What are the ailens waiting for?

Originally posted by tha stillz

Not to derail the thread, but religion is one of the worst things that has happened to earth and humanity. Islam, Christianity, Judism they are all the same load of horse sht. I believe in god, but not in the meaningless rituals or ideologies that force populations to collide - this is not godly.

I am so sorry that religion has done so much harm to you, because appearantly it has in order for you to say such ludicrous.

Religion is not what causes conflict between people. Those conflicts between people are easily modivated by political and racial differences as they are to religious ones.

Don't make religion be an excuse to why people are always fighting one another.

I mean heck if we were all athiests, we would still be fighting one another and probably for even more dumber reasons.

Religion has done far more good than bad and the reason why there appears to be so much harm from religions is actually a part of our own aggressive nature that just wouldn't die.

Originally posted by Shar_Chi
It's not just that we blow each other up... I mean, that one's painfully obvious. It's also our ignorant manner towards everything else. Honestly, we rape the planet for short term profits. We treat animals like absolute dirt. And we've already started taking our particular blend of greed + arrogance into space.

Let's face facts, humanity could be really really good, but as a whole, we suck pretty hard. Stop waiting for alien messiahs to fix things for you & get busy.

You sound like an extraterrestrial messiah...

Originally posted by Mouth
Do you all realize how far away everything else is?

Are you aware of how old the Universe is?

Originally posted by Mouth
First off, the conditions for life to exist on a planet must be pretty perfect... i.e. distance from the star, size of the planet, rotation, types of gas, etc etc.

No it doesn't...

Life can survive and be developed in almost any condition thinkable... The only life we have found so far its self can exist in a wide range of improbable conditions.

Originally posted by Mouth
The closes star is over 4 light years away, which is reeaaallly far.

For us it is...

Originally posted by Mouth
Just from that fact, it seems rather silly for any alien race to come all the way over here just for one planet.

Unless there is something on this planet this is very important and they already own everything else in this Galaxy (plus any other galaxies)

Originally posted by Mouth
I just can't believe that aliens would come all this way for the pointless little rock that we live on, compared to the amount of resources located not only in our galaxy, but others as well.

It isn't as pointless if you add in this probabilities. (Actualities)

1) There is an advance race of beings that have been scurring across the Universe for millions or even billions of years and is so smart that extinction to them is impossibility.
2) Because of them every other race has been successful not to become extinct.
3) The entire universe or a good portion of it or maybe just this galaxy has been explored.
4) They created life on this planet and like responsible adults are trying to succeed in raising them to humane and decent individuals within the galactic collective. Or they've ignored Earth when they first got here and now this is all that remains.

[edit on 16-8-2006 by Timeseer]

Whew, this thread has been all over the map on this question. It seems that, somehow, this question can evoke discussions about the NWO, benevolent aliens, evil ones, even some brief input on the Middle Question. Yet this question hasn't been answered directly. What are the aliens waiting for? That's easy, the aliens are waiting for the RIGHT TIME.

Please don't take my comment as being flippant. I do have a point to make.

I am, as many members of ATS (perhaps), a fan of science fiction. One of the mainstays of this genre of literature is the concept of Terra-forming. That is, just in case one doesn't know, the process of manipulating the existing conditions on a planet to make it more inhabitable. in the case of TERRA-forming, for humans. This process is not, at least in the science fiction that I've read, a very quick procedure. It's not conceivable, at least in our technologically limited imaginations, that making an inhospitable planet into one that could readily sustain life for humans.

Perhaps the aliens have been subjecting the earth through the lengthy process of "alien-forming", "Mars forming", "Alpha Centauri-forming", well you get the idea, to make the planet Earth capable of sustaining THEIR KIND comfortably?

Of course I don't have evidence of this but it is interesting to note that the Earth has been undergoing climate change -- rapid climate change -- for a number of years. It is interesting to note that the concept of global warming is a relatively recent concept in geological circles. It wasn't that long ago that the prevailing concept among geologists and environmental scientists was one of an impending ice age, that is, global cooling. This was a prevalent belief as recently as the sixties.

It's obvious that "something" is going on with our environment. Perhaps, the geologists in the sixties noticed the thermometer rising and simply changed their opinion from the concept of glaciers growing across North America to the idea that it will now be an arid desert or a torrid zone. The concept of global warming has certainly become more and more an accepted given.

What has caused this global warming? There are those who can immediately point their accusatory fingers at the actions of man, the industrialization of the world, pollution and any number of other "causes". Yet there are pundits of this theory that point out that man could not possibly change or alter the environment this drastically, this quickly. Who's right? ..... Who cares? The truth is the word does seem to be getting progressively warmer and we don't know what to do about it -- if anything.

