If US Attacks Iran, Iran Attacks Israel

And here is another Article:

SpaceWar

According to General Alireza Afshar, a deputy chief of general staff in charge of propaganda, the warning made last week by a lower-ranking spokesman carries "no value in the eyes of the Iranian armed forces".

On Tuesday a spokesman for Iranian war games held in April, Rear Admiral Mohammad Ebrahim Dehqani, told the ISNA news agency that "if America gets up to mischief, Israel will be our first target to hit".

But Afshar said "his comments only represent his personal point of view."

So I think this is just another Spin to the Iran Story - sure have been alot of them these days, dontcha agree?

Well it is nice to know, that Rear Admiral still has to answer to the GENERAL.

souljah i dont think its really the topic of discussion anymore lol, we have kind of go into a general basis of iran vs the world threads.

iraqi king:
like i said i know all about what your talking about i just may not have made it as clear as i probably should have. Iran by right, can have nuclear weapons. But like any nation, including the US, i must ask if their government is trustworthy with such options as nuclear weapons. I feel uneasy with just about every country having nuclear weapons for the sole fact none of them are intelligent and patient enough. I dont fear terrorism because i believe terrorism is something every free nation must come by, and move on from. Im afraid of these government and corporation nuts doing whatever they have to in order to further their own agenda.

Nobody wants to sacrifice anymore. You live in a free society, the price may very well be your life, whether it be at war or at home victim to terrorism, you must sometimes sacrifice. From time to time we must be reminded by the blood of innocents and tyrrants what the cost of freedom is. Our innocents got killed, and the tyrrants suicided to do it. Blood was shed, and we were suppose to be reminded that this freedom comes at a price. Instead of standing up strong and saying we will move on, we went into lockdown security. We were unwilling to move on and say if it happens then it happens, and we will not stop being free. We decided our security was worth more then freedom. In that sense we have lost what we stand for, security and money we stand for now.

Jakamo:
i think its safe to say that not many believe bush, we did us that chemical weapon, and its safe to say that america doesnt stand for the same thing anymore.

but on another note, the EU is pushin just as hard if not harder then the US on iran sanctions, but not military action.

Hello sammael, thanks for your response – I appreciate it.

What really concerns me about this scenario is that for Iran with Russia support to be so bold as to attack Israel, they must not be too worried about an American military response! Why not? Could America be rocked by several well-planned terrorist attacks possibly targeting important infrastructure, energy plants or military installations in the Middle East before hand? And could the aftermath & chaos of that cause America to be unable to respond militarily? American armed forces are spread very thin on the ground these days. We’re still rooting around Afghanistan looking for Osama Bin Laden & resolving the Taliban issue - after how many years? We can’t even stabilize Iraq, how on Earth would we juggle Afghanistan, Iraq & Iran simultaneously?

When U.S. forces invaded Iraq (remember shock & awe?) I said here at ATS that we could well be in for another Viet Nam type of experience of guerilla warfare in the streets. I was shouted down by gung-ho guys who said that the Republican Guard would surrender to Wolf Blitzer at the first opportunity. Well, here we are losing American troops everyday to insurgents using homemade remote control bombs and missile launchers made from PVC drain pipes. I watched an episode of Frontline last week that profiled several Iraqi insurgents. The report said that the insurgency is predominately made up of former Iraqi military personnel who were suddenly unemployed by American politics. They are a trained & angry group of ex-soldiers who are following Saddam’s orders of the last days of his regime for guerilla warfare. They were openly firing mortar rounds in the middle of the street during broad daylight. And leaving mutilated bodies strewn around Baghdad to invoke terror in Iraqi citizens.

You wrote: “As for the, "Well, it's right there in the bible..." hoo-ha, I wonder how many times in the past that people have claimed that this is the end?” I completely understand your skepticism about Biblical prophecy, as most people disregard it - as you have.

Yes, I agree that every generation has looked for events that appear to reflect Biblical prophecy ushering in the last days. However, that does not negate the Bible’s Prophetic Truth. Just because prophesied events have not happened yet and so couldn’t possibly happen at all, is a weak argument. Because I’ve never broken my leg does not negate the possibility that I could at any time.

