Athiests, What would it take for you to be a Christian??

I was raised a Christian, and you couldn't do anything to convince me to worship some non-existent man in the sky again. I thought it was normal to believe in Jesus and worship someone, but then I realized how insane it actually all is. The only religion I follow is self-rule and self-responsibility.

Well done GeeGee!

I guess there is hope for other theists out there as well!

Well to believe in Jesus and to obey the ten commants . I try to, is not a bad way to live ,also its good fire insurance.

reply to post by GeeGee


Self-responsibility.

Responding overtly and expressly to the self. No offense, just noticing something.

I used to be luthern,I attended a Luthern middle school,as well as a Luthern high school.
I was raised that it was normal to believe in "god".
But the more religion I was taught,the more and more it made no sense.
So I turned away from organised religion.
Now,I do believe something is responsible for life and the universe being here,call it god,nature,chance,whatever.
But I highly doubt its the mythical god the bible preaches about.
NOw that being said,I dont look down or think less of those who do believe in Christianity.If it comforts you and gets you through life,than so be it.

Now,as for what it would take to bring me back into the fold...well
Show me this loving,caring god that allows millions of children to starve to death throughout the world.
Show me this loving,caring god who allows a child to be born with aids or cancer,just to live a short life,only to die.And leave its parents behind to suffer.
Explain to me why a child is born into a home,gets raped,molested and beaten by its parents.
Explain to me why god created such a huge universe for no reason.As humanity will never see 10% of it.Such a large space is pointless.
If god loves all of us,then why not come back an bring fourth world peace?
Why sit on his high and mighty throne and watch the world suffer,when he could bring fourth an end at any time?
To be made to suffer here on earth,to recieve heaven is a sick game,sorta like his own personal FOX reality show.
And any god that would evn allow hell to be an option is cruel,afterall,anyone who has lived through this hell on earth,should automatically be allowed into heaven.Havent we suffered enough?
And why exactly would god send souls to earth int he first place?If Heaven is so great,heres an idea,leave us there.

IF there is a god,he isnt the all loving caring god you think he is.
In fact he is probaly mean,vengeful(well after the flood thing,id say he is),sadistic,and theres a good chance he hates us all.
Well thats my 2 cents,its not to offend anyone.

reply to post by Black_Fox


Damn all these rantings about the actions of men being those of God. People starve because other people dictate policy that leaves them out. This can be applied to everything.

reply to post by depth om


How is being born with mental defects or and physical impairment the doing of man? Is is the parents fault for having them?

And so what if some thing were man's fault? Can't god help?
Why should millions of people suffer because of a select few?





[edit on 19-10-2007 by AncientVoid]

It's our fault yes. The curse is encrypted in our DNA, to be passed on through blood. Our forefather and mother disobeyed God for no other reason than catering to the self when there was no reason to. Making their own worlds where they are the leaders, they are able to discern actions, judge them, to judge, one must know all truths, God embodies perfect truth.

They climbed upon a role that only God could captain. Perfect, all knowing form told them not to do this. God knew what would happen if they acquired any part of the knowledge of evil. His perfect creation, laid waste to by sin. Imperfect now. Death begins. Decaying, God builds things back up again. Everything will die though. Die as in un-form, un-assemble. Eras of peace, bodies, buildings, weather etc. Everything changes.

I think this theory can explain deformity and the like.

Nothing in harmony, just a constant balancing out of forces, swinging and careening around to compensate for eachother. All things are like this. "Chaos" some call it, but there is no chaos. Just finer movement.

God is real, and we all knew about him long ago. The organism that is humanity, turned away, to their own gods, tweaking and sculpting a perfect god for themselves. The self is foreign. The collective organism is fractured. There is too much self centering. Give, love, plant, grow. No me, we.

Christ came in his name. Yeshua was real, his God exists. Evidence is coming.

Refute, please refute.

I challenge.

reply to post by depth om


Is that what the church teaches?
Why are you using DNA? They didn't know about it back then. Does it say DNA curse or w/e in the bible?

Edit: Then why are some people born with mental disabilities while others are not?
I guess your making this up as you go along?

[edit on 19-10-2007 by AncientVoid]

I really have to back AncientVoid here, and not just because we're both atheists.

Seriously, if god was a perfect being, why would he allow kids to be born with Harlequin type Ichthyosis? Epilepsy? Why let little kids die of SIDS? AIDS? Why Siamese twins?

Are these all because of "free will"?

It does not make sense to say that a perfect being created an imperfect system. That means god either made a mistake, or he did it on purpose. The first choice hints at god not being perfect, or that he takes delight in suffering.

Only natural selection can explain these sad fates satisfactorily.

The very 'thingy' that gets me:

Being a Spiritual person, I even question:

"WHO or WHAT made things?

