15 y/o given Life Sentence

Rehbailitation is, by and large, a myth.

As for 'compassion', I'll say what I said in another thread: If your dog is rabid, you put it down. It's the humane thing to do. You don't cage it and let it out when it foams a little less at the mouth. Does it matter WHAT made your dog rabid? No. What matters is that other people might get bit.

DE

(addition)Rabies is a disease caused by a virus. This is the case of an ignorant youth lacking the rational thinking due to human corruption. Both rabies and the thinking can be dealt with in us humans. Future medical advances may also help us cure it in animals as well.(/addition)

Life in prison where he can work to purchase luxury items, watch TV, and basically live life the same way as the free world will NOT do anything for this boy. everything is handed to you in prison, and your daily peers for the duration of your stay are like-minded criminals.

Not only would temproarily banishing him, or anyone guilty of such crimes for that matter, to a hostile natural environment help them gain an appreciation for the society he lives in and the rules required to live in it peacefully. It will also teach him survival skills, it will test his endurance, force him to reach beyond his known means to see the next day, and also give him time to dwell on anything on his mind away from the complications and constant scrutiny of human corruption.

There is also the benefit of not having to support him for the rest of his life using our tax dollars. I would say after a year or two in the wild he will gain a whole new outlook on life, learn to respect the benefits of society, and may even join an effort to educate youth across America on the dangers of irrational thoughts and unnatuarl lifestyles.

By automatically condemning someone to death we are stating that we are giving up, falling to the same line of irrational thinking, or even just too plain apathetic to try and help a lost soul.

By sending him back to the raw land that we came from, he will learn the sufferring our ancenstors endured to bring us where we are today, and where animals who choose not to live our way belong if they do not follow the rules for harmony.

[edit on 10/17/2006 by DYepes]

Originally posted by DYepes
Rabies is a disease caused by a virus. This is the case of an ignorant youth lacking the rational thinking due to human corruption. Both rabies and the thinking can be dealt with in us humans. Future medical advances may also help us cure it in animals as well.

Pedophilia is also a disease. Psychopathy as well. This, I believe, is not a case of 'corruption' or 'bad decisions'. This is a case of insanity, of a person who is a MENACE TO SOCIETY, much like a rabid dog. I very much doubt they can be cured, like the child molesters who claim to be okay to be in society. Well, we know how often they reoffend.

What's his likelihood to reoffend? How many people have to be hurt or killed before we do the HUMANE thing?

DE

Deus
You know nothing of this child except that he killed another child. You are very willing to have someone put to death while knowing very little about his mental state. If this child is 'diseased' like you say, then there are medical treatments to help him lead a normal life. If he had the proper medication, and been diagnosed early enough this may never have happened.

Unfortunately, many people still have a blood lust, and instead of killing others, they rely on getting behind mobs and killing people in public. Just like a lynching. All these quotes like 'git a rope' and 'hang 'em high' is as much of a psycopathic compulsion as anything this kid did.

Originally posted by Rasobasi420
You know nothing of this child except that he killed another child. You are very willing to have someone put to death while knowing very little about his mental state. If this child is 'diseased' like you say, then there are medical treatments to help him lead a normal life. If he had the proper medication, and been diagnosed early enough this may never have happened.

Emphasis mine. I know MORE than that, given in the article. He attempted to seduce an eleven year old with cystic fibrosis. Then, he first beat, then stabbed said child to death. He stabbed a child to death, you understand? He escalated his use of force, ending that child's life knowingly. He took a frying pan, fractured the child's eye socket, and then stabbed him sixteen times. He then took measures to conceal his crime, showing that he knew that what he was doing was wrong. Hell, he attempted to lure the boy to his house! He lied to the police, attempted to conceal his crime by cleaning the area and moving the body.

I don't know what magic drugs you're talking about, that prevent homocidal urges, or deviant behavior (because attempting to pick up 11 year olds of any sex sure as hell isn't normal). Nor is a 'savage, sustained assault' on a young and vulnerable boy going to go away because of drugs or any diagnosis. Where is personal responsibility in all this? He might be sick, yes, but he was OBVIOUSLY aware of what he was doing.

There's a whack of 'ifs' here. The only sure thing is that there is no expression of remorse, and that society would be safer with him swinging from a gallows. The facts of the crime are in the link. If you are more sympathic to criminal than the victim, then there is something SERIOUSLY wrong. I don't know if he'll harm another person, vulnerable or not. I do know that the gallows prevents him, 100% from doing so. He's shown intent, capacity, and ability. What more do you want? Shall he kill again? Perhaps rape a child before you are convinced?

DE

Originally posted by DeusEx
I don't know what magic drugs you're talking about, that prevent homocidal urges, or deviant behavior (because attempting to pick up 11 year olds of any sex sure as hell isn't normal). Nor is a 'savage, sustained assault' on a young and vulnerable boy going to go away because of drugs or any diagnosis. Where is personal responsibility in all this? He might be sick, yes, but he was OBVIOUSLY aware of what he was doing.