Ezekiel prophesied that several nations would attack Israel. Those nations are:
Gog (Russia)
Magog (Northern confederation of nations under Russian leadership)
Persia (Iran)
Rosh, Meshech, and Tubal (Turkey)
Cush (Ethiopia, Sudan and Libya)
Gomer (Germany)
Togarmah (Armenia)

A friend of mine in England told me that one of her clients recently returned from Iran where he was hired to supply complex programming codes for strategic weapons. He said that these codes are NOT available to US Military Intelligence as they were privately provided by himself and that from his perspective, “Things were set to kick off soon”. This person is not a Bible believing man, just an ordinary citizen who happens to be an encryption programmer.

Is it simply coincidental that Russia has been supplying Iran with advanced weapons systems for some time now? See Link: www.indcjournal.com...

Is it not indicative of Iran’s hostile intentions when the Iranian president recently declared that Israel should be wiped off the face of the Earth? Or that after Iran testing it’s new stealth missile systems and advanced torpedoes –announced that it intends to share its nuclear technology with Sudan, another country on the list of nations to attack Israel? Why not keep an open mind and watch how things develop in the Middle East?

I do not want to see the Middle East explode in a military conflict. But as I watch the evening world news, I see it coming!

Putting faith in a collection of stories, some of which were stolen from previous religions, is not a legitimate reason to claim that this is the end times. If somebody wants to believe in fairy tales that is okay, but one day they have to wake up to reality. Religion is not reality.

I don't care if you are jewish, christian, islamic, buddhist, hindu or a scientologist. Mankind has to wise up to the fact that for us to evolve we have to put the blame on ourselves for the failure to make a descent future. So saying that, I hope chaos reigns in a new age of man. I will not shed a tear for the ones that are lost because their blood could legitimately be the building blocks of wonderful new world where mankind sees the flaws in which we have allowed to push ourselves to the breaking poin

The funniest thing to me right now is how the U.S. really hasn't talked any trash it has mostly been Iran.

Originally posted by sammael
Putting faith in a collection of stories, some of which were stolen from previous religions, is not a legitimate reason to claim that this is the end times. If somebody wants to believe in fairy tales that is okay, but one day they have to wake up to reality. Religion is not reality.

I don't care if you are jewish, christian, islamic, buddhist, hindu or a scientologist. Mankind has to wise up to the fact that for us to evolve we have to put the blame on ourselves for the failure to make a descent future. So saying that, I hope chaos reigns in a new age of man. I will not shed a tear for the ones that are lost because their blood could legitimately be the building blocks of wonderful new world where mankind sees the flaws in which we have allowed to push ourselves to the breaking poin

The funniest thing to me right now is how the U.S. really hasn't talked any trash it has mostly been Iran.

I couldn't agree more. Let's look at reality guys, and forget all the religious stuff. The truth is that if USA chooses to strike Iran's most important targets, then Iran will soon loose the war. Iran's military power is nothing compared to the military power of USA.

The problem though is after the war. As someone pointed out, USA has a problem to keep peace in Iraq, which is much smaller than Iran...so it would not be possible to do that in Iran.

As for threating Israel, as soon as Iran attacks, it will be obliterated. Iran has no chance in winning the battle. And it is not possible for Iran to do guerilla warfare, because the formation of land does not allow it.

So the real problem is what happens after the war. Most propably we will see a rise in terrorism, due to much more muslims be outraged from USA's invasion.

I believe in the prophecy, which is why I am very worried about Iran. A friend from Israel updates me all the time on what's happening, and if you think Iran already didn't get nuclear weapons of some sort AGES ago, then your deceived. Belaruss reported 250 missing suitcase nukes for instance. Think Russia didn't supply Iran enriched Uranium also by now? If Germany in 1945 sent Japan a sub full of it (and Germany was in pieces) and Japan tested a small bomb in that same year in Korea , please tell me why a country like Iran in 2006 can't pull off the same? Best proof is Iran is buying missiles which are constructed for nukes specificaly. Even if they don't have nukes (which I doubt) all it takes for complete Middle East chaos is a conventional scud on the Dimona plant in Israel.

