How Can There Not Be A God

Originally posted by Mrknighttime32
You cannot see air but you can feel that too.

I can feel a breeze. I can see the effects of the wind. Scientifically, it can be explained. I breath air. Science has explained how our bodies use air. I may not be able to 'see' air, but I can see the effects of it moving and I see my chest rise and fall in concert with air moving in and out of me.

Sight isn't the only indication of something existing. We have (at least) 5 senses with which to experience our existence.

I have experienced no indication of what you call God. Don't get me wrong, I have had profound moments of joy, wonder, awe. I love more deeply than I can express. I just don't attribute any of that to something called God. These feelings and experiences come from me.

I am not looking for or worshipping anything.

Originally posted by Mrknighttime32
I still want the reasons of why you think God does not exsist.

Because I have no indication that 'he' does.

[edit on 25-5-2006 by Benevolent Heretic]

Like I said I want to know reasons why people feel the way they feel, but let me tell you something what if science is wrong it is created by man and man is wrong lots of times. You say that you have feelings of love and joy well my friend unless you are evil and doing bad things for joy then you are feeling God you just choose not to believe the truth. I challenge you to read the bible every night for 40 days straight and come back here and tell me what you think then. I bet if you were on your death bed you might call out to God too or if your child or family was in danger you would call out to him to. (God Forbid)

I gave you my reason, didn't I? That first sentence must not be directed to me.

Originally posted by Mrknighttime32
unless you are evil and doing bad things for joy then you are feeling God

I don't attribute my good feelings to God any more than I attribute the days when I'm depresed, sad or lonely to God. If I attributed my 'good' feelings to God, wouldn't I have to attribute my 'bad' feelings to him, too? Instead, I just own all my feelings myself. That way I don't have to get confused about who to attribute them to.

I challenge you to read the bible every night for 40 days straight and come back here and tell me what you think then.

I was raised on the bible. I read it for 15 years or so. Forty days isn't going to change my beliefs.

I bet if you were on your death bed you might call out to God too

Mrknighttime32 - I've been on my death bed. I'm a cancer survivor. I'm not at all afraid of death. I have no reason to 'call out' to anyone when I die. I am not afraid.

I understand you believe in God and I think that's great. I really do. I think it's great that you have your faith and it helps you in your life. But I don't have the same needs.

But why do you think that you are a survivor of cancer and many other people arent is that just luck or what do you think of that. Maybe God is trying to show you is powers, or show others His power through you.

Originally posted by Mrknighttime32
Can a con artist die for three days the rise again

The purported resurrection of Jesus/Issa is highly questionable and for a number of reasons.

First, there is evidence found in India that there was someone named Issa (and also Jus Asaf - which means "leader of the healed"), who was considered a great prophet with many Gifts of the Spirit. Just before dying AT THE AGE OF EIGHTY he declared to be the GALILEAN MESSIAH. They even have his tomb in Kashmir.

Issa/Jus Asaf Escaped Death On The Cross & Died In India At 80 After Proclaiming To Be The Galilean Messiah

The second argument is simply the lack of current evidence to support the idea that Jesus can come back from the dead NOW.

Given the opportunity and ability, most of us would come back from the dead in fully grown bodies all the time.

So what's the problem?

Is Jesus just practicing some kind of "divine detachment"?

Whatever that is.

Or rather, the more likely possibility, he never came back from the dead in the first place and can't do so now either.

Third, aren't gods supposed to be COMPASSIONATE and MORALLY RESPONSIBLE?

Why is Jesus allowing many priests, ministers - and some nuns too - who preach in his name no less, to sexually molest and in some cases RAPE thousands of innocent children around the world?

They have a name for people like that in the legal system. They are called ENABLERS.

At the very least, Jesus is an ENABLER for PEDOPHILE ATROCITIES in his own churches!

A poor god indeed.

All of the above detracts from the whole "Jesus is Lord" paradigm.

