How did Atta's passport actually survive?

a reply to: Jay-morris

Why don’t you do some honest research and you tell me? I think all the items you just asked have been provided and cited in this one thread? Is that a false statement?

And if you research the evidence log that holds the description of the passport, wonder what else is listed.

Then you have the Terrorists remains and DNA at the WTC.

And would you like to answer, why even bother planting the passport?

All you have is the disbelief a passport survived in the face of numerous crash examples where IDs and documents survived.

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Jay-morris

originally posted by: firerescue
a reply to: Jay-morris

These parts are from same plane, UNITED 175

sites.google.com...

sites.google.com...

sites.google.com...

Ok, so there was only one passport found, which happens to be from one of the terrorists on the plane?

How many passports would you expect on domestic flights?

More than one I would think.

Why?

We're they all American? Would they take their passport or ID card?

I do not know, as I do not know who was on the plane.

So you think there would be more than one just becuase you think there would be more than one

a reply to: neutronflux


No, he has the fact that the crook Bernie Kerik "found" the passport, and he has the fact that something OTHER THAN AA11 struck the tower.

Atta was a character in a play, and his passport was a stage prop meant to fool those easily fooled.

I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

a reply to: Salander

How is the passport “fooling” anyone? It was not even key placing the terrorists on the jets? Witness accounts, records, bank records, phone calls, and transactions do that.

Human remains and DNA places the terrorists at the towers. Along with the jet wreckage that ended up on the street.

Why are you worried about an oddity that is a footnote in history, was not used as key evidence, was not even needed evidence, was not the only evidence, history shows passports do survive jet crashes, and there is no logical reason to plant the passport in the first place.

Because you don’t care about truth. It’s about pushing nothing but innuendo as credible evidence.

originally posted by: Jay-morris
I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Just the usual argument from incredulity fallacy that is standard for conspiracy theorists then

With a false dichotomy thrown in as a bonus

originally posted by: Jay-morris
I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Who is saying it is not odd. I think the argument by referencing crash history and jet wreckage ending up on the street shows it was very possible. It would be odd if there was no recognizable personal items with the wreckage in the street in the context of jet crash history.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Has nothing to do with the government that should be continuously scrutinized. It has everything to do with a truth movement with real credibility issues and populated with con artists pushing innuendo as credible evidence. A truth movement that should also be scrutinized.

Is there a credible reason to plant the passport? What would it gain?

originally posted by: Jay-morris
I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Like I said looking at one single result and working back is the wrong way to look at probability.

What do you think were the chances of this happening



After a fire a bent metal beam supported by a wooden beam now if someone said that could happen you would have thought no way.

a reply to: Jay-morris

We're they all American? Would they take their passport or ID card?
I do not know, as I do not know who was on the plane.

So why don't you simply lookup the flight manifest ....??

Is that too difficult for you.....??

www.911myths.com...:Flight_175_Manifest_a.jpg

As this was a domestic flight between 2 American cities, passports were not required

The terrorists being foreigners would require a passport for ID purposes, lacking documentation such as drivers license,
social security cards or other forms of id

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Jay-morris
I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Just the usual argument from incredulity fallacy that is standard for conspiracy theorists then

With a false dichotomy thrown in as a bonus

It is not a fallacy to use common sense when analyzing events. It is not a fallacy to consider the character of the persons making statements in the analysis of events. Liars lie, and politicians and government officials lie very often.

Common Sense is a good thing, not a fallacy. The entire story of 911 fails at every turn. It cannot be true, so why should a person with any common sense believe it?

originally posted by: Salander

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Jay-morris
I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Just the usual argument from incredulity fallacy that is standard for conspiracy theorists then

With a false dichotomy thrown in as a bonus

It is not a fallacy to use common sense when analyzing events. It is not a fallacy to consider the character of the persons making statements in the analysis of events. Liars lie, and politicians and government officials lie very often.

Common Sense is a good thing, not a fallacy. The entire story of 911 fails at every turn. It cannot be true, so why should a person with any common sense believe it?

It is a fallacy to decide that something couldn't have happened simply because you don't believe it could have happened.

originally posted by: Salander

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Jay-morris
I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Just the usual argument from incredulity fallacy that is standard for conspiracy theorists then

With a false dichotomy thrown in as a bonus

It is not a fallacy to use common sense when analyzing events. It is not a fallacy to consider the character of the persons making statements in the analysis of events. Liars lie, and politicians and government officials lie very often.