You guys are worried about this prophecy, but now the evidence that this prophecy is about to be fulfilled seems very near zero. And that assumes that your beliefs about such a complicated prophecy are correct.

well i say screw the Iran crisis, we have got this to worry about
www.abovetopsecret.com...'

www.ip-watch.org...

i can say im more worried about this then any action Iran is taking right now.

I belive that the prophocy is based on religion which is in turn based on opinion. Russia would not bomb Isreal rather it will help iran to do so. Isreal (im not anti semitic) is one of the most hated nations in the region. Most arabs see what Irans aggresive stance as something that had aught to have been done since 1948. If Iran strikes Isreal, terrorism in western eyes, will greatly expand (any attack will encourage muslims to regain their land)
It is very hard to convince any arab that Isreal has the right to exist for obvious reasons. Iran may not even have to support so called terrorists if they lauch a retaliatary attack on Isreal or the US. A personal message to the US, if you cant secure Iraq, Iran will be suicide. Iran for all we know could have a suitcase bombb connected in
Tel Aviv and is waiting for Isreal to strike. Iran wouldnt be excersing its freedom of speech (which for some reason cannot be applyed to jews or Isreal because youll be labeled anti semitic) if it didnt have something up its sleeve. Isreals paranoia with nations that dont treat them with special care will eventually be its downfall. Weither from Iran or any other group.

Take a look at how fast the word anti semitic came out of Isreals mouth
news.bbc.co.uk...
The Israeli press ran headlines of a "Swedish boycott" and the National Religious Party described the move as "anti-Semitic".

And take a look at this
news.bbc.co.uk...
Actions like this really support their cause. The question of why she did it is sadly left out.


Isreals presence in the region is not being taken lightly by nations around it. With the US backing Isreal for wrong and right it further inflames the region. Iran may provide that spark. The chances of Isreal or America living in peace if they bomb Iran (which will be seen as the 3rd attack on muslims countys in years) will be zero.
If i were Isreal or the US, id change my policy of confronting Iran for the sake of peace.

Originally posted by Jakomo
Bain:

The U.S. has made a lot of mistakes but that doesn't mean we do not protect the rights of people around the world. We are also hated because we are a nation of God - moral values that others despise. Moral values, that I will admit are a dying breed in the U.S. and around the world.

Hated because you are a nation of God? You have high moral values that others despise? ?!

Grim's post says it all, and with an American perspective you might appreciate more. Otherwise, I'm afraid you are living in an America I have never seen.



Seeker:

Hey? Why you keep talking about the US and Israel?

Because those are the two countries pushing hardest for Iran to "disarm", even though they have no nukes. And Israel doesn't follow the NPT and you somehow seem to think Iran should. Who knows why.

Iran should feel threatened, and they have the right to defend themselves. Bottom line.

Nygdan:

Bush has specifically stated that its not a war against islam or muslims, but against radical fundamental islamists.

Yeah, except nobody believes a word that comes out of his lying mouth.

The US hasn't used chemical weapons

White phosporus.

Not illegal.

Link?

www.who.int...
A recent United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) [...shows] contamination by DU in the environment was localized to a few tens of metres around impact sites[...]Thus, the probability of significant exposure to local populations was considered to be very low.[...]About 98% of uranium entering the body via ingestion is not absorbed, but is eliminated via the faeces. Typical gut absorption rates for uranium in food and water are about 2% for soluble and about 0.2% for insoluble uranium compounds.

You have to inhale it, and you can only inhale high concentrations right around the individual tanks that were hit with it.

Because why? I didn’t elect him... He can’t make decisions that impact me, my family, and humanity.

Clearly he can, does, and will.

And if he does, and you support it, will you be surprised when people who SUFFER because of his decisions, decide to inflict some suffering back at you?

Nope. Are any Iranians going to be suprised in a year or so when there are Joes on the streets of Tehran?

If you would kindly explain how invading Iraq somehow made the US more secure, I’m all ears.

The Iraq invasion is part of a larger programme to re-organize the middle east along democratic and open social lines. By removing repressive regimes, the economic and social situation in the middle east will change, thus removing the root causes of terrorism. With this new order, the cultural units will be changed over generational time.

? Could America be rocked by several well-planned terrorist attacks possibly targeting important infrastructure, energy plants or military installations in the Middle East before hand?

