philosophy and highest ideal of God is that he is force behind and in everything. the beginning and end, the total sum of all parts. The glue that binds us. The force from star wars even.

Relating on a personal and meaningful level with that sort of idea is not easy.

In steps religion, in which I see that the relationship between that higher ideal of God and me is that he is my father, and I his child.

In this light, religion is essential to politics, and life in general. As who will fight wars, when we are all family, all being born from the same source.

Religions dont start wars, its conflicting ideals and dreams.. both with the same ideas but different names. Its delusions of seperation thats infecting the world globally. We're deluded into thinking we are seperate from each other. Dont ever wish for religion to go away, already people are leaving the churches by their thousands, people are waking up, everyone can see it.

The only way to ever unite the entire world is through religion, but religion as I have explained it - the ideal that we are all brothers and sisters born of the same source. Anything else only stimulates competition and comparing of worth.

The only place I see religious topics in this thread as valid is when we compare them to what she spoke of tyranny doing.

Stalin created a false threat and hyped the crowd to keep them from looking at what he was doing,

Hitler filled the news papers with highly charged rhetoric to keep people emotionally charged so they could not think about what really is going on.

I see the religious discussion here (but not elsewhere) as a mechanism to divert and disguise her real points.

We now have a corporate militia called Blackwater that is answerable to only money.

We have threats of treason charges, against reporters. The attempt to chill free speech, and keep people quiet through surveillance, I loved her example of her throwing out a book at an airport because she was scared to take it through TSA screening. This is the slow march to Fascism fear, and control bit by bit, conditioning us to accept that power can dictate what we say or think

Dixie chick CD's being burned, people wanting to do that is there choice, political groups organizing the events is an attack on free speech and reminds me also of the book burning parties of early Germany.

Many good points she made in the speech, that need to be thought through and discussed, not just diverted from, diversion is a tool of the powers that be.

Maybe this thread is a good exercise in identifying emotion to distract.

reply to post by mortalengine


Again, Religion and its many facets will derail this thread.

I don't know why this is difficult for ATS members to understand. SO many threads on ATS are ruined by zeolots with an agenda - either pro or con to Religion.

Get over it and let's get on with the discsussion. It's not personal. Its practical. There is a Forum on ATS called Conspiracies in Religion. Take your arguments there or start a new thread in this forum.

Really, I do not mean to be rude. But we cannot keep going on this way in a thread that is not about Religion, specifcally.

Maybe this thread is a good exercise in identifying emotion to distract.

i imagine similar arguments were proferred when the jews became worried about the rise of anti-semitism in germany. people probably told them they were imagining things. reading too much into it or trying to make excuses for the poor behavior of other jews.

what i'm doing is trying to point out that there's a dichotomy in our government that has, as its opposing viewpoints, two forms of tyranny, neither of which is the us government as it was meant to be, as she mentions, but she then pretends not to notice the problem is two-sided.

Originally posted by undo
what i'm doing is trying to point out that there's a dichotomy in our government that has, as its opposing viewpoints, two forms of tyranny, neither of which is the us government as it was meant to be, as she mentions, but she then pretends not to notice the problem is two-sided.

Yes and there are plenty of threads for that discussion that do not derail the conversation on the points she did mention. To move the discussion back to internal arguments charged with emotion from the right/left set up division is to divert attention from the plethora of points she did discuss. Do you wish to discuss what she did say?

What are your thoughts on Blackwater, what are your thoughts on secret prisons and torture, what are your thoughts on chilling free speech by fear and diversion. What are your thoughts about bravery, and the founding fathers thoughts on checks and balances, what are your thoughts on the societal push back against tyranny.

[edit on 18-10-2007 by Redge777]

as i said, she makes valid points.
just wish she'd have followed thru.
she says see, if we
just look to democracy.... erm, wait, can anyone
here tell me what the definition of the us form
of government is? what kind of government do we
have? or, rather, are we supposed to have?
are we suppose to have a form of government where
one of the parties actually runs on the ticket of
being the sworn enemy of the very people that have
voted them in?

do you honestly believe the only people
that vote democrat or have done so in the past, are only
socialist yuppies? oh heck no. i'm from michigan, a blue
state, even though i live in a south state atm. and the entire
state of michigan has been consistently democrat for as long
as i can remember. i think they even went democrat during
reagan's era. my parents were democrats. my mom was
a dyed in the wool, union forming, christian. you can imagine
how pissed off she would've been to see the jesus fish with the
word hypocrite in it, as a democratic bumper sticker.

the problem is, that's the other option. not a sensible democratic
party, but one that rabidly hates half the nation. and these
people are going to represent us and save us from the current
disaster?

i'm not blind. blonde, yes. blind no.

I was interested in hearing your opinion of the points she made.

I'll throw in my vote to not let religion derail this topic. And, while you're posting your religious posts in other threads, please take note to differentiate between religion and organized religion (Sorry, ATS's tag line should be "ATS - Where you too can play devil's advocate").

I was so very excited to get to work this morning and find a worthwhile topic and ensuing discussion on ATS. I love this site and it's purpose, but I grow tired of all the "wading" I have to do.

This is a stupid post with no point. Feel free to scroll on by.