Common Sense is a good thing, not a fallacy. The entire story of 911 fails at every turn. It cannot be true, so why should a person with any common sense believe it?

It's about time you put up or shut up you spout the same BS every 9/11 thread your on look what happened with the Empire State Building crash.

Upon impact, the plane’s jet fuel exploded, filling the interior of the building with flames all the way down to the 75th floor and sending flames out of the hole the plane had ripped open in the building’s side.

Now although this plane had a maximum of 974 gallons if fully loaded with fuel (not 10,000) it still managed to cause fires over 4 floors in a building that wasn't open plan like the Towers. Now how many times has it been claimed on here by the truther side that ALL the fuel would be burnt in the explosion so as we can see they are WRONG.

While the 78th and 79th floors bore the brunt of the damage, one of the B-25's engines fell down an elevator shaft and set off a major fire in the basement. The other engine hurtled across the building and tore through seven walls before emerging from the 33rd Street side of the tower. The debris crashed through the roof of a thirteen-story building across the street where another fire erupted. Other heavy wreckage, including the landing gear, also caused damage to the Empire State and nearby buildings while Stan Lomax reportedly saw part of a wing catapulting towards Madison Avenue.

An engine snapped an elevator cable while at least one woman was riding in the elevator car. The emergency auto brake saved the woman from crashing to the bottom, but the engine fell down the shaft and landed on top of it. Quick-thinking rescuers pulled the woman from the elevator, saving her life.

Gloria Pall worked for the United Service Organization's headquarters on the 56th floor.
"I was at the file cabinet and all of a sudden the building felt like it was just going to topple over," Pall said. "It threw me across the room, and I landed against the wall. People were screaming and looking at each other. We didn't know what to do. We didn't know if it was a bomb or what happened.

How many of those are similar to the events at 9/11 lets see some of your common sense in action

a reply to: Salander

is it true or false there is a long history of IDs and documents surviving jet crashes and jets being blown out of the air by missiles?

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Salander

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Jay-morris
I just find it hard to believe thst people do not find this odd, not even one bit. The only passport found, just so happend to be from one of the terrorists. The chances itself of a passport surviving is quite extraordinary, but to be from the terrorist that is odd.

But of course, we should never question the government, or the official story :/

Just the usual argument from incredulity fallacy that is standard for conspiracy theorists then

With a false dichotomy thrown in as a bonus

It is not a fallacy to use common sense when analyzing events. It is not a fallacy to consider the character of the persons making statements in the analysis of events. Liars lie, and politicians and government officials lie very often.

Common Sense is a good thing, not a fallacy. The entire story of 911 fails at every turn. It cannot be true, so why should a person with any common sense believe it?

It is a fallacy to decide that something couldn't have happened simply because you don't believe it could have happened.

It is an irrational act to believe the statements of known liars. That makes it a fallacy too, no?

a reply to: wmd_2008


It is 16 years later, and therefore "certainly about time" that you put up or shut up about the official fairytale you defend here.

But I know full well that is not about to happen. The official story is invalid in so many ways that even the Commission itself declared 60+ times that "it found no evidence" to support various claims made by the official story.

Yessir, anytime you like you could put up or shut up.

a reply to: Salander

They say empty vessel's make the most noise between your ears must be the noisiest place in the universe. You have NO understanding of construction or the loads imposed on these structures oh and yes I will have fries with that

a reply to: Salander

What is it like to be so far down the rabbit hole you cannot see the con artists of the truth movement? The ones your little quotes also apply to?

So far up fantasy conspiracy creek you cannot answer one simple question because it will sink you conspiracist’s life ring?

is it true or false there is a long history of IDs and documents surviving jet crashes and jets being blown out of the air by missiles?

For the bonus question; with all the evidence of the terrorists purchasing and boarding the jets, what purpose would planted evidence serve? What would be the motive. How was the passport key to anything? Why would somebody bother?

a reply to: wmd_2008


You are correct that I am neither an engineer nor a construction expert.

But analysis of the so-called "big picture" regarding 911 is an understanding of human behavior.

For anybody with an understanding of human behavior, the government cover-up is very easy to observe. If the government has nothing to hide, why is it hiding so much?

Is the cover-up worse than the crime? Do we need to start another thread to analyze that question?

a reply to: Salander

Cover up of what? No jets and your pet theory nuclear weapons brought down the towers? Please do list the evidence.....