Yes.

And could the aftermath & chaos of that cause America to be unable to respond militarily?

Doubtful.

American armed forces are spread very thin on the ground these days

There are only a small number of Combat Brigades in Iraq, and that was enough to utterly destroy the conventional army, occupy the capital, topple the regime, and put its leaders on trial.

losing American troops everyday to insurgents using homemade remote control bombs and missile launchers made from PVC drain pipes

Indeed, this will happen in Iran post-conventional warefare. Of course, the insurgency won't have the iranian government and oil wealth to support it like the Iraqi one does, and, at least potentially, some groups, like the zoroasterians, will 'go along' with the occupation, similar to how the Kurds and swamp arabs have been in Iraq.

as something that had aught to have been done since 1948.

Did they forget that they tried that on a few occasions and got trounced each time? The only reason there is an occupation in Palestine is because of those previous lost wars. If an arab alliance attacked Israel again, they'd, again, be justified in ocupying arab territory, likesay, egypt, syria, lebanon, parts of the Gulf.
It would be very odd for the saudis to attack israel, get smashed up, and have yehudis occupying Mecca, no?

if it didnt have something up its sleeve.

Indeed, the Iranians aren't stupid, and their government seems to be widely in support of a war, they are steeling themselves for it.

With the US backing Isreal for wrong and right it further inflames the region. Iran may provide that spark

Agreed, its possible that, if Iran is invaded, and especially if the yehudis take part in it, that the arab regimes will decide, "this is it" and form an alliance to root out the US and Israel.

[edit on 5-5-2006 by Nygdan]

nygdan
hahahahah this is the worst thing ive heard to date
"zoroasterians, will 'go along' with the occupation, similar to how the Kurds and swamp arabs have been in Iraq. "

hahahahah

Mate in Iraq the kurds and shiites make up 80%, that leaves 20% sunni left that are fighting ( and they are putting up a decent resistance, i fully do not support any sunnis). Its not called a swamp its called marshes. In iran i can assure you that 80% WILL FIGHT, Iran is roughly 60 million people. so america better have a big pocket and lots of body bags in order to fight 48, 000 000 people. 11 million of whom are armed and are street worthy meaning they can organise the other 37 million. (look up Basji)
What are Basij?
Citizens that are trained to be soldiers, but still continue to do their normal jobs. (Militia). There are an estimated 11,000,000 basij members.
www.irandefence.net...

www.rferl.org...


" Leader Praises Basij
TEHRAN, Aug. 24--Leader of the Islamic Revolution Ayatollah Seyyed Ali Khamenei on Wednesday attended the headquarters of Basij (volunteer forces) and reviewed their parades.
The leader paid tribute to Basij martyrs and exchanged views with commanders and members of the paramilitary forces, IRNA reported.
Addressing members of the Basij, the leader said Basij symbolizes the awareness, spirituality and faith of the Iranian nation and is an exceptional outcome of the Islamic Revolution.
“Basij is a highly popular movement whose members are from different walks of life and with different educational backgrounds. The Basij is a matter of joy for its young members, hope for friends and fear for enemies,“ he said.
Ayatollah Khamenei noted that Basij played a surprising role in the course of the eight-year Iraq-imposed war on Iran.
“The exemplary role of Basij has impressed Muslims and the entire world. That’s why the US and its allies are making every effort to ignore the sacrifices of Basij members and question their lofty values,“ he said.
He pointed out that the resistance of the Iranian nation and Basij to US threats has guaranteed stability of the region, adding that the US has failed in its anti-Iran conspiracies thanks to the determination of the Iranian nation.
“Currently, the US is making attempts to use political and cultural means and their lackeys to undermine the Islamic Republic and change its identity. But, they will suffer the heaviest blow from the Basij,“ he said.
Basij Commander Brigadier General Mohammad Hejazi also presented a report and said the Basij is ready for defense, relief operations during natural disasters, as well as science and technology.
The leader presented awards to top Basij members and family of martyrs."
www.iran-daily.com...