Why does there always have to be a Why for the human mind to comprehend phenomenon? Perhaps that is merely just something we are imposing on the event due to our own egos (in order to understand it in relation to ourselves). Sure there is a cause and effect to all events, but that is not indicative of a Why in any philosopical sense. There is a difference; You either see it or you don't. Nothing else on this planet appears to need some concept of a consious creater in order to exist.

hiya

This is a topic that has battered my brain for a long time

I was born into christianity and tbh it was that that made me disbelieve! im 31 years of age and can honestly say that it has only been of late that i can declare to be a firm believer in God. Ive studied many religions over the years and even dabbled in the occult to, imo ones belief in god is determined by how they define god or how they wanna percieve god to be. We all tend to compile our own ideas due to knowledge we gather and analytical observations of the world we live in, whether he/she or it(potent or omni-potent) exists!

Life has taught me that the devil exists and i can honestly say ive danced with him, therefore if he exists then so does god! if god is everything and nothing, god is whomever or whatever u want it to be, to me god can be merely the intention in a mans heart, if his intentions are good then he walks with god, if his intentions are bad then he walks with the devil. You could say that some do both but isnt that merely just encompassing the infinite possibilities that is life,god ,death and the devil.

The notion of of god is just so hard to grasp due to all the religions out there with there god or gods doctrines that they spew out over and over to fill there begging bowls and recruit another sucker to control, thats not gods way!lol

I can talk about this all day but to me if all god is, is the intention in my heart then thats good enuff for me, cus i walk with love and truth and couldnt ask for more!

find yrself and u will find god, dont worry i wont say i told u so when u get to agartha! hehe

SouLJa

if its known fact a person or thing can't know anything new except based on experience. Where di the original experience come from?

Next with the above said how could 5 senses evolve from nothing known?

Its human nature not to accept something you have lost knowing and its fine I wish the churches and the people with no faith would see human nature of this and why its done in stead of the great debate that seems to raise anger in so many. Not say your post but some of the posts I have seen are just bitter. Also the thought of Heaven and Hell. We are all not perfect and we all make mistakes I think it comes down to a moment after a life of learning where we will go. If your faced or all of us faced with ultimate truth which path will you pick? Maybe the right path is a little harder when the time comes. Than again maybe it will be easier for someone who holds strong faith.

Its a question that goes through all of our heads and I imagine must of us struggle with it everyday. Even the ones who feel they have found faith I imagine they question it as well. Human nature.

science can't show proof of god so there is none?
People who have took the study beyond evolution and maybe dove into some mysteries end with chaos. both are easy outs for an answer unknown...

Originally posted by Jugg
I, myself, do not believe in a god. Not a christian god nor a muslim god.

Why? Because evolution and natural selection makes so much more sense, if you bother reading real stuff about it, instead of listening to Kent Hovinds lies.

[edit on 26-5-2006 by 32genroman]

[edit on 26-5-2006 by 32genroman]

There is no god but Allah the moon god:LOL:

If a friend that I have known for years to whom I would trust my home, my wealth (?) and my lady were to say to me "I have just seen a pink Elephant flying at altitude 200 feet in your living room" I would consider him mad or playing the fool.
The reason? Although I know the friend, common sense and experience has shown me that there are no flying pink elephants, let alone in my living room.

If he said Keira Knightly was naked in my living room gagging for it. I would not believe it. Keira exists, apparently, so does my front room, but common sense allows me to form the opinion that my friend is not correct.

Substitute god for the pink elephant and there you go. If I did not see for myself, feel for myself and hear for myself that god was in my living room, then as a rational human being how can I believe its existence just because someone told me so?

What the god squad are really saying is that someone they never knew or met, thousands of years ago, say that they met a supernatural entity, told some people, who then wrote it all down.

Where is this god now eh? Bit shy isn't he / she / it?

If ever the bloke was needed it was now.

To me science has proven that he / she /it is not there.
Religion scared its slaves into believing god was in heaven above and the devil below. Well we have bored quite deep into the earth and no devil yet.

We been to the moon and beyond and guess what...no god. So where do you say he is now eh?

The cupboard under the stairs perhaps?
Perhaps hes fallen behind the cushion on the sofa with some spare change and the TV remote?
Perhaps hes sharing a flat with Lord Lucan?

He is not there. Is he?

Go on godly people prove he is there. Saying nonsense like I know hes there he is in my heart etc. C'mon.