Thank you Dr. Deus. FYI I never said he didn't know what he was doing, or that it wasn't a savage attack. And as for proper medication not curbing violent urges, you are dead wrong. There are many medications for chemical imbalances, depending on what disorder, if any, he has. Those imbalances compounded with the raging hormones of a 15yo, and the social ramifications of being outed, could throw an imbalanced child into fits of rage.

There's a whack of 'ifs' here. The only sure thing is that there is no expression of remorse, and that society would be safer with him swinging from a gallows. The facts of the crime are in the link. If you are more sympathic to criminal than the victim, then there is something SERIOUSLY wrong. I don't know if he'll harm another person, vulnerable or not. I do know that the gallows prevents him, 100% from doing so. He's shown intent, capacity, and ability. What more do you want? Shall he kill again? Perhaps rape a child before you are convinced?

By that logic, I could hang you from the gallows and ensure that society would be safe from you raping and murdering children right?

I never said I was more sympethetic to the accused than the victim did I. I do know that one life is gone, and it would be a tragedy if 2 lives were lost. Especially when one life could be saved. I'm worried if all violent crimes stop, people with your mindset won't rest until they have someone to hang. Jaywalkers? Pot-smokers?

Originally posted by Rasobasi420
Thank you Dr. Deus. FYI I never said he didn't know what he was doing, or that it wasn't a savage attack. And as for proper medication not curbing violent urges, you are dead wrong. There are many medications for chemical imbalances, depending on what disorder, if any, he has. Those imbalances compounded with the raging hormones of a 15yo, and the social ramifications of being outed, could throw an imbalanced child into fits of rage.

This was more than a fit of rage, this was a premeditated attack upon a child, a vulnerable child at that. Had it not been murder, it probably would have been rape. There are MANY drugs for chemical imbalances, but how many of them would work in this case? I'm sure you could render this cold-blooded murderer a vegetable, or in a medical coma...and that's an improvement over death, how?

By that logic, I could hang you from the gallows and ensure that society would be safe from you raping and murdering children right?

Oh really? Have I shown myself willing to murder a child for no reason? Have I murdered a child yet? Have I hit on any eleven year olds? No. I simply want justice. Make excuses for this murderer all you want, it won't hide the fact that he decided to murder a child, deliberately. He is clearly capable of doing it again.

I never said I was more sympethetic to the accused than the victim did I. I do know that one life is gone, and it would be a tragedy if 2 lives were lost. Especially when one life could be saved.

Well, I know how you feel. Except this psychopath can't be saved. I'm thinking about the next boy he targets. Are you willing to take a chance that when he gets out, he will do it again? Are you sure he won't commit more offences while inside prison?

I'm worried if all violent crimes stop, people with your mindset won't rest until they have someone to hang. Jaywalkers? Pot-smokers?

The day all violent crimes stop is the day the last human being dies. You might think his mental state is an out for him. Does this mean you support pedophiles being released because they have a mental condition? Oh wait, this murderer IS a would be pedophile.We have a murderer, with a high risk of reoffence and a lust for young boys, and you want to give him a hug and let him out?

Madness.

DE

Dr.Deus

And you know he's likely to do this again because.....
Did you see it in a movie once? Have you heard of it happening on TV? What reference do you have? Are you a psychiatrist? Do you have experience with mental disorders and chemical imbalances further than what you've heard on TV

Deus, Rasobi, I would just be curious on what your opinion is on the alternative I have outlined at the begining of this page? Agree, disagree? Any partciular reasons?

Deus, there are hundreds if not thousands of cases of violent criminals who have reintegrated into society, and even taken roles where they are directly helping and guiding others facing the same path they just came from.

While I was in jail I even read a book with testimonials of some of the most hardcore criminals in some Prison in the West. Those men served their time, multiple times, and are now helping others with spiritual and educational guidance. Although I was just some delinquet small time street youth at the time, I felt inspired by that book and the individuals who expressed their stories in it.

Now, how many other lives would have been lost by now if we had just shots, hung, electrocuted, gassed or killed in any merciless manner those people? Where would I be today if society did not see forgiveness in any way as an option?

Never give up on a person, ALWAYS have hope we can help change someones life for the better, no matter how ruthless a past (or present) they are coming from.

Do the Christian thing, Forgive and Help. All those criminals are victims of the Devil's corruption on humanity, and abandoning them is condeming their souls, and taking away a little part of our own.

DY
I'm not sure if banishment would be a great idea either. Back in the day, banishment was the equivalent of the death penalty, and I think it's similar now. If anything, it may force this already imbalanced person to revert to a feral state, causing more damage than good. However, I may have misunderstood your meaning.

Edit: Maybe feral is the wrong word. Perhaps more violent and antisocial would be a better description.

[edit on 17-10-2006 by Rasobasi420]

I agree with rab. It won't help us, he'll be a more savage killer if anything.

DYepes, I try not to think about the multiple-offenders much. I try not to think about the innocents who paid the price for them to find themselves. How many women did they rape? How many men and women and children suffered and died? Hundreds may have reintegrated into society, but how many didn't? There's a difference between peddling crack and rape, just like there's a difference between assault and murder.