I even, question on the repetiveness of the 'before...before...before..God"

If there is a God...(who made 'that god'...and the god before him and so on) Just boggles the mind....(like a 70's beer commercial..."and they told 2 friends, and they told 2 friends...and so on and so on..and so on....)

As mankind, at this point in time, has only dealt with 10 percent of our brain matter> How can we discern what is truth?

Falacies of mankind.

We may someday find out explanations to everything.

It may or may not take an Aeon. Mabey more?

Until then, It is my belief....a ghost of an answer to many questions.

It is my hope and belief, that we may ALL be reconciled unto one universally accepted truth.

That we all look, with the same eyes and thoughts, to see and understand uniquivicablly...that which we knew...

...all along.

~Ducky~


[edit on 20-10-2007 by TheDuckster]

reply to post by TheDuckster


We don't use only 10% of our brain. That's a myth which started when someone misquoted or misrepresented Einstein. Seriously someone should put a ad informing people this is not true and stop this from spreading.

reply to post by depth om


God puts a curse into our D.N.A. for our disobedience, that would affect countless generations of humans beings in this world to suffer and sin?

Wow, talk about a father figure who really loves us....

(sarcasm)

I maybe my Father's son, but I am not my father. My choices and paths maybe different from my parents.

Guilty until proven innocent if at all possible, babies punished and tortured before even having a chance at choosing their own paths and choices?

Funny thing is, God appears to display similar sins, emotions and actions that maybe equal to or worse than some human beings..... very unbecoming for a supposed perfect and enligthened being.

God certainly knows how to hold a grudge and to make sure that those who do not obey are made to suffer with a venegence for generations.

I suppose we are God's children after all, I am beginning to see lots of similarities.....

[edit on 20-10-2007 by ixiy]

The very concept of this thread is ridiculous. For you Christians to realize what a dumb question the OP posed I'll have to ask my own question:

What makes you Christians be Christians, without using the following answers:

1. Faith/Heard the Voice of God/"I can just feel it"/etc. - Faith is not a valid answer because faith is merely a feeling in your head, kind of like crazy people who have faith that they are the reincarnation of Elvis because their dead alien mother is telling them so through telepathy.

2. The word of Jesus - Not valid because you didn't here it. You've got stuff that his friends wrote down about him, and voices in your head.

3. The Bible says so - Also not a valid answer because for a book to claim its contents are the truth does not make its contents the truth, and nothing working 100% independantly of the Bible has ever confirmed it to be completely true.

---

Now, I don't expect any of you to answer that question without violating one of my conditions, because those ARE the answers to that question. You are more than welcome to accept those answers for whatever reason you want, but not everyone does.

Furthermore, the original question is slightly irritating because it's a lot like asking a holocaust survivor "What would it take to make you embrace nazism?"

If you haven't infered my answer to the original question yet, here it is. I'll become a Christian when every single factor that made me an atheist is removed from the picture.

In the collective consciousness, beliefs are subject to scrutiny and doubt.

In the intraverse, the personal universe, belief is adopted and realized, existing. You doubt, I believe. You haven't been in my shoes. I haven't been in yours.

He is I Am.

As GZA would say, Bible = Basic instructions before leaving earth.

Proof will come and doubt will be replaced with either one of two things. Joy or sorrow. I've been through the world and its trappings, experienced what it had to offer, what it was. I've been to both sides, the good and the evil. My mind and being has arrived at a conclusion. Christ is King.

I'm programmed, right? Who, might I ask, benefits from my programmed mind. Besides mankind, through what Christ has instilled in me, transferred into action.

Just as wind can only be seen indirectly, God is seen indirectly. The veil will be lifted after a time, times and a time. You could die today though.

We are all quick to lift up, believe, the writings of man, be it Dawkins, or the apostles. I've got my proof, do you have yours.

This relationship is personal, there are no voices in the head. It is vibration of the heart.

If God was eradicated from the world, the strong-man would rule. The barbarian who crushes and consumes will be king. The upright man knows what is wrong, but the man who sees others as animal, mere flesh, he will cut you down and build up his kingdom.

We are limited by our minds and senses, as are all beings. Realize this, and you are one step closer to God.

I suppose the only thing that would make me believe in god would be for god to appear in the sky and every single person on earth would see him at the same time. After all, isn't god everywhere? We should all be able to see him at the same time if he appeared, right?

Evidence that god exists would make me beleive in god. And, yes, without science I would still not beleive in god, as there's STILL no evidence that he exists.

And then, if he DID exist, then why would he be a Christian?

reply to post by JimmyCarterIsSmarter


Because Earth is in the centre of the universe

reply to post by GeeGee


i have a hypothesis that most people are religious simply because it is forced on them by their parents when they are yong and impreshionable
religion would have to become logical for me to believe even remotely( that will never happen though)