Stop being a know-it-all

what about those of us who DO know everything?




ok, to be honest, i really knew everything at 15, now, not so much.

Nobody knows everything, thats what the point i'm trying to make is. But if someone asks a question in a forum i'd likely try and investigate.. most likely googling and give a reasonable answer based on several sources. If the person who asked the question chooses to follow my opinion or statement then fair enough. I agree that people who try and force a statement as fact are no use at all to this forum but as long as the person recieveing the answer can judge between fact and fiction in their mind then fair enough.

At the end of the day this is a conspiracy forum and the 'facts' are not always there leaving more opinion than not and if people get moaned at for giving their opinion because they aren't 'qualified' in that area then i'll quite happily leave and never return!

Originally posted by Yarcofin
I was going to say something about this entire thread being some sort of giant egotistical circle jerk,

Yeah, in some ways it is, isn't it? and you and your buddies can take that action elsewhere.

METHINKS THOU-and some others- DOTH PROTEST TOO MUCH

DID ANY OF YOU BOTHER READING MY FIRST POST shortly after gemwolf started this thread? I know gemwolf did and appreciated it.

I gave my .02 not to get off rambling a long winded diatribe, but because it backs up gemwolf's original topic by expounding upon it and explaining the types of people gemwolf refers to in this thread, this topic-as it really isn't just about "know it alls" on certain subjects-it goes much further into the types of people and what they do here.

We HOPE to have some people that KNOW IT ALL and can EXPOUND upon it ALL on certain subjects for everyone who doesn't know all on that subject.

HOWEVER, as my post further explains and validates gemwolf on this subject, it is more about certain types of people and HOW they behave and what their behavior does, and I have u2u'd with gemwolf since this thread began, so I know we are on the same page here.

None of this was/ is to single out actual persons with full knowledge on a subject, or who has specialized on a subject, or a few or many, but rather the wannabe "know it alls" who believe they know everything about every subject, either because they truly believe they do from a quick google search, or because they are good at BS, etc. and regardless of who or why-their behavior when they call, or try to prove others idiots all the time, is not acceptable or appreciated around here where collaboartion of ideas enlightens everyone, and maturely contesting facts, does the same.

Also, to address those who NEVER stay on the topic of a subject but pick out inconsequential points of a post to dispute, or attempt to discredit the thread's author, or a posts authored in a thread, by attacking the posters intelligence, beliefs, writing style, opinions, grammatical or spelling errors etc for a quick psuedo-superior fix.

This thread is NOT saying people with FULL knowledge of something are to be shunned, nor that when we are wrong or our opinions are discredited maturely on fact, and within the context of a thread's subject and point, we feel brow beaten by a know it all. Nope, not at all.

On the contrary we can respect when (if) we are wrong...but *some* people apparently can not and have to go around ALWAYS being right, or thinking they are, claiming they are, and will look for a place to be "right" at all costs...or creating one...not creating a thread mind you, but creating an opportunity to be "right" in someone's else's thread-at ALL costs... even if it is NOT about the threads subject at hand, nor contributes to the threads subject, or even if it twists the thread's original topic so they can be right.

Is this thread's topic really beyond some of you posters comprehension, or really just too accurate for you to accept?

think2much:

I have a question. Hopefully, you won't jump all over me for asking it.

How do you tell the difference between the "Googlers" and the people who know what they're talking about unless you're an expert on any particular subject yourself?

Also, to address those who NEVER stay on the topic of a subject but pick out inconsequential points of a post to dispute, or attempt to discredit the thread's author, or a posts authored in a thread, by attacking the posters intelligence, beliefs, writing style, opinions, grammatical or spelling errors etc for a quick psuedo-superior fix.

Couldn't agree you more. Mutual respect should always be followed. Creating a post through your own work and time, then have it picked at by someone looking to gain a certain 'higher' status is completely unacceptable.

This thread is NOT saying people with FULL knowledge of something are to be shunned, nor that when we are wrong or our opinions are discredited maturely on fact, and within the context of a thread's subject and point, we feel brow beaten by a know it all. Nope, not at all.

The point im trying to make is you state that something can only be discredited with fact. As I have stated before this is a conspiracy site and if facts were readily available then there would be no need for this site.