This is where I get back to answering the question posed by the thread, "What are the aliens waiting for?" My answer is; they are waiting for the "right time". They could be waiting for the fruits of their "alien - forming" technologies to produce a planet that the aliens find hospitable or, perhaps, more reminiscent of "home".

I would hazard a guess and say that the alien "homeworld" is a place where it's a lot hotter than our earth is now. There probably are a lot of deserts on their home planet and it might be quite arid.

This is where I bring in the water aspect into the mix.

By making the planet Earth warmer through their "alien forming" technologies, they are melting the polar ice caps. They are turning all of that ice into liquid water and I would suppose that handling liquid is easier than handling large chunks of ice. This would enable the aliens to transport water -- what could be a precious commodity on their arid homeworld -- back. So the aliens might be transforming the weather on Earth to either make our planet more hospitable or they might simply be making the process of collecting ALL OF OUR WATER more efficient. But again, they have to wait for the planet to get warming.

Originally posted by Gazrok

I pose a simple question. What are the ailens waiting for? By this I mean, if they are the high beings and they see humanity tearing itself apart, why would they not reveal themselves and help humanity. So far God and religion hasn't helped humanity. The gov'ts of the world haven't helped any and Now these craft and beings that people have seen leave no impact, .......what gives?

Why assume their motives are peaceful or to help mankind?

Looking at the evidence, we see...
1. primary interests involved investigating defense installations
2. abduction of citizens
3. a desire for secrecy
4. evasive action when confronted

Given this, we can make many assumptions...sadly, "helping man" isn't one of those logical assumptions.

Another typical human reaction. This sadden me too.
1. They don't want human to blow up nuclear weapon in space. Nuclear explosions goes behond physical dimension and interferes with subtle/finer level of existence, where other beings might be living in.
2. It has been said that the cover groups have technology to induce everything from memories and dreams to make you think you were abducted. All that mixed with the right type of drugs.
3. There is no desire for secrecracy, but they are sure darn waiting for our sprirituality to come par with our technical development.
4. Humans are evil. Shoot first, ask questions later. You darn bet i would escape when confronted if the first thing i see when i come on a new planet is a gun pointed at me.

5. You should consider that help might be coming not from the physical realm, but more finer realms.

If you stop thinking as a Human, and try to see yourself in the skin of an advance being visiting a more primitive planet, you can find plenty of reasons for not interacting with them directly, especialy when you know one of the top power on the planet is corrupted to the bones, i'm talking about the US here.

[edit on 16-8-2006 by Toc]

Originally posted by Timeseer

Originally posted by tha stillz

Not to derail the thread, but religion is one of the worst things that has happened to earth and humanity. Islam, Christianity, Judism they are all the same load of horse sht. I believe in god, but not in the meaningless rituals or ideologies that force populations to collide - this is not godly.

I am so sorry that religion has done so much harm to you, because appearantly it has in order for you to say such ludicrous.

Religion is not what causes conflict between people. Those conflicts between people are easily modivated by political and racial differences as they are to religious ones.

Don't make religion be an excuse to why people are always fighting one another.

I mean heck if we were all athiests, we would still be fighting one another and probably for even more dumber reasons.

Religion has done far more good than bad and the reason why there appears to be so much harm from religions is actually a part of our own aggressive nature that just wouldn't die.

Originally posted by Shar_Chi
It's not just that we blow each other up... I mean, that one's painfully obvious. It's also our ignorant manner towards everything else. Honestly, we rape the planet for short term profits. We treat animals like absolute dirt. And we've already started taking our particular blend of greed + arrogance into space.

Let's face facts, humanity could be really really good, but as a whole, we suck pretty hard. Stop waiting for alien messiahs to fix things for you & get busy.

You sound like an extraterrestrial messiah...

Originally posted by Mouth
Do you all realize how far away everything else is?

Are you aware of how old the Universe is?

Originally posted by Mouth
First off, the conditions for life to exist on a planet must be pretty perfect... i.e. distance from the star, size of the planet, rotation, types of gas, etc etc.

No it doesn't...

Life can survive and be developed in almost any condition thinkable... The only life we have found so far its self can exist in a wide range of improbable conditions.

Originally posted by Mouth
The closes star is over 4 light years away, which is reeaaallly far.

For us it is...

Originally posted by Mouth
Just from that fact, it seems rather silly for any alien race to come all the way over here just for one planet.

Unless there is something on this planet this is very important and they already own everything else in this Galaxy (plus any other galaxies)

Originally posted by Mouth
I just can't believe that aliens would come all this way for the pointless little rock that we live on, compared to the amount of resources located not only in our galaxy, but others as well.

