Woman Dies after Airport Arrest

Originally posted by Boondock78
sa far as dressing inappropriately, i don't think it is up to you or the airline to decide what that is..THAT is my point.
i mean, who gets to decide what is inappropriate?

The Air Carrier gets to decide that, If you think you may be wearing something that may be offensive to someone you need to first realize that you are not out in public or in your own home, your in someone else’s business. In that business they have the 100% rite to ask you change, leave, or to deny you service if they find it to be offensive. When something like this occurs, it would also not simply be decided by a PSA they would have to call their supervisor, who might even go so far as to bring down the station manager to ensure that there was agreement on the offensiveness. A station Manager is the top of the food chain for an airline at each individual station.

Originally posted by defcon5
They have to re-apply the breaks and caulks.
Re-attach the jetway bridge.
Disable the door chute mechanism.
Open the door.
Then they have to remove the person who is in the seat.
Remove the person’s baggage, which must first be located in the lower hold.
Put the new person on the aircraft.
Put her baggage on the plane.
Reseal all the doors.
Reset the chute.
Remove all the caulks.
Reset the breaks.
Pull the jetway again.

If the aircraft has an INOP APU then you also have to:
Shut down The engine
Reapply ground power
Re-apply the A/C unit
Allow the Airstart cart time to cool down before trying to start up again.


The TSA’s tried to get her to calm down before the police arrived, that obviously was not going to diffuse the situation.

ok, so just for fun, everyone has to be checked in by 11am. lady gets there at 11:01.
are you telling me that in that 1 minute, they pulled the brakes and caulks, detached the jetway bridge, enabled the chute mechanism, closed the door, already sat someone in that empty seat, etc etc.....
they do all that between 11 and 11:01 huh?

as far as the tsa's trying to calm her down, how much time did they spend trying to calm her down?
what did they do?

i'm not saying schedules need to be redone cause of the customers but a little leeway and decent treatment of people goes a long way

Originally posted by defcon5

The Air Carrier gets to decide that,
When something like this occurs, it would also not simply be decided by a PSA they would have to call their supervisor, who might even go so far as to bring down the station manager to ensure that there was agreement on the offensiveness.

so lets say i have my sketti monster shirt on and i am on the plane...fundie next to me gets bent and offended...
they call the supervisor and maybe even the station manager cause i have an offensive shirt on...

does this not cause them money?
time is money right? even 1 minute.
so, they will sit there and try to toss me off the plane cause maybe my shirt is offensive...they have time for that but not time for a person arriving 1 minute late to get on the plane?

i guess i just don't get it at all.

what about my tattoos? it is part of my body.

on my right bicep it says 'the meek shall inherit nothing'..just for giggles, if i sit down in the aisle seat and some fundie is at the window seat and they have to look at my tattoo the entire flight, if they get uptight can i be booted off?

all this is lame if you ask me

No, but they set a limit on the time you can check in at the gate so that they have enough time to pull your bags without delaying the departure. If you don't show up on the plane your bags are required by law to be removed from the plane. There's a 10-15 minute rule so that they know who's there and who isn't and what bags can go. 99% of the traveling public abides by this rule, and most airlines give you a few minute leeway. They're not going to pull your bags if you're one minute late, but they're not going to let you on the plane if you're 5 minutes late.

reply to post by Zaphod58


so there is some leeway there. thats all i was getting at...defcon5 makes it seem like as soon as the clock strikes 12 the plane is already in the air.

i understand that people need to be responsible and get there on time but a person being 1 minute late is absolutely understandable, especially these days when security could tie you yp or you could get stuck behind someone that security has tied up....

The airlines are aware when security is slow and they make allowances for that. But if you're late and security ISN'T slow then it was just your fault for being late and they're not going to make the same allowances for you.

As for the question about the shirt, yes, they will make the decision to remove you from the plane, or they will ask you to cover your shirt up somehow. The time on the ground can usually be made up once they're in the air.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
As for the question about the shirt, yes, they will make the decision to remove you from the plane, or they will ask you to cover your shirt up somehow. The time on the ground can usually be made up once they're in the air.

and the tattoo's?

it's nice to know that these days if someone gets bent cause of a shirt you have on, you could get tossed off the plane.
last i checked, everyones green backs spend the same...

simple way i avoid this is don't set foot in an airport. this is definately one big ass hassle that i do not need.

Easiest way to avoid it is to simply wear a non-offensive tshirt, or a button down type shirt. It's only a few hours out of one day while you're on the plane.

As for tattoos, I haven't seen someone tossed yet because of a tattoo. If it was a naked woman on your arm, they would make you cover it up, but for something like "The meek shall inherit nothing" they wouldn't put you off the plane.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
Easiest way to avoid it is to simply wear a non-offensive tshirt, or a button down type shirt. It's only a few hours out of one day while you're on the plane.

As for tattoos, I haven't seen someone tossed yet because of a tattoo. If it was a naked woman on your arm, they would make you cover it up, but for something like "The meek shall inherit nothing" they wouldn't put you off the plane.

i get what you are saying but i am a pretty brash person. i don't really get offended. so now before i/we fly we must look in our closet for proper attire? an oxford?
i like my sketti monster shirt. i think it is very funny and i love to wear it around.

it is only a few hours a day on the plane but the point is, if i paid my money lke everyone else, why should i have to adjust my attire?

where does it stop?
someone mentioned flying while sick?
if you have a cough should you not be able to fly?
what if you have mad B.O?
i certainly don't want to it next to the dude that smells like buttocks but, should he be kicked off the plane for it?