I support capital punishment for capital crimes. And damned if this isn't a capital crime if I've ever seen one.

As for my credentials, I'm not a doctor. I do, however, have a college degree in Law and Private Security. Recidivism was a big issue for us. It was a pre-academy course, so policing and criminology were taken every year. I don't believe there is any excuse for rape, and only self-defence for murder. I don't care how crazy you are, or how loaded, or how misunderstood. Take some personal responsibility like our friend DYepes.

DE

Every homosexual man I've associated with on a regular basis has had psychological issues... primarily rage.

Gee, I wonder why?

Hostility breeds hatred - imagine being a teenage kid, and coming to the realization that you're a "fag", the most hated thing you can possibly be. I imagine you'd feel plenty of rage yourself.

Still there's no excuse for something like this. Literally millions of young men go through the same kind of thing, and manage not to kill anybody over it.

It's a sad story - one young life is ended prematurely, another is destroyed.
What a waste.

How can that make a person any more savage then spending years surrounded by the most savage people of society in an enclosed mini-city? How can it be any worse than the death penalty if we are not killing the person at all, but giving him/her the opportunity to live again?

See the thing is these people are going from the modern world where life is extremely easy, to the land of the animal. The sudden departure from such a life and the need to watch your back everytime you come around a tree is a life-awakening experience for someone who has come from a life of ready to eat food waiting to be grabbed at a store, or a comforting bed, sofa where one can actually relax. Or a cooled or heated shelter to keep you away from the elements. Do not underestimate a persons will to survive and their apprehension for ever having to live that way again.

Any time a person even thinks of a crime, that memory will come back into play, and they may just think twice.

It is my opinion and firm belief that our government should begin testing this as an option to our current methods of discipline. with the largest prison population on Earth, and growing everyday. Does it not seem wise to begin seeking an alternative to how we go about rehabilitating misguided people who have made irrational decisions?

Obviously it would be at least mercful to consider supplying those with no survival experience whatsoever with some basic supplies to aid in their survival and life-awakening expereicne away from modern society.

Tag em, track em, and study the results.

If these people deserve no mercy whatsoever, then there should be no qualms about doing this. And if we believe death and life imprisonment is too harsh, why would this also not be a good option if it is giving life, AND allowing rehabilitation in a possibly much shorter time frame?

Could be from hostility encountered growing up. Could be a result of trauma they suffered early in life. Could be just good old... nuts.

Either way, this event isn't rational. Something is wrong with the kid's brain. Fix it and he'll be fine... sorta.

>

xmotex
Gee, I wonder why?

Hostility breeds hatred - imagine being a teenage kid, and coming to the realization that you're a "fag", the most hated thing you can possibly be. I imagine you'd feel plenty of rage yourself.

[edit on 17-10-2006 by apc]

They do have their rightubder the 8th Amendment . I'm sure the UK has a similar law. The concept of testing on inmates, no matter what the result, doesn't sit well with many, so it may not go far.

Or perhaps the testing can be done as an optional choice for them. Life in prison, or 1-5 years in a wild land where you must survive, and then allowed back into society on probation. In most cases a typical human should in fact be able to survive. It is the hardship and solidarity that will change their way of thinking. If that can proove to be successful, we can see where it will lead from there.

Hey, so many laws are already being changed for the worse as far as citizens go, whats one more to help crinimals better reintergrate into society?

Well, how about this: When criminals prove they can re-enter society sucessfully, or they finish their sentence, they can be let back on the playground. I'm not sure how you're going to reintegrate them, as the fact of the matter is they didn't integrate in the first place...which is why they're in jail.

DE

Originally posted by DYepes
Hey, so many laws are already being changed for the worse as far as citizens go, whats one more to help crinimals better reintergrate into society?

Something tells me making them live like aminals won't help them reintergrate. (sorry... had to. )

You put a bunch of inmates into the forest... you end up with a few dead inmates, and a whole lot of [insert forum appropriate euphemism for "subservient cellmate"]es.

Unless you mean send them out to safari one at a time... which might take a while.

[edit on 17-10-2006 by apc]

Ok so how do you go about proving that Deus? Does this apply to even small infractions like mine? Would you prefer I had been locked away for the rest of my life? What standards would you have used to have me prove my ability to reintergrate me?

Umm apc, in case you have not noticed, it is already that way. They are in an urban safari. At least in that kind of setting, those who are victimized by bigger inmates or groups have a place to run and hide. they do not have to return and spend the rest of their duration with thoseinmates. What about the corrupt gaurds who allow horrible things to happen?

In this environment, luring an asshole towards a pack of wolves, a bear, gators or whatever is a much more fair way of defending yourself from power hungry assholes then gaurds whop continue to allow things to happen.

The current system allows tainted people to live like animals anyways, but pays for everything they need to be happy doing so. The system I propose gives everyone a level playing field. It also forces them to appreciate what a stable society has to offer.