It isn't as pointless if you add in this probabilities. (Actualities)

1) There is an advance race of beings that have been scurring across the Universe for millions or even billions of years and is so smart that extinction to them is impossibility.
2) Because of them every other race has been successful not to become extinct.
3) The entire universe or a good portion of it or maybe just this galaxy has been explored.
4) They created life on this planet and like responsible adults are trying to succeed in raising them to humane and decent individuals within the galactic collective. Or they've ignored Earth when they first got here and now this is all that remains.

[edit on 16-8-2006 by Timeseer]

I don't agree with you. Religion has been the source of the planet largest battles ever seen. I'm sure someone with some good knowledge of religion history could jump in now and show you. Heck, people are still arguing about religion all over the globe even today. In god we trust...coming from the mouth of Bush, so ridiculous...

Originally posted by benevolent tyrant
Whew, this thread has been all over the map on this question. It seems that, somehow, this question can evoke discussions about the NWO, benevolent aliens, evil ones, even some brief input on the Middle Question. Yet this question hasn't ...
would suppose that handling liquid is easier than handling large chunks of ice. This would enable the aliens to transport water -- what could be a precious commodity on their arid homeworld -- back. So the aliens might be transforming the weather on Earth to either make our planet more hospitable or they might simply be making the process of collecting ALL OF OUR WATER more efficient. But again, they have to wait for the planet to get warming.

This is total nonsense. Cars and industries are the ones raising the CO2 level in our atmosphere, not aliens... It's the work of the military-industrial complex my friend. Stop putting evil behavior on species we even didn't comfirm were bad.

This is again typical human reaction, projecting their vision onto things, and generalising their behavoir to other species. It's not because human are power thirsty that every one else in the universe is...

I get the feeling they're biding their time - working with those who have accepted them as a reality, staing hidden from those who would exploit them for commerce or novelty (or experimentation)...

Remember - just because they haven't contacted YOU yet, doesn't mean they haven't contacted others.

Originally posted by GENERAL EYES
I get the feeling they're biding their time - working with those who have accepted them as a reality, staing hidden from those who would exploit them for commerce or novelty (or experimentation)...

Remember - just because they haven't contacted YOU yet, doesn't mean they haven't contacted others.

HEY! you got a point here GENERAL. And this totaly makes sense too... The problem is we don't have that much longer to wake up and do something about our destructive manners...

Originally posted by Gazrok

Why assume their motives are peaceful or to help mankind?

Looking at the evidence, we see...
1. primary interests involved investigating defense installations
2. abduction of citizens
3. a desire for secrecy
4. evasive action when confronted

Given this, we can make many assumptions...sadly, "helping man" isn't one of those logical assumptions.

I'm not convinced this assumption is accurate. From reported sightings we can assume thier interests include defense installations, it may not be their primary interest.

In addition, all of the above characteristics could also pertain to my government.

1. My goverment shows interest in other nations defense installations, as well as their own.

2. My government has abducted citizens.

3. My government obviously desires secrecy on many issues.

4. My government has demonstrated evasive actions when confronted about certain issues.

I'm not totally dismissing your valid observations, but you could use the same logic to make the following statement about the governments of the world....

Given this, we can make many assumptions...sadly, "helping man" isn't one of those logical assumptions.

I'm not totally dismissing your valid observations, but you could use the same logic to make the following statement about the governments of the world....

Are you saying that governments DO desire to help mankind? The same logic applies because the same thing CAN be said for governments! (at least to a degree)

Remember that most governments are created out of a desire to provide safety and basic needs, not for some altruistic ideal.... In addition, the goal of those in power (in any kind of government), is to stay in power, even if in other capacities within government.

Originally posted by Toc
I don't agree with you. Religion has been the source of the planet largest battles ever seen.

Like what battles? The crusades? The crusades have been more about political issues then religious ones. In fact some of these politicals are intertwined with religious issues that make the entire calamity appear to be a religious war. But it was actually a political war associating with the power of the Pope over the people of Europe and his competition against the rising power of Islam. It seems religious, but that is because they are theocratic institutions. So their political issues appear alot like religious ones, just because of these grounds.

Originally posted by Toc
I'm sure someone with some good knowledge of religion history could jump in now and show you.

Show what? The conflict between Ireland and Britain? That has more to do with racial issues than religious ones. The Irish want to remain fully indepedent and identified solely for their racial identity as a national identity. This in part has to deal with their catholic background, which is just a part of their cultural identity. Catholicism is a part of the Irish cultural identity.

Originally posted by Toc
Heck, people are still arguing about religion all over the globe even today.

Yes but unless they involve something more concrete like racial or political issues, they don't erupt into gruesome battles.

Take the conflict between Israel and Arabs that is as much of a racial issue as it is a religious one. But if it wasn't a racial issue, then it wouldn't have become as much of a conflict as it did. There is a large conflict between Shia and Sunni muslims, but because they are both Arabs, they eccentially still get alone, unless a political issue arises.