I also feel googlers are an essential part to this site as you can't take an experts view as face value. It is always best to investigate yourself.. perhaps even question the original poster upon the subject matter. Know it alls are there to cause trouble by putting others down, me disagreeing with an expert over an issue in which i have researched on google is another matter, a forum is generally an open debate.. obviously conflicting views are going to happen. I'm sure different views and different information from different sources allows users to filter negative inormation. A user who claims his point is right and will not consider any other source is just nieve and shouldn't be on an open discussion site.

Perhaps I am a 'know it all' as i do not have a specific subject area in which i research and have read upon regulary.. so kill me! If someone raises a question and i disagree or give an opinion I do not see how that is a bad thing. I am here to learn and mix ideas to form my own theories.. If i wanted to be dictated to by an 'expert' i'd go back to school!!

Originally posted by Gemwolf
I made the original post to state what's bothering me about my experience here at ATS. And it's getting worse.

That's what's so dumb about the topic. It's just above a flounce in the hierarchy of forum or newsgroup posts. I've seen this kind of thing often in the many forums I've been in since the Internet was invented by Al Gore in 1962.

The posts present the argument that there is a "problem" with the group in some way, and hope to convince the other members to do something about it. Which is just silly. The group is what it is. It changes and evolves as different people come and go. Moderated or not, sometimes it's a wonderful and fulfilling experience, other times it's a huge waste of time. But there's little or nothing you can do as an individual to change the quality of the group, other than provide a consistent example of the quality you want the group to have.

But that's not US, that's YOU. Which I suppose is my point. If you feel that there are too many "know-it-alls" here, or that your opinions are not being given their proper respect or consideration, maybe this just isn't the group for you anymore.

It could be that the group has changed. Or maybe you have. Maybe you've graduated, and it's time for you to head out into the world with your ATS diploma in hand and find a better, more appropriate group to present your questions and comments. There's nothing wrong with that. In fact, it's a good thing. Or maybe you need to take a little sabbatical from the group until it returns to a state you find more appealing.

Either way, the "problem" isn't with the group. It's with YOU. And if you're seriously looking for a solution to the problem, then you have to be willing to admit the strong possibility that the solution can only be found within yourself. That, like with smoking or any other habit that goes bad, maybe you have to get your gumption up and quit.

I suggest cold turkey. Sure, it hurts at first, but after a while you'll lose interest in logging in here and maybe find that other board, where you feel more comfortable. No need for a tearful or accusatory good-bye. Just fade away into the sunset.

Good luck!

Originally posted by Knights
Couldn't agree you more. Mutual respect should always be followed. Creating a post through your own work and time, then have it picked at by someone looking to gain a certain 'higher' status is completely unacceptable.

Knight THAT is what this thread is really all about. Plain and simple. Be it a thread post picked apart because of contrasting info-googled facts or otherwise, or because of other opinions, facrs etc... whenever someone feels they have to make another feel like in idiot-or calls them one, and belittles someone for their thread, post opnion, belief etc- that is what we take exception with here.

Originally posted by KnightsThe point im trying to make is you state that something can only be discredited with fact. As I have stated before this is a conspiracy site and if facts were readily available then there would be no need for this site.

No, I did NOT say that something can only be discredited with fact, I said something to the effect of 'when something is discredited with fact' and we are otherwise proven wrong, or have our ideas disputed maturely, we have no problem with that, nor should anyone really. But I wasn't trying to imply that is the only way to discredit something.

Originally posted by KnightsI also feel googlers are an essential part to this site as you can't take an experts view as face value. It is always best to investigate yourself.. perhaps even question the original poster upon the subject matter.

I had a private instructor for highschool who taught me "question everything" and "question authority especially" and if I ever listened to anyone in my entire life it was him...so I do question everything, and I do my own research, and none of this was to ever try to discredit those who use google...I have used google...I have used wikipedia...that is not the main point here you know, it's just when the googleophiles become the subject matter experts in their own minds...then it's gets crazy...

and likewise it's crazy when people have to call others idiots, put them down for their interests, beliefs, "cool finds" etc... or when they just want to discredit people for the sake of ...discrediting someone...it's just STUPID.

When someone's hobby here becames to dicredit others, and attack intelligence, or pick apart the grammar, spelling, syntax etc of everyone's posts (mods privately doing so in u2u's for the benefit of everyone excluded) then it's time to find a new hobby folks!