It's the same as if you were going to work. You're not going to be allowed to go to work in a shirt that would offend most of the office. It's the same with a plane. If it offends most of the plane they're not going to let you on. If you're sick, unless it's something pretty bad, and obviously pretty bad, they're going to let you on the plane. It's pretty rare to have someone denied boarding due to body odor but it can happen. Usually though they'll simply ask them to go into the bathroom and change clothes, and clean up some, and let them onto the plane afterwards.

The airlines are in a no win situation with regards to this. They have to keep the public safe, and discomfort to a minimum. That means occasionally asking someone to cover up what they're wearing, or to clean themselves up, etc. They have to walk a pretty delicate balance as to what does and doesn't go onto their planes. In most cases if it later comes to their attention that they shouldn't have done something then they'll try to make it up.

Originally posted by Boondock78
so lets say i have my sketti monster shirt on and i am on the plane...fundie next to me gets bent and offended...

Wow…
So, no one better discriminate against your beliefs, but it’s ok for you to pick on fundamental Christians?

Can you say hypocrite ?
I knew you could!

So what are you anyway, an anti-everything, no common sense, 16 year old?
Yeah, I know its fun to be anti-everything when you’re still in highschool…
Kind of makes you cool and all!

Originally posted by Zaphod58
If you don't show up on the plane your bags are required by law to be removed from the plane.

A-Freckin-Men!!!!

Welcome back Zaph…

Who on this thread wants to speculate as to why that law exists?

Let’s lay criminal negligence square in the lap of the person to whom it belongs according to this thread.

According to the police report released Thursday, Gotbaum's husband, Noah, called the airport several times that day, trying to reach his wife or the airport police, telling them they didn't know the circumstances involving his wife, whom he described as suicidal.

Does this sound like someone who should have been flying alone?
Does this sound like someone that anyone on this site would like to have on an aircraft with them?
You think that maybe the airlines should have had a heads-up on what they were dealing with?
Maybe before the problem occurred, and not after the fact?


I almost have to ask how much insurance money he received from this incident…
If he is not pulled in for criminal negligence, then there is really something wrong with this world. Its not the police’s fault for having to deal with the situation, its his for creating it.

Why was her husband not there?
Can you say alibi?
If bartenders are charged with manslaughter for allowing folks to get drunk then drive, why not husbands who know they are putting a drunken, suicidal person on an aircraft unattended?
I have to also wonder what her husbands profession was, is he an attorney?

Collect the insurance.
Collect the lawsuit money from the airport..
Collect the lawsuit money from the airlines…
Collect the lawsuit money from the airport police….


[edit on 10/15/2007 by defcon5]

Originally posted by defcon5

So what are you anyway, an anti-everything, no common sense, 16 year old?
Yeah, I know its fun to be anti-everything when you’re still in highschool…
Kind of makes you cool and all!

huh?
me wearing a shirt that might offend someone means i am picking on others beliefs?
i don't understand that but ok.

i am an anti everything 30 year old. since you asked

reply to post by defcon5


this entire post was garbage...
negligence on the husband?

just cause you are married to someone does not mean you own them...

she is, well, WAS an adult yes? thats right

a lot of people 'might be' suicidal and they fly...

you want they should fill out a survey first? should they go through a a process to see if they are mentally ok to fly?


negligence on the husband...the only person that tried to tell people that his wife is not well..bwuahahahahahhahaahBWUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

edit*
you said he 'put her' drunken and suicidal self on the plane...
bwuaahhaahahahahahhaa



[edit on 15-10-2007 by Boondock78]

Didn't see this posted in here yet, but this is what the Justice Department investigation finds with Arrest Related deaths.


"The review found 55 percent of the 2,002 arrest-related deaths from 2003 through 2005 were due to homicide by state and local law enforcement officers. Alcohol and drug intoxication caused 13 percent of the deaths, followed by suicides at 12 percent, accidental injury at 7 percent and illness or natural causes, 6 percent. The causes for the deaths of the remaining 7 percent were unknown." - Department of Justice

www.foxnews.com.../crime

IMO there are easier ways for people to commit suicide by cop than what happened in this case. Also of you read the artical, Arizona ranks above New york in Police killings.

"New York now ranks sixth nationwide in the number of police killings, behind Arizona and Illinois, according to Thursday's report." - Department of Justice

Can't blame the public for asking questions with stats like that.

Here is a update from this case on rense.It seems some interesting details I had not heard.
DWTrense.com link

The M.E. Report is out and it says that the lady was intoxicated and her dead was self inflicted.

m.cnn.com...

Still is hard to believe that the police is not liable in some way, shape pr form for her death.

wcbstv.com...

Drunk..,no negligence. I am saddened to hear of hear death but glad of exoneration of the police in this case.

reply to post by esdad71


For what I read she was on meds, at no point says she was drunk.

Anyways what we need to look here is at police procedures, once law enforcement out handcuffs on you, they are in charge of your well being, and it this case that did not happen.