Why did he / she /it pick out one little piece of the world to spread the world? Did not the rest of the world matter?
All I see is riches and exploitation in its name. The evil that man has done in its name without it calling wrong doers to account is enough for me.

I could go on but I will not. We come this way once, eat, drink be merry hump till it falls off.
Till a burning bush says "Hello I'm god" I will carry on and enjoy life.
Any way you guys say your god will forgive me anyway as long as I confess so I see no need for change......

Do I want any part of an entity that allows his agents to, beat woman (islam), bugger little boys (cathies) or think they are superiorly smug (shonkies). Although the jews do provide entertainment with their comedy beards and hats....

Peace my friends

At this moment in time I do not have enough information (read: proof) to say for sure. I am open to the idea of God or no God. I just hope that there is some type of afterlife, and not simply a neverending black abyss.

I personally refuse to accept that the God of modern Christianity is God, though. I refuse to believe that something all-powerful would demand worship and sentence you to be tortured forever if you don't. If there is a God, it would be more like a nurturing, caring mother. A parent doesn't banish it's children into fire because they disagree with it. If there is a creator God, not only are we God's precious creations, but we ourselves are a part of God.

So basically if there is a God, I don't think it would be a very angry schizophrenic man with a long white beard.

Originally posted by Mrknighttime32
But why do you think that you are a survivor of cancer and many other people arent is that just luck or what do you think of that.

I am a survivor because I found it in time for the medical community to rid my body of it. My very best lifelong friend was not so fortunate. It was too late by the time she learned she had cancer and she died from it last year. Death is part of life. As to why me? Why her? I don't know. And I have no need to know. It may be some grand design, it may be a crap shoot. I don't know, and there's really no way for me to know, and it really doesn't matter to me.

Maybe God is trying to show you is powers, or show others His power through you.

If there is something called God and he wants to show me something, I'm right here. He can show me he exists by appearing to me, talking to me or otherwise 'showing' me that he exists. But I won't make up stories like "maybe this or maybe that" and base my belief system on it. To me, saying that 'maybe God wants to show me his powers' is the same as saying 'Maybe a pink elephant of light saved my body from cancer'. Yeah, I think I'll believe that. I have no reason to believe that. It's that simple.

I know it's difficult for someone who believes so strongly in God to understand my position on this, and actually I don't really expect you to understand. I'm just explaining because you asked (and this happens to be a favorite topic of mine).

And I also have no need nor desire to convince anyone to believe the way I do.

I am a very spiritual person. I do believe in life after death. I have had many indications that it exists and is full of a powerful love we can't really experience here. But I have no indication that a deity exists there. I just believe there's a lot more to 'us' than we are consciously aware of.

hiya

Tbh m8 i believe in myself and by doing that im believing in god!, at one time i asked questions like- if god created man then what created god, they could say- god came from nothing, then i could say- well if god came from nothin then why not man!lol

Mang its like a serpent eating itself away from tail to head!

Ask yrself 1 question what is more important and relevant, knowing how you got here or that you are here and why?Id say the latter

Its apparant in life fullstop that everything has an opposite, so even when there was nothing there had to be something, same as night and day, on and off, in and out, existance anti-existance, christ and anti-christ

theres no knowledge like self knowledge so embrace yr true selves and do what you came here to do!

Peace to u all

SouLJa

How come there were numerous other gospels, yet these were destroyed due to one mans decision back in the 12 or 1300's I believe? Who knows what is real about religion.

Also out of all the planets in the universe (trillions).....he created everything in 6 days..and decided to have earth, a planet in the back waters of the milky way galaxy, have his only son be sacrifced?

Does this mean that there is no other life anywhere in the universe (no scienctific proof but the odds would be outstanding that we are alone)? Or that if there is, if they have what we call a religion then that's it's wrong?

I've always felt that religion is used as a control.....though my belief is that there is a hell of a lot more going on in the universe than we know......like higher planes of existance...not that there is one individual running everything.

[edit on 26-5-2006 by ferretman2]

Originally posted by Census
If it were as simple as "survival of the fittest" then what purpose does a purple orchid in the jungle have...how did flowering plants evolve and from what, how did photosynthesis evlove, how did thought evolve, how does everything come from nothing?