...and when new ATSers witness this bad "know-it-all" behavior they think it's par for the course to just call someone an idiot and intellectually walk all over someone and piss on their post...and it is NOT. Not the way to do things and NOT acceptable.

I think gemwolf mostly directed this to those "know-it-alls" who are new here, young in age or on ATS, who with a quick google search FOR AN EXAMPLE can arm themselves well...only to piss on others post/thread.

so the main point here is NOT "do not be a googler" but "Do not piss all over someone's post by being a know it all" whether you are armed with google, 1 year of college, or 10, none.... it's HOW you behave...not what you know or where you obtained it.

The google reference just shows how quickly ANYONE can get the same info you have on google, so don't use something so simple to piss on another poster. Plain and simple. It's about behavior and respect.



[edit on 31-3-2006 by think2much]

[edit on 31-3-2006 by think2much]

Originally posted by Enkidu
But there's little or nothing you can do as an individual to change the quality of the group (snip)

I do not condone apathy. I was taught even one person can make a difference and I believe it to this day. You may not always know what the difference is, or whom you reached or what effect you had, and maybe what you do doesn't have an effect for a very long time...but everyone can make a difference.

Originally posted by Enkidu
other than provide a consistent example of the quality you want the group to have.

May I add, and point out problems as they arise, and give examples of the characteristics you do not wish the group to have, and thus strive for the quality you wish to see the group achieve.

Originally posted by Enkidu
But that's not US, that's YOU. Which I suppose is my point. If you feel that there are too many "know-it-alls" here, or that your opinions are not being given their proper respect or consideration, maybe this just isn't the group for you anymore.

ATS is my HOME. I registered and never looked back. I am not here until I try to find something better, or leave for something worse. There is no site that compares to ATS. Not by a long shot. I have made it MY HOME, and I want it to be comfortable and inviting for others that share it, I want it to be lively and fun, entertaining and enlightening, and I want to be proud of it when I invite others into it.

This *is* the group for me I assure you. I don't know if any of my opnions are ever given the proper respect or consideration, I actually feel at large I am basically ignored here by most. Maybe because I do not attack, and do not flame for responses, but I don't care, I say what I want to say how and where I want to say it and always try to have respect for others and their opinions.

I personally have had some disagreements, but that is par for the course and I don't mind them at all usually, but I have never felt intimidated myself, nor put down, nor have I ever been really discredited or called an idiot or anything negative outright here...or if I have, it didn't make much of an impact as I don't recall it! I also have never had a thread of mine distroyed by know it alls here, but I have seen it done to others and THAT is why I participate in this thread wholeheartedly.

I see it happen to others all the time here. To the point some pople are so defensive they become offensive when they feel they are being attaked-possibly again-on a new thread they've created and they create -or exacerbate -a negative tone on their own thread. Who wants a hostile envirnoment? Who wants to make their home in one? Or their home INTO one. Not me.

Originally posted by Enkidu
Either way, the "problem" isn't with the group. It's with YOU. And if you're seriously looking for a solution to the problem, then you have to be willing to admit the strong possibility that the solution can only be found within yourself. That, like with smoking or any other habit that goes bad, maybe you have to get your gumption up and quit.

Oh yeah thats right...I'm sure some of you would like to let the quality of ATS go to hell. You figure if people don't like being ridiculed, berrated, brow beaten, insulted, and otherwise immaturely disrespected, or don't like watching others treated in the same deaming way, they should just give into the intellectual bullies and pack up and leave ATS, right?

Yeah that would certainly keep the quality up at ATS-just hand it over to disrespecting bullies and watch it go down the toilet as the No 1 site of it's type. I don't think so. Maybe thats the new MO of the opponents of ATS...

My instructor once told me "You have to be in the system to change the system"

I think of that now two fold...that I am here to help ATS to continue to evolve in the right direction, and also to protect it from degeneration from within...from those within the system trying to change the system...but not for ATS's community's best interest.

Maybe some of the "know it alls" here are really here to destroy the fabric of ATS from within...to infiltrate and subtly gnaw away at the tone, and through thinly vieled psuedo intellectualism cause strife in the community...just another conspiracy...not to outright flame and get banned as a troll..no...just slowly work away at the fabric of the quality of ATS...from within. Sneaky.