Nygdan your a classic. Im crying with laughter ""zoroasterians, will 'go along' with the occupation, similar to how the Kurds and swamp arabs have been in Iraq. "

Do you realise that if iran is bombed the world economy will colapse?
Just the "talk" of war has pushed prices to $74 dollors, if there is war and Iran cuts its oil and bombs the saudi oil supplys. be prepared to see that number sky rocket. Unless you own a bike dont expect to use a car to get to work.
America is going in blind and will stop only when it has thorns in its hands, but itll be to late by then.

Originally posted by Iraqi_king
Do you realise that if iran is bombed the world economy will colapse?
Just the "talk" of war has pushed prices to $74 dollors, if there is war and Iran cuts its oil and bombs the saudi oil supplys. be prepared to see that number sky rocket. Unless you own a bike dont expect to use a car to get to work.
America is going in blind and will stop only when it has thorns in its hands, but itll be to late by then.

It's not the talk of war, it's the corrupt partnership our SOB president has with the oil industry. I'm sure America is not going in anywhere, I really don't think another military action is on the agenda, but it's almost amusing (well, not really) to see all these tough talking posts about "thorns" in America's hands or whatever, if we were nearly as brutal as some of the back @ssward societies in the ME, we could bring such horror to Iran, conventionally, that they'd be terrified to come out of whatever shelter they could find. I'm glad we're not the monsters some love to paint us as, but all the trash talking almost makes me wish we were. I know that's just foolish pride talking, but I'm only human I guess....

Iraqi_king, you are aware that the Kurds back and support Israel and its right to exist?





seekerof

Originally posted by Iraqi_king
Its not called a swamp its called marshes.

Apologies, no offense intended.

america better have a big pocket and lots of body bags in order to fight 48, 000 000 people.

There's no way there will be an uprising of 49 million people. 80% is fantastically high, its simply not going to happen.

(look up Basji)

"Mobilization" apparently. Seems you mean it as about what a militia would mean. Yes, this should be expected, Iranian militias will rise up and fight against the occupation. They won't accomplish anything more than what the Iraqi militia has accomplished, killing its own people and preventing stability from returning to their own country.

Do you realise that if iran is bombed the world economy will colapse?

I'm a little confused as to how this means that the zoroasterians will not participate. From what I understand, they've only even recently been allowed to practice their religion again. They'll probably not participate in the uprising at all, sort of like the Yezidi in Iraq. Why do you think that this is unreasonable to expect? I'm not saying that it will make a terrible difference, but there will be regions of Iran that won't have much of an insurgency going on.

if there is war and Iran cuts its oil and bombs the saudi oil supplys.

Iran won't be able to bomb the saudi oil supply, their conventional military will be wiped out.

nygdan i guess we will have to agree to simply disagree. there is no way the US military is going to be able to pull that off on Iran. You are severely underestimating these people and their capabilities. But i refuse to argue this because its mainly opinion till it happens. I say their weapons are way more efficient and dangerous then iraqs and that they have much better technology. I believe that they are alot more united and "fanatical" then iraq was, and there will be much more resistance.

we cant argue this till its over though.

Seekerof, yes but do u have an article which says this ?, its not that i dont belive you but would like to be able to refernce it.

Nygdan. Ill give you a picture. Im an Iraqi, have family and lived through that period of war between 1980 to 1988. The iraqi army was a army of conscripts. The united states, france and russia and our niegbouring arab states supplyed us with EVERYTING in order for us to fight the shiite Iran. We bearly kept hold of the areas we controlled. I know its hard to belive but during the war we had american fighterjets (f16s) and cobra attack helipcopter and french missiles. Along with american spy sattiltes at our disposal. Preety much the Iraqi army and the people were ready for war. Iraq was not the way you see it now. Th "now" is a result of embargos, secretiran striff and mass mursders commited by the former regime. Now Iran on the other hand in 1979 made a revolution, one year later we invaded. (p.n the iraqi army worried america so much that during the gulf war, just aboout every counrty fought us, and the US knew that half the army was sick of war). Imagine iraq after saddam was toppled and a new goverment formed, and the turkey for examples sack decides to invade. we would be smashed. The Iranians on the other hand pushed us from tehran to baghdad no joke. The united states saw we were going to lose so they supplyed us with weapons (how do they know we had wmd's? they had the recipts) We used chemicals against them and to no avail they kept a professional army at bay for 8 years before a peace was decided(we wanted peace)