Any person who believes that this government is of the people, by the people, or for the people needs to get their nose out of the text book and squeegee their third #@! eye (R.I.P. Bill Hicks). If you need an example, take a look at the current system of Congress and the President and the bills that go back and forth like so many paper airplanes in a 4th grade class when the teacher has just stepped out.

We choose the people who will represent us in the HOR and Congress. What are these elections based on? Who has the best presence? The best advertising? The best label? It's like choosing your candy from a candy isle. You may like the flavor and packaging of 'Oh Henry' - but the fact is, it's all just sugar in different shapes and sizes, and it will all still rot your teeth just the same.

How many bills go through congress each week? How many of you have read all of them? How many of you have read half of them? How many of you have read 1 of them?

News Report: Child Health Care bill gets passed in Congress. Sounds great! What does it mean? "I dunno. I guess some kids get better health care. That's neat."

News Report: Child Health Care bill gets vetoed by the President.

Summary: A bunch of guys that I don't know, wearing suits I'll never be able to afford gave the thumbs up to some piece of paper that affects our children and our tax dollars. I don't know what this paper says. I had no hand in helping to write this paper and I had no voice about whether I like it or not - but it's got a good title, so it's fine by me. Then, one guy - One Guy - says "Millions of people elected you guys in nice suits to pass this bill. But they also elected me, and it doesn't go along with my agenda - so I say no." Now it goes back to congress.

Checks and balances - sounds great. I bet you it had more meaning and more impact at the time of the signing of the constitution. Fact remains - nobody asked me - and nobody asked you.

But you know what? That's fine - as long as it doesn't affect me. I can still drive my sports car to work, pick up a twelve pack on the way home, launch my boat on the weekend and grill my USDA Grade A certified, steroid injected beef on my Weber. Why can't my athletes use steroids, but my food can? Strange.

Now replace 'Child Health Care' with 'Patriot Act'. Hey, good name. What's it say?

Life continues.

The most terrifying thing in that video was the 'list'. What list? Why do we have a list? Who writes this list? If I go promote and throw a conference or concert with a title like "Free the Constitution", will I be put on that list?

Many of her points could be passed off as contextual or coincidental (not saying they are) - but the list is here, now, and it's real. Those speaking loudly about our freedoms are being 'listed' and hassled. That is a line that should not be crossed. That, in itself, should be a breaking point. But it's not. Why? Because I still drove my sports car to work - where I complain on ATS all day. I'll still get my 12 pack of precious pumpkin ale on my way home.

We're all pathetic. No offense... kinda. We won't do anything until it affects us or inconveniences us - and then it will be too late.

Global warming - nothing I can do, I'll put my trust in the government. Oh, now the government is taking away my transportation, limiting our food rations, controlling private commerce...

Squeegee that third !@!%# eye.

This proves, in my opinion, what happens when you mix politics & religion. I think there is a force at work here that were just not really talking about. I believe they are calling themselve both Republican & Democrat. I believe, through Faith Based Initatives, the christian religion has been successfully hijacked. This group of Dems. & Repubs. have the same goal and are backed by the same cooperations and special interest. And neither care for democracy only money. There is an agenda being played out in the White House. We aren't really sure what the exact endgame is but part of that process is to destroy democracy in America and in my opinion it's coming along just fine.
This truly is not a Democrat or Republican issue exclusively. There is something else at work here. We need to aknowledge this, give it a name and identify the main players and bring it out into the daylight before it's too late.

Originally posted by undo

...And every faction believes theirs will be the last one standing - a carefully crafted piece of war time propaganda, meant to pit everyone against everyone else till no one's left...

Edit: It wouldn't be so bad if she hadn't made it clear she felt the democrats were the only salvation from this situation.

First, what good would there be in wiping everybody out? What power is there to be had if there are no people to have power over? More to societal context; what money is to be made?

Second - this is an honest question, no sarcasm here - Where did she make "it clear she felt the democrats were the only salvation from this situation.". I must have missed that. Can you give me a time reference in the video?

Originally posted by Redge777
I was interested in hearing your opinion of the points she made.

Well, about 15 years ago, I went into a coma. But, before I did, alot of very weird stuff happened. How much of it was my brain going bonkers from infection and how much was reality, I still don't know to this day, although I know most of it was just the infection. One thing though, that was most pronounced, was this overwhelming paranoia, that every aspect of my life was being surveilled. (I had brain stem encephalitis.) When I went to the bathroom, took a bath, made love with hubby, I felt totally violated. The way I put it at the time was it was like being raped while video taped, every day, every night. non-stop. So I totally have compassion for anyone that is actually, literally, going through the whole "list" concept.

I can't believe there's an actual list. Well, isn't this similar to the days of McCarthy-ism? The list of communist sympathesizers or some such? I can understand a certain amount of national defense, but just having a different opinion should not qualify someone for surveillance.. if she's feeling paranoid about such a dramatic lack of privacy, I can relate, if for no other reason than it felt real to me at the time I was experiencing it and it was a horrible feeling.

Originally posted by mek12
... I think there is a force at work here that were just not really talking about...There is an agenda being played out in the White House. We aren't really sure what the exact endgame is but part of that process is to destroy democracy in America and in my opinion it's coming along just fine...There is something else at work here. We need to aknowledge this, give it a name and identify the main players and bring it out into the daylight before it's too late.

An interesting discussion about this exact phenomenon in this thread right here:

Who is the Puppet Master:
www.abovetopsecret.com...'