Some British Teachers Dropping the Holocaust From Their History Lessons

Originally posted by spanishcaravan
lol,if this is true then can all the "stupid american" jokes stop?

Man,i thought WE were going overboard with not wanting to offend people.

The stupid American jokes are'nt because of political correctness, it's
because the majority of our population is generally stupid, hell most
people can't even point out most foreign countries on a map.

Let's get this in perspective (over at Littlegreenfootballs many American Loons think that the UK has been overtaken by "Evil Muslims" due to scare stories like this).

Subjects like the Holocaust and crusades have not always been taught in British schools. We never did them at all in my school (1990-1996). It's impossible for schools to cover all history so schools pick and choose. It's not like you go into school and they teach you human history from year 0 to 2007, bit by bit.

Actually, I don't think the second world war even got a mention in my secondary school...we studied other stuff.

I'm not sure the Holocaust is an ideal subject for very young children to study, anyway.

These kind of stories do the round because the British Press love to write about 2 things:
1> How bad/crap our schools are; how easy exams are nowdays/ how stupid our children are.
2> How the country is going to the dogs because of "political correctness"

This story combines both, nicely.

I would never call someone stupied just because they can't do a few things that I can. I have found that people who don't know what I do tend to know a few things that I don't. Listen to "stupied" people every once and a while, they might help you out.

As for on topic, how about we just drop history from school. It would be a good way to not offend anybody. The history of humanity if full of mistakes and that is how we learn. Who really cares who did what, where that came from, or why we do this? It's all about learning what we are going to do and that is why history is taught.

It's important that history is taught acurately...and there are often 10 sides to every story.

Imagine trying to teach the history of the Iraq war/invasion/liberation to a class of 12 year olds in 10 years time...in a lesson lasting 30 minutes!

A minefield!

i know i was taught the history of world war two thoughout my school years(1997-02) we were taught about the holacaust in our religios studies also and part of the course required us to watch shinderlas list (i know iknow i spelt that wrong).

the only thing i disagreed with when they were teaching me the history of ww2 was we had to do a poster of hitler saying vote for hitler which at the time i refused to do and got detechion for it but i still refused to do it, i beleive it was an insult to the brave men and women who died fighting to eradicate him and the men woen and children that died in those camps.
im not sure if other people on here would agree with me but i was twelve and i still thought it was wrong and my parents stud by me

Earlier posters who have said that schools pick their history teaching subjects are correct.

During my compulsory subejct secondary schooling years (81-84) we learnt nothing about the Crusades or WW2. We studied British History from the Romans through to the Normans instead.

Those people who chose to study History from 84-86 (I dropped it for sciences) studied the start of the Cold War and the Kennedy assasination in detail.

There was no "agenda" there at all.

Everything I've learnt about the Crusades and WW2 is entirely self taught (and the better for it I might add) , because I took the time out to learn it.

I guess what I'm saying is that the articles referred to are the typical "pick on something and blow it out of proportion" stuff the UK press likes to launch into now and again. Fact is that the Government has dumbed down the education system so much with the implementation of the National Curriculm that anything "controversial" in ANY subject isn't likely to get taught, and thats nothing at all to do with Muslims or any other faith.

I would like to point out however that alot of Catholic Schools never taught sex education - does that mean the state pandered to Catholic fundamentalists?

Immortal Technique said it best in his song 'The Point Of No Return' by saying, "...Universal Truth is Not Measured In Mass Apeal"

A good way to judge the article's accuracy would be to find the actual DFES funded Historical Association report.

I've had no joy as yet.

Daily Mail

Daily Express

Daily Star

The Guardian

and a cache of the teletext page which is no longer available.

Jak

BBC News is covering the story as well.

I think they should teach about the Holocaust and also about the Crusades after all it is history. But I fear most kids wouldn't be interested in this subject and some are just too thick to understand anyway( just like some adults are ).

Muslims were killed in the Holocaust too I believe

(have to check that, but i think a small number did)

Oh come on...

Have you guys not worked it out yet? The PA (Press Assocation) means all of those sites will carry it. They always carry each others stories online if you are a member. It means nothing.

I wonder why this report can't be found yet or none of these papers have sourced it. Which paper posted it first? Look at that and you might just be able to put two and tow together and come out with 4.

Furthermore, the education system is a sham. I studied the holocaust at A-Level as part of the A-Level History program. I am glad it is not being taught because it should not be. All that is needed is to name two camps (Death Camps not Labour Camps) and to know that Jewish people were the primary victims. Ask any GCSE or A Level student to name 5 groups of people who the Germanic Government targetted and they'd be hard passed. Here's a pretty decent list: en.wikipedia.org... - Yes it included members of the Islamic faith however it was not on Religious grounds but ethnic grounds, in fact none of it was on a overly Religious Policy people just like to make out like it was.

Originally posted by shots
LMAO back at you now the guradian is carrying the same story

www.guardian.co.uk...