Originally posted by Enkidu
I suggest cold turkey. Sure, it hurts at first, but after a while you'll lose interest in logging in here and maybe find that other board, where you feel more comfortable. No need for a tearful or accusatory good-bye. Just fade away into the sunset.

Oh you are so funny. You must be a genius that knows everything to be so insightful and witty.

Ah, and in all of my definitions of how intellectual trolls work, let me not forget humor in attaking others...those that use wit, to make a funny statements to make fun of someone, amusing enough that it validates the trolls point even if it is wrong....if it can make someone smile or laugh, then they've gain some validity for their point. What a shame.

I feel I should say more, but really...I'm so disgusted I dare not.

Originally posted by think2much
ATS is my HOME.

Well, you know, sometimes there's a big flood and your home fills with mud and you have to decide whether or not to dig out or move. People do develop what I consider to be unhealthy attachments to these kinds of forums. Maybe you're one of those people.

Oh yeah thats right...I'm sure some of you would like to let the quality of ATS go to hell. You figure if people don't like being ridiculed, berrated, brow beaten, insulted, and otherwise immaturely disrespected, or don't like watching others treated in the same deaming way, they should just give into the intellectual bullies and pack up and leave ATS, right?

It would be a very effective solution.

Oh you are so funny. You must be a genius that knows everything to be so insightful and witty.

Ahem. I must be a genius "who" knows everything to be so insightful and witty.



[edit on 31-3-2006 by Enkidu]

Originally posted by Enkidu
Ahem. I must be a genius "who" knows everything to be so insightful and witty.

I consider you an "it" not a "who", so "that" will suffice.

p.s. you're not as cool as you think you are and I'd much rather clean up the mud from my home then just let it flood in. I may be able to do nothing about the likes of you, but perhps others will see you all for the fools you are and strive to be less like you....just one new person not becoming like someone like you, and it's worth my effort to speak out.

Damn what have i gotten myself into.Look everyone stop fighting -NOW-lol geeze.You know I went off just a little too much.I totally see what you guys are trying to say,Its not a generalization but a direct approach to what does happen to some on here.

As I have said I have had to step in and stand up for some here and there.
I think I should have stayed out of this one but here I am,I think some of us here are starting to just fight off of feelings and not the actual topic.

I really respect most of you guys and I have to say I was wrong to go about things the way I did,Sometimes I just don't think about things.

After reading what Gemwolf and Think2much have said,and trying to understand it,I dont really think there is anything wrong with what they said,mabey the way they said it,or worded it,but then again just like my response these are based off of feelings.Which sometimes get in the way of who we are and how we really treat people,or at least try to treat people.

This post still makes me mad but thats me,I think you guys are being harsh on those who are less aware of the way they treat others,if someone is doing this ,how do you get them to stop?I bet these guys have seen it more than me,though ive seen some bad stuff happen on here. and it usually does happen to those who cant really defend themselves or just dont get into it but get walked all over,kinda like i did to gemwolf,which was not really retaliated.

Im not usually like that and im sorry.But i cannot excuse my behavior either.
It was not towards me,heck i dont even think gemwolf has even encountered me at all.
I dont like the way I have been acting towards this post.Trying to become a pest just to prove a point,and I think i did a good job of being an a__
I'm done with it and I don't even really know why I started,I think it was cause I seen Yarcofin being pushed around by this group for his opinions.

I dunno.Regardless though I dont think ant good has really come of this thread at all.Ack I'm so mixed with this whole thing.I think it might have been the whole hypocrisy of the thread,discriminating those who discriminate does not make you any better,it kinda makes what you say redundant,now although I don't really think that was the intentions of anyone here(mabey),that is the way it came across to me.

I'll be okay.

the thing that everyone should 'know' is how important finding things to agree on is and building from there...instead of arguing over stupid things and creating furhter conflict..I think my sig describes it best

UNITE FOR WHATS RIGHT, not another lame song about who's wrong

Well, what the hey. I don't mean to step on anybody's toes.

But I'm a relatively intelligent guy who has had to back off and be nice to people and even pretend to be less intelligent than I am my whole life in order to avoid hurting the feelings of people who are, if not less intelligent, then at least less able to effectively express themselves. And honestly, I'm tired of it. I like a place where I don't have to dumb it down.