Now " They won't accomplish anything more than what the Iraqi militia has accomplished, killing its own people and preventing stability from returning to their own country. "

You havnt meet Iranian nationalists. the iraqi militia for all its hoplessness lack of support and constant raids has left the Americans in a postion where they want to leave asap. the american army cant and was not able to crush a sunni insurgency, what chance do they have againt Iran. Any attack on Iran would anger the shiites of Iraq, who in turn as the americans have said "can make life very hard for coalition forces" add that to an assault on Iran along with skyrocketing oil supplys and the american Achilles’ heel will be exposed and oil will be an arrow. If terrorists have managed attacks on saudi oil fields, Iran wont have to work that hard. Iran can simply drift mines in the persion gulf, and leave it to imagination to what happens when a oil tanker hits a mine. Then there goes 35% of global oil outputs and ythen as any economic analysis this. "What happens when 35% of global oil supplys stop pouring in overnight"
Iran has taken measures to ensure it can disable everyship both military and civilian. Read this


May 5 (Bloomberg) -- Iran may be planning to share the pain of any U.S. attack with the world's oil markets.

"A strike against Iran's nuclear program would probably be met with an effort to choke off oil shipments through the Strait of Hormuz, military planners and Middle East analysts say. The goal would be to trigger a market disruption that would force President George W. Bush to back off.

The Iranians hope the mere threat of such action may lead oil-consuming nations to pressure the U.S. to resolve the dispute short of a military confrontation. About 17 million barrels of oil, representing one-fifth of the world's consumption, is shipped through the strait every day.

Roiling the markets would be part of a broader retaliation that would include terrorist attacks against U.S. forces or other interests in Iraq and worldwide, said Michael Eisenstadt, an Iran expert at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy and a former Central Command analyst.

``Iran's capabilities are focusing on disrupting oil traffic through the straits,'' Army Colonel Mark Tillman, a professor at the National Defense University in Washington and former Central Command planner, said in an interview. ````Why else would they have these things?''

While Iran probably couldn't close the Strait of Hormuz -- which lies between Iran and Oman and is 34 miles at its narrowest point -- it could cause havoc by threatening or attacking individual oil tankers or terminals, analysts said. Oil from Iran, Iraq, Qatar, Bahrain, the United Arab Emirates, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia is shipped through the Strait.

Iran's Revolutionary Guard-controlled navy ``has been developed primarily to `internationalize' a conflict by choking off oil exports through the Strait,'' Abizaid, head of the U.S. Central Command, told lawmakers.

So from this we see Irans card. Its got the US by the ....s as we like to say.

read this
"Notably, Iran successfully test-fired a high-speed, maneuverable and heat-seeking Misaq-1 surface-to-air missile (SAM), as well as a medium-range and remote-controlled Kowsar surface-to-sea missile, which zeroes in on its target and which can successfully cope with ECM (Electronic Counter-Measures) systems. Iran also tested a modern flying boat that can skim waves at up to 100 knots, RIA Novosti added.

The new Fajr-3 radar-evading ballistic missile and the Hut torpedo, the Iranian Navy's fastest underwater weapon with a speed of 100 meters per second, were also launched.

Iran made it clear that it completely controlled the Strait of Hormuz, through which the Middle East exports 80% of its oil. Tehran also said it was ready for war, and that any encroachment on its interests in the Persian Gulf would meet with a resolute response from the water, from under the water, from the air, from islands and the coast, RIA Novosti noted. "


So bye cya bye oil if iran is hit.

This would explain alot in regards to the American forign policy
informationclearinghouse.info...

Yes, the oil shock would be a strangle. One thing people often don't consider though- the US has huge reserves to tap in these types of situations. Now how long these would last is the question, but either way, if people complain about gas prices now, imagine when one of the world's top oil suppliers suddenly stops production.

Its not the just the US will be affected but most western country will. Most european countrys have little little reserves and the most dangerous effect of oil is that if production is affected it takes time to find another supplyer and fill the gap.
The 1970s shock skare damaged the markets, and our dependece on oil has risen dramatically since the 1970s