I am a skeptic and I admit it will you? How can so many be so wrong? Granted three that might be contected yes by all means but now we have a fourth claiming the same thing

Er... the lmao is directed at you using the Daily Star as if it is a credible source... lol

You seriously need to do a little research into the tabloids that you put forward as sources.

Originally posted by Odium
Oh come on...

Odium are you and terran blue perhaps part of the latest movement of spreading disinformation by MEMRI?

memri.org...

I sure hope not that could drag ATS down the tubes.

Now to the topic at hand. If this story is true does that mean that teachers will not or cannot teach Muslim's Holocausts and Genocide Remembrance Day. Just what do you think Muslim's would say if scholars refused to teach their history? I would tend to think all hell would break loose.

The Education System in the U.K. is simple. There is a list of subjects which can be taught, some are easy and some are hard. Some still rub people up the wrong way - such as slavery, the holocaust, etcetera. Due to this some teachers will not teach them. They are given this choice.

The website you link is a Canadian website, it has nothing to do with the U.K. again nice try. Nor do we teach any of the subjects in are history classes and it isn't on the sylabus either. However, I've never seen a single Muslim mind about it.

In fact, here is the GCSE syllabus:
Cold War
Germany (Rise of Nazism)
League of Nations
Post WW1
UN

Nothing to do with Islamic History at all.

A Level:
AS Level
Votes for Women 1880-1918
France in revolution 1776-94
Conflict, Depression and Opportunity: British Society between the Wars 1919-39

A2 Level
Politics Presidency and society in the USA 1968-2001
Representation and Democracy in Britain 1830-1931
Radicalism and the British State: the Chartist Experience 1838-50

These are just two examples of what is taught, since you can't be bothered to do your own research before posting. What does that have to do with Islamic History and Muslim's Holocausts and Genocide Remembrance Day?

Originally posted by shots

Odium are you and terran blue perhaps part of the latest movement of spreading disinformation by MEMRI?

Where have I done this? I'd like quotes please and evidence to support this claim.

Originally posted by Odium


Where have I done this? I'd like quotes please and evidence to support this claim.

I never said you did make any claims. I asked a quaestion you do see the question mark don't you?

FYI the reason I asked is because in my opinion it appears you are defending them so I asked or is it against the law to ask questions now

Originally posted by shots

Originally posted by Odium


Where have I done this? I'd like quotes please and evidence to support this claim.

I never said you did make any claims. I asked a quaestion you do see the question mark don't you?

FYI the reason I asked is because in my opinion it appears you are defending them so I asked or is it against the law to ask questions now

Defending who?

So now I am defending them? By them do you mean Muslims? If your information is false, this is not my fault. You still have yet to show us:

The report.
The schools and teachers in question.
Where Islamic History is being taught over British History.
Etcetera.

Here was me thinking news on this site required some form of evidence and not links to opinion. Which is all you've so far given us.

Originally posted by Odium
You still have yet to show us:

The report.
The schools and teachers in question.
Where Islamic History is being taught over British History.
Etcetera.

Be Patient the story is just unfolding. It is very common for some details to be missing from the first reports.


ATTENTION all emdia sources you must furnish any and all details immediately on this story Odium says so

Actually, I've just finished with the report.

Here it is: www.haevents.org.uk...

I suggest you go read it. It is critical of the teachers and schools. It is not critical of the parents nor of any religious group. I suggest you go to page 13 and see how many of these issues can be taught and are before you jump the gun about political correctness. The report was up last night as well, just took a while to find.

This thread is nothing more than the Right Wing media taking quotes out of context and then the Press Association publishing it on every website. What a laughable thread.

I am a student at a secondary school in england and in my opinion history is the most important subject we learn! The holocaust happened whether we like it or not, David Irving and his fellow Iranian friends who deny it are typical of the Iranians ideology, do something shocking and watch the attention, just look at whats happening to our men and woman who've been captured by them, not because they tresspassed because they didn't but because Iran know that they have to make the world liston, i personally would've declared war immediately striking Iran with trident, luckily im not incharge so back to the point...
I was taught about the holocaust, not very much being a bit of a history buff, and noticed the emphasism that was put on the jews, completely ignoring all other factions which suffered like the poles, the disabled the gypsies and the communists, so if anything they should teach us more, not to gloryfy the event but so others can learn from the Nazi's mistake. As for the crusades i'm quite a fan of them myself showing a crucial era in the early british empire in which we as a country could strike into the muslim world, this is something which should be taught, this is national pride which in the modern british empire (i.e. nothing effectively) we cannot have.
In school we aren't taught about the crusades, years 7- 8 are wasted on the middleages and the general drearyness of the french revolution. Year 9 is our main source of knowledge for the first and second world wars, the american civil war and slavery....During this period we are able to learn about the holocaust for maybe a lesson, so maybe the reason it is being dropped is because of the limited time which we are taught history, once a week, and perhaps then we can be taught in greater detail the more important/ interesting to some, events in modern history such as pearl harbour and D-day, both of which aren't the most important events because pearl harbour was a conspiracy and D-day was flawwed.
Maybe we'd better off learning about the Romans, they didn't do too badly for a few hundred years....

Ross1879