Originally posted by Toc
In god we trust...coming from the mouth of Bush, so ridiculous...

The Bush Administrations loves trying to tie in religion to their politcial decision planning.

"We must protect Israel, because it is the holyland and not because of political ties with that nation and Britain."

The war with Iraq was bassed off of Economic issues, which in sense was actually just greedy politicians wanting to grab a piece of that land's oil.

[edit on 16-8-2006 by Timeseer]

Originally posted by Timeseer
The crusades have been more about political issues then religious ones. In fact some of these politicals are intertwined with religious issues that make the entire calamity appear to be a religious war.
....
Show what? The conflict between Ireland and Britain? That has more to do with racial issues than religious ones.

The proiblem here, Timeseer, is that racism involves religion. Anti semetism is racism against a religion. So, saying historical wars were based on racism and not religion is false, since opponents were racist against their enemy's religious beliefs.

click here to read up a bit on religious wars.

timeseer, unfortunately you have been brainwashed- religion sucks. God is cool but religion is stupid.

Do a little research on religious wars in india... There were many. And they were bloody.

I know you don't want to believe this so you won't... so I guess it is pointless to continue a dialogue with you.

Peace

Originally posted by Mouth

I just can't believe that aliens would come all this way for the pointless little rock that we live on, compared to the amount of resources located not only in our galaxy, but others as well.

I assume that you were born and grew up on this 'pointless little rock'. If thats the case then you wouldn't have much of a perspective to really determine what aliens would or would not be interested in. Anymore than, say, cows who grow up in nice green fields munching on grass all of their lives until they see a cowboy on a horse and think "that cowboy surely couldn't be interested in little 'ol me."

Originally posted by Mouth

One more thing, I think the only contact we will see, at least in our lifetime, is maybe some sort of machine that is controlled from far away, landing on our planet.

Uh, yeah...they're called 'grays'.

Originally posted by Mouth

we still have yet to discover a planet that is even close to being habitable for out kind of environment.

Who is we, Mouth?

Many of us know that all planets in our solar system are habitable for 'our' kind of environment. That includes Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Mercury, Neptune and all the rest.

You might consider qualifying your statement by saying, "...based on information fed to me by NASA I believe we have yet to discover..."

That way, if it turns out NASA was feeding you disinformation, you would have a way out of that box you claim you are thinking outside of.

Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by Mouth

I just can't believe that aliens would come all this way for the pointless little rock that we live on, compared to the amount of resources located not only in our galaxy, but others as well.

I assume that you were born and grew up on this 'pointless little rock'. If thats the case then you wouldn't have much of a perspective to really determine what aliens would or would not be interested in. Anymore than, say, cows who grow up in nice green fields munching on grass all of their lives until they see a cowboy on a horse and think "that cowboy surely couldn't be interested in little 'ol me."

Isn't that always the case with all living beings be they human or what have you as value is in the eye of the beholder.

Originally posted by johnlear
Many of us know that all planets in our solar system are habitable for 'our' kind of environment. That includes Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Mercury, Neptune and all the rest.

I am speechless... *starts imaginating possibilities of living on Saturn* :O

Originally posted by johnlear

Many of us know that all planets in our solar system are habitable for 'our' kind of environment. That includes Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Mercury, Neptune and all the rest.

Oh really? All planets are habitable?
Got some evidence to back that up? I think I would rather trust the experts on that subject. Just the fact that a certain range of temperature for us is required to live, pretty much ends that argument

That way, if it turns out NASA was feeding you disinformation, you would have a way out of that box you claim you are thinking outside of.

please.

From the other angle..
We have yet to understand each other, logic differs from nation to nation, sex to sex, person to person etc. One could say that logic could, infact should differ vastly from kind to kind. Sooo.. Why are we still discussing their objectives? Pointless as of yet imo.
With that thought lets get to the SETI program. What actually influences the tech path of a kind? My bet would be: 1) enviromnent 2) logic. What NASA is looking for with SETI is a same planet like ours, same system like ours, with the samiliar kind populating it. Go figure why. Electromagnetism could be pretty obvious for us, but for ETI? And viceversa. There is only one possible tech pass and we know all of it? Yeah, and the sun orbits Earth, wich is flat.

Originally posted by Mouth

Oh really? All planets are habitable?
Got some evidence to back that up?

I think common sense would be enough...but if you believe that Venus has an atmosphere of sulphuric acid plus 90 bars of pressure plus hot flowing lava all over the place plus a surface temperature of 800 degrees... I've got some valuable swampland to sell you.

I think I would rather trust the experts on that subject. Just the fact that a certain range of temperature for us is required to live, pretty much ends that argument.

Uh huh. Please remember that the only gas giant in our solar system is NASA.





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