I refuse to be darwins monkey

where did God come from then? did he magically appear or has he been here forever? if he has been here forever, then i guess it'll be a long time before he gets here, because time goes backwards forever. and if you disagree about time going backwards forever, then u just said God himself was created.

i don't believe in life being created from nothing either. which is why i find people keep saying "god CREATED, how could ur belief create from nothing" or "science CREATED, how could ur belief create life from nothing" funny.

i believe in time. well, that's not true. i believe time doesn't exist and forever is right now and that the time we know as clocks is just as much a simple measurement not between two physical places(or physical times), but in the spiritual as the thing we know as memory.

we aren't here because we were created, we are here because we have to be. and if there is a God, he's God because he has to be too.

[edit on 26-5-2006 by chibidai_rrr]

[edit on 26-5-2006 by chibidai_rrr]

I think allah the sun god has a lot of good key points, they just need to be rearanged....

Ive never understood why people consider sceince as a way to prove God incorrect. Science is simply an explaination of how things "are". For example, evolution is not way to show that God didnt have a hand in creation, it simply explains the physical and mathmatical means that he did it. For those people that think that "and God created the heavens and the earth" is enough explaination for them, then so be it. For those that arent satified with just scripture theres quantum physics, E=Mc2, and other natural equations. Its not essential information for our exsistence, but is available for those who have the will to know.

Another specification I need to mention is that there is and always will be the creator, but RELIGION is a human run institution, and is subject to come and go like hollywood fashion. We were given the divine scripture WHICH MIND YOU...commands us to gather with others of like faith in the name of the lord. If we want to make born agains, catholics, prodistants, jehovahs witnesses, mormons, etc..and start warring against eachother...then thats our misunderstanding, and our problem.

[edit on 26-5-2006 by transparency]

Originally posted by Mrknighttime32
1. The one that created the universe in six days.
2.The one who sent his son to die for our sins.
3. The feeling you get when you know you are doing wrong.
4. The feeling you get when you want to do the right thing.
5. God is also the one who allows everything that happens on earth to happen; yes even the bad things God does not cause these things, but He does allow the Devil to do these thing.
6. AND MOST IMPORTANT GOD IS THE ONE THAT WILL END ALL SUFFERING AND MAKE COMPLETE HAPPINESS FOR THOSE THAT CHOOSE TO BELIEVE.

I do have more if you would like, but I want to see you response.

So I am to believe in a god that:
Is a coward, sends his son to do his work
Impotent, needs humans to do all his work
Selfish, His way or the highway
God sounds like a leader in some fascist regime. I do not believe in the Christian god, but I will not rule out the possibility that a creator exists.

hiya

lol

If god did appear and show hisself to you, would you believe him then or would he need some ID lol

-other gospels

Enoch
Malachi

Left out of king james bible lool, if the bibles gods word who are they to edit it and alter it to traditional english!

God is science and no science cannot in essence prove god neither can it disprove god!

The story of noah is alot more plausible with a scientific look on things.
Noah didnt take 2 of every animal cause its common sense they would kill eachother and the ark would need to be half the size of the world to hold all of them and the food necessary to feed them.
Its logical that he took the dna of 2 of every animal!

Theres so many mysteries in life that just plainly boil down to the manufacturing of the history of we know and the technology and intellect posessed by species of the past.

Stoneage man are seen to be animalistic and brutal and just plain stupid and yet they believed in reincarnation and had a ritual to prepare there return.
They would bury there dead in the fetal position representing rebirth

SouLJa

Originally posted by Mrknighttime32
I truly belive that the God that everyone is talking about is the God in the bible[...]

You know the Gnostic Christians believed that the God as represented in the Bible is actually an incredibly powerful physical entity of some kind (an "alien," if you will), that created the world--or at least mankind's intelligent perception of it--through some unknown means. But this thing was not the "real" God. This creature, known by different names, thinks it's God, though, and has a tendency to demand devotion and supplication and will kill big populations of humans if it doesn't get it. It's insane, and for a long time people were at its mercy. It seems to have gone away, though, and hasn't been back for a while, although people with a lot of imagination sometimes think they enounter it.

This false, psychotic God is the one people pray to and worship, because they don't know any better. It reveals itself as false because it has needs, which is something the real God would not.