If someone's logic is faulty, or their "facts" are questionable, or their grammar is lousy, do I have some kind of "noblesse oblige" to baby these folks so their widdle feewings don't get huwt? Why should my superior knowledge or intellect require ME to be the one to back down or make the extra effort?

Look, if your arguments are weak, and your opinions are just plain stupid, you should expect to be browbeaten by your betters and shown where you're wrong. Just as I expect to be browbeaten by my betters when (not if) I come up with something monumentally stupid. Even if it comes from the Googlers. A fact is a fact regardless where it comes from, and if I'll face those facts when they're presented to me.

It's called having a bit of maturity and a tough skin, and a process by which you might actually sharpen your reasoning and refine your thinking. Me treating you with kid gloves and patting you on the back for your efforts isn't helping either of us.

This isn't the Special Olympics, where everybody who competes is a winner. At least I hope it isn't. I would prefer this to be a place where, as the motto implies, ignorance and sloppy thinking are denied, and the discussions are tempered and refined with a bit of fire.

[edit on 31-3-2006 by Enkidu]

What are you trying to say.. that this is the competition? That we should have a winner of each thread about who 'knows' the most?!

Sorry but i'm not impressed, if a thread has been devised by someone of 'less intelligence' as you put it.. why should you be able to knock them down? If i saw you in real life and you were less attractive/fit/had no personality would that give me the right to insult you or laugh at you because you are inferior to me.... of course not. This is a forum where we are all here to learn and discuss all kind of topics, it's give and take.. we are all in this conspiracy devising/ solving together, learning from each other.. work together not against each other. Please show respect for the forum and the people who work hard on a posts and keep the forum alive.

I'm not one of these know-it-alls because I read five pages of this post and still don't know what the problem is. Should people start dumbing down posts so people don't feel like they are getting overwhelmed?

Where's that picture of a bunny with a pancake on his head when you need it?

I found him hiding in a dark corner.

If someone's logic is faulty, or their "facts" are questionable, or their grammar is lousy, do I have some kind of "noblesse oblige" to baby these folks so their widdle feewings don't get huwt? Why should my superior knowledge or intellect require ME to be the one to back down or make the extra effort?

Look, if your arguments are weak, and your opinions are just plain stupid, you should expect to be browbeaten by your betters and shown where you're wrong.

I'm not sure if you missed something there but nobody mentioned 'dumbing down', but if a young person or someone who had no knowledge in a particular subject asks what you consider a stupid question or proposes a ridiculous theory they should in NO WAY be heckled for being 'inferior'. Instead they should be encouraged.. at the end of the day you want people to think alike, to question things in life. Not put them off before they even start. This is a learning process not somewhere where you can go on and dictate 'facts'.

Encourage don't deter.

Sorry I think i pretty much fit the bill for the know it all twenty year old. I do try to respect my elders as much as I can though. I just posted a thread before i resad your post that's short and pretty much exactly what i think your against lol. Sorry.

If you want to look at it though here.
super genius potential of sociopathy?

Excellent post!

Others have said this using a lot more words but I think it comes down to a lot of folks confusing "strongly held beliefs" with "facts".

OK, a little more - when I first came to this board I was amazed at the incredible number of genuine, bonafide subject matter experts that were here willing to have honest debates and cite authors, books, historians, etc. that I'd never heard of so, it was a massive resource for me and I could hardly believe my great fortune! Sadly, Yellers-of-Strongly-Held-Beliefs eventually drowned out their voices and they have all disappeared. In fact, I've mostly disappeared myself other than to check back from time-to-time to see if any of the true scholars have reappeared. Sadly, they have not. This community is too valuable to allow it to be taken over by the shouting matches or it should just declare itself a shouting match site.

I really appreciate what the mods have been trying to do! Don't let the turkeys take over the farm!

Al

Please eloborate on your point in question there?? Who exactly are you classing as 'turkeys'?

One of the main points of this post was to respect everyones views and to never insult any other person for your own personal claim.. it may just be me but aren't you showing yourself as being a know it all? You are discrediting others views and labelling them turkeys. Fair enough give credit where credit is due but don't insult other users.