According to these early Christians, the real God is beyond our comprehension and can't be understood by us or dealt with in any way. God is beyond our prayers, beyond caring, beyond creation and destruction, beyond a thousand dimensions in a thousand universes. Beyond everything.

I still want the reasons of why you think God does not exsist. You cannot see air but you can feel that too.

The false God as described in the Bible may have been some kind of alien or strange entity from another time or dimension, toying with us like an ant farm. The old myths are too vague and unclear to offer any good evidence of its true nature.

As for the "real" God of the Gnostics, if that "thing" (which is not really even a thing) doesn't exist in any way that we can understand, then it doesn't matter if it exists or not. Looking at it in a Zen way, the real God is ( * ). So what's the difference?



God, as the feeling you experience, is a combination of chemicals in your brain, combined with the lag or gap between the time something really happens and the time you experience it. It is the airy feeling you experience when you don't know something. Your God is "I don't know," which you attribute to the false God because that's what your Mommy and Daddy told you it was, because believe it not, they didn't know any better, either.

So I guess my answer is that there is no God because it doesn't matter if there's a God or not. And, no offense, but I think you probably aren't capable of understanding that.

[edit on 26-5-2006 by Enkidu]

I love hearing people say they don't believe in God because of science.

Any scientists here should know that everything we've observed in nature is still a theory, not a fact, and it is impossible to use logic to prove something is not possible.

But all of that aside, I do believe in God, and the initial belief was sparked because of science. You see, the bulk of scientific theory is based upon the simple premise of cause and effect. In fact, at it's most suimple, science can be basically boiled down to "I did this at this time, and this is what happened". From that, we extrapelate laws, theories, and relationships in the natural world.

So Cause and Effect are taken as fact by the scientific community. The problem I have, is not with the question of "What was the first cause?", which by defenition is God, but what is the cause of the "Cause and Effect" theory itself? What is the cause of the laws of physics. Science can define these laws through observation, but will never give us the answer to what is the cause of the law of gravity. Yes I understand that a large mass will attract smaller masses through the unseen and barely defined force of gravity, but why? What's it's cause?

So despite my love of science, and my study of theoretical mathematics, Science in no way denies or precludes the idea of God.

Originally posted by Enkidu



God, as the feeling you experience, is a combination of chemicals in your brain, combined with the lag or gap between the time something really happens and the time you experience it. It is the airy feeling you experience when you don't know something. Your God is "I don't know," which you attribute to the false God because that's what your Mommy and Daddy told you it was, because believe it not, they didn't know any better, either.

So I guess my answer is that there is no God because it doesn't matter if there's a God or not. And, no offense, but I think you probably aren't capable of understanding that.

What the Christiains have done in destroying so much of the ancient teachings is create this idea that God needs a label and they have controled man for so long (all religions have done this). To think God is a combination of chemicals in the brain is just amazing from my perspective. It is unbelievable that people who do not open themselves to spirit think this way.

People that let modern media and teachings do that to themselves almost always think people that live in spirit do not understand basic chemistry and science. They buy the whole Froyd ideal that we are nothing but smart animals. They never read ancient teachings, and if they do only editied versions and little snipets here and there, which makes them no better than the Christains except the new religion is what they call science. My bet is Enkidu is under the age of thirty and has not had enough experience to look back on things with the proper perspective. Or has just not listened to the universe very well. They must think they are smarter than people like Albert Einstien, Plato, Hermes, etc.

Life mysteries are revealed backwards, but life must be lived foreward. We cannot make proper judgement about spirit, until we have had enough "experience", not nessicarily in years either. When the universal mind knocks on your door, you know it. The teacher will arive when the student is ready. Some people are never ready.

I have rambled on enough, I understand more about emergency medicin than most doctors. I know about chemicals and what they do to influence your thinking. I have seen more than my share of people die on the side of the road, for I am Fire/rescue. I have felt them pass, I know there is spirit from experience. I know there is God, for my higher power has been guiding my higher-self for sometime now.

You cannot argue God with someone that does not believe in God, because they are just not ready yet, and may never be in this lifetime. Some people just need to live a sterile spiritless life.

I choose to live, and